My Asymmetric Electrodynamic Machines

[prochiro]

Hello All
On the post with the video's YOUtube reversed the feed and will not fix them. I posted to dropbox and you can see them there. Our own forum will not let me change the video also.

Test 3https://www.dropbox.com/s/9ix3nye2w3...Feed%20003.wmv

Test 4
https://www.dropbox.com/s/sbhr966r2z...Feed%20004.wmv

You can also see more when the film is not reversed by YouTube. They are really getting to be a pain in the b***.

@Cornboy
I am taking a positive from battery thru motor then into pulser then to neg of battery. I know we talked about this before but the search program on this thread will not search vary well now. You can pull a work out of your post and search will say there is 0 found. What I was asking about is if we went to pulser first, then motor, is it possible that it would be different concerning spikes. I know they really go backwards but could not remember the exact reason we did it as we did.

@Hitby13kw
The fet went at the end of video 2 or the turn on of video three. Notice the severe start speed on both video 3 and 4. At that time I also changed the frequency from 30 to much higher and then much lower to see if I could get control of speed as the duty pot was not responding all that well. When I saw the amps surging on file 4 and saw the #2 LED was off I knew the jug was up. You asked about LED on or off or blinking. If blinking is on, all is well so keep going. If LED is on, your fet is locked on full time and you should also hear a surge at motor,wild. If the LED is off, you can maybe go on but that circuit is ether not working or fet is gone and remained open as well as heat will stop. I hope I described that correctly. I will begin take down of fets after supper.
Dana

[Cornboy 555]

OK.

OK, DANA, from what you have described, it sounds like you are switching LOW side , it's just that N channel Fets, don't like switching on high side, and i thought you may have had a problem because of that.

All the best Cornboy.

[Ufopolitics]

Awesome!!

Hello All
On the post with the video's YOUtube reversed the feed and will not fix them. I posted to dropbox and you can see them there. Our own forum will not let me change the video also.

Test 3https://www.dropbox.com/s/9ix3nye2w3...Feed%20003.wmv

Test 4
https://www.dropbox.com/s/sbhr966r2z...Feed%20004.wmv

You can also see more when the film is not reversed by YouTube. They are really getting to be a pain in the b***.

@Cornboy
I am taking a positive from battery thru motor then into pulser then to neg of battery. I know we talked about this before but the search program on this thread will not search vary well now. You can pull a work out of your post and search will say there is 0 found. What I was asking about is if we went to pulser first, then motor, is it possible that it would be different concerning spikes. I know they really go backwards but could not remember the exact reason we did it as we did.

@Hitby13kw
The fet went at the end of video 2 or the turn on of video three. Notice the severe start speed on both video 3 and 4. At that time I also changed the frequency from 30 to much higher and then much lower to see if I could get control of speed as the duty pot was not responding all that well. When I saw the amps surging on file 4 and saw the #2 LED was off I knew the jug was up. You asked about LED on or off or blinking. If blinking is on, all is well so keep going. If LED is on, your fet is locked on full time and you should also hear a surge at motor,wild. If the LED is off, you can maybe go on but that circuit is ether not working or fet is gone and remained open as well as heat will stop. I hope I described that correctly. I will begin take down of fets after supper.
Dana

Hello Dana,

Got back a while from work, being here reading and watching your vids...Ok, related to your previous question about FET's...You have them right, the FET's are N-Channels, so they close/switch circuit on "Low Side" (Or Negative)...@Cornboy:That answers your question right?

FET's are receiving Gate signal through Opto-Couplers...from Arduino Microprocessor...FET's Source Legs Go ALL, to Battery Bank Negative, then Each Module's FET's Drains (Channel 1,2,3 and 4) go to each respective Numbered Gates at Motor (P1,P8,P15 and P22)

Remember this Drawing?

[IMG][/IMG]

Well, All we are doing now is replacing ALL Four Switches by the Four Monster Pulsers...FET's Pairs at each Module...Source/Drain Terminals...connected to both ends of switches...while FET'Gates are driven by the Low side signals from Arduino Microprocessor...that's all.

NOW, AND BEFORE I FORGET, VERY IMPORTANT!

Dana, You MUST Install Potentiometers (ALL THREE) on an "L" Aluminum or Steel Bracket...and get a wire from that L Bracket and hook it to your Modules Ground...(NOT THE HIGH VOLTAGE BATTERY BANK NEGATIVE, BUT, TO THE MONSTER OPERATING VOLTAGE AT THE LOW SIDE SIGNAL)

The thing is...by touching the Potentiometer chassis not being grounded, will create Interference at the sensitive low signal side...it has happened to me before...AND, IF You could find Plastic Knobs...would be even better...that way your Hands Ground will not be transmitted to the sensitive side....That may be one of your "Crosstalk Issues" with FET's

Now I watched both videos on Drop Box..(will watch the YT later)...and it is great, nice, your machine sounds super robust...

Now, when you have the System running with 48V...(Second Video)...You MUST lower the Duty or Frequency to get MAX to 3800 RPM's...You got there OVER 4200....And that IS WAY TOO MUCH!...basically when you are not adding a load at generator head side. And here is where we will have to work together -with Sir John Stone, when -hopefully soon, He gets everything well at home- We must make some kind of an "Automatic Speed Control" that MAINTAINS the Generator Head RPM's Spec's...and fluctuates Up-Down between those ranges, when adding or taking loads on-off
BUT, By Now we would have to do it "Manually"...

Remember the "Scheduled Testing" that I posted earlier?...check it out again...Remember that I wrote to "mark" the POT's Knobs position, when You reach the right RPM's Range...while measuring Frequency at Motor Gates or FET's Drains...Just One Channel required...and write it down, please.
The point on doing this, is to start adding from small to bigger Wattage Draw Loads at Gen Output...then Gen will demand more RPM's...as you keep adding loads...so, needs to increase POT's...as also Frequency at Motor Gates will increase...

Bottom line:We need to generate with this written Data a "Demand-Response Ratio Chart" between Both Machines as we increase-decrease loads from Generator Head

With this data...We would be either able to write the codes for a Frequency Driven Circuit...at Arduino...or build a Sensor-actuator system to follow this Communication Protocols.

And yes, Amperage was pulsing at Second Video (48 V Test) because that Blown FET...went bad by closing circuit 100% of the time (Full Short Circuit)...so, Meter is reading Three Short Pulses and One at Full length , no pulse but linear feed...and That test WAS GREAT! (Sorry about your FET...Though...)...BUT, We ALL Could SEE CLEARLY...the BIG TIME difference between pulsing with Sequenced dead/off times and Amperage Draw...versus the Linear/Straight Feed...raising up Amps Draw, when Ammeter Needle jumped Higher ... BEAUTIFUL!!

EXCELLENT WORK MY FRIEND!! AWESOME!


Warm Regards



Ufopolitics

[prochiro]

Found the problem

Hello UFO and all

The autopsy was performed and the cause of fet death was found. It was all my fault. When I put those two fets in I did a continuity check and all seemed well. The problem was bad solder connection on the one outside fet pin and when continuity was checked, seemed good but the contact came from the other fet as both sides end up in the same place. I had to use a magnifying glass to see it. I have the damage repaired and doing another short test on that circuit. The one fet that was working held up its ind until it could go no further. In truth, I was expecting much lower amps than the tests indicated. Now UFO, you should really see test 1 and 2 as the control is correct there and smooth. What you saw in test 3 and 4 was after the last fet died. The duty pot had no control over the machine at the end and was loosing it from the start of file 3 on. I will run those tests tomorrow after I add a a pot holder and grounding setup. One thing that I have found is that you do not want to touch two of the heat sinks at the same time with your hand. Got just a little spicy there for a second. Don't worry, everything is under control and getting better all the time. I am going to test the pee out of the Monsters so when the next new system comes we can test it from the start.
Dana

[Ufopolitics]

Tests 1 & 2

Hello UFO and all

The autopsy was performed and the cause of fet death was found. It was all my fault. When I put those two fets in I did a continuity check and all seemed well. The problem was bad solder connection on the one outside fet pin and when continuity was checked, seemed good but the contact came from the other fet as both sides end up in the same place. I had to use a magnifying glass to see it. I have the damage repaired and doing another short test on that circuit. The one fet that was working held up its ind until it could go no further. In truth, I was expecting much lower amps than the tests indicated. Now UFO, you should really see test 1 and 2 as the control is correct there and smooth. What you saw in test 3 and 4 was after the last fet died. The duty pot had no control over the machine at the end and was loosing it from the start of file 3 on. I will run those tests tomorrow after I add a a pot holder and grounding setup. One thing that I have found is that you do not want to touch two of the heat sinks at the same time with your hand. Got just a little spicy there for a second. Don't worry, everything is under control and getting better all the time. I am going to test the pee out of the Monsters so when the next new system comes we can test it from the start.
Dana

Hello Dana,


I MUST have started from "An Organized Sequence" watching this beautiful first two videos!!...


YES!...You've got it there friend...We are gonna beat it this time, definitively, sure off...

Very Smooth but yet very powerful Machines running...very low amp draw...cool FET's...

Dana, do something...put a Volt Meter between just One Chanel and Positive from batteries...to see if you are getting full/peak voltage at "On Times"...please...no matter what voltage/battery bank being tested...


Do You guys remember when Mr Joe Newman said...that His Motors worked mainly on Voltage?...

Then... "The Knowledgeable Audience" laughed of his ignorance..."


Right?...right...

Start loading that Gen Head with small loads first, my dear friend...no hurry...take it "very easy"...and slow...one by one...then let's watch the demand-draw relation...


Superb work Dana!


Regards


Ufopolitics

[iankoglin]

G'day Kogs
Post 427 in other thread is a good two part circuit in thicker lines.
Dana

G'day Patrick
I really like your setup/progress I shows no matter what others think if you keep progressing you eventually get there.
Than you for the copy of JS Monster Driver version 5.1 T3001 and Thank you John stone for designing it
I tried to find the 2 part circuit you mentioned Post 427 but it didn't seem to be there I tried looking at several pages before and after on both threads but could not locate it.
Would you please check if you had the page number right.

I noticed that you have built the driver in two parts
I would like to try first just the FET part on my other small motors I am working on and when I receive my Arduino UNO (soon) I will build the P56 motor and then build the complete driver to run it from the Arduino UNO

I remember seeing the post where you have a smaller alternator than the Mac Alte.
I am still going to modify 2 other "MY" motors first so as to get a bit of practice winding and then start on the P56's
I have 3 of them one I want to run the Mac Alte with and the other two I will wind them one in reverse so as to run them in tandem to fit into a car.

I am really looking forward to the new thread
Kindest Regards to you


Kogs still at it

[prochiro]

@ Kogs
I'm sorry, I gave you my posts count. I have plastered those files all over the last page in the first thread. Now get to work, have fun.
Dana

[Midaztouch]

Great Job Dana!!!

Dana,

I enjoyed the videos. I should have watched the Dropbox vids first. I had to do a handstand to watch some on youtube.

I was very impressed that you use a Magnifying Glass to do the "Autopsy". I guess, a "fine tooth comb" may not have found the problem. I'm glad to to see that the problem with the FET was not serious.

Keep it Clean and Green

Richie

[sampojo]

Great insight as usual

@Ufo
and what great things you are so freely sharing. Its a blessing.

I wonder what its like to walk into your shop and look around and see what you can see. And just what are your loyal customers buying from you there?

Don't answer that!

@Dana, excellent tests, excellent troubleshooting, excellent everything.

[Lightworker1]

IR Temperature Sensor now also Complete

Hello everyone. My arduino IR Temperature Sensor project is now complete.
The other previous sensor was my Hall RPM Sensor "Allegro A1302"
Here is a small video of this sensor and arduino

https://www.dropbox.com/s/68xw1yazm3...0Sensor-01.mp4


Data Sheet Melexis MLX90614 IR Temperature Sensor

https://www.dropbox.com/s/44r4gt6c3i...heet%20%20.pdf

Arduino Sketch
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/zgaypmqc8lrm7sy/kSbfw2AHEj

Processing Sketch
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/3nr63c216krplfn/90DSPBVQll


Useful Tutorial: Tutorial 07 for Arduino: I2C Communication and Processing
by sciguy14 - Jermy Blum. This is a great tutorial but the code in that program may not work with current version of software.

Tutorial 06 for Arduino: Serial Communication and Processing - YouTube


Hello UFO, Dana, Hitby13KV, Machinealive, Cornboy (with MAG3) and all who are now working with the Imperial -- just a thought:

I think We can use Electronic Speed Control System using traditional negative speed feed back system using Arduinos.

As RPM Hall Sensor is also now functional WHICH WILL DETECT REAL ROTATIONAL SPEED (RPM).
We can set desired RPM rate at 3800 RPMs in Arduino as CONSTANT INTEGER = 3800;

Next as the load on the imperial goes up and down, we can use use the error signal voltage between the
demand (3800 RPM) and current RPM to vary PWM of the driver signal to John Stone's Monster FET Bank.
In other words, as the load varies up and down, the resulting
error signal can be used to hold RPM at a steady rate of 3800 RPM within some +- limits
The aim here is to keep error voltage signal close to ZERO.

Now I am in position to carry out real experimental work on the dual pentagon motor with capacitors.

Warmest Regards

lightworker1

[Cornboy 555]

Heavy Light work.

Thanks very much Light, good work.

Warm Regards Cornboy.

[JohnStone]

Hi Lightworker,
your sugggestion correspnds to mine. Simple speed control by controlling PWM.
In Arduino world there are perfect control routines for PID control. But it is difficult to tune them. Leave this for later refinements.
The first approach should start with simple PI-control only (see link above) ->
check speed on a regular basis not too often (i.e. every 500ms) and increment or decrement PWM slightly (depending of detection of overspeed / underspeed). This procedure will be slow in adaption but will not generate wild oscilations in speed. For initial LAB test it will surely suffice.

Applying sudden load will cause drop of rpm and take some seconds to readjust. Same if load being disconnected. In any case the adjusted rpm will be exactly as required.

Notion: Any further expansion will need some gauges and further controls. Uncontrolled growth of Arduino environment will be less productive. Extensive use of LCD display and controls will take away precious arduino power. Let's discuss later on how to procede.


BTW: Currently I am still not able to track the thread completely. But please address questions by PM if you like. I will answer ASAP.
JS

[Ufopolitics]

Hello Light

[COLOR="RoyalBlue"][B]

Hello UFO, Dana, Hitby13KV, Machinealive, Cornboy (with MAG3) and all who are now working with the Imperial -- just a thought:

I think We can use Electronic Speed Control System using traditional negative speed feed back system using Arduinos.

As RPM Hall Sensor is also now functional WHICH WILL DETECT REAL ROTATIONAL SPEED (RPM).
We can set desired RPM rate at 3800 RPMs in Arduino as CONSTANT INTEGER = 3800;

Next as the load on the imperial goes up and down, we can use use the error signal voltage between the
demand (3800 RPM) and current RPM to vary PWM of the driver signal to John Stone's Monster FET Bank.
In other words, as the load varies up and down, the resulting
error signal can be used to hold RPM at a steady rate of 3800 RPM within some +- limits
The aim here is to keep error voltage signal close to ZERO.

Now I am in position to carry out real experimental work on the dual pentagon motor with capacitors.

Warmest Regards

lightworker1

Hello Light,

Yes that could be an option, however, by using the Prime Mover RPM's as a fixed parameter , or RPM's at 3800 (which is NOT Constant during operation, Generators run from 3200 to 3800 [600 RPM's difference, while "Ideal" is 3600] depending on load) we are just concentrating in "One side Only"...of the Communication Protocol for Both Machines...

Now, IF We go to Generator Head Output signal in HERTZ...Then We DO have a constant Fixed Parameter there, or 60 Hz...By keeping this parameter at CLOSED RANGE...which is from 58 to 62 Hertz, difference is 4 Hertz variation,it will keep all appliances running at a "Safe" Cycles per second.

That is the reason why I asked Dana and Hitby13kw...to run tests measuring Hertz at BOTH ENDS of Machines during operation...when "No Load"...and when start to add smaller loads -at a time- and watching/writing down Machines Demand-Response. This Data will help Us construct a very accurate Graph Curve of Hertz at both ends, therefore help Us to move into Automatic Speed Control driving Imperial.

Therefore, I would like to recommend as Main Fixed Integer to be concerned, the Hertz at Generator Output...then we could also establish a Computational balance based on RPM's at Imperial....or Hertz driving Imperial through Arduino...or even better, both RPM's and Hertz Control (more secure).

RPM's is a result of Signal Frequency sent to FET's Gates...and that fact establishes that by driving directly from signals...we will achieve faster responses from Motor.

Let's remember that by running a Generator Head ABOVE the established Hertz Range...we WILL definitively BLOW OUT anything that gets connected to those Outputs...besides, We will NOT BE "in compliance" with all the Controlling "Agencies"...and they will definitively restrict use unless UL Approved...

Warm Regards Lightworker and excellent work there you are doing!!


Ufopolitics

[machinealive]

quad driver

Finally got the arduino running

Quad pulser now functional - YouTube

Thanks for the codes Dana.
I'm going to start hooking up imperial, may have time tonight.

Can't wait to see your new thread UFO.

[prochiro]

The movie you have to see.

Hello All

I made some changes in the Arduino program so that complete control including turn off motor is by the duty cycle pot. Pot turned all the way down turns off motor. Now when running the Arduino, there will be only a vary small hot spot for your frequency and it will be between 10 and 30. Find it and do not change it at all(leave it alone). The only thing you do to start and run your imperial is turn the duty pot.
Download this program:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/cagd0lxzan...PWM_ver1_2.ino

This is the state of the setup to date.


When you use the serial screen, you will see the duty cycle printed one time until you change it, then it reprints.


This is the video we have all been waiting for. The run voltage is 36V and RPM at top speed is 3333. I will add one more 6V to do 3780 RPM. When we get the controls for generator HZ then we will need 48V total. The amperage is running between 11 and 12 amps. The motor noise is half that when we started and no vibration.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/kncw35ppuc...lQuadFeed2.wmv

More to do, loading is the next step.
Dana