Use for the Tesla Switch

[nvisser]

Another note on negistors, there are only two places in the TS where this occurs, as I see it. In the serial transistors, and in the transistors at the bottom of the circuit, NOT in the top transistors. The top transistors are dealing with positive potentials. Perhaps we should remove the top transistors and deal with only the serial and bottom transistors which are being switched on differences of potential on the negative side?

AND, JB said it was better to put the load on the collector side. This occurs on the bottom transistors, but not on the top transistors (unless you are using PNPs....maybe that is a good thing Bits). The top transistors (if the batteries are to be the load) are on the emitter side, which is NOT where JB indicated the load should be.

Leroy

There are no loads on the positive sid...
I find it easy to see how the transistors must go
Always put the collector to the more positive side and also switch the base from there . That is for npn`s
That negative pulse has never shown up on my scope. I see straight forward positive and negative going 12v square waves

[ldissing]

There are no loads on the positive sid...
I find it easy to see how the transistors must go
Always put the collector to the more positive side and also switch the base from there . That is for npn`s
That negative pulse has never shown up on my scope. I see straight forward positive and negative going 12v square waves

Ah nvisser, is that true? What constitutes the load when the left side serial transistor is "on". There is 24V on the left side. What is on the other side IS the load? 12V + a load. I believe that {the 2 batteries, i.e. 12V, plus the load} IS the load. JB said we want the battery as the load, (he did not say this) else the transistors will get hot, via it's internal resistance and the power is dissipated in the transistor and not the load.

Discussion? I guess it depends on which transistor we are talking about too. Each transistor sees different voltages, and from it's "positive potential" to it's "negative potential" is the load.

You are looking across the "load" as you see it. I see +-12V too when I probe there. What about across the upper battery positive to lower battery negative of each serial side? That is where I believe JB was probing, but I'm probably incorrect, as usual.

Leroy

[Matthew Jones]

@ALL,

Did any of you "get it", and if so, would you share your "getting it"?


Leroy

P.S. I think it has something to do with why JB puts semiconductors in the opposite direction from what is considered to be "normal". Or maybe it is just that he is using a negative potential for triggering the device as in the FEG book. That is what I "got", but I'm not sure it was what he meant us to "get".

I have been looking at it. I am not sure if I am right or not. In fact I went out and bought a new scope so I could look at it. beloww 100mhz scope will not show it.
All the MJL's I have tried it on did it.
3 batteries. The MJL connecting the 2 batts in series. Then switched on in a pulse. The MJL will make that wave he drew.
Connect the scope to the collector and ground to the emitter.

I did some tests to see if the charge battery recovered more than the serial batteries, but to the best I can tell it did not. Under a short test.
So grabbing whatever it is must be a bigger trick than I can figure out.

@EDIT: Let me add I would like to find some math that would tell me the real total of energy taken out of the serial battery, and deposited into the parrallel. Other than just voltage levels.

Matt

[Bit's-n-Bytes]

So grabbing whatever it is must be a bigger trick than I can figure out.

Matt

Vissie and I had this discussion this morning. With most of us with workable TS's, it is clear most batts are coming up to a level and not any further. I think this is the spot where we need a "Kick" (Capacitor disharge or inductive spike) to get the batts to rise. I am experimenting with a few things to achieve this.

Bit's

[ldissing]

Connect the scope to the collector and ground to the emitter.
Matt

@Matt,

I did put my crippled scope probe on the collector/emitter and I see do see the negative movement. I was getting over 200ma through measuring it with a current meter as Bits has displayed in his videos, I do not know if this is the "real" current (need to put an analog meter on there), but the transistors got very hot at a high frequency, roughly at 1ms on/off, but I did see the dip. So, I introduced a small delay and took the current (as read on the meter) down to about 100ma and the transistors cooled down, but my 2 2.33V bulbs in parallel, and one 2.47V bulb (in parallel too) are still lit, but a little dimmer. This caused the batteries to reverse and start on an upward climb, now the question is, will they continue to increase. Time will tell as we all know.

@Bits,

If we have 14V over the batteries, then we should not need the "kick" with an inductor or a capacitor discharge. I'm not saying that would not help (and I'm sure it would), but if we have 2 V over the parallel battery voltage...they should charge, don't you think?

Leroy

[Matthew Jones]

Well the batteries internal impedance could be maxed out from this process. Or in other words the battery believes its at capacity.

They may need to be discharged then recharged several times to lower impedance. Or be formatted using a radiant type generator.

The thing to do might be to discharge the batteries, and see if they will charge again, and to what level. I am sure someone already did though. Any results.

Matt

[ldissing]

The thing to do might be to discharge the batteries, and see if they will charge again, and to what level. I am sure someone already did though. Any results.
Matt

Or, discharge the batteries to 12.4 or 12.0 or something and then put them back in the TS and see if they charge?

Leroy

P.S. Matt, thank you for "showing" me the place to see the negative movement...makes me happy to see something I am supposed to be seeing...I'm a "visual" learner!

[Matthew Jones]

Well the bad news is I have just tested the 14th transistor in my collection, and they all show it.
In fact 4 mosfets showed it too.

The real disappointment come from the latching mosfets. To turn them on you hit them with positive voltage and you get the UP part of the wave, then you hit them with negative voltage and you get the DOWN part.

So to my best conclusion it is just a by product of turning the transistor on and it turning itself off.

The negistor's run at a real high frequency and may appear to have more energy at the emitter than the collector by this action alone.
But how to grab that and use it is beyond me.

Like I have said before I can get it out of a coil and a mechanical switch and it is for sure real power, that is easy to grab, but these semi conductors are to much for this blond. LOL

Matt

[ldissing]

Well the bad news is I have just tested the 14th transistor in my collection, and they all show it.
In fact 4 mosfets showed it too.

Why is this bad news?

So to my best conclusion it is just a by product of turning the transistor on and it turning itself off.

Did it turn itself off, or did you do it?

The negistor's run at a real high frequency and may appear to have more energy at the emitter than the collector by this action alone.
But how to grab that and use it is beyond me.

Energy always flows from a positive potential to a "lower" potential, so it is axiomatic!

... but these semi conductors are to much for this blond. LOL

I'm not SUPPOSED to be blond either!

I will not respond to your posts further until I know something, so feel free to post without my interruptions.

Leroy

[John_K]

Thanks guys for al the responses.

I think I'll go with Vissies's 2N2222 suggestions first , as I have them on hand.

I've got some chores to do first, but will get back to it later on today.

I'm gonna get rid of the SLABs first as they're junk.

Not sure if you seen JB's latest video:

YouTube - Energenx Tesla Switch Solar Charger " The Small One"



John K.

[blackchisel97]

Slabs

I'm gonna get rid of the SLABs first as they're junk.

I came to the same conclusion about mine.

Not sure if you seen JB's latest video:

YouTube - Energenx Tesla Switch Solar Charger " The Small One"

Thanks for the VID link.


Vtech

[JANGYD]

negistor

@JANG,

You indicated to JB, you had "found" something regarding negative resistance. Either I'm just stupid, which is probably the case, or everyone else on this list has figured it out and doesn't need to ask the question, or everyone is afraid to ask, but I did not "get it". I do not know to what in the world JB was referring in the Naudin and Keeley references. He said Naudin had not figured out "how to utilize" the negistor. I did not "get it" either, and he did not comment further, when he could have just said....this is the way you utilize it. That is not the JB style though, so I did not expect it him to do that.

Did you "get it"? Would you share your observations?

I don't think I found 'something' regarding negative resistance,
what I found is my or our researchs can be out of the way.
What I found regarding researches on 'Negistor' are
1) Current can flow in opposite direction, it's not about leakage current.
2) Voltage can be reverse(negative), if there is the current.
I think these two things are not about 'true negistor'
When it comes to No. 2), we have to check the current in detail.

I think "true negistor' means it pouring out more energy output than input,
either positve energy or negative energy.
As for me It should be bettter if it's negative energy.

Regard,

JANG

ps) if possible next week I will upload the scopeshot regarding on my studying.

[nvisser]

I'm gonna get rid of the SLABs first as they're junk.
John K.

Why do you guys want to do that. are they old or do you think even good ones cannot work in this setup
What should we use then? Lead acids with liquid acid inside. Like ancient car batteries. What are that batteries that Bits use?

quote:If we have 14V over the batteries, then we should not need the "kick" with an inductor or a capacitor discharge. I'm not saying that would not help (and I'm sure it would), but if we have 2 V over the parallel battery voltage...they should charge, don't you think?
Leroy

That is true they should charge. But what happens the moment they go into series again. If they supply to much current to the other parralel bank they are going to loose all that was gained. I can see when measuring over 1 battery that when in parralel mode the voltage goes up a bit more than the battery voltage but when it switch into series it drop well below the current battery voltage.
So I get confused with some of the statement that we have to use a heavy load that will according to me get the current flowing and cause losses
Then somewhere else we were told to see how much voltage we can switch in 1 Usec before the current starts to flow. Now that sounds feasible. The question is how to do it. The only way i can think about is to switch with say 1 sec intevals but with a very short duty cycle . Near to 1 usec which is like nothing compared to 1 sec. Maybe the phrase 1usec did not meant 1 usec but rather meant a short time like 1 msec which is already a small duty cycle. Then on the other hand he never told us anywhere to use such a small duty cycle. I thing it was mentioned to use between full(50%) and 40%. I cannot remember now.

[nvisser]

The Small one

Not sure if you seen JB's latest video:
YouTube - Energenx Tesla Switch Solar Charger " The Small One"

John K.

Very nice!!
If the panel supply is 19v the 2 caps cannot charge up to more than 19v. That means when he drops the caps onto the battery 19v goes there but very quickly. Thus the high current pulses. It looks like the batteries are charged in series. It must be 6v batteries as the voltmeter shows 14v.

[Inquorate]

If the instructions don't work..

Hi guys, if we've done everything we've been told and cannot get self charging, then we have possibly misunderstood the instructions.

If no further advice has been forthcoming, and no theory can guide us to further refinements, we need to use imagination and add controlled variables, observing the outcomes. Then with luck, enough of a pattern will develop.

We then correlate the information and develop new experiments until we reach our goal.

In short, lacking sufficient guidance, we need to think clearly and guide ourselves.