Use for the Tesla Switch

[ldissing]

Team, I am not advocating that we change the design that we have going on but maybe have the need to change the firing sequence a bit. Originally it was said that S1,S3, and S6 fired together. Let's classify these as group 1 and S2, S4, and S5 as group 2. When group 1 fires, (looking at the schematic) it would appear that we just need a slight delay for the devices within group 1 and the same for group 2. John did say there are 16 switching points for consideration.

Just my thoughts,

Bit's

There are sixteen switching points in the solar charger. He has a bi-polar circuit (6 transistors) in there too besides the TS and there may be two TS in there because of the 4 capacitors. If there are two TS in there, then more switching points too, because he has to control which side he is charging, and which side he is discharging. Creates a lot of switching points to get it all working, but the circuits are not complicated.

This is all from memory, but I pretty much have it memorized.....

When thinking about the transformer Mueller report version, I'm not sure they actually fire in a series although, if one talks about current through it, then it goes through the first transformer and continues on, but my guess is that they fire pretty much at the same time. As fast as the current can travel, which is pretty fast for the 8 (24 in series) ohm side.

You notice JB was using 5V batteries in that Mueller report version. 5 / 24ohms = 208 milli amps through to the cap but as the cap fills up, it decreases, i.e. it is not a constant current unless the on time was very short. When that current is shut of abruptly though, you should get a spike out of those inductors as they try to continue to pump current, so the voltage will increase by about 2 times. I do not know what the turns ratio is on that transformer, but that would mean a lot less current and higher voltage on the other side, but it can not be a factor of 125. It probably suffices to say that it is significantly over 10V, which would allow the transistors to fire efficiently and the current would not be too big going into the base.

My system is still running after swapping to low side batteries with the high side batteries. The "now" high side appears to have slowed charging after increasing a measly 0.1V (tenth of a volt) but it is still hanging in there and NOT going down after 18 hours at 150ma. Haven't checked the new low side batteries yet, as they were both very strong and very charged. It is all great fun, but time consuming. It is painful to have to wait for so long to see what it is finally going to do. Our commercialize lives are so used to instant gratification and all. Patience is a virtue, I keep telling myself.

Leroy

[Plazma]

An Open Question

Hi Leroy,

Agreed, what ever timing logic is connected controls the switching frequency - and yes, its push-pull ref the cap.

John B has stated over and over that "its in the switching" - so, just what combination of timing(frequency), rise/fall times on the edges, semiconductor materials (e.g., pnp vs npn, etc), and active circuit elements in the switch would consistently drive the switch into the Crohn/Bedini sweet spot?

Looking at John B's hand-drawn pulse it seems there is an initial spike upwards follwed by a sharp drop way down into the negative regime, followed by a fairly long "integration" period coming back. I can almost visualize (kinda like Bits or you inferred) that an inductor could cause part of this - and if the inductor collapses, the sudden drop down - as experienced by the base of a bipolar semiconductor.

However, could another semiconductor in the switch cause this kind of pulse?

I have wondered from time-to-time if there is a 2cd semiconductor involved in an idividual switch - like a pnp in parallel with an npn or 2 scr's as used in AC switches and power supplies configured "nose-to-toes" or reverse biased in a "creative" way to give a push-pull effect into the negative regime. Diodes, especially Zener diodes also come to mind. It's an open question, especially if coils are not used in the device.

Best,

Plazma

Plazma,

The frequency is still controlled by the 3524. The capacitor firing back across the transformers only occurs when the 3524 transistor (for the second side) is conducting. Anyway, it is still frequency controlled via the 3524. It is configured (hooked) up in a push pull mode, not the way we have it connected in JBs non-transformer circuit, where it is just pushing a current to the optos.

Perhaps you already knew this, but others may not.

Leroy

[nvisser]

Will it be possible to combine the full tesla switch with this solid state charger?
Device and method for pulse charging ... - Google Patent Search
The left side series transistor of the TS and the first set of transistors of the SSC (solid state charger) fires together to charge the cap bank to 24V.
Then the 2nd set of transistors of the SSC and the 2 parallel transistors of the right side of the TS fires, dropping the 24v onto the 2 parallel batteries.
That is the one direction
Now for the reverse direction the same SSC can be used.
The right side series transistor and the same first set of transistors of the SSC fires.
Then the 2nd set of transistors of the SSC and the 2 parallel transistors of the left side of the TS fires, dropping the 24v onto the left side 2 parallel batteries.
I am not sure why the SSC make magic but I think that is how John gets the magic in that last video.
I am not sure where to fit the bipolar switch in yet as I only thought about this setup and did not attempt to draw any circuit diagrams
Since John now said that something is missing in the scalar charger charger diagram I will put it on the rack and move on to the full switch
I etched my pc board today and will start building soon, as John said we must get this working first.

[ldissing]

Will it be possible to combine the full tesla switch with this solid state charger?
Device and method for pulse charging ... - Google Patent Search
The left side series transistor of the TS and the first set of transistors of the SSC (solid state charger) fires together to charge the cap bank to 24V.
Then the 2nd set of transistors of the SSC and the 2 parallel transistors of the right side of the TS fires, dropping the 24v onto the 2 parallel batteries.
That is the one direction
Now for the reverse direction the same SSC can be used.
The right side series transistor and the same first set of transistors of the SSC fires.
Then the 2nd set of transistors of the SSC and the 2 parallel transistors of the left side of the TS fires, dropping the 24v onto the left side 2 parallel batteries.
I am not sure why the SSC make magic but I think that is how John gets the magic in that last video.
I am not sure where to fit the bipolar switch in yet as I only thought about this setup and did not attempt to draw any circuit diagrams
Since John now said that something is missing in the scalar charger charger diagram I will put it on the rack and move on to the full switch
I etched my pc board today and will start building soon, as John said we must get this working first.

You have a lot of text here, and I have not sorted it all out yet. JB said there was something wrong with the Bill and Ray scalar charger, not his circuit, but perhaps he meant that too, but we don't know for sure.

I think the idea is:

Use a solid state charger to charge two caps. This can be done with the half bi-polar circuit, or just with a single transistor and a bifilar coil in SSG fashion or trifilar coil as described in the FEG book. I always thought the full bipolar switch was for north south wheel with neos, so I'm having some difficulty with the full bipolar switch. You do not really need a wheel, you can do it solid state. BUT, you must have something to take that HV pulse. If not a battery, then a capacitor of high enough capacity to handle the time it takes to charge at a frequency at which the batteries like 2Hz.

Then, take those two caps in parallel and use the switch, to make them serial. While you are discharging those, you have another pair with the SSG circuit is charging, so you have to switch between the two banks.

So it would go something like this:
1/2 second total time on the charging first bank. 1/2 second charge, on the second bank bank, then back to the first.

Serialize capacitors for 1/4 second, delay 1/4 second = 1/2 second. During the discharge of the 1st bank and rest of the battery, the second set charges in parallel this totals 1/2 second. Then, the first bank are reconnected, the second bank are serialized and it starts all over. Of course, there may need to be some stoppage of the charging circuit while the switch is made between capacitor banks or the timing has to be good so that no HV pulses are seen while the switch takes place and the second bank should not discharge into the first bank...during the switch between capacitor banks. Thinking out load, so I don't know if this all makes sense.

Leroy

P.S. Or maybe you charge the capacitors to 50 or 100 V with the switch in place, so the capacitor are in series while charging. The capacitors will charge faster in series, because it is half the capacitance, and then turn off the TS and place them parallel, so that you have twice the capacitance at 1/2 the voltage, i.e. 25-50V and blast that into the batteries. According to the patents (I think I read this) twice the voltage of the batteries is good for charging and reconditioning.

[ldissing]

Another thing JB spoke of that noone has mentioned

JB mentioned an analog computer. Controlling the TS with an analog computer has also not been discussed on this group. I do not think JB was referring to analog to digital conversions for control.

Peter and another guy (should be able to remember his name) showed us an analog computer made of capacitors and inductors and showed how different frequencies and signals operated with it. I do not have the reference at the moment.

Leroy

[EgmQC]

JB mentioned an analog computer. Controlling the TS with an analog computer has also not been discussed on this group. I do not think JB was referring to analog to digital conversions for control.

Peter and another guy (should be able to remember his name) showed us an analog computer made of capacitors and inductors and showed how different frequencies and signals operated with it. I do not have the reference at the moment.

Leroy

The name is Eric Dollard. YouTube - Part 1 of 6: Eric Dollard Tesla Longitudinal wave Energy SBARC Ham Radio with Chris Carson

Listen to the analogy to the Scalar charger at the end (begin at part 6 , at 0:43).

Best Regards,
EgmQC

[ldissing]

The name is Eric Dollard. YouTube - Part 1 of 6: Eric Dollard Tesla Longitudinal wave Energy SBARC Ham Radio with Chris Carson

Listen to the analogy to the Scalar charger at the end (begin at part 6 , at 0:43).

Best Regards,
EgmQC

Eric Dollard is the name, but this is not the video I was talking about. It was a video with Eric and Peter in a lab. Peter was filming and Eric was demonstrating. He does however, in this vid, talk about analog computers.

Leroy

[EgmQC]

Eric Dollard is the name, but this is not the video I was talking about. It was a video with Eric and Peter in a lab. Peter was filming and Eric was demonstrating.

Leroy

I know which video you mean, but he show the SAME thing here , YouTube - Part 3 of 6: Eric Dollard Tesla Longitudinal Wave Energy SBARC Ham Radio with Chris Carson at 3:37 , with the same diagram , same experiment.

Best Regards,
EgmQC

[ldissing]

I know which video you mean, but he show the SAME thing here , YouTube - Part 3 of 6: Eric Dollard Tesla Longitudinal Wave Energy SBARC Ham Radio with Chris Carson at 3:37 , with the same diagram , same experiment.

Best Regards,
EgmQC

EgmQC,

Hope you do not mind but...

I'm going to have to disagree with you here. It was not even close to the same. I watched all six clips and he very briefly shows here what was shown on the other video. The other was more in depth and you could see the device, etc.

I think the point is inductors in series and caps in parallel for several "cells" Chris says in part 3 or 4, but this is an analog computer, as I understand it.

Leroy

[EgmQC]

EgmQC,

Hope you do not mind but...

I'm going to have to disagree with you here. It was not even close to the same. I watched all six clips and he very briefly shows here what was shown on the other video. The other was more in depth and you could see the device, etc.

I think the point is inductors in series and caps in parallel for several "cells" Chris says in part 3 or 4, but this is an analog computer, as I understand it.

Leroy

The video you wanted is this one Tesla transverse and longitudinal electric waves , that begin at 16:08 , its where he talk about analog computer with the 2 coils and the 2 vacuum capacitor. Same experiment but i must agree with you , with some more theory behind it.

Best Regards,
EgmQC

Edit:
OMG i realize what you wanted to see in this video , a eyes opener!!!!!! i saw it a million time but never got that little detail.

[Murlin]

I love those videos.

I forgot all about Borderland Sciences .

They have some great old videos. I need to go back and watch them all again its been several years since I saw them.

Thanks for reminding me....

regards,
Murlin

[Matthew Jones]

Here's a Question

Alright we know the 2 switch should work. But we all seem to have to add a switch to keep it from shorting.
We know the transistors should switch into the negative and have the same effect as the "Negistor". How then then do we marry the 2 to get the effect and fire the transistor so that it will step the batteries up to series.

Go back to the 2 Switch circiut and look. One transistor is ON via a positive pulse. The other is being pulsed with a a negative pulse. My question.
Which one is truly at the higher potential at that moment?
Go back to Naudin's negistor. 1 transistor step up so much. 3 Transistors step up more. Why?... A bigger drop to the negative. But he doesn't fire them so they must be OFF. Look at whats in the circuit then remember.

Mr John said...The battery acts just like a capacitor, resistor, inductor....

.

I still am not sure exactly what I am looking at but I think I am going to head in some direction. It will most likely end up starting a few fires but, there has got to be something there. Maybe ya'll with a better electronics background can see it.

I still have not been able to make even the smallest load not short somthing out on the 2 switch using relays. Tonight I am going to try some transistors. But I am still not sure what will happen.

Matt

[ldissing]

Alright we know the 2 switch should work. But we all seem to have to add a switch to keep it from shorting.
We know the transistors should switch into the negative and have the same effect as the "Negistor". How then then do we marry the 2 to get the effect and fire the transistor so that it will step the batteries up to series.

Go back to the 2 Switch circiut and look. One transistor is ON via a positive pulse. The other is being pulsed with a a negative pulse. My question.
Which one is truly at the higher potential at that moment?
Go back to Naudin's negistor. 1 transistor step up so much. 3 Transistors step up more. Why?... A bigger drop to the negative. But he doesn't fire them so they must be OFF. Look at whats in the circuit then remember.
.

I still am not sure exactly what I am looking at but I think I am going to head in some direction. It will most likely end up starting a few fires but, there has got to be something there. Maybe ya'll with a better electronics background can see it.

I still have not been able to make even the smallest load not short somthing out on the 2 switch using relays. Tonight I am going to try some transistors. But I am still not sure what will happen.

Matt

You'll fry them, that is what will happen. I'm sort of kidding, sort of not. JB talks about balancing the load, and if all the batteries are at the same potential, then it is all the better, but I fried more components with two scrs (or transistors) without the upper and lower ones than I care to mention. Had to air out the lab (garage) it was so smokey and smelly.

If the on pulse was very short, then perhaps you can get away with it, but at 250 ms, I don't think so. Current wouldn't have a chance to get going with a short on pulse. They can also handle huge surges of current for 8 ms or so, so that would be max on time for the pulse (see diode and transistor specs).

The negative resistance (negister) has no signal at the base. That is exactly what happens with the opto NO signal is present, it is just floating. The MJLs need about 17V to go negative (reverse conduct), and here, there just isn't enough voltage for this to happen. Max = 12 V, right? 24 - 12V is only 12 and then there are the diode drops to consider. If you had a coil that was pulsing a high voltage, then it would probably go negative.

The three devices Naudin was using were 2222s if I remember right. Those will go negative at 6-7V. But they will burn up really fast with what we're doing here, I think. 3 in series just caused the voltage to be at 18-21V before they break down and reverse conduct.

Is it really a negative pulse, or is it just 180 degrees out of sync with the other side? It is off when the other one, etc. Based on where the optos are tied to the circuit, it isn't a negative pulse, it is just a zero pulse, or off, or just no signal, which is what the optos do, i.e. no signal at all.

My two cents,

Leroy

P.S. How to make the potential look like 17V over 12V or 30+ volts so they WILL go into the negative region, that is the question?

[John_K]

TS with SS Charger?

You have a lot of text here, and I have not sorted it all out yet. JB said there was something wrong with the Bill and Ray scalar charger, not his circuit, but perhaps he meant that too, but we don't know for sure.

I think the idea is:

Use a solid state charger to charge two caps. This can be done with the half bi-polar circuit, or just with a single transistor and a bifilar coil in SSG fashion or trifilar coil as described in the FEG book. I always thought the full bipolar switch was for north south wheel with neos, so I'm having some difficulty with the full bipolar switch. You do not really need a wheel, you can do it solid state. BUT, you must have something to take that HV pulse. If not a battery, then a capacitor of high enough capacity to handle the time it takes to charge at a frequency at which the batteries like 2Hz.

Then, take those two caps in parallel and use the switch, to make them serial. While you are discharging those, you have another pair with the SSG circuit is charging, so you have to switch between the two banks.

So it would go something like this:
1/2 second total time on the charging first bank. 1/2 second charge, on the second bank bank, then back to the first.

Serialize capacitors for 1/4 second, delay 1/4 second = 1/2 second. During the discharge of the 1st bank and rest of the battery, the second set charges in parallel this totals 1/2 second. Then, the first bank are reconnected, the second bank are serialized and it starts all over. Of course, there may need to be some stoppage of the charging circuit while the switch is made between capacitor banks or the timing has to be good so that no HV pulses are seen while the switch takes place and the second bank should not discharge into the first bank...during the switch between capacitor banks. Thinking out load, so I don't know if this all makes sense.

Leroy

P.S. Or maybe you charge the capacitors to 50 or 100 V with the switch in place, so the capacitor are in series while charging. The capacitors will charge faster in series, because it is half the capacitance, and then turn off the TS and place them parallel, so that you have twice the capacitance at 1/2 the voltage, i.e. 25-50V and blast that into the batteries. According to the patents (I think I read this) twice the voltage of the batteries is good for charging and reconditioning.

I was thinking about a similar setup, but I think a slightly different way.

Use the solid state charger as the load for the TS (between the two negatives), after rectifying to DC. Use the SS setup plus cap pulser circuit as per p46, but dump the cap at the same time you switch the two banks. The theory is that when the banks switch, the cap is dumped into the 12V bank to give it a kick in the pants. Then the SS charger charges the cap bank again, the banks switch and the cap is dumped into the other (now) 12V bank.

This way, we get to use an inductor as the TS load (replace a positive resistance with an inductor) and the load is extracting negative energy which collects in a cap and is dumped as positive energy.

It goes back to JB saying to generate negative energy at high frequency and dump it at low frequency.

Just a thought...

John K.

[ldissing]

I was thinking about a similar setup, but I think a slightly different way.

Use the solid state charger as the load for the TS (between the two negatives), after rectifying to DC. Use the SS setup plus cap pulser circuit as per p46, but dump the cap at the same time you switch the two banks. The theory is that when the banks switch, the cap is dumped into the 12V bank to give it a kick in the pants. Then the SS charger charges the cap bank again, the banks switch and the cap is dumped into the other (now) 12V bank.

This way, we get to use an inductor as the TS load (replace a positive resistance with an inductor) and the load is extracting negative energy which collects in a cap and is dumped as positive energy.

It goes back to JB saying to generate negative energy at high frequency and dump it at low frequency.

Just a thought...

John K.

Yes, definitely doable, but I was speaking about the solar charger that JB showed. In relation to the TS with 4 batteries, you are definitely on target, that is a good way to get some radiant charge back into the system to keep it going and have fewer losses. I've been waiting for someone to comment on my suggestion. You are, as always, insightful my friend.

What is your opinion of charging in serial and discharging in parallel? Charging will be faster, and the kick in charging the battery more significant. You could do this with the SSG as well.

Lero