My Asymmetric Electrodynamic Machines

[Hiwater]

UFO what would be a good winding schematic for a 14 slot armature.

I Have two of them One with a 14 commutator bars and one with 28 comm bar sections. Any advice would be very much appreciated.


I have been following the thread and its time to get involved. I believe you
have presented information on thid thread it would take some of us here 50 years to try and figure out.

After unwinding one of the armatures I can see how the windings are brought back to oppose the other half of the winding. Then I could see exactly what you were saying. Reversing every 180 degrees.cancelling out .

SO THANKS UFO FOR ALL YOUR WILLINGS TO SHARE WITH US.

Everyone here has learned in a few days --What could have taken years to learn. Thanks again.

[Bob Smith]

Marius
Cool motor mod! It looks to me like you're running a pretty high voltage and current through your motor. I'm now running my 5 pole from a 6 volt lead acid battery, and can only leave it on for a minute or so before it gets too hot. I don't want to overheat it. I believe I need to run it with a smaller battery. This may be why your wires burned.

As you run your motor, the radiant energy production in its coils will condition your battery.

As far as charging/generator, see Netica's 5 pole motor replication (same principle for 3-pole machine). You will see that one set of leads gives a higher output than the other - one is more suited as motor lead; the other more suited as generator lead:
Replication of Ufopolitics 5 pole asymmetric motor by netica. Video 3 - YouTube

If you run one set of wires/clips from your power battery to the machine, you should be able to run another set of wires/clips from the other two leads on your machine to charge another battery.

I hope I've got this right, and that this is of some help.
Bob

[Ufopolitics]

Hello Mike

I pulled apart 3 of the MY1016 scooter motors. They all use the same commutator.
The smallest one rated at 250 watt 14a 2500rpm the shaft is the same size on both sides.
The 300 watt 16.4a 2750rpm rated one and the largest one have a larger shaft on the drive side.
The brush width on the smaller one is the same size as the commutator segments, on the larger 2 the brush width covers almost 1.5 commutator segments.
6 scooters in my junk pile and no matching motors.
The smaller one looks to be the easyist to convert so I will hunt for a match to it.

Mike Klimesh

Hi Mike,

Ah, let's see, You could build one out of two..If you could get a longer shaft...in the Longer Armature one...it will be your best solution my friend...but I know finding a right sized shaft is not easy...

Taking the shaft out is another "mission"...You will need a Hydraulic Press, plus all the right attachments, in order not to damage shaft nor Armature Lamination's...therefore damaging epoxy resin insulation.

And None of them have the shaft long enough to add the 2nd Comm?
the Middle or the Longer one?

Don't worry about brush size, line them up according to your forward rotation with lower ones, disregard the 0.5 excess towards the rear, if the other one is touching nothing would happen. Besides this set up allows right next brushes to be contacted at same time.


Come on you can!!


Cheers


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Not One Commutator...does NOT WORK!

mklimesh,
I may be wrong, but because those motors have two sets of two brushes already, I think UFO posted a wiring configuration where you only need ONE commutator.

Dave

Hey Dave,

No, I have shown a One Comm Pictures to MrBrownn about using Diodes in a previous arrangement with One Comm...BUT IT DOES NOT WORK...AS TWO.

How is your Motor coming?
How is Mathews doing?

Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Is up to You dear Friend...

Ufopolitics,

I have 2 Torque Master 180's on order as well.

In the mean time, been wrapping the RS5PM (Radio Shack 5 Pole Motor).

Using Radio Shack red wire 25 turns I get .9 ohms.

Which is best 25 turns or shooting for the 1.2 to 1.4 ohms?

Thanks,

IndianaBoys

Hello Indiana Boys,

I don't see such a big difference in 0.1 Ohms, really...and since Coils are always switching Off...there will not be time to burn anything...unless you add to many amps-volts at Source...
And if you plan to pulse little motor...it will be absolutely fine dear friend.

Regards


UFO

[Ufopolitics]

You are right...

I believe coil must be at least 1 ohm or risk blowing fets.

CB

Hello C&B,

Yes absolutely right...but it is not such big difference...0.01 ohms

Regards


UFO

[Ufopolitics]

That looks awesome!!

Hello everyone!

Thank you UFO for such great results with your asymmetric rotor.
I'm trying to kill the ''witch'' here in east europe but is a bit harder ( maybe dracula is involved too ) .

Made a small vid; this is the thrid rotor that i made with the same result: is spining but not recharging the battery like other replicators observed.
I'm going to make a 5 pole rotor soon; mean while please watch this:

UFO's asymmetric 3 pole rotor - YouTube

Tryed 0.3 mm wire with 25 turns but in 10 seconds the coils were very hot. In the end the 0.3 mm wire just broked and now the coils have 0.2mm wire with 100 turns each coil.

Hello Mariuscivic!!

Nice little Motor!!

It is such great News you are making this little Motor also in Eastern Europe!!...wow...am very glad

Ok, my friend, You are running a Battery that is almost full...so little Motor will not charge it because Source has Higher Potential...

It will be good to always attach a small load to Output while you are running it , small lamp or so...basically with such big Battery...this small motors are designed to be run by small batteries...your wire is too thin to handle its Amps ratings...it will be good to regulate/pulse Input also...

Try with an old bad battery,or not charged...and watch it...a very low voltage...2-3 volts...

Try "jumping" rear terminals, and then upper negative output to negative of battery (Positive is already connected) Use Diode from Motor to Batt allowing from Motor Output to Batt ,BUT NOT from Battery to Motor negative terminal [M(-)]--[-l<-]--[B(-)]


Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Hello Hiwater

UFO what would be a good winding schematic for a 14 slot armature.

I Have two of them One with a 14 commutator bars and one with 28 comm bar sections. Any advice would be very much appreciated.


I have been following the thread and its time to get involved. I believe you
have presented information on thid thread it would take some of us here 50 years to try and figure out.

After unwinding one of the armatures I can see how the windings are brought back to oppose the other half of the winding. Then I could see exactly what you were saying. Reversing every 180 degrees.cancelling out .

SO THANKS UFO FOR ALL YOUR WILLINGS TO SHARE WITH US.

Everyone here has learned in a few days --What could have taken years to learn. Thanks again.

Hello dear Hiwater,

Thanks my friend, my pleasure!

Let's see, you could use the 12Pole arrangement, I posted recently, you will have P14 (14 Pairs) 28 Coils...instead of P12...Better...

Second Comm 28 elements, are 2 elements together same in width as one of 14? are the same diameter?

Yes?...attach them by each two...

No?...need a Commutator to match the 14 elements and same diameter Sorry friend..


Regards


UFO

[MasterBlaster]

I pulled apart 3 of the MY1016 scooter motors. They all use the same commutator.
The smallest one rated at 250 watt 14a 2500rpm the shaft is the same size on both sides.
The 300 watt 16.4a 2750rpm rated one and the largest one have a larger shaft on the drive side.
The brush width on the smaller one is the same size as the commutator segments, on the larger 2 the brush width covers almost 1.5 commutator segments.
6 scooters in my junk pile and no matching motors.
The smaller one looks to be the easyist to convert so I will hunt for a match to it.

Here is a supplier in the UK that seems to have these motors at a reasonable price.

Electric Motors + Parts - All Parts By Type - Spare Parts – PetrolScooter UK

[sebosfato]

Modification progress

Hello UFO

My motor modification is almost complete!!! just got to do some final adjusts on the brushes position relative to the new collector! ... It came out better than i could imagine... Merit for my friends that operate those nice big machines..

It was a 18 pole and 18 segments commutator and two brushes motor. Of course now it get two commutator with 18 segment and 4 brushes... while still having the 18 poles

just remembering its a 0,5 HP motor

Is there a formula to calculate the number of turns depending on the volts applied?

If not

I would like to know from you if you can help me, telling me +- how many turns i should start with and with what configuration... you mentioned i could use the 3 pole design, but i'm limited there because i'm not sure how to use more poles in this design... I think i understood the 12 pole schematic, maybe 18 poles is something like that isn't?

Could you explain more about that angles interact to me with some details please. Why do you activate the coils at the weak field rather than stronger field?

Well I'm thinking about this... if wind only three coils

Or if would be better to try using all the poles?

Changing subject:

I noticed that teslas patent drawing you always show here, has two slip rings and one commutator interconnected.. 4 brushes... Somewhat Like Alexanders patent...


If i understood well in the alexander patent he meant to use one pair of slip ring for each output coil, and each output coil is in the same slot of each input coils---

He says it acts as a motor-transformer-generator aways assisting rotation instead of opposing it. 3x over unity or so…

So each output coil will have a different phase relationship…

I think that if DC is wanted than instead of having many slip rings the generating coils can be full wave rectified and summed together in parallel… or maybe as a three phase would be…

What i'm meaning is that this way only one slip ring will be needed… for the output

Could exist a connection there?


Many thanks yet for the inspiration

Regards

Fabio

[Ufopolitics]

Hello Sebosfato...

Hello UFO

My motor modification is almost complete!!! just got to do some final adjusts on the brushes position relative to the new collector! ... It came out better than i could imagine... Merit for my friends that operate those nice big machines..

It was a 18 pole and 18 segments commutator and two brushes motor. Of course now it get two commutator with 18 segment and 4 brushes... while still having the 18 poles

just remembering its a 0,5 HP motor

Is there a formula to calculate the number of turns depending on the volts applied?

If not

I would like to know from you if you can help me, telling me +- how many turns i should start with and with what configuration... you mentioned i could use the 3 pole design, but i'm limited there because i'm not sure how to use more poles in this design... I think i understood the 12 pole schematic, maybe 18 poles is something like that isn't?

Could you explain more about that angles interact to me with some details please. Why do you activate the coils at the weak field rather than stronger field?

Well I'm thinking about this... if wind only three coils

Or if would be better to try using all the poles?

Changing subject:

I noticed that teslas patent drawing you always show here, has two slip rings and one commutator interconnected.. 4 brushes... Somewhat Like Alexanders patent...


If i understood well in the alexander patent he meant to use one pair of slip ring for each output coil, and each output coil is in the same slot of each input coils---

He says it acts as a motor-transformer-generator aways assisting rotation instead of opposing it. 3x over unity or so…

So each output coil will have a different phase relationship…

I think that if DC is wanted than instead of having many slip rings the generating coils can be full wave rectified and summed together in parallel… or maybe as a three phase would be…

What i'm meaning is that this way only one slip ring will be needed… for the output

Could exist a connection there?


Many thanks yet for the inspiration

Regards

Fabio

Hello Sebosfato,


For Your 18 Poles Quad Brush-Stator the best choice would be the BOSCH Set-Up...NOT the 2S/2Brush 12 Poles...

Tesla's Patent refers in His Claims to either one Machines...A/C or D/C...Motor or Generator...

The Alexander's Patent is a Symmetrical Machine...just like the Old Dynamo-Motors...Each set of SERIES COILS attach to two slip rings....
Each, Motor and Generator have SEPARATED Outputs-Inputs...

Different Machines my friend...so...do not "Heat Up" your Pentium...


Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Asymmetric Fiberglass Stator Core Plus Winding Specs

Hello to ALL,

Here is the Video for the wiring's of Fiberglass Stator using the "Light Path". please let me know if you understand it, so I could use same method to show Armature windings...

ASYMMETRIC FIBERGLASS STATOR CORE PLUS WINDING SPECS - YouTube

Of course Video must be downloaded and played with an Editor or software that allows pausing it or slow motion playback better than YT..other wise you guys could go....
...


Regards


Ufopolitics

[sebosfato]

Hello UFO

I took a look at the bosch schematic too, but I think i expressed myself wrong, i meant there are two separated collectors with 18 segments, and two brushes for each collector... not 4 brushes sorry...

Whats the best deal you think i could do in that case?

How about how many turns UFO?


Regards

Fabio

[Ufopolitics]

Sebosfato...

Hello UFO

I took a look at the bosch schematic too, but I think i expressed myself wrong, i meant there are two separated collectors with 18 segments, and two brushes for each collector... not 4 brushes sorry...

Whats the best deal you think i could do in that case?

How about how many turns UFO?


Regards

Fabio

Hello Fabio,
And also to the rest, when You guys need some advice...

Please give me the whole motor structure, meaning:

How many Stators?(#S)
How many Poles at Armature?(#P)
How many Brushes?(#B)
How many Commutator Elements?(#C)

If you have the 18P/18C/2S/2B, then go with the P12 enhanced to P18...It should work fine...however, I am not done testing that motor on Lab...so, play by "ear"...

How many turns depends on your application, Source...Now for testing, get as much wire as it fits...and gauge?...get the coarser, heavier gauge you could fit also...just make sure to leave room for final turns...

Regards

UFO

[sebosfato]

Yes i got exact that. 18p 18c 2s 2b ... Thanks UFO

Ok i will try with the 18 poles for now...

I noticed that your sacred geometry coil you added another coil to the v shape coils to reinforce the opposite field forming the triangle, is a good practice for the 18poles? I mean does it improve it somehow?

I'm going to start winding it tomorrow =)



Thanks again

Regards

Fabio