Originally posted by Ufopolitics
View Post
Hello Brian516 and Welcome aboard,
Don't worry about your previous confusion, it is not your fault.
As you could see this guy is not there to help anyone, just to insist/push his "design" of single poles Imperial as "his own idea"...however, he is using ALL my CAD's and all my designs to run that thread.
He has never wound any other motor than the Imperial he has been working on for over two years...
Never has put together a small motor as the one you have.
One of my first Diagrams here on post#96 written on 7/14/2012 was about a SINGLE COIL THREE POLE MOTOR and Diagram below:
[IMG]
[/IMG]
And as I wrote there, this type of winding is applicable to other configuration in bigger machines.
But hey, let's talk about your five pole and forget about all 'counterfeit material'
First do not listen to that guy about winding your motor with a HEAVIER GAUGE, pure nonsense, you use the SAME or FINER GAUGE and motor will run perfectly smooth and fine.
The Imperial he is working on is originally wound with 16 awg and NOT with 18 awg like he is doing it right now...so, forgive him, he is full of it to the top of his head, and it does not allow him to think properly.
About the Mechanical Set Up:
To remove all epoxy resin and separate plastic fan, you will need a very sharp and fine blade and be very careful with fingers. try getting blade in between without damaging the epoxy on rotor metal.
After fan out and all epoxy in slots, between poles taken out, you need to spread open each commutator hook, going from above to brake them apart to be able to pull wires out with a fine needle nose pliers, do it to both motors commutators. Do not apply heat with a soldering gun, as you may brake the comm copper elements from mica, then commutator is not good anymore.
To pull one commutator out to use it on main motor you have to do it EVENLY FROM BELOW, meaning, DO NOT PUSH ONLY from one element or it will brake apart. Do not try to turn commutator while on shaft either, shaft has straight splines and you will brake it if forcing to turn it.
This motors have enough room to add second commutator, but you may have to force shaft a bit up (towards shaft take off power), leaving less space at bottom of motor (back) enough to get shaft inside rear bushing...just measure distances.
The other part to do is to 'elongate' or extrude the Main outer casing...where you may have to cut a ring off the end of second motor where brushes are mounted, it is all about doing the right measurements where to cut. At Main Motor you have to cut rear end to solder or glue the brush ring and use the housing and brushes from second motor. When you do all this cutting and soldering is better to remove magnets from casing. I have a 175 Watts Soldering Gun that could do that job easily. If you do not have that kind of gun, you could use epoxy or other glue compounds to 'weld' metal.
Make sure before soldering the whole ring , tack it first and test freedom of shaft movement (not binding) by assembling the whole motor together with magnets and all brushes.
When pressing the second commutator, make sure it is perfectly aligned to bottom one (the original that came with motor), meaning, aligning element to element in a linear fashion, as well as when you solder the casing ring, make sure it will hold brushes seating identical above and below.
About the winding:
Once you have all mechanical structures finished...the easier part is to wind it.
The first winding on this Five Pole Motor was displayed here
and CAD below:
[IMG]
[/IMG]
Here you could use different type of windings, including the Pentagon type or the 'Single Coil' unbelievable idea of this guy
..., and I have all drawings to follow up the winding method of your choice.
[IMG]
[/IMG]
However, I recommend to wind the All North Type, where all coils (no matter if single or pairs) are wound all in same direction, like I have shown on the post I cited link above, on the three pole first motor I have shown here.
Below is a video on a five pole where I test/compare the North-South Pairs versus the All North Pairs.
[VIDEO]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=diY96XR76Fg[/VIDEO]
Cheers and remember to be careful with blade.
Good luck friend.
Ufopolitics
Don't worry about your previous confusion, it is not your fault.
As you could see this guy is not there to help anyone, just to insist/push his "design" of single poles Imperial as "his own idea"...however, he is using ALL my CAD's and all my designs to run that thread.
He has never wound any other motor than the Imperial he has been working on for over two years...
Never has put together a small motor as the one you have.
One of my first Diagrams here on post#96 written on 7/14/2012 was about a SINGLE COIL THREE POLE MOTOR and Diagram below:
[IMG]
[/IMG]And as I wrote there, this type of winding is applicable to other configuration in bigger machines.
But hey, let's talk about your five pole and forget about all 'counterfeit material'
First do not listen to that guy about winding your motor with a HEAVIER GAUGE, pure nonsense, you use the SAME or FINER GAUGE and motor will run perfectly smooth and fine.
The Imperial he is working on is originally wound with 16 awg and NOT with 18 awg like he is doing it right now...so, forgive him, he is full of it to the top of his head, and it does not allow him to think properly.
About the Mechanical Set Up:
To remove all epoxy resin and separate plastic fan, you will need a very sharp and fine blade and be very careful with fingers. try getting blade in between without damaging the epoxy on rotor metal.
After fan out and all epoxy in slots, between poles taken out, you need to spread open each commutator hook, going from above to brake them apart to be able to pull wires out with a fine needle nose pliers, do it to both motors commutators. Do not apply heat with a soldering gun, as you may brake the comm copper elements from mica, then commutator is not good anymore.
To pull one commutator out to use it on main motor you have to do it EVENLY FROM BELOW, meaning, DO NOT PUSH ONLY from one element or it will brake apart. Do not try to turn commutator while on shaft either, shaft has straight splines and you will brake it if forcing to turn it.
This motors have enough room to add second commutator, but you may have to force shaft a bit up (towards shaft take off power), leaving less space at bottom of motor (back) enough to get shaft inside rear bushing...just measure distances.
The other part to do is to 'elongate' or extrude the Main outer casing...where you may have to cut a ring off the end of second motor where brushes are mounted, it is all about doing the right measurements where to cut. At Main Motor you have to cut rear end to solder or glue the brush ring and use the housing and brushes from second motor. When you do all this cutting and soldering is better to remove magnets from casing. I have a 175 Watts Soldering Gun that could do that job easily. If you do not have that kind of gun, you could use epoxy or other glue compounds to 'weld' metal.
Make sure before soldering the whole ring , tack it first and test freedom of shaft movement (not binding) by assembling the whole motor together with magnets and all brushes.
When pressing the second commutator, make sure it is perfectly aligned to bottom one (the original that came with motor), meaning, aligning element to element in a linear fashion, as well as when you solder the casing ring, make sure it will hold brushes seating identical above and below.
About the winding:
Once you have all mechanical structures finished...the easier part is to wind it.
The first winding on this Five Pole Motor was displayed here
and CAD below:
[IMG]
[/IMG]Here you could use different type of windings, including the Pentagon type or the 'Single Coil' unbelievable idea of this guy
..., and I have all drawings to follow up the winding method of your choice. [IMG]
[/IMG]However, I recommend to wind the All North Type, where all coils (no matter if single or pairs) are wound all in same direction, like I have shown on the post I cited link above, on the three pole first motor I have shown here.
Below is a video on a five pole where I test/compare the North-South Pairs versus the All North Pairs.
[VIDEO]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=diY96XR76Fg[/VIDEO]
Cheers and remember to be careful with blade.
Good luck friend.
Ufopolitics
Hi there UFO and all,
Sorry I didn't follow up directly after my last post and UFO's reply, I got a bit busy. Picked up an O-scope and had to clean it and get it functioning properly, and learn the basics of getting stable traces. I've never used a scope before, so it ate up all my time at first, but now I'm close to the point where I have a little more free time to spend on actual projects, too. I'm going to get started on my 5-pole build soon, but first I'm going to do a little more research into what type of windings I will go with. I'm just going to use the wire that I have available. The new wire that I have that is close to the factory size is 22awg, but for used, I have a decent variety. (just have to make sure I don't use any that has left-over epoxy stuck to it!)
I'm open to suggestions for every aspect of this build.
As for bonding the cases together, I could use JB weld, or, if my friend over at the machine shop isn't too busy, I could have him weld it for me. In that case, he has the proper tools available to get a perfectly straight cut on each case and get it aligned correctly for the weld.
both shafts are a little bit short for my liking, and would leave very little room for me to use it as a prime mover for other projects later on, and also for any kind of testing, so I'm probably going to see if any of the local shops have SS rod of the correct size that I can grab. Usually they give me their small scraps for free, and bigger scraps for the price by weight of recycled metals.
The other option I have would be to pull off some of the laminations and free up some more room on the shaft.
Brian
.
Leave a comment: