Proof 9/11 was planned is in.

[Aaron]

@Aldwyn

The terrible thing isn't your stupidity, it's the fact that it makes you all so nuts that you are scary.

Are you here for some constructive discussion or are you simply here to
insult the members? You don't have to agree with the posts, but calling
people names and insulting them in other ways simply won't be tolerated.

[life4living]

Your point being? You are so deep into the myth of a US 9/11 conspiracy that you see things where they aren't. The windows blowing out as the building falls? Tell me how that could not happen if there is air in a building when it goes down? What happens to air when you compress the space that holds it?

The terrible thing isn't your stupidity, it's the fact that it makes you all so nuts that you are scary.

You poor person. No, I mean it. I feel compassion for you. You are asleep and you don't know it.

[Mad Scientist]

Grow up and think for yourselves!

Yes good idea, so think about this.
Bunch of terrorists fly plane into building, even thought they could barely fly a Cessna. Plane is totally destroyed all on board are killed, their bodies cremated in the fire, the building is totally destroyed. But we are told we know who did it! And how do we know, well the passport of one of the terrorists on the plane miraculously managed to survive all that fire and destruction and then floated down to land on top of the rubble where it was then conveniently found by the investigators.
It was then determined the terrorists came from Saudi Arabia and the attack was planned and carried out by some guy with a scruffy beard and a turban hiding in a cave on the other side of the world. So naturally the only logical thing for us to do was invade Iraq.

Then almost immediately the Patriot Act pops into existence sort of like it was just sitting there waiting for the right opportunity to be unleashed on the public. We are told all this extra security is done for our safety and protection yet the reality is we are slowly being turning us into a police state where our freedoms and liberty mean nothing. Of course if all of this security checking is truly being done to protect us from terrorists why then is our southern border wide open?

But we must never question our government officials as they are so much wiser then us, we need only do whatever they ask, we have no need to think, because they will tell us what to think, so trust your masters they will take good care of you.

[Slovenia]

Good Thread

Mad Scientist you are okay.

[Pamela Vicik-Smith]

I have no idea if Aldwyn is from the US or not. My guess is he is American. I say that because it appears to me that most people who are not from the states generally accept that 9/11 was an inside job. At least, most people I have had conversations with about the topic.

I remember when I first heard of the theory that our own government did this to us and I found it incredulous. But after viewing and reading hours worth of video, testimonies, and eye witness accounts, all doubt was removed.

I still have a lot of unanswered questions. I knew someone on the plane that purportedly flew into the Pentagon. If that plane did not fly into the Pentagon (and the evidence indicates it did not), what happened to it and the people on it? My guess is that it was deliberately crashed into the Atlantic, far enough away that no debris would ever surface. But who knows?

I have friends who are not part of this forum and generally speaking, do not think along the same lines that I think. However, even one of them is reading and viewing things on her own about the subject and is now almost convinced that 9/11 was an inside job.

Jesse Ventura has done a lot to help open peoples minds and to get them thinking and asking questions. It is amusing when my friend hears something he has said and then comes into work the next day all excited to tell me about it.

[aljhoa]

Your point being? You are so deep into the myth of a US 9/11 conspiracy that you see things where they aren't. The windows blowing out as the building falls? Tell me how that could not happen if there is air in a building when it goes down? What happens to air when you compress the space that holds it?

The terrible thing isn't your stupidity, it's the fact that it makes you all so nuts that you are scary.

YouTube - 9/11 Coincidences (7/19)

Insurance Scam?
Macro termite damage,
Let NYFD manage.
7-hour raging fire
Extinguished pulled wire.
Al

[Aldwyn]

Are you here for some constructive discussion or are you simply here to
insult the members? You don't have to agree with the posts, but calling
people names and insulting them in other ways simply won't be tolerated.

Constructive discussion of the 9/11 "truther" nonsense is impossible. Any rational person would have abandoned the irrational notion by now. The best that can be done is to plead with the believers to seek help.

[Aldwyn]

Yes good idea, so think about this.
Bunch of terrorists fly plane into building, even thought they could barely fly a Cessna. Plane is totally destroyed all on board are killed, their bodies cremated in the fire, the building is totally destroyed. But we are told we know who did it! And how do we know, well the passport of one of the terrorists on the plane miraculously managed to survive all that fire and destruction and then floated down to land on top of the rubble where it was then conveniently found by the investigators.
It was then determined the terrorists came from Saudi Arabia and the attack was planned and carried out by some guy with a scruffy beard and a turban hiding in a cave on the other side of the world. So naturally the only logical thing for us to do was invade Iraq.

Then almost immediately the Patriot Act pops into existence sort of like it was just sitting there waiting for the right opportunity to be unleashed on the public. We are told all this extra security is done for our safety and protection yet the reality is we are slowly being turning us into a police state where our freedoms and liberty mean nothing. Of course if all of this security checking is truly being done to protect us from terrorists why then is our southern border wide open?

But we must never question our government officials as they are so much wiser then us, we need only do whatever they ask, we have no need to think, because they will tell us what to think, so trust your masters they will take good care of you.

You yourself show the silliness of your belief. Why wouldn't one frame Iraqis if one wanted to use the incident to start a war with Iraq?

The Patriot Act is a terrible violation of the constitution, and if the idiots going on about this nonsense had not made half the fight against it sound insane, maybe we could have stopped it. If the government had wanted an excuse for the Patriot Act, or war with Iraq, why would they have attacked the World Trade Center and kill many of their rich friends and destroy so much of their own wealth? Why not kill thousands of common people at a sporting event? They could have done it simpler, not hurt the companies that support them, and saved billions of dollars in stock market losses.

The fact that there are inconsistencies in our laws and border practices does not in any way prove the bizarre, impossible, disproven theories proposed here.

[Aldwyn]

I have no idea if Aldwyn is from the US or not. My guess is he is American. I say that because it appears to me that most people who are not from the states generally accept that 9/11 was an inside job. At least, most people I have had conversations with about the topic.

I remember when I first heard of the theory that our own government did this to us and I found it incredulous. But after viewing and reading hours worth of video, testimonies, and eye witness accounts, all doubt was removed.

I still have a lot of unanswered questions. I knew someone on the plane that purportedly flew into the Pentagon. If that plane did not fly into the Pentagon (and the evidence indicates it did not), what happened to it and the people on it? My guess is that it was deliberately crashed into the Atlantic, far enough away that no debris would ever surface. But who knows?

I have friends who are not part of this forum and generally speaking, do not think along the same lines that I think. However, even one of them is reading and viewing things on her own about the subject and is now almost convinced that 9/11 was an inside job.

Jesse Ventura has done a lot to help open peoples minds and to get them thinking and asking questions. It is amusing when my friend hears something he has said and then comes into work the next day all excited to tell me about it.

Listen to yourself! You yourself KNOW someone who was on the plane that was crashed into the pentagon. Doesn't respect for that individual compel you to seek out the real, available, sane answers to these idiotic questions?

The people who believe in this nonsense have one thing in common, a lack of critical thinking skills. They see the real crimes of the Bush Administration that no one is stopping. They see an attack that is horrible. They need to make it all understandable in their world view, so they develop this mythology. It is a mythology that builds on itself, so that one part supports many others. It has become so self-feeding that they can no longer see the edges of it. If they will just examine some of the basic rules of critical thinking, then look at it again from the beginning, they will see it is nonsense, but few will.

[Mad Scientist]

If hey will just examine some of the basic rules of critical thinking, then look at it again from the beginning, they will see it is nonsense, but few will.

I agree basic rules of critical thinking are required so lets look at this from the beginning.

A plane flies into at building and the jet fuel bursts into flames. The resulting fire melts the steel support columns and the building collapses. A nice simple straight forward explanation if you all you do is just listen to the talking heads on radio and TV and don’t do any critical thinking.

But then we not suppose to ask questions like what is jet fuel, basically it’s kerosene, and what temperature does it burn at, well under ideal conditions about 1800 degrees, but we can see that it was oxygen starved because of all the black smoke, thus no 1800 degree flame. Of course if we want to melt steel we need around 2800 degrees, where did this extra heat come from?

Can we say thermite, an industrial compound used to cut and weld steel, and was found in debris. So why was it there? Because there is no legitimate reason for this explosive material to have been there in the first place?

If we ignore the thermite for the moment, even though there is ample evidence of its presents from its typical flow patterns and cut beams. But lets assume the burning kerosene was able to produce enough heat to simply weaken the steel and thus allow the beams to collapse. Ok in this scenario what is the likelihood that the fire would have uniformly heated up all the beams thus allowing them to collapse simultaneously? Is it not reasonable to expect that if this was the case that the fire would probably be hotter on one side of the building then the other? Then if the beams on that side buckled first that would cause the top of the tower to have fallen off to that side rather then straight down?

Of course it didn’t to that it fell straight down and it fell at a virtual free fall speed. How can that be? When the floors beneath the impact area were undamaged and thus retained there full strength.

Could the multiple explosions that many heard at ground and near ground level before the buildings started to collapse have something to do with why those lower floors collapsed?

Meanwhile over at the pentagon another plane(?) is flown into the side if it. We are told the terrorists made a 180 degree descending turn and hit the building at around 500 MPH. A feat that pilots who fly this type of plane say that could not do. When this twin engine plane hit the building the big heavy engines apparently bounced off the wall while the fuselage managed to punch a hole in it. Then the wings folded back and were sucked into the hole, or so we have been told to believe. Once inside the plane was totally consumed by fire along with the bodies of all the passengers. However we were able to identify them from their fingerprints. But the bodies of the people that worked that section of the building they were recovered and some even escaped the fire.

A CCN reporter who was on the scene shortly after it happened reported live on air that all he could be see "was a small hole and very little debris". Same reporter when asked a year latter what he saw that day said it was a large hole and wreckage was scattered all about. Was his hindsight that much better then his first impression? Or was he told to get in line with the official story?

Prior to 911 you might recall that Rumfield had a news conference where he mentioned that the pentagon had a small accounting problem in that they had lost track of a few trillion dollars. Well three guesses what part of the building that those records were keep in, along with the people that knew what they contained.

[rickoff]

If the government had wanted an excuse for the Patriot Act, or war with Iraq, why would they have attacked the World Trade Center and kill many of their rich friends and destroy so much of their own wealth? Why not kill thousands of common people at a sporting event? They could have done it simpler, not hurt the companies that support them, and saved billions of dollars in stock market losses.

Your reasoning may seem sound to you, but you fail to take into account these factors:

• The destruction of the WTC towers in New York City could be equated to an attack upon the heart of American capitalism, whereas an attack upon a sports stadium would only be a meaningless attack on human life.
• Very few of the supposed WTC "victims" actually died on 9/11. The towers had been largely vacated in the months prior to the event, and had been prepped for demolition. See this video series.
• The "rich friends" and cronies of the perpetrators were forewarned to stay away from the WTC site, and the friends and perpetrators used foreknowledge of the events to make a fortune in the markets using put options (bets that certain stocks, or stock indexes, would fall - which they certainly did). The stock market crash made many people unimaginably wealthy, while only the common investors - who panicked and sold their stock holdings right after the markets tanked - were the losers. Those who bought the shares that investors dumped at their lowest ebb in value were the winners in this scenario, much like Rothschild did after causing a market panic by starting a rumor that Napoleon had defeated the British at Waterloo, and then quietly buying up all the shares he could get his hands on for a mere pittance.
• Hardly any of the persons listed as passengers on the four airliners that supposedly crashed actually appear in the Social Security Death Index, and many of these "victims," who were featured in a CNN 9/11 victims memorial website with accompanying photos, were fraudulently posted there. IPTC metadata embedded in these photos shows that several of these, such as Mark Bingham's tribute, were prepared before 9/11. The graduation photo used for the tribute, and obtained by AP wire services, was taken in 1993, so why the sudden interest in Mark Bingham on August 30, 2001, the date his photo was labeled with the AP identifier and IPTC data added to identify Bingham as an "ATTACKS AIRLINE VICTIM?" Are we supposed to believe that, sometime between August 30th and September 11th, AP was going to release a story about Mark Bingham graduating in 1993? Any sane and logical thinking person would have to say definitely not! The only reasonable conclusion we can make, therefore, is that the IPTC "Date created" data obviously points a finger at 9/11 foreknowledge that Mark Bingham would be reported as one of the "victims" of flight 93.

I could go on and on and on about the many things concerning the "official" story of 9/11 that are preposterous, but I'm sure that as a believer of that story you would only dismiss all of it out of hand without ever objectively examining the overwhelming inside job evidence. After all, any believer of the "official" story will conclude that there must be some logical explanation to each contrary evidence that is presented. What you should first do is to ask yourself why it is that the 9/11 Commission members themselves stated that they were lied to, and their investigation was impaired and obfuscated by government agencies. After all, their report - which is based upon these lies and omissions - is the "official" story of what happened on 9/11, and the story that you believe.

Rick

[ztec2002]

9/11 the myth and the reaity

type 9/11 the myth and the reality , by david ray griffin . in the you tube search bar and watch it then ask yourself .why the government does't go toe to toe with scientists on both sides . proving the facts than it would be laid to rest or jail
cheers:

[Mad Scientist]

Thank you for sharing, your observations are interesting.
At most major accident or crime scenes one of the first things authorities do is to tape off the area so some tiny bit of evidence will not by chance be lost. Then the proper individuals come in and take the time to carefully sort through and record everything that might be of interest.

Yet here it seemed like they couldn’t start the clean up fast enough. Why was that? Could it be that those in control didn’t the world to see what you saw?

[FRC]

Relative

John A. Ogonowski (February 24, 1951 – September 11, 2001) was a pilot and an agricultural activist. He was piloting American Airlines Flight 11 when it was hijacked and flown into the North Tower of the World Trade Center as part of the 9/11 attacks. A resident of Dracut, Massachusetts, Ogonowski was a leading figure on behalf of farming in Massachusetts, particularly for immigrant farmers from Cambodia,[1] whom he assisted as part of the New Entry Sustainable Farming Project

John Ogonowski was believed to be a relative of our family, but have not verified it yet. Ogonowski was my Grandmother's maiden name.

FRC

[aljhoa]

The Investigation Team was cautious about using these results directly in the formulation of collapse hypotheses. In addition to the scaling issues raised by the test results, the fires in the towers on September 11, and the resulting exposure of the floor systems, were substantially different from the conditions in the test furnaces. Nonetheless, the results established that this type of assembly was capable of sustaining a large gravity load, without collapsing, for a substantial period of time relative to the duration of the fires in any given location on September 11.
http://wtc.nist.gov/pubs/NISTNCSTAR1Draft.pdf

How Could Thermite, an Incendiary, Demolish the Towers, When Buildings Are Normally Demolished Using High-Explosive Cutter Charges?
Why Weren't Demolition Charges Triggered by the Plane Crashes or the Subsequent Fires?
Explosive Residues: Energetic Materials and the World Trade Center Destruction

YouTube - No explosives in WTC: No Booms = No dynamite

Al