Recession Ending

[Vortex]

?GRAY AREA? ... Ask yourself: Why is that?

If not in a Gray Area, things are hidden in plain sight!!!
Ask yourself why was this symbol :

was replaced with this symbol:


It was important enough to make the change from a double
to a single vertical line through the S ..
THERE is NOT a double vertical line dollar sign on your keyboard.
Ask yourself: Why is that? (in plain sight!)

[future pather]

Do you mean the theory that the single line denotes no gold backing the dollar?

If so, I think this is just a myth judging by the following exchange. Especially since the one who brought it up only posts once (like maybe not a regular, just spreading a rumor) and does not site any references when asked to do so:

Localised dollar signs | Typophile

[Vortex]

Do you mean the theory that the single line denotes no gold backing the dollar?

If so, I think this is just a myth judging by the following exchange. Especially since the one who brought it up only posts once (like maybe not a regular, just spreading a rumor) and does not site any references when asked to do so:

Localised dollar signs | Typophile

Here's a smoking gun:

It's in Philadelphia, go check it out Jess.

I said Nothing about a "theory".
Is it a "rumor" that the dollar sign use to have to vertical lines? I think not,
see image above.

The easier answer might be when did the single vertical line symbol come
into existence? Knowing that might sync up with other things happening
at that time frame that CAUSED it to be changed.

How does one change an entire country from using double strike dollars signs
to using single strike dollars signs? Who makes that happen? Who made sure
all the printers, newspapers and type writers were changed?
This took great effort and expense .. it must have been VERY IMPORTANT to
make the change and thusly the reason for the change must be equally
as important.

It wasn't until the Morgan silver dollar 1878-1921 did the
phase "In God We Trust" shows up.
Ask yourself: Why is that?
It would seem that before the Morgan silver dollar, we did not trust in God.
Or might it be that the phase is meant to mean something entirely different
than we think... again something else in plain sight?

Dollar/Peso sign - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Just my thoughts about it.
Randy

[future pather]

Sorry Randy,

I'm really not following. I am not at all claiming it's a myth that the double stroke has been often used as a symbol for US currency.

What I think is a myth is that it was changed all of a sudden and that there is a meaning to the change.

Jessica

[ANTIQUER]

Why public defenders & tax money?

Jessica; an interesting statement from one whose father is a lawyer.

And besides, our tax dollars go to attorneys to represent prostitutes whenever a prostitute gets arrested and requests a public defender. It's bc the government places so much importance on civil rights, even those of prostitutes.

Without impugning your father's motives, as I do not know him personally,I will express the opinion that too many lawyers are greedy,egotistical and self-centered.
As an example we have a prominent attorney here whose punch line in his t.v. commercials is "Morgan & Morgan; for the people". When asked about the exorbitant fees he collected in a certain case in relation to his punch line he replied "Well, I'm one of the people" He was later arrested on D.U.I.charges and got away with only a $250.00 fine, no probation, no suspension or loss of license.
As for Public Defenders they "park" in the p.d.'s office as an internship on their way to a higher goal while learning the ropes in the realistic world of criminal law.

Everyone in the system here knows if you cannot afford to hire a lawyer and are appointed a P.D. you are doomed.I recently asked two deputies and a city cop I know about the fate of an acquaintance of mine who was arrested, could not afford a lawyer and was assigned a P.D. All 3 immediately replied "Oh, he's toast!"

The law requiring the public to pay for defense of the indigent lawbreakers basically pays for the upkeep of the P.D.s and is a way of guaranteeing same until they can move on to more lucrative fields.

Unfortunately, our justice system has become a legal system seriously lacking in justice . The P.D.'s mostly guide the client through the system and usually make a plea bargain to keep the jails and the court docket from becoming more crowded than they are and to collect the $40.00 per visit to their probation officer while on probation. (Of course they are also collecting exorbitant fines and court costs during this time.) Their concern is the welfare of the system, not that of the client. If as sometimes happens the court appoints a a practicing attorney from outside the public defenders office to serve in a voluntary capacity they urge the client to make a plea deal so as to spend as little time as possible on them and shove the case through the system.

I'm sure you will disagree with much I have said but I speak from experiences of my own and of people I have known. In summary the P.D.'s office, as with most of the system, is merely a way for lawyers to make money, not dispense justice nor protect the rights of prostitutes, etc. and it is just as screwed up as any other part of the government.

This is nothing new. The editor of the Tombstone, Arizona Gazette commented in the mid 1880's " The only way we are going to have any justice in this country is to shoot all the lawyers."

Al

[future pather]

My father is not a public defender. He generally works where he receives no pay unless he wins a case for his client by proving an injustice, and his pay comes out of the winnings.

I believe in the law. Without it people would be free to murder and steal. Lawyers are experts in how the law works.

Anyone can study it but most are too lazy. Then they complain if they need an attorney. It's not the attorney's fault.

Regarding previous posts about ACORN, I wanted to point out that it turns out to be a complete lie that Obama ever worked for them. Also the voter fraud stuff was untrue or portrayed completely wrong.

The actual situation regarding the so claimed voter fraud is described at 8:20 in the following MSNBC news story:

http://salsa.wiredforchange.com/o/27...paign_KEY=2977

[rickoff]

"complete lie?" "untrue or portrayed wrong?"

Regarding previous posts about ACORN, I wanted to point out that it turns out to be a complete lie that Obama ever worked for them. Also the voter fraud stuff was untrue or portrayed completely wrong.

I didn't post anything about Obama that I can recollect, however here are the facts concerning his involvement with ACORN:

• First, Obama ran a voter registration program for an ACORN affiliate. Could this be where the workers were educated in all their recorded fraudulent methods?
• Next he worked as an advocate and an attorney on key legal cases for ACORN.
• He then proceeded to conduct training programs for ACORN’s staff and workers.
• In the presidential campaign he spoke to a number of ACORN gatherings and promised them they would have a significant input in his new administration (all on video).
• During the 2008 presidential campaign, ACORN received 800 thousand dollars from the Obama organization to help in getting out the vote. Does all this sound like an insignificant, oblique association?

Regarding your statement that the voter registration fraud "stuff" was "untrue or portrayed wrong:"

It would appear that you are suggesting that I am either a liar, or didn't have my facts straight. In post #19, I had said, "ACORN and its top officials are under indictment in 15 states for voter fraud and related activities. Last month Las Vegas election officials said that 48% of the voter registration forms gathered by ACORN workers were clearly fraudulent." These are factual statements, and a matter of public record. Have your lawyer dad check the validity of these statements if you don't know how, and I'm sure he will agree. Also, I believe he could tell you that indictments don't just happen because some individual or special interest group makes assertions of wrongdoing against ACORN. Indictments require the existence of substantiated evidence of wrongdoing, and in the case of ACORN the evidence was not only substantiated by the voter registration forms they filed, but was also very substantial, resulting in by far the largest voter registration fraud in history. The allegations of fraud were initiated not by right-wing radicals hoping to stir up trouble for ACORN, but rather by election commission officials who discovered the massive fraud and abuse, and who reported it to state attorney generals, the US attorney general, and federal election officials. Take this video interview, for example, of the Kansas City, Missouri director of the Board of Elections: YouTube - FOXNews Story on Voter Fraud in Missouri
In Kansas City, ACORN filed 35,000 voter registration forms, and 40% of these were found to be fraudulent. This was not simply small mistakes by a few workers that could be chalked up to human error, as the ACORN apologist, near the mid point of the video, would have you believe. ACORN employees have filed registrations for felons serving prison sentences (who of course can not legally vote excepting in two states), have registered countless deceased people, and have repeatedly filed multiple registrations for a single individual using multiple birth dates, addresses, and social security numbers. In a great many instances, the names of those being "registered" appear to have been simply pulled out of a telephone book, since the actual people said they had never filled out a form and that their signatures had been forged.

The newscasters in the video which you cited as an example to nullify ACORN's wrongdoings stated that voter registration fraud is not the same thing as voter fraud, so we are supposed to believe that no harm was actually done. If you would believe that then I have a bridge I would like to sell to you. You can safely bet that ACORN keeps copies of those registrations on file. Now suppose that for every registration record ACORN possesses, that they pay an illegal alien (or anyone else willing to do something illegal for money) to use this information to cast a vote on election day as instructed by ACORN. One such person could actually vote multiple times and in multiple districts by this manner, with little chance of being detected. In the last presidential election, I walked into a local gymnasium and approached a table where some people had a list of registered voters. A lady asked for my name, and when I responded she simply put a check mark on her list, beside my name. I was not asked for verification of identity. Now suppose that someone just walks in, points to an unchecked name on the list and says, "That's me." The impostor casts their vote. Since about half of all eligible voters do not vote in most elections, there's an even chance that no one would ever show up to question why their name had previously be checked off. But suppose that I had come in and seen a check mark had already been applied next to my name. What do you suppose would happen? If I proved my identity and raised a stink then they would probably let me vote, but the ballot of the person who had used my name would already have been counted, and could not possibly be located and nullified. This would have the effect of nullifying my legal vote. The allowance to vote by absentee ballot further ensures fraudulent activity. One ACORN worker, for example, could fraudulently fill in hundreds, or even thousands of absentee ballots bearing the names of deceased individuals and prisoners, and submit these at city hall absentee ballot boxes. Do you think that is far fetched? Think again. In New York state, for example, an analysis done by a Poughkeepsie newspaper matched names, dates of birth and ZIP codes in the state's database of 11.7 million voter registration records against the same information in the Social Security Administration's "Death Master File." They found that the list contained as many as 77,000 dead people on its voter registration rolls, and that as many as 2,600 of them had cast votes from the grave. Do you think that registration of felons is not a real problem? Think again. A study conducted by the Florida Sun Sentinel in late October 2008 found:

• More than 65,000 ineligible and duplicate voters on Florida's registration rolls, which included:
• 600 dead people on the list.
• 32,000 multiple-registered voters.
• More than 33,000 convicted felons who should not be eligible to vote.
• In the final five weeks before voter registration closed Oct. 6, Florida added more than 2,600 ineligible felons to the rolls.

It should be noted that a bill to require voter identification and eligibility verification was introduced well before the 2008 presidential election. While this would have resulted in a massive reduction in voting fraud, the bill was defeated. Can you guess why, and which political party was most likely to benefit from the defeat?

Surely any sane person must admit that registration fraud is essential to actual voting fraud, and is not an insignificant problem by any means. We might never have known the extent of ACORN's involvement in voter registration fraud had their workers not been so sloppy and outrageous in their filings, and if ACORN supervisors had conducted oversight to remove highly suspicious and blatantly bogus forms. ACORN fully deserves the backlash that this failed oversight has brought them.

Rick

[Aaron]

unemployment stats

The unemployment rate keeps climbing but I wonder if the stats are completely underplayed.

I don't know if it is this way in the rest of the U.S., but this is how it is here... If someone is on unemployment, they are in the stats. But after 2 years if they are still not employed, they lose their unemployment benefits. At that point, they are NOT in the unemployment stats anymore, yet they are still unemployed.

Is that kind of stat manipulation applicable elsewhere or is that just here?

[jibbguy]

I think yer right about that Aaron

Inflation, Money Supply, GDP, Unemployment and the Dollar - Alternate Data Series

[rickoff]

Re: Unemployment stats

The unemployment rate keeps climbing but I wonder if the stats are completely underplayed.

I don't know if it is this way in the rest of the U.S., but this is how it is here... If someone is on unemployment, they are in the stats. But after 2 years if they are still not employed, they lose their unemployment benefits. At that point, they are NOT in the unemployment stats anymore, yet they are still unemployed.

Is that kind of stat manipulation applicable elsewhere or is that just here?

This is a tricky question. The US Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) claims that Unemployment Insurance statistics are not compiled by them, and are not used in determining unemployment rates. Here is what the Bureau of Labor Statistics has to say about it:
----------------------------------

What do the unemployment insurance (UI) figures measure?

The UI figures are not produced by the Bureau of Labor Statistics. Statistics on insured unemployment in the United States are collected as a by-product of UI programs. Workers who lose their jobs and are covered by these programs typically file claims ("initial claims") that serve as notice that they are beginning a period of unemployment. Claimants who qualify for benefits are counted in the insured unemployment figures (as "continued claims"). Data on UI claims are maintained by the Employment and Training Administration, an agency of the U.S. Department of Labor, and are available on the Internet at: http://workforcesecurity.doleta.gov/unemploy/claims.asp.
These data are not used to measure total unemployment because they exclude several important groups. To begin with, not all workers are covered by UI programs. For example, self-employed workers, unpaid family workers, workers in certain not-for-profit organizations, and several other small (primarily seasonal) worker categories are not covered. In addition, the insured unemployed exclude the following:

• Unemployed workers who have exhausted their benefits
• Unemployed workers who have not yet earned benefit rights (such as new entrants or reentrants to the labor force)
• Disqualified workers whose unemployment is considered to have resulted from their own actions rather than from economic conditions; for example, a worker discharged for misconduct on the job
• Otherwise eligible unemployed persons who do not file for benefits

--------------------------------------------------

According to BLS, those who are counted for unemployment statistics are defined as being "Persons classified as unemployed if they do not have a job, have actively looked for work in the prior 4 weeks, and are currently available for work."

I do see a major problem with this definition, because this still leaves a lot of people seemingly unaccounted for. So where does their data actually come from each month, and just what people are not considered to be in the labor pool, which would exclude them from being included in statistics?
------------------------------------------------
According to BLS:
Where do the statistics come from?

Because unemployment insurance records relate only to persons who have applied for such benefits, and because it is impractical to actually count every unemployed person each month, the Government conducts a monthly sample survey called the Current Population Survey (CPS) to measure the extent of unemployment in the country. The CPS has been conducted in the United States every month since 1940 when it began as a Work Projects Administration program. It has been expanded and modified several times since then.

Who is not in the labor force?

Persons not in the labor force are those who are not classified as employed or unemployed during the survey reference week.
Labor force measures are based on the civilian noninstitutional population 16 years old and over. (Excluded are persons under 16 years of age, all persons confined to institutions such as nursing homes and prisons, and persons on active duty in the Armed Forces.) The labor force is made up of the employed and the unemployed. The remainder—those who have no job and are not looking for one—are counted as "not in the labor force." Many who are not in the labor force are going to school or are retired. Family responsibilities keep others out of the labor force.

How large is the labor force?

On average in 2008, there were roughly 145 million employed and 9 million unemployed making up a labor force of 154 million persons. There were about 80 million persons not in the labor force.
-----------------------------------------------------

Okay, so the statistics are based on the CPS, a monthly sample survey. We all know that sample surveys only survey a small percentage of the population. Let's say that 2% of the population is actually surveyed within a given month, and even that would be a gargantuan untertaking requiring surveyal of 468,000 people. From this survey they exclude everyone they surveyed who is not considered to be in the labor force (the elderly, those in nursing homes or prisons, those who are under 16 years of age or who are students, and of course "those who have no job and are not looking for one." I think it is this last group that we need to be most concerned with. This would include everyone who is not working and who either does not want to work or has given up on actively looking for a job. Whatever the reason they are not working, even though they are able to, they are still unemployed, and should be included in unemployment statistics. Even if they were, though, is a 2% survey really representative of actual unemployment statistics? Of course not. Unemployment statistics could be far more representative of the facts if simply based upon total outlay of costs in all welfare, subsidization, and entitlement programs, which is what all legally employed persons are paying for. And I consider the "legally employed" distinction to be an important one. It has been estimated that perhaps 20 million or more illegal aliens are now currently residing in the US. Some are employed, and many are not. These illegals are not included in unemployment statistics, and yet they do take full advantage of welfare programs and medical care that legally employed and retired persons are paying for in taxes.

So, in conclusion, we can safely say that government figures on unemployment are pretty much slanted and useless information that has little, if any, true bearing upon the facts. We do know, however, that even these figures do say that surveyed unemployment rates have dramatically increased since the beginning of 2009, and have continued rising nearly every month since Barack Obama's inauguration, despite massive "economic stimulus" spending.

2009 Month:Jan=7.6 Feb=8.1 Mar=8.5 Apr=8.9 May=9.4 Jun=9.5 Jul=9.4 Aug=9.7 Sep=9.8% umemployment rate
(source = BLS)

So things aren't changing for the better, and aren't likely to.

To get an idea of how severe the unemployment problem may actually be, let's use Pittsburgh as an example. There are roughly 300 thousand people living in Pittsburgh. Using the BLS statement as to what people are actually included in the labor force, we can extrapolate that 34% of the people in Pittsburgh (or any other location in the US, for that matter)are not considered as part of the labor force or included in statistics, and that would represent 102,000 people. Deduct that from 300,000, and that leaves a "labor force" of 198,000 people. Recent statistics show that there are roughly 58,000 unemployed people in Pittsburgh's labor force, so this equates to a 29% unemployment rate based upon BLS standards, or about 3 times the national average. Since we know that a large number of people are not accounted for, the situation is quite likely far worse than the 29% figure would indicate, and this is just the story of one city.

Rick

[Aaron]

local unemployment

But after 2 years if they are still not employed, they lose their unemployment benefits. At that point, they are NOT in the unemployment stats anymore, yet they are still unemployed.

A friend stopped by and he mentioned that unemployment benefits here are for 6 months not 2 years. In either case, for the local unemployment rate, when someone goes off unemployment here, they aren't counted as unemployed.

The job situation here is getting worse and worse.

He has one of the most successful food businesses in town, cafeteria, cafe and also catering. He put an ad in craigslist for an assistant that would do everything from food prep to washing dishes. He said he literally had about 50 people responding and quite a few were very over qualified. Experienced chefs, etc... and many would be happy working minimum wage just to do something.

I'm very thankful I do all my work online and am not limited to the US economy!

[Aaron]

economy

Rick,

That is troublesome the amount of people that aren't counted as part of the work force.

I haven't seen any evidence that any of the "stimulus" package that was of course passed under threat of martial law (treason) has contributed anything whatsoever to creating jobs.
YouTube - Rep. Brad Sherman Martial Law
YouTube - Michael Burgess - martial law over night
YouTube - Paulson Was Behind Bailout Martial Law Threat
YouTube - Kaptur calls Pelosi, Paulson CRIMINALS!!!

Even the auto sales appear to be dropping back down so the token program of cash for clunkers, etc... was only a very, very short term boost, which had no significant effect long term for any of the automakers.

[rickoff]

when someone goes off unemployment here, they aren't counted as unemployed.

The job situation here is getting worse and worse.

As mentioned in my previous post, the Bureau of Labor Standards (BLS)does not base any statistics on Unemployment Insurance data. So whether a person goes on unemployment insurance or off that insurace because it expires has no bearing whatsoever on BLS statistical data, unless the unemployed person just happens to be one of a very small segment of the population that is surveyed each month by BLS. BLS has done these monthly surveys since 1940, and while I had used an example of perhaps 2% of the population being a part of the monthly survey, the actual figure is probably way less than that - perhaps 2/10 of 1 %. So it is a safe bet to say that any individual in your area, or anywhere else in the US, probably has no effect at all upon unemployment statistics. I'm 64, and have never been included in a BLS survey. About the only reliable information coming from these surveys is that they do show that things are getting worse, but they afford us no idea how bad things may actually be. That's why I cited the Pittsburgh example at the bottom of my previous post. Incidentally, this news just came in, concerning unemployment, from our former Fed chairman and plunderer of US wealth:

"Former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan predicts that the unemployment rate will push past 10 percent and stay at that level for a while. 'Pretty awful' is how Greenspan describes Friday's report that the unemployment rate has risen to 9.8 percent."

The stated unemployment rate, until this year, had not reached 9 % since 1983, when Paul Volcker was Fed chairman. Currently, Volcker is the chairman of the newly formed Economic Recovery Advisory Board under President Barack Obama. Interesting tidbit, huh?

As you say, Aaron, the job situation is getting worse and worse, and not just in Pittsburgh, or in Washington state, where you live. It's happening everywhere. The actual unemployment rate is likely way higher than we are led to believe, so when words like "pretty awful" are used to describe the situation, you can be sure that is an understatement.

Rick

[Mad Scientist]

If you listen to some of the economists the ones that are not connected with some government agency they agree that 9-10% unemployment is unrealistic and in reality it is probably twice that. They also predict that like the housing markets collapse it is likely that the commercial loan market will be next.

With people losing their jobs and homes there is less need for commercial property. So as a result those individuals who went heavily into debt to develop commercial property if they find that they are now unable to rent or lease that property they stand to lose not thousands of dollars like the homeowner but millions of dollars. For our economy that would be like the sound of the other shoe hitting the floor.

What we are watching here would appear to the controlled demolition of our economy in preparation for a new world order.

[TRON]

Dont Get Suckered

There definitely seems to be a lot of new incentives. That is great if it works out long term.

In my area, I'm just keeping my eye on available properties, listed and private.

At these prices and soon to be better, I'd be crazy not to walk into that kind of equity.

Sure things look like a great buy... thats what the global bank wants you to think... you buy a home at a reduced price... then when the economy levels out??? Who is actually going to buy it from you at a profit? you will be stuck with it!
Our world is going global, one world bank will control it all, taxes on every move you make... this is just the beginning of sorrows.. if i were you, i would save as much money as i could under the mattress!, for hard times ahead

Much worse than this little bump

Search: The Obama Deception on youtube and watch the 2 hour film... it opened my eyes !

im going to buy copies from prisonplanet.tv and randomly give them away to people all across my state, if they will simply commit to sitting thru one time and passing it on to a friend

If you have a house... do what you can to lower to a fixed rate and stay in it, pay it off, pay off the credit cards, live on cupons and food discounts, buy dented food cans, get assistance from a food bank... start hoarding all your cash... read books, dont spend money THE GREAT DEPRESSION IS COMING AGAIN!