Use for the Tesla Switch

[John_Bedini]

Tesla Switch

Nvisser,
You are correct as the parallel switch can not be replaced at its time, I'm working on that and will post if I get it working.
Thanks
John

[blackchisel97]

parallel switch

Was this circuit aproved by John?The scr`s was his idea but I cannot recall that he said we can just remove the parallel switch transistors.He said he will think about it
Well, Mea Culpa I tried and you're right about feedback through diodes. Just lost D1,D5 and one diode which I had in series with triac. Triac miraculously survived. It was calm without a load and I could see switching on the scope but as soon as I connected #47 load they cracked open.
Oscillator works good. I'll think about later today. Need a nap, almost 4am.

Thanks

Vtech

[ldissing]

Notes are invaluable...if you look at them!

Was this circuit aproved by John. The scr`s was his idea but I cannot recall that he said we can just remove the parralel switch transistors.He said he will think about it. Without them it looks like the series voltage can feedback on itself through the other diodes. Is that not why Idissing are frying diodes and scr`s?

@nvisser:
Thank you for pointing it out to me! You know...that is what notes are for. I'd worked this out before and come to the same conclusion. Then, I go off on a tangent and do not consult my prior conclusions and blow more stuff up in one day then I ever did before.

The reason it "appeared" to work before, was that I did not have the lower diodes of the upper diode pairs connected up to the other side. When I went to hook it up Brandt style, I noticed what I had done (previously, by not connecting those diodes) and willi nilli (sp) connected them up via the original circuit I had in my head, and a feedback roasting I went.

Now, that doesn't mean that the SCR can not be utilized. It can and it does work as well as the transistor but some work is yet to be done.

@ldissing: Look at your notes, moron! Hey ldissing, you're talking to yourself again. Oh, ldissing that's me, time to go do some work.

Leroy

[nvisser]

Loads

I found 6v 50ma pilot lamps today. They will be perfect to connect in parralel to find the correct load.

[ldissing]

Back in business

I'm back in business just in time to pack to leave. Good and bad, but at least I did have enough parts to build again. No more testing for a while, hope you are all successful in getting your systems up and running. Do NOT do what I did and try to go too fast, guys. Be like the turtle, go slow and keep your parts intact and not in the ceiling...or melted on the bench. You may all be smarter than I, probably are, but just a word of caution.

Leroy

[ldissing]

Leroy,
Sorry but work calls, here is my battery test. The battery is out of an alarm box and the battery would not take a charge so I just used it in the test machine. I just left it on the potential switch to see what would happen. At first you can see the surface charge and then it fall down under the 1 amp load which is way to much for this battery, but I did it anyway. so here is what a dead battery did that could not be charged.
JohnB

Meant to thank you for posting the battery discharge results. Looks like you did get some load powering charge in there. That is awesome, if I'm not mistaken this was off the scalar charger?

Leroy

[ldissing]

3 uses

Leroy,
The switch has three function it can do if you give it a little more thought.

John B

JB,

3 purposes for the switch:

1. Charging batteries
2. Running loads
3. Refrigeration

I think you are going to run the switch under water because it is a better conductor of "heat" than air. So, the water will keep the switch from freezing by moving heat to the switch.

Even close?

Leroy

[Helijason]

Larger batteries?

@ John

I'm curious what you expect larger AH batteries will do in this circuit?

If we get the switch working with lower potentials then the next step would be to increase that potential, right?

Regards, Jason

[John_Bedini]

tesla Switch

Helijason,
Right
John B

@ John

I'm curious what you expect larger AH batteries will do in this circuit?

If we get the switch working with lower potentials then the next step would be to increase that potential, right?

Regards, Jason

[ldissing]

What the TS does

John B,

I've been thinking a lot about this circuit. The lower section with the load could be hooked up at least two ways or more, but I know that the circuit you posted is the correct circuit, so I am not questioning the circuit. Just WHAT is happening.

It is very interesting that the output from the two diodes coming from the negative, hook directly to the collector of the transistor on the "other" side. They could have been hooked up on the collector of the transistor on the "same" side, but they aren't.

1. Two diodes connected to "same" side transistors collector. If we look at this case first, we see that the "positive" (two diode output) side would flow through the load, through the transistor, and finally to the "negative" of the 24V side. This would be what a "normal" person would do if they wanted to drive a load, right? But this would consume current and potential. It would also limit current and potential arbitrarily based on the load.

2. Two diodes connected to "other" side transistors collector. In this scenario, the load is totally bypassed. So, what is actually happening here. The way I'm thinking about it is, that the positive potential is pushed away, and directed to the "load". The negative of the 24V side is unable to accept this potential, so some is pushed back (not all), to the only other place it can go, which is to the cap/bridge/load. The capacitor across the bridge will accept this potential, thus it can charge up. We are looking for the heavyside flow, which is rejected by the battery it is trying to enter, thus our load can see it, via the capacitor which can accept this energy and convert it to positive energy.

It will run either way, because I've tried both cases, but I'm sure the one posted on your site is the correct one.

BTW, the wave form with the SCR (from anode to cathode), the switching part, is quite a bit deeper than with the MJL21194s by about 2 volts. It is quite steep on the down slope, but both have a less steep incline back to the top...and it does overshoot the "normal" top when the duty cycle is increased on either device.

I'm going to stop bothering everyone with my thoughts, and just do some engineering for a while...when I get back.

I have seen some below ambient temperatures on the devices, but not freezing yet. That also depends on the duty cycle and frequency and I'm sure my load is not quite right yet.

Still can't get my head around the load. You are using an inductor and a light in the scalar battery charger, I'm sure this would also work as the load. I am currently just using a small 3.2-3.8V bulb at 20ma current max. I do have a cap across it but it is not a solid light, it is always lit, but is brighter as the pulse fires. I do get pretty good charging when the output (scope across the cap in the bridge) has multiple peaks in it. That duty cycle is not the max, I haven't measured it yet. Your skill with impedance is awesome, I wish I had a better understanding so I could progress faster. Lots of studying to do.

Is the capacitor/bridge/Load + cap/bridge/capacitor needed on the output side. Could a bridge be utilized without the caps on either side. I mean, I know it can, but would that limit what we are trying to see/understand?
Leroy

[ErikN]

First post - scalar charger w/SCR

Hi All,

I've been a member of this forum for a year or two, but finally decided I had something worth posting, so here it goes.

I built the 3 battery switch John suggested recently using MJL21194s. Hooked it up to 3 very poor batteries and was able to see all of them increase in voltage. Shorting out C-E of individual transistors, you could see which battery was affected. I only made mental notes, but it's easy to try and very enlightening. Be sure to scope across C-E, that seems to be where the magic is.

Next I built a scalar charger from the H11D1, MJL21194s, 1uf, U8100E (diode), I also place a red LED with 330 ohm resistor in series with the H11D1s so I could watch them turn on. For a driver, I simply used a square pulse from a signal generator and hooked the opto pairs up in reverse, so one would fire on the + signal and the other on the -. Oh, the caps are 330uf 35V in parallel with 10000uf 100V (for each transistor).

I started with an old, but pretty decent 1.7ah 12V makita battery charged from an RC-1AU. It's resting voltage started a bit over 13v. I used a small auto bulb for a load of ~90ma. A one point, the battery only lost .01V over 2 hours, so I may have had something close to right, but could never repro it. Kept tinkering with pulse/freq and battery kept draining until I stopped at 12.2 or so.

It sat until tonight when I placed a 2n6509 SCR in parallel with the middle MJL21194 and hooked up a separate opto for it, so the middle MJL isn't used. A spare home made 4 strand inductor (each strand in series & no clue about the inductance) for my load. Not sure if this is significant, but one of the wires is iron, two ~23ga and one 26ga. A little debugging and I had it running and was seeing nice spikes on the scope. A little more tweaking and voila! The battery started charging!

I've attached scope shot across K/A of the SCR. The first (DSCF8601) is charging the best about .01V every couple minutes, then I began increasing the drive voltage (to de-tune it) and show the sequence of shots. Charging gets progressively worse, until the last (DSCF8610) which charges pretty well, but not as good as the first.

So here is what stood out for me tonight...

Start with a low frequency. 9hz was too low for me to see on the scope, but 50-60 hz worked well.

John started with a dead battery. So did I, it's easier to see the voltage rise when you get the circuit tuned.

Remember how to tune your SG?
Adjust the base current. I did this by adjusting the drive voltage to the optos.
Tune to a single pulse. By adjusting the base current on the optos until you get a single spike/pulse.
Tuning appears to be independant of the operating frequency.

Way past my bedtime tonight. Hopefully I'm onto something and the photos will help someone else!

Thanks John Bedini, I think a few SG lessons hit home tonight!

Erik

[Inquorate]

Every now and then..

Every now and then, someone makes one hell of an entrance to the forum with a superb 1st post..



Thankyou for sharing your observations ErikN, it's great to finally hear from you

Edit: funny that you say the sg lessons finally drove home - I've been finding the same, along with others like ren; as if the schoolgirl was intended to show how to charge a battery without current, just potential.

Love and light

[Inquorate]

Transistors in 3 battery switch behaving like mechanical switch

Hi all, after seeing the scope shots ErikN posted, I thought I'd seen similar patterns before so I looked and found I have.. It was the first thing I looked at with my scope when I got it.

YouTube - scope of sparking on mechanical switch

Look at the scope around 2:50

So, Thankyou John_Bedini for showing us how to use transistors in such a way as to replicate the sharp on and off times that can be managed albeit with difficulty with a mechanical switch.

I was beginning to lose hope that transistors could do this.

[lamare]

I would agree with this and have attached two pdf's I wrote some time ago after noticing dentrite growths on the electrodes of water cells and then subsequently lead acid battery cells.

Thanks Dave, it looks interesting. I have reposted this at the theoretical thread:

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...html#post76537

[StevanC]

negative going BJT

Mr. John Bedini
Does this mean negative resistance like on the welding arc?
Like switching it with 50mA and still getting it to saturate as if it where switched with 500mA?

I think i just begin to follow - or loosing it altogether...
Stevan C.

blackchise,
No I'm using the MJL21194 because when switching it can go negative. I know this because we have built negative resistance oscillators with them. Peter L also knows this device goes negative.
John B