Use for the Tesla Switch

[Bit's-n-Bytes]

I just wanted to post some progress on my biggest tesla switch yet.
I started testing today to get the bugs worked out and see what switching rates to use.
Based on the last 4 switch's (And 16 before that) I have pretty much developed a good theory for what to use component wise based on how much power you need. So I'll be publishing that next month some time after I get a slew of tests done on this one.

Basically ran this switch 2 time today and watched the back charging. So far all the batteries have charged as expected.

I discharged them some so I can document a test, and right now I am waiting for the thing to settle out. Start a long run and see what happens.

Anyway here's a teaser for ya YouTube - 1kwTS.MPG

Just wanted to update you guys.

CHeers
Matt

Matt, that is awsome, looking forward to test results. Great Job !

Jeff

[nvisser]

Nice one Matt
Can you refer us back to the latest diagram you posted.
If I recall you use solid state relays.
It looks like a normal of the rack inverter. You should even get more back if you tap the reactive spikes from the inverter transformer.

[Matthew Jones]

I'll post a schematic as soon as I am settled on how wired. But basically its just like the ISCC in my signature.
I did a few things different to start out but I am going to have to rearrange a few things.

One thing I have got to come up with is a Hbridge type rectifier. I tried one with the solid state relays but I have not made it work yet. The diodes are killing me. With a High amp load I can lose as much as 2.8 volt of potential just from the bridge rectifier. So the inverter is steady in alarm state. Didn't plan that one. I got few ideas though, I gotta find the right component.
Anyway I gotta switch about every 20 seconds and thats not enough time on these batteries. The last time I had to switch about every 2.5 minutes or so to allow the charge to set in.

You should even get more back if you tap the reactive spikes from the inverter transformer.

I am trying to just keep it real simple for now. I want it real easy to build, so anybody can make it work. But I might have to do some additional stuff depending on how it goes.
This is the first time I have used and inverter and battery charger. I know the thing works well if you use a motor and generator. I just gotta match that.

Cheers
Matt

[nvisser]

Thank you , Jeff. I didn't know about this update.

I have a question.
On Brandt 24V system ( http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...html#post99657 ) posted by Nvisser I have captured spikes of 340V average on each of the loads.
Is it really possible?

I thought I will post the whole article about Ronald Brandt

[John_K]

I thought I will post the whole article about Ronald Brandt

Thanks Vissie for posting the RB doc.

So we can see that RB was actually using 6 batteries, rather than the 4 that we are used to seeing. Obviously the TS could also be up-scaled to use any number of batteries as well, depending on the voltage required.
Also interesting is that he was using the TS to drive a 32HP motor and with the right batteries he could achieve >400 miles on one charge.
Even more interesting was that he only got ~100 miles with different batteries because he couldn't get them in resonance.

RB claimed that if you achieve resonance (~900Hz) they batteries last longer. The P. Kelly document that Bit's posted claimed that the Electrodyne Corp. found that the TS worked best between 100Hz and 800Hz and that >800Hz the device was "dangerous".

This begs the question - why is JB using such a low frequency (~2Hz) and not the higher frequencies mentioned in the various documents. Even the Eike Mueller document has reference to 400Hz switching.

In my mind, it makes sense to switch at the resonant frequency of the batteries, or a sub-harmonic of it. Doesn't it?

Also, it is clear from the RB doc that he was using a transformer as a load, however he was still only drawing 24V to run his motor. It is interesting that he would use a transformer AND then rectify the AC back to DC. Why wouldn't he just rectify the AC straight off the -ve terminals of the batteries? Since he would still have 24V anyway. It appears that the transformer would have been a 1:1 transformer, since he was not stepping up (or down) the voltage. IMO, the transformer is key to the success of the TS as well. (JB did hint about it previously).

Thoughts?


John K.

[Mark]

Maybe the transformer was just used to isolate the output.

[Bit's-n-Bytes]

Thanks Vissie for posting the RB doc.

It appears that the transformer would have been a 1:1 transformer, since he was not stepping up (or down) the voltage. IMO, the transformer is key to the success of the TS as well. (JB did hint about it previously).

Thoughts?


John K.

Hey John, passed on your message and will continue to follow up. In the mean while Here is the latest;

This is an inverter that I put together that basically pulls about 330- 500ma @ 12V and an produces 110AC using the right transformer. This is what I have been experimenting with so far. The transformer is the key to success and the ability to drive it with almost no loss is the unlocking of the dead bolt.

Jeff

[Matthew Jones]

This is an inverter that I put together that basically pulls about 330- 500ma @ 12V and an produces 110AC using the right transformer.

110 AC at what kinda amperage? What kinda hertz? (60 hz)

I have read that thing about the resonance 4 times now. How do you find the resonant frequency of a battery?
I think it is perfectly conceivable that battery can act as a capacitor and allow energy to be multiplied like a joule thief with a capacitor. Ring it out for lack of a better word.

I have tried several 24 volt circuits like shown in the RB article. The last one was set up that way but the problem with running it is the center batteries drop while the outside batteries grow. So it is hard to tell what is going where. I like using 8 batteries to come up with 24 volt difference.

I'm going to put a motor on mine tomorrow and run it at 900 hz and see what it does to the batteries. I have never ran that fast. Since Mr John recommended a slower pace I have had pretty good luck, but I originally was looking to go much faster. We'll see.

If anybody knows how to check a battery for a resonant frequency or has some ideas let me know.
This bigger system I have alot more possibilities. Let find this thing and get it going.

Cheers
Matt

[John_K]

@Mark, no I think there is more to it than that. You are right in that the transformer inductively isolates the circuit, but I think the collapsing magnetic field combined with the high speed switching is drawing in energy from the environment.

@Bit's. Thanks, I got a reply already.
Nice design on the inverter. I hope the testing is going well. A few Q's and obbos:
Is the input DC or AC? The two diodes after the input (D1 & D2) and C3 imply an AC input so I'm guessing you are using the AC output of your TS as the inverter input?
I like how you are driving the power trannys (MJL21194?) with the driver trannys (2N2222 or BD140?). Is the reason you parallel 3 power trannys to handle the load or to lower the losses?
The output (J1) has a "+" and "-" sign. Is this a typo as the way I see it the output is AC?

@Matt, I would advise you start off at ~400Hz first before going to ~900Hz to be safe, just in case. As for finding the resonant frequency (which is somewhere between 1-6Mhz) you'll be searching for a sub-harmonic. One way to see if you have it is to make a sniffer coil and connect it to a scope. What you are looking for is a ringing wave, the longer and stronger the ring, the closer to the sub-harmonic.
I made a sniffer coil by using the coil that can be found in the turntable motor of a microwave oven. You pass the cable going to the battery terminal through the center of the coil and orientate the coil at 90% to the cable.
I've attached a document I made up that theoretically should be the resonant frequencies of a lead-acid battery. Use it as a guide but don't hang your hat on it. Note that there are sub-harmonic frequencies just near the 400 and 800Hz marks.

I guess in answer to your Q to Bit's about what frequency his inverter runs at, it would depend on how he has the PIC programmed. I'm guessing he's running it at 60Hz.

Just my thoughts....


John K.

[Matthew Jones]

I'll take a look at it. Do you have the specs (or a guess) or wire type on that coil. The dumps closed today so I am fresh out of junk microwaves. LOL.

@Bytes
What kinda transformer are you using? I wanna take a look at driving one also.

Matt

[Bit's-n-Bytes]

I'll take a look at it. Do you have the specs (or a guess) or wire type on that coil. The dumps closed today so I am fresh out of junk microwaves. LOL.

@Bytes
What kinda transformer are you using? I wanna take a look at driving one also.

Matt

@John, @Matt, here is the parts list;


1n4001-Q1 1n4001
1n4001-Q3 1n4001
C1 0.33uf
C2 0.1uf
C3 35,000uf 35V
Cap-Q1 1.0uf
Cap-Q3 1.0uf
D1 1N5408
D2 1N5408
D3 STPS8H100D
D12 1N5408
DB9
J1
J2
J3
LED1 Yellow
LED2 Yellow
Q1 MJL21194
Q2 MJL21194
Q3 MJL21194
Q4 MJL21194
Q5 MJL21194
Q6 MJL21194
Q7 MJL21194
Q8 MJL21194
R2 10k 1/2 Watt
R3 10k 1/4 Watt
R4 22k 1/4 Watt
R5 330R 1/4 Watt
R6 330R 1/4 Watt
SW1 Reset E28
T1 273-1365A (Radio Shack)
U1 PICAXE-18X
U3 LM7805
U-Q1 H11d1
U-Q3 H11d1
Z2 1N4744A

The output is AC so disregard the + - (carry over from other designs)

The input is 12V only AC or DC.

Add or Remove MJL's Q5,Q6,Q7,Q8 for increase or decrease in power rating.

The transformer noted here is 0.45A, so you'll need to subsitute with others as necessary.

Here is the code for the chip;
Main:

high 7
pause 10
low 7

high 6
pause 10
low 6


goto Main

Adjusting the delay down increases freq's.

Enjoy,

Jeff

[John_K]

I'll take a look at it. Do you have the specs (or a guess) or wire type on that coil. The dumps closed today so I am fresh out of junk microwaves. LOL.

@Bytes
What kinda transformer are you using? I wanna take a look at driving one also.

Matt

Matt, at a guess it's probably 150 turns of very fine wire in a 2" donut form. I don't have one in front of me (traveling interstate ATM).


John K.

[Matthew Jones]

Thanks Bytes
Thanks John.

I gotta replace some switch's in the morning. I was trying to run real fast with FREQOUT command and exceeded the switching rate of the relays. 10k

I didn't even get fireworks just some small snap crackle pops for 200+ dollers.

Its hard learning the hard way.

One thing I did notice on a 4 hour test at 800hz through motor is the next to no current but the motor still runs pretty strong. At 50hz I was pulling a 5 amp load. At 800hz I was pulling almost 2 amps and the motor seemed to be as strong with a finger test. Its not great science but there is something there.

I am going to run the inverter the same way tomorrow and see how big of a load I can pull while switching at higher rates.

I am going to put me a coil together and start checking the batteries, see what I can see.

Also I was wondering if there was any clue as to what kind of battery SPECS Brandt was running. I haven't seen it but maybe I missed it

Cheers
Matt

[StevanC]

Maybe they where SAFT made NiCd-s?

=2c
Stevan C.

[Matthew Jones]

Whats an SAFT?? I don't think NiCads are that old. But maybe they are. But its hard to find big nicads so I don't know. I know Bedini used them when ever Mueller published that paper.

@Bytes
If your around. Were you driving that transformer before just off of the switch output?
I am wondering if that possible. I need to step my voltage up and I can either do it after the battery or before the load. So I was just wondering if you can drive a transformer that way or if you got to have other components.

Cheers
Matt