Is The united states Actually a democracy?

[Samemf]

I mean if its actually a democracy wouldnt a reall democracy take into account the most votes instead of the 4 states ?

It seems to me that the USA is is going into if not already a faciest sytle of system is it not ?

which country in the world would be the closest to a real democracy in your opinion ?



Sam

[Aaron]

democracy vs constitutional republic

Hi Sam,

The United States is founded as a Constitutional Republic and not a democracy. I would hope that every American would take it upon themselves to study what a Constitutional Republic is because it is our duty to understand the difference.

It is about being a sovereign citizen that has a right to do pretty much anything you want as long as you don't infringe on the rights of others.

That means your rights can never be infringed upon just because a majority of people want to limit your freedom. In a democracy, no matter how wicked, evil and vile a rule is, it can become law in a majority rule and more and more rights can be suppressed.

The ruling "forces" of the US (federal reserve - whatever controls the money supply) over many, many decades have slowly manipulated the minds of the people to think that anyone who does stand for a constitutional republic are crazy, radical, dangerous and un-American. There have been a few crazies over time that are going about proving their point about being "free" in a very wrong and destructive way. The govt uses each of these incidents as an example to all that these Constitution waving maniacs are dangerous people. That may be true but that doesn't mean that Constitution waving patriots are the same kind of people.

In a majority rules democracy, money always inevitably wins the votes (honestly or dishonestly) and this always turns into a system where the rich become slave masters of the poor. This is historically true to my knowledge. That can happen through private wealth or corporate wealth. Today it is common practice for corporate interests to be intermingled with our government, especially with banking interests, defense interests, oil interests and pharmaceutical interests as the most likely top 4. Banking interest is by far the head of them all.

As the 1983 American Heritage Dictionary noted, fascism is: "A system of government that exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with belligerent nationalism."

The above straight forward definition of fascism has been wiped from the dictionaries to obscure the language so as to depower the people. Language is power.

It is hard to campaign when you can't even put food on the table. Moving on to the extreme end, which is always turns into, is a dictatorship of various kinds. In a constitutional republic, a rich man and poor man are equally responsible for their own affairs without answering to anyone...again, as long as they're not infringing on the rights of others.

Many Americans are led to believe that spreading democracy around the world is a good thing but it is an uneducated view. Spreading the concept of a constitutional republic around the world to countries that are suppressed would be in alignment with what America really stands for even though people do not even learn this fact in school anymore. The last time these facts about American government were commonly known to the people were probably several generations before my grandparents were ever born...around the 13th and 14th amendment time. Those 2 deserve special study because not all things are as they appear to be.

Check out this tidbit of wisdom from one of the founding fathers as it is difficult to argue with those who had the wisdom and foresight to start such a mind-boggling experiment to begin with:

“A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine.” - Thomas Jefferson, (American 3rd US President (1801-09). Author of the Declaration of Independence. 1762-1826)


There is no country in the world that is operating as a free country so long as they are in partnership with a central banking system.

[ANTIQUER]

Hi Sam,

The United States is founded as a Constitutional Republic and not a democracy. I would hope that every American would take it upon themselves to study what a Constitutional Republic is because it is our duty to understand the difference.

It is about being a sovereign citizen that has a right to do pretty much anything you want as long as you don't infringe on the rights of others.

That means your rights can never be infringed upon just because a majority of people want to limit your freedom. In a democracy, no matter how wicked, evil and vile a rule is, it can become law in a majority rule and more and more rights can be suppressed.

The ruling "forces" of the US (federal reserve - whatever controls the money supply) over many, many decades have slowly manipulated the minds of the people to think that anyone who does stand for a constitutional republic are crazy, radical, dangerous and un-American. There have been a few crazies over time that are going about proving their point about being "free" in a very wrong and destructive way. The govt uses each of these incidents as an example to all that these Constitution waving maniacs are dangerous people. That may be true but that doesn't mean that Constitution waving patriots are the same kind of people.

In a majority rules democracy, money always inevitably wins the votes (honestly or dishonestly) and this always turns into a system where the rich become slave masters of the poor. This is historically true to my knowledge. That can happen through private wealth or corporate wealth. Today it is common practice for corporate interests to be intermingled with our government, especially with banking interests, defense interests, oil interests and pharmaceutical interests as the most likely top 4. Banking interest is by far the head of them all.

As the 1983 American Heritage Dictionary noted, fascism is: "A system of government that exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with belligerent nationalism."

The above straight forward definition of fascism has been wiped from the dictionaries to obscure the language so as to depower the people. Language is power.

It is hard to campaign when you can't even put food on the table. Moving on to the extreme end, which is always turns into, is a dictatorship of various kinds. In a constitutional republic, a rich man and poor man are equally responsible for their own affairs without answering to anyone...again, as long as they're not infringing on the rights of others.

Many Americans are led to believe that spreading democracy around the world is a good thing but it is an uneducated view. Spreading the concept of a constitutional republic around the world to countries that are suppressed would be in alignment with what America really stands for even though people do not even learn this fact in school anymore. The last time these facts about American government were commonly known to the people were probably several generations before my grandparents were ever born...around the 13th and 14th amendment time. Those 2 deserve special study because not all things are as they appear to be.

Check out this tidbit of wisdom from one of the founding fathers as it is difficult to argue with those who had the wisdom and foresight to start such a mind-boggling experiment to begin with:

“A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine.” - Thomas Jefferson, (American 3rd US President (1801-09). Author of the Declaration of Independence. 1762-1826)


There is no country in the world that is operating as a free country so long as they are in partnership with a central banking system.

Hi Aaron.

Great and accurate answer. Always happy to find someone else who understands, as we are getting fewer by the year.

I would add for Samemf"s benefit that the Greek democracy, loudly proclaimed as the first democracy in the world and the model for all, destroyed itself due to mob rule.

A constitutional republic elects leaders who make laws after debate and consideration and then they and the public live by them. Everyone is governed by law, not mob rule or the influence of any individual or group of individuals ( At least that is how it is supposed to work).

Al.

[Aaron]

note

Thanks Al,

I'd like to point out when I said: "Many Americans are led to believe that spreading democracy around the world is a good thing but it is an uneducated view. Spreading the concept of a constitutional republic around the world to countries that are suppressed would be in alignment with what America really stands for even though people do not even learn this fact in school anymore."

That doesn't mean that I believe we should be going around being policeman on behalf of the central banking system, etc... Just that a constitutional republic is favorable to me compared to "spreading democracy."

Anyway, hot topic!

[patmac]

Thanks Al,

I'd like to point out when I said: "Many Americans are led to believe that spreading democracy around the world is a good thing but it is an uneducated view. Spreading the concept of a constitutional republic around the world to countries that are suppressed would be in alignment with what America really stands for even though people do not even learn this fact in school anymore."

That doesn't mean that I believe we should be going around being policeman on behalf of the central banking system, etc... Just that a constitutional republic is favorable to me compared to "spreading democracy."

Anyway, hot topic!

Hey Aaron I want to tell to yours a little history, little history about me, people and country...

If you look my forum participation you can view my profile, I'm living in Colombia in this moments, I falling in love of Renewable Energy,
That is a of my greats dreams.

I'm living in Colombia but maybe you can't believe me if tell you; I was born in Venezuela, my mother is from Venezuela and my father is from Colombia, in south america. Venezuela was who created OPEC, OPEC was created by Juan Pablo Perez Alfonzo he was born in Venezuela.

You can see in all your news paper about the problems from Venezuela and dictartorship Hugo Chavez and his powerful governement oil rich, you can not believe me if I tell you that I HATE THE PETROLEUM.....

In this moment we are SLAVE's PETROLEUM, our governement is corrupt fascist only thinks about a war with yours, when we no hate to USA that is not true by other hand like us many thinks of USA, because I've learned very much about yours, thinks like BaseBall, Basket Ball, our cities, our highways, bridge, buidings is like yours in Venezuela.

But Petroleum only we going us to auto-destruction people is destruted by richness of petroleum, ambition, greed, corruption, in politics campaigns governements use petro-dollards for buy votes, and destroy oposition, damaging people dignity, destroy his emplyments, bussiness etc.

All in my country is imported, and underployments is in everywhere, many people only can work for the regimen to survive, you can manufacture something and you can see it in the market in half or less cost that you can manufacture it, because governement spends all the money, importing giftings ....

Our farmers have no enough resources to produce, they have no security, education water service is poor, energy grid is poor. Actually in mains cities there is mane blackouts to 6 hours daily. When the farmers succed reap theirs products, market prices are much lower, and when they get high theirs prices, governement accuse farmers of to try desetabilize...

Out communication medias are threaten everyday by the regimen, license to use frequency to broadscast was suspended to one channel because they're do'nt want deceive the people. Journalist are murdereds by the regimen.

We have tried to overthrow but the power of money ever wins. We have tried to talk with George Bush to stops purshases petroleum to Venezuela, but he no hear us, never hear us. Appearently Bush is a partner of Hugo Chavez in petroleum bussiness, and that matter we have us oppressed, we have tried to talk with neighborhood countries and ever recieves gifts of Hugo Chavez and they never hear us..... Last time we tried that some countries nears to Venezuela like Dominican Republic to talk with others countries to create a International Organization to stop regimen and expasion of Hugo Chavez and strangely Condolezza Rice came to Brazil, and says: "Remember, OES is the only organization and yours can have no another....." That answer was very very fast, but to say that Hugo Chavez must be stopped many years ago, that no is important for EEUU governement. I fell so sorry. I'm sorry so much. We're loosing our freedom everyday, yours and us too all by the petroleum... I prefer have no so things...

Latinoamerican underployments and low education is destroing us, and destroying to your countrie causing immigration illegal creating a laboral market desleal...

We need survive without petroleum, is detroying us...

Your analysis is very true, democracy no is just, is corrupt democracy is only in benefits to powerful people with money.

Tanks Aaron by your real analysis....

[muttdogg]

Fascism

Hey Aaron , Al & Samemf,
If the question is which country is the closest to democracy, excuse me, a true democracy, I'd have to say Cuba, where communism, the purest form of democracy, is practiced. Hold on a sec!. In it's initial form communism is one vote for all, with a circular ruling body whose leader is not elected, but "forced" to be the leader from a relvolving lottery. Unfortunately, they also adhere to marxism. The most corrupt form of communism, whose root word is communal. Probably the most communal form of common government, is Isreal, though their Knesset is based on English common law.
Where Aaron is correct, the USA has a constitutional republic form of government. What is different from all other governments is our senate. Not only the way they debate more slowly than the house of representatives, but how they are elected. Two per state, so no matter how large, or small the state, each has input. Why do you think Sen. Byrd, D-Wva, is able to take your money, and use it in his state?
The other relative to the senate, is the house of lords in England. We elect our Lords, as opposed to the English way of naming them from some weird idea of land ownership. (Of course some may say that is how the USA does it.)
We also have separation of powers, while very rarely used in the latter half of the 20th century, and continues today. Which is unusual for any federal government. One of the reasons why, when voting for president,you must consider what type of judges he/she may nominate.
That brings me to the electoral college, a certainly misunderstood body, if I ever heard one. The original idea was to allow the smaller coastal states, and the New England states to have as equal a say as, say Virginia, Pennsylvania, or New York. The reason a presidential election still depends on the Electoral college, is that a presidential nominee must spend as much time in New Hampshire, or Iowa, as they do in California. As each state has the same senate votes.
That is why when some idiot says, " did you hear what he said on tv?" I want to smack them so hard they won't wake up until next Tuesday. Dig in to their resume. Find out what they have stood for, and vote intelligently. Not just for the monied man, but for the person you feel will do the most good for you and yours. Your vote counts. This country has a most atrocious voting turn-out. Do you really want me, I have voted faithfully for the last thirty years, to determine who is your next........... (fill in the blank)?
Samemf, voter apathy, alongside poor viewing habits, and the disdain of regular voters, who shape our government, is the apocryphal demise that the elite want you to believe. Why vote? Because it matters. The silly little people that stay at home on election day, and do nothing, are just silly little people. They don't care about anything, as long as it doesn't interfere with their stupid tv shows.
Vote, then no matter how much money any one else has, you will make the difference.
Ask big Al, I am long-winded, of course Al and I now seem to agree again. AAARRRGGGHH!
Dan

[ANTIQUER]

Hey Aaron , Al & Samemf,
If the question is which country is the closest to democracy, excuse me, a true democracy, I'd have to say Cuba, where communism, the purest form of democracy, is practiced. Hold on a sec!. In it's initial form communism is one vote for all, with a circular ruling body whose leader is not elected, but "forced" to be the leader from a relvolving lottery. Unfortunately, they also adhere to marxism. The most corrupt form of communism, whose root word is communal. Probably the most communal form of common government, is Isreal, though their Knesset is based on English common law.
Where Aaron is correct, the USA has a constitutional republic form of government. What is different from all other governments is our senate. Not only the way they debate more slowly than the house of representatives, but how they are elected. Two per state, so no matter how large, or small the state, each has input. Why do you think Sen. Byrd, D-Wva, is able to take your money, and use it in his state?
The other relative to the senate, is the house of lords in England. We elect our Lords, as opposed to the English way of naming them from some weird idea of land ownership. (Of course some may say that is how the USA does it.)
We also have separation of powers, while very rarely used in the latter half of the 20th century, and continues today. Which is unusual for any federal government. One of the reasons why, when voting for president,you must consider what type of judges he/she may nominate.
That brings me to the electoral college, a certainly misunderstood body, if I ever heard one. The original idea was to allow the smaller coastal states, and the New England states to have as equal a say as, say Virginia, Pennsylvania, or New York. The reason a presidential election still depends on the Electoral college, is that a presidential nominee must spend as much time in New Hampshire, or Iowa, as they do in California. As each state has the same senate votes.
That is why when some idiot says, " did you hear what he said on tv?" I want to smack them so hard they won't wake up until next Tuesday. Dig in to their resume. Find out what they have stood for, and vote intelligently. Not just for the monied man, but for the person you feel will do the most good for you and yours. Your vote counts. This country has a most atrocious voting turn-out. Do you really want me, I have voted faithfully for the last thirty years, to determine who is your next........... (fill in the blank)?
Samemf, voter apathy, alongside poor viewing habits, and the disdain of regular voters, who shape our government, is the apocryphal demise that the elite want you to believe. Why vote? Because it matters. The silly little people that stay at home on election day, and do nothing, are just silly little people. They don't care about anything, as long as it doesn't interfere with their stupid tv shows.
Vote, then no matter how much money any one else has, you will make the difference.
Ask big Al, I am long-winded, of course Al and I now seem to agree again. AAARRRGGGHH!
Dan

AAARRRGGGHHH!!!!

O.K. Dan, I got that out of my system too. Maybe the world won't come to an end tonite or Hell freeze over.

From the looks of all his posts yesterday Samemf may be ahead in the long-winded column, or at least tied with us.


I agree with much of what you say, but there is no form of Communism that will work because it just makes it easier for the despots or whatever to take over. The second problem with it is there is no government that will work without it's leaders having at least some belief in God to control their basic evil nature. Look at the results in every country that adopted Communism and rejected any form of worship. The results speak for themselves and that's all I have to say on that subject.

Again, you are correct about the lazy, gullible, indifferent and apathetic electorate in general. At best 40% want to listen to the nit-picking smoke & mirror campaigns right before the elections with no real idea what these axe grinding politicians are really about.

The press is just as bad. Who else is running besides the presidential candidates? You will hear basically nothing until maybe 2 weeks before the election, yet congress makes the laws and controls the money. 1/3 of the senate is running and 1/2 of the house, yet all we hear about is the presidency, the weakest part of the government which is supposed to deal mainly with foreign policy.

The solution to government corruption, malfeasance or whatever is simple: DON'T RE-ELECT ANYONE FOR 3 ELECTION CYCLES!!! By then you will have a whole new government and the entrenched parties will get the idea we have had enough and we ain't gonna take it anymore, and the lobbyists will be going crazy wondering who to drop their money on. The politicians will either straighten up and work on the country's real problems or we will continue to throw them out until they do. The country will get along in the meantime as the lower level bureaucrats keep the wheels turning anyhow.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents worth. Next?

Al.

[patmac]

Yeah.... Cuba is the worst system on the planet, people eat bad food, is trash practically talking, Hugo Chavez love Cuban system and he going us to a disaster apocalyptical. Communist is corrupt only governement people can have confort like car, house electrodomestics etc.

[Samemf]

thanks guys for the replys an interesting read ..

Sam

[Ingram]

I'm liking you guys more & more!

Thanks for expressing how I feel