My Asymmetric Electrodynamic Machines

[Sanskara316]

Now...I will just render One Video in this Intermezzo ...from a great Member that we have been working together since My First Thread here...His Name is NETICA.
(And, Netica, please let me borrow your nice video to show it here for all to enjoy... )

Ufopolitics Project Replication with DC brushed motor. by netica. Video 2 - YouTube


Now so you all have "An Idea" what we are dealing here...I will explain...Netica is just using My Coil Set Up (And an AIR CORE Coil)...oscillating it with my Arrangement...and Two Diodes from Coil are feeding that Symmetrical Motor...nothing more...no changes to Motor...just ran by My Radiant Energy Source from Coil, regulated by two Diodes...Pulsed by my simple 555 timer...

Now, something "not explainable" by "Your Classic Physics" happens here...No Matter how much Netica tries to press with two pieces of wood against shaft, almost bringing it to a stop!!...Amperage will NOT increase even a decimal count...but decreases !!??

Now, if we go back to Peter Lindemann Calculations...what is the "Typical, Normal" behavior of any Symmetrical Motor when "Under Load"?

Well , only a "small drop" of 371 RPM (2235-1864), will create an increase from 1.1 Amps at Idle...to 7.0 Amps (which is exactly the total Max Amps from battery )


This is just so you have an idea...of the "difference"...


Thanks a million Netica, excellent video!!


Regards to all


Ufopolitics

this video convinced me, about the truths in asymmetrical systems, to those who have doubts, Please watch this video, it will change your mind, I promise you Thanks UFO

[Ufopolitics]

Great!!

thanks ufo,


I think I will cut out a 3 and a 5 pole with the 6 " dia. pieces, I will video everything that I do.

Someone asked about my oscillator on the other thread. It was the circuit John Stone posted. I am getting parts tomorrow for oscillators. I will video the build step by step, with tests at each stage, if you want.

MR John Stone has made awesome designed oscillators...His professional touch by creating Interchangeable Modules, could not be better!

We had there also the great original contribution from Mad Scientist, based on the LM339...That later On Bob French was using to charge batteries back and forth...

That will be a great, awesome idea to post the making of the oscillator step by step!!...excellent idea, many thanks for doing that here!!...it will help a lot here that are kind of lost in a way to make them...like Adilu...

The only reason I was going to build a big 5 pole, is because I managed to get the 5 pole r/s motor going, and I really do not have a lot of experience winding motors. If it ain't broke....

I do have a 16 pole that i found today. I went back through the posts but did not find the 16 pole schem. At least not laid out enough for someone with my poor motor winding skills.

I was going to try making 4 comm segments, and 4 groups of arms, but I'm really not sure.

Four and Four is "Too Symmetrical"...I have been trying to help MR John Stone (now he is on vacation) on an Eight Poles...I have not been able to "solve" that riddle as of now...(Honestly I have not tried later on it)

Ufo, would it be possible for you to post or re-post a 16 pole with 2 brushes per comm.

Thanks again

I will have to make that for you...the one I have made was for Turion...but it is based on 4Stators /4 Brush system...
Now yours is a Two(2) Stator, right?...It should be...for dual brush...


Regards


Ufopolitics

[sputnik]

this video convinced me, about the truths in asymmetrical systems, to those who have doubts, Please watch this video, it will change your mind, I promise you Thanks UFO

+1
Great work Netica!

[machinealive]

Yes UFO it is a two pole stator but you don't have to make that up for me, I kept hunting around and found some 12 poles, just have to shave a little off the shaft to get the other comm on.

They are in good shape so hopefully I will get at that soon, I appreciate you help/offer,

I guess I could turn 2brush 16 pole, into a 4 brush, can you still use a single wind for stator with 4 brush setup?

[Ufopolitics]

Two Stator Four Brush

Yes UFO it is a two pole stator but you don't have to make that up for me, I kept hunting around and found some 12 poles, just have to shave a little off the shaft to get the other comm on.

They are in good shape so hopefully I will get at that soon, I appreciate you help/offer,

Hello Machinealive,

Great, I will still get you something there later on the week...

I guess I could turn 2brush 16 pole, into a 4 brush, can you still use a single wind for stator with 4 brush setup?

Machinealive, the purpose of a Four Brush is to have a Four Stator, when talking "Symmetrical Systems"...just because in a Symmetrical Machine the four brush divides the 360 in Four at Quadrant, so there will be produced at Armature-Rotor a Steady Virtual Magnetic Symmetry Pattern of NSNS, where each magnetic field will display at 90 degrees related to the Four Stators Magnetic Fields, and just "a bit" out of phase from their dead center, so it gets a rotation going when energized.

What you could do is use the same 16 Poles Four Brush diagram and energize with the Two Input Brushes the Two Pair of Coils that you will connect in parallel...(series will add the resistance of all four coils)...Now you will have to re-arrange the Two Stators positioning so you get a steady rotation at all times...I will have to get all that on a CAD...to confirm it for you. But this way you will use just two brushes and two stators and the 16 poles...


Another simple approach is to wind it based on My P-12 Diagram (Below), where I have two ways on Brushes set up related to stators(here they are at 90)...Then expand the Pairs to P-16...it will work, and you will use coils wrapping four poles...4X4=16

[IMG][/IMG]


Regards


Ufopolitics

[adilu]

Hello Adilu,

After reviewing your question a few times, and my previous answer...then I finally realized the "essence" of your concern...:



Dear, the Presence of a Magnetic Field is one Phenomena...and the Induction from that Magnetic Field projected to another "body" is another phenomena, that we all know as "Induction"...They do not necessarily need to be always manifested at the same time. Since there are so many different Magnetic Fields Patterns, based on their nature and generation processes...

The "Induction" process that We are mostly familiar with, and the "only one" They taught at school...is the Ferrous Induction, where the nature of this Material Must be present in order to "execute". We wrongfully know this process as "the one and only"...and that fact, highly limits our knowledge of other real and natural magnetic processes.
A Ceramic Magnet contains Ferrous Materials in it, as a Neodymium or Rare Earth magnet also contains same material...Then We proceed to "Artificially Copy-Paste" same process but in our known electromagnet/coils...always having a laminated ferrous metal composition included...
Based on this "Locked-in Model" we have built all our Electrical Machinery for more than a Century...

So, in order for you to really understand what is going on here...I need to explain a bit further...

That is NOT the "one and only" Induction that we all had all this time surrounding Us...and goes back to a "Universal Infinite Process" that dates back to endless times.
There is another Induction, a Non Artificial one, very natural...It manifests everyday in front of Us...and it is based on just "Pure Magnetic Fields Patterns"...without the need, requirement of any "specific" earth material...but just "Air"...
It is more powerful than our known one...much more...if we align-process those magnetic patterns the right ways...
I call it "Negative Induction"...just because we have always considered our Artificially Generated Energy as "Positive"...but, it should have been "The other way around"...but it is ok...

How they work together ?...simple...a "Push-Pull" action...When we push our "Positive" magnetic field outwards...and we cut it down by pulsation to zero or a short...A Negative Magnetic Pattern drives In...We are "Pulling" it In, by our action...it is a natural response.

Now, when we feed that Hollow Stator linear, we still produce our magnetic field, and pretty strong...but it will not "transfer" strongly through Induction...which I use advantage off...to allow the Negative Reverse Radiant Field to enter stronger by Pulses into Machine. And since it is "Reverse"...meaning opposite to Our Magnetic field , is then understood it creates an induction that assists our rotation...
But that I already explained before...

Hope I explained better now...


Regards


Ufopolitics

hello UFO
and thank you for further explanation
i saw it a second time when i was reviewing your explanations..sorry
it is a great and simple explanation .....maybe when you have time you will tell us like a story more of .."SHE"


best regards!
adi

[adilu]

That will be a great, awesome idea to post the making of the oscillator step by step!!...excellent idea, many thanks for doing that here!!...it will help a lot here that are kind of lost in a way to make them...like Adilu...


Regards


Ufopolitics

hello Machinealive
UFO is right...for me and others like me a step by step video of making an oscillator is a bless
thank you in advance

adi

[Netica]

Now...I will just render One Video in this Intermezzo ...from a great Member that we have been working together since My First Thread here...His Name is NETICA.
(And, Netica, please let me borrow your nice video to show it here for all to enjoy... )

Ufopolitics Project Replication with DC brushed motor. by netica. Video 2 - YouTube


Now so you all have "An Idea" what we are dealing here...I will explain...Netica is just using My Coil Set Up (And an AIR CORE Coil)...oscillating it with my Arrangement...and Two Diodes from Coil are feeding that Symmetrical Motor...nothing more...no changes to Motor...just ran by My Radiant Energy Source from Coil, regulated by two Diodes...Pulsed by my simple 555 timer...

Now, something "not explainable" by "Your Classic Physics" happens here...No Matter how much Netica tries to press with two pieces of wood against shaft, almost bringing it to a stop!!...Amperage will NOT increase even a decimal count...but decreases !!??

Now, if we go back to Peter Lindemann Calculations...what is the "Typical, Normal" behavior of any Symmetrical Motor when "Under Load"?

Well , only a "small drop" of 371 RPM (2235-1864), will create an increase from 1.1 Amps at Idle...to 7.0 Amps (which is exactly the total Max Amps from battery )


This is just so you have an idea...of the "difference"...


Thanks a million Netica, excellent video!!


Regards to all


Ufopolitics

Hi Ufo and All,

Ufo I am very happy for you to use my videos, am glad to be able to help, and thank you for your continuous support and help.

Hi prochiro, Sanskara, sputnik, thank you and glad you liked this video.

With regards to this video I found this effect to occur around certain frequency both the frequency and the duty cycle mattered.

Thanks netica

[adilu]

hello Netica!
i saw your video ......it is amazing
but i didn't understand UFO's description very well...he is referring to "My Coil Setup" and "My arrangement"
i watched again your video but i can not identify in there the coil setup and the arrangement (sorry UFO ) maybe from diff thread
can you describe more explicit pls?

tks

adi

[Ufopolitics]

Quoting Myself on Previous Post

I wanted to start winding this since the commutators for it will be here any day now. If I am understanding you correctly, there would be 32 coil pairs on a 16 pole motor, and each pair would have half the windings that the coils on the current 16 pole have. But with two coils on each pole (32 coil pairs and only 16 poles) each pole will have two coils that start on it, and they will be in parallel with each other. ?? And not sure what you mean by "Two poles instead of four"
Dave

Hello Dave,

I already explained this in detail ...(From Page 41 Post#1227)
Below I am quoting myself, so you do not have to search:

The Asymmetrical Generator winding of your Motor:

Figure you will wind instead of One Pair (let's say "P1")...You will divide that Pair in Four Coils, instead of Two (like you have now in your wound machine)
Meaning, you will have two North Coils and two South Coils, each coil wrapped around Two Poles instead of Four Poles. Now, you will do that sequence at all Now "Groups" and not "Pairs" anymore...so let's call this used to be "P1"...now "G1".

In G1, You could wind the Pairs of Norths and South Coils in series one after the other...or in parallel...and same Old Ohm laws apply here as for Capacitors or Batteries connections...Parallel will deliver higher Amps, average Voltage, less Resistance...and series will add more resistance, added Voltage and less Amps...So that is completely up to the desired application.
At the end you will have either way the same amount of ending terminals as in your previous Machine...meaning sixteen above sixteen lower commutator terminals...same exact areas of interactions...comprehending Four Poles Norths, Four Poles Souths...You just have changed the Magnetic Patterns of Coils.
Now...why this?...Ok, for those who do not know...Now we have more number of vertical (elongated) wires...and much less "horizontal ones"...The Horizontal wires do..."Absolutely nothing, nada...but be the conductors of induced energy by the vertical ones"

I will explain: I always consider the Shaft (Axis) of Machine as being in the Vertical Plane (for sake of reference, and no matter how you turn that motor in space... )
What we are doing here is having double of wires running "Parallel to Machine Axis"...meaning "Vertical Wires"...This wires are the ONLY ONES that actually cut the Magnetic Field Perpendicular to Flux Lines...therefore, they are the ones who really generate electrical induction. And the "Secret Formula" is very simple according to Faraday Induction Laws from the 1800's..."The More Wires you guys have cutting perpendicularly the magnetic field lines ....the higher the energy induced..."
So, if you still want MORE ENERGY...then go One Coil per One Pole...(Meaning you will fraction Four Norths and Four Souths per Group) and you will have now four times the amount of VERTICAL wires as your previous wound motor...

Now, just by one 360º Turn of that machine...figure how many wire-conductors will cut the magnetic field lines...Then you will generate huge amount of energy at just one turn...

What I recommend when building this dedicated Generator machines...is to add a Fiberglass or Mica Annular Board right below commutator...one to each commutator, and very secured to them (epoxy is possible)..and drill holes where every commutator element goes, in order to insert small lines of copper sheets...to grab and clamp wires coming from Coils and also to commutator elements...that way you could "jump" them in that board...as to connect them series or parallel...or even combinations of both... ...while checking which connection will render best results at output..Make sure you number them at the Boards...so you do not get confused or have conflicts...What I do is when wiring add a piece of masking tape to each wire...with their respective numbers...then insert them at board...

This Generator is also a Motor...but it will not have the same Solid Magnetic Patterns at their rotor coils to Stator Interactions, but "Fractal Magnetic Patterns within same Polarity Domains"...therefore, Machine will run (as a Motor) with less speed and less torque...but that is exactly what we need in a Generator...
The way to connect it to "Prime Mover" or the Asymmetrical Motor...is like I have shown before here...preferably shafts connected face to face (less mechanical energy loss) than Pulley to Pulley and belt (side to side connection)
Now the "IDEAL" "Prime Mover" or Asymmetrical Motor to Run this Generators...needs to be the Fastest ones...and also of heavier torque (thanks God we can have both high ends parameters here... )...that is why I recommend the Dual Triangles (Star of David) or other one that have longer "Throw Out Angles" (More Poles per coils as possible, related to stator size and disposition allows)
Therefore, it would be also understood, that a very Long Armature Motor...will be much better than a "Pancake Style Armature" for a Dedicated Generator Machine...those short armatures are better for Motor Applications...However, remember that our Motors also generate energy...

I know this kind of complicates things a bit...so, whenever I have the chance I will render some diagrams...
Please let me know those who understood this post. And please do not hesitate to ask.

Thanks


Regards to all


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Dear Adilu...

hello Netica!
i saw your video ......it is amazing
but i didn't understand UFO's description very well...he is referring to "My Coil Setup" and "My arrangement"
i watched again your video but i can not identify in there the coil setup and the arrangement (sorry UFO ) maybe from diff thread
can you describe more explicit pls?

tks

adi

Hello Dear Adilu,

I was referring to my very first and pretty long and winding Thread...

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...nt-energy.html

Everything is there...Stationary Coils, Oscillators...etc,etc


Regards


Ufopolitics

[adilu]

tks UFO
i'll start reading

[Ufopolitics]

Thanks Netica

Hi Ufo and All,

Ufo I am very happy for you to use my videos, am glad to be able to help, and thank you for your continuous support and help.

Hi prochiro, Sanskara, sputnik, thank you and glad you liked this video.

With regards to this video I found this effect to occur around certain frequency both the frequency and the duty cycle mattered.

Thanks netica

Hello Netica,

Thanks Netica, that video is awesome...Now, I know you have there three yellow capacitors...are they connected in parallel related to Coil Output-Motor Input?...I notice two small ones are in series then in parallel to bigger one?

Could you tell Us what were the Caps spec's?

I did realize it takes you some time to "tune" the right frequency-duty cycle...do you remember around what numbers this happened?

I believe (not sure though) that you are using on this video, the LM339 Oscillator from Mad Scientist?...Or the enhanced one by John Stone?

I want to reproduce that "Effect" but with My Asymmetrical BOSCH Machine...see what happens...and make a video of it.


Thanks, and really appreciate your help and contributions !

Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Reasons to Match Coils...

Hi UFO,

Thanks for the tip! The motor is a 5 pole design. Each coil was 51 turns and 2.2 Ohms. The resistance at the half way point was 3.4 Ohms. The wire gauge is 28 (0.0125"). My questions are what gauge of wire should I use and when you say "your Mod Single Coil will be 1 1/2 of One original one" do you mean "coil pair" (P1,P3 + P1,P4 = 3.4 Ohms)?

I have more motors on order so I can make a second mod. motor.

Cheers,
Vince

Hello Vince,

Normally a Five Pole Symmetric Machine, each coil comprehends two poles...is that right in your motors?

The reason to "Match-Balance" Coils, is in order to set both machines (Original and Mod) in a standard and common grounds to be tested evenly...However, this windings to match Original not necessarily means that is the way to wind Asymmetrical Machines in order to perform better, but, only for purposes of testing related to Amps-Volts Draw and RPM development. I wanted to make that clear to you before proceeding here.

Now if Original Coils wrap around two poles, then Modified will do also, except that it will have Double the amount of Coils. Your original comes with exactly Five(5)Coils...and the Mod will have Ten(10) Coils or Five Pairs...However, the Mod will energize just One Pair per "Momentum", while Original will energize the whole Five Coils within same "Momentum"...That is why Original will show less Amp draw (more resistance in total, Ohm Law I=V/R, the bigger "R" the lower "I") when idling (no load), besides forced C EMF by Symmetry, will also create a Counter Resistance that will reduce heavy electron positive flow...reflecting in even less amperage draw. I am saying this because we will never get a very low amp draw on Asymmetry...besides by rotation we get back flow at input if no load is applied to Asymmetrical Machine. The advantages are when Machines are at load...then the opposite happens...and Motors are designed to work...not to stay at idle all times...

Now if you set a diagram to Original Input related to its armature coils...Input brushes divide the whole series array in two all times, meaning Resistance Total will be Parallel Formula of Half and Half ...meaning, You said Half way (half coils of total armature) resistance is 3.4 Ohms, so adding and divided by two, we will have same value of 3.4 Ohms

So a close "match" will be...One Pair of Coils in the Modified to have around 3.4 Ohms...
Now, normally for an Asymmetric Machine that will be a bit high R per Pair, as I recommend to be above or equal to One Ohm per Pair...(1.0 to 1.8, 2.0)

Try winding them with 30 awg...finer wire to get a bit more room and gain resistance with lesser turns...


Regards


Ufopolitics

[Netica]

Hello Netica,

Thanks Netica, that video is awesome...Now, I know you have there three yellow capacitors...are they connected in parallel related to Coil Output-Motor Input?...I notice two small ones are in series then in parallel to bigger one?

Could you tell Us what were the Caps spec's?

I did realize it takes you some time to "tune" the right frequency-duty cycle...do you remember around what numbers this happened?

I believe (not sure though) that you are using on this video, the LM339 Oscillator from Mad Scientist?...Or the enhanced one by John Stone?

I want to reproduce that "Effect" but with My Asymmetrical BOSCH Machine...see what happens...and make a video of it.


Thanks, and really appreciate your help and contributions !

Regards


Ufopolitics

Hello Ufo,

With regard to the capacitors I used small ones to start with then added more, I noticed the more I added the better the performance of the motor, It just kept speeding up, until it reached a point where adding the capacitors made no difference. The one I ended up with was 10uf 250v. And yes it is connected in parallel with the motor from coil output.
The 2 small caps I think were 3.3uf 250v each,in series but then in parallel with the other cap and motor. I don't think these smaller caps made much difference once I had the bigger 10uf one attached.
The capacitors were Metallised Polypropylene.

I have no idea what the frequency was, I just dialed it in till it worked the best, same with the duty cycle. at a guess the duty cycle was around 60-70%.

The oscillator I used was from RMCybernetics - RMCybernetics - DIY Homemade Power Pulse Controller
I used this because I just found it the easiest to build and it worked with no problems I just put about 5 different value caps for C1 which are switchable to change the frequency range.


I wanted to re-check this first but may take awhile now because I have crap everywhere. I done another test after making the video, just a little while ago measuring the volts and amps on the motor side (cold side) of the coil.
The video shows the amps on the hot side of the coil and remains constant with load and the volts are 36v.
Now if I remember correctly, on the motor side when the load was applied the amps did go up (on the cold side) but the voltage went right down. Now the hot side showed no change as you see in the video.
So there seems to be one thing happening on the hot side and another thing happening on the cold side.
On the cold side the amps, volts, speed, and load all seemed to be related, they all were changing interrelated to each other but the draw on the hot side would stay constant and unchanging.
The cold side seemed to be isolated from the hot in the way it was behaving.

Regards
netica