My Asymmetric Electrodynamic Machines

[asollid]

I have not been able to find a post showing a radially wound armature and an axially wound field coil being pulsed. Or is it not necessary to pulse a radially wound armature since the induced magnetic field already aids rotation?

[s e t h]

i don't think anyone in this thread has yet posted anything using both field coils and a proper stator frame being pulsed.

does anyone know of any electric motors built with armature and stator electromagnets that is designed to run on pulsed DC?

i just feel that if there is anything special happening in pulsed DC say creating a field that can interact with another similar field to produce rotation then stator and field coils being puled seem like a good place to start looking.

[prochiro]

Whats going on

Can anyone else load further posts or get page 200???
Dana

[s e t h]

Can anyone else load further posts or get page 200???
Dana

this post seems to be on page 200 to me...often forum software likes to show there is one more page when there isn't...your post above was the last on the thread at the time

[iankoglin]

Asymmetric field coils

i don't think anyone in this thread has yet posted anything using both field coils and a proper stator frame being pulsed.

does anyone know of any electric motors built with armature and stator electromagnets that is designed to run on pulsed DC?

i just feel that if there is anything special happening in pulsed DC say creating a field that can interact with another similar field to produce rotation then stator and field coils being puled seem like a good place to start looking.

G'day Seth
Yes there is somewhere in the first third of this thread that an Asymmetric field coils were discussed and built using a PVC pipe with fins glued on the outside of the pipe to enable the field coils to be wound and kept in position.
UFO discussed the wiring and one of the members (I just cannot remember his name) built the asymmetrical wound Stator frame that would rotate any wound armature placed inside it.
Also as I mentioned in a prior post that UFO made an asymmetric DC motor using just the Magnet wire and wood only.

I am sorry I just do not have the time myself to look up these posts but it has been done.
I myself spend a lot of time re reading these posts to verify things before I commit to building them so get things right.
I think sometimes when I go through these posts I really need to catalogue them but I like everyone else is just busy.
I am at the moment busy rebuilding/rewinding my ZY1020F motor for my Tricycle. I have wound the first 3 poles when I had finished the third found I wired it upside down and had to re wind it
@ Dana this post is post 12 on page 200
Kindest Regards

Kogs always busy and my knee still hurts

[Cornboy 555]

i don't think anyone in this thread has yet posted anything using both field coils and a proper stator frame being pulsed.

does anyone know of any electric motors built with armature and stator electromagnets that is designed to run on pulsed DC?

i just feel that if there is anything special happening in pulsed DC say creating a field that can interact with another similar field to produce rotation then stator and field coils being puled seem like a good place to start looking.

Hello Seth, i am scratch building a motor just as you describe, based on UFO's MAG3 design. It's progress is a bit slow due to lack of time.

If you wish to follow it the easiest way would be to click on cornboy 555 then all posts by cornboy 555.
I started posting here specifically to build this motor.

Hey DANA, this post is the second time i tried, the first didn't go through.


All the best and Merry Christmas Everyone, Cornboy.

[erfinder]

Hello Seth, i am scratch building a motor just as you describe, based on UFO's MAG3 design. It's progress is a bit slow due to lack of time.

If you wish to follow it the easiest way would be to click on cornboy 555 then all posts by cornboy 555.
I started posting here specifically to build this motor.

Hey DANA, this post is the second time i tried, the first didn't go through.


All the best and Merry Christmas Everyone, Cornboy.

There is so much information being thrown down the throats of the people viewing this thread that it can become overwhelming. The purpose of this post is to offer a pat on the back to Cornboy for deciding to revisit an old idea presented by the author of this thread. I am referring to the device called:

"Fiberglass Stator or Switching Poles Inductor".

In my opinion, this was the most significant disclosure made by UFO to date, everything before and after this specific disclosure failed miserably to reach me, this is me giving honor to a guy who doesn't like me. When UFO began presenting the information on this particular design topology, I was in awe, finally we were on common ground. Unfortunately, the moment was short lived, he stopped all further public research and development and put the pedal to the metal with what is now on the table, namely, the V style windings, a winding method which in my opinion still lacks an adequate explanation.



This is where this particular design and the discussion ended. A few videos were made showing the device spinning, and causing a few compact florescent lamps to flicker. No practical application was ever suggested nor even hinted at.

Each and every person who has ever attempted a replication of the so-called asymmetrical motor should have asked themselves prior to doing such, what happened to the superior concepts demonstrated in the fiberglass design. Fast forward past the first 50 pages, through over 150 pages on the thread and there's no further mentioning of the device! It's as if it never existed. If you purchased an imperial, I highly recommend you begin asking yourself and UFO why these concepts, specifically the winding topology of the fiberglass device wasn't incorporated into these present day retrofits. Isn't the fiberglass winding topology supposed to be superior to the V winding method? Why waste time and resources on an inferior method? In your position, after having been more or less beguiled into into making an insane, premature investment based on speculation, I personally would demand that this specific machine and associated concepts be revisited, and amplified so that they can be effectively applied to the machines that you all are working on right now!

One other person on this forum other than myself, working independent of one another came to similar conclusions. His work, like mine was independent of UFO's. He rewound a rotor in the manner similar to and yet superior (the word superior here is attached to the desired output, I know nothing about the 3BGS other than what you can read on the thread, and what I have read is the device generates torque and electrical output more or less simultaneous....the term superior is now established) to the one disclosed by UFO. Where the man I'm referring to got his inspiration I don't know, however, it was good seeing his work, as it helped me to see that I too was on the right path.



How many can see what UFO forgot to demonstrate? How this rotor is wound is found in the following PDF.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...se%20motor.pdf

Anyone with an imperial, should take a break and look into this 3BGS, why? Because the term asymmetrical applies there, both to physical geometry of the coils, and to the behavior of fields that they produce. From discussions that I had in the past with researchers who work specifically with the 3BGS, the generator effect that I have demonstrated is present. With this design, the use of the commutator is acceptable as not all commutator segments are used, so there is a dead time programmed into this design. The device functions in a manner which allows it to function as a motor, generator, and transformer, CEMF is generated and used in combination with collapsing field energy in this design. Basically, everything you were promised but have yet to get from UFO was found independent from him by the researchers in the 3BGS thread. If you are unwilling to get your hands dirty in a new direction don't expect to get your questions answered. In the 3BGS the motor is part of a system, the point I'm making here is that you should have that motor already! It appears that UFO skipped that phase in the R and D, he gave you a fiberglass machine (a toy, a prototype, proof of principle device) a carrot, and road off into the sunset with the rest, and now you are working on devices which could possibly do more if you were privy to more information.

So Cornboy, I applaud your decision to take a few steps back, your decision to re-investigate that fiberglass design is the right thing to do. My recommendation, if you haven't started looking it already, look into the 3BGS. There is a wealth of information to be researched there, I think it's only fair that the UFO crowd takes a closer look at the 3BGS, if for no other reason, in the beginning, before UFO started pushing and shoving, those folks gave his information a fair review, they were then and have remained open minded. Today, they have the motor-generator he promised he would present, and they accomplished this monumental task without his input!


Merry Christmas


Regards

[MonsieurM]

erfinder

Antonio d'Angelo -- Inter-Atomic Ion Motor -- NY Times article & US Patent # 2021177

check out Fig. X


Merry Xmas

[erfinder]

erfinder

Antonio d'Angelo -- Inter-Atomic Ion Motor -- NY Times article & US Patent # 2021177

check out Fig. X


Merry Xmas

If there ever was a patent granted to anyone which in my opinion could represent the AC/DC motor generator which is the heart of Tesla's method of conversion, it would be this patent. Its good you bring this patent up, I studied it too, its been a source of inspiration of some of my research.



One thing that stands out in this patent is the concept of winding the primary with three windings, and how this leads to the reduction of a large portion of the effects associated with self-induction (Lenz) including sparking at the commutators.

This patent should be an inspiration to the many pulse motor builders out there who've wound multiple strand coils for their machines. This patent can definitely serve as a guide, providing one with new inspiration and insights into directions yet to be explored by pulse motor builders.

Figure 10 is about a three phase embodiment of this device. The principles a carbon copy of that which is discussed in figures I-V. A repeating theme, which is specifically repeated in a description of figure 10 is the mentioning of a time period during which the electric current flow in the secondary will have no demagnetizing effect on the pole winding, this taking place when the secondary current is flowing between poles having the same polarity. Really significant aspect of this design.

In my opinion, this is one worthy of deep study.

Regards

[Turion]

Just some information

When UFO first came out with his design, I built one and I ran it in the 3BGS setup, and got amazing results. The primary batteries were charging while I was running loads on the third battery. You could see the voltage climbing in the videos I took. Unfortunately for me, my build did not hold together well and I could not replicate my results with that specific motor. The fault was the build, not the design of the motor itself. I needed to build another motor, and had too many things going to get around to it.

The design Erfinder posted here is the pulse motor design Matt Jones had developed years back and presented to us to use with the 3BGS long before any of us heard of UFO's motor. I have also gotten amazing results with it AT TIMES. It has no more torque than any other pulse motor, but you can run it at high voltage (just like UFO's motor) and get work out of it.

But let me make one thing clear. I can get amazing results with an OFF THE SHELF MOTOR too, on the 3BGS setup. The wiring configuration of the 3BGS setup, where the motor runs between the positives of two batteries allows for something unique to happen.

In my opinion, much, much, much more study needs to be done before ANYONE has a definitive answer as to which is the BEST configuration to run with the 3BGS setup. I will state that the MOST excited I ever got (other than when I first discovered the 3BGS setup and it ran for weeks) was watching the primaries climb while running UFO's motor. ;-)

As to whether UFO's original disclosure, his present configuration or Matt's configuration is best when run connected normally to a power source, I have not done any comparison let alone extensive testing. I doubt ANYONE has.

I have NO pride when it comes to furthering this research, and no trouble admitting when I am wrong. The 3BGS thread is about dead at this point, and I have no desire to revive it. I brought the information to this forum and if no one chooses to pursue it, that's fine with me. I have fulfilled my obligation. I continue to research, but I am no longer presenting results until I have a looped system.

Dave

[machinealive]

Hello UFO and everyone, hope everyone is enjoying the holidays.

I have not done any comparison let alone extensive testing. I doubt ANYONE has.

That is a good point. You guys can't live like this, can you. I am ordering two imperial rotors, as soon as lovely Diane is in this week, there just so cheap, to test the s..t out of. These 2 are gonna be wound different then UFO's, one like the Figuera/ Telsa rotor, that UFO drew, so nicely for everyone, thank you UFO. The other, is gonna be another idea I have, more Russillian/ tesla, pancake style, it looks more simiar to Matt's rotor, but not quite.

But I have to know for myself. Hopefully, there will be no hard feelings from anyone. :cheers, the system I dream about, still needs a power source to run/ start, and sunlight, batteries, and DC input, is still the best shot I have, FOR NOW.

Monsieur, I managed to get the all the heavy duty windings out of my big generator rotor just today, what a pig. But, anyway I have planned for some time now to turn that gen into the priest's patent, that fig 10, is too similar to Russell's dia on locking potential, and still Tesla influence, you can see it, it is my favorite patent right now. I still am gonna get the Figuera sandwich , spinning, see if I really warp my mind .

Later
Machine

[Cornboy 555]

Well, thanks for the pat on the back Erfinder, but the reason i am pursuing the electromagnet rotor and stator design, is simply because i feel it will produce high torque, and is scalable to any size, eg, bikes, cars, trains, planes etc.

The lack of interference, from Permanent Magnets, to the fields produced by Electromagnets, i think will win the day.

Also the possibility of using a core material with no residual magnetism, able to change magnetic and electrical direction instantly, really appeals to me.

Congratulations on the 3BGS system Dave, i have been following your thread also, i will definately be experimenting with your setup using my MAG3 motor, and any future builds. I feel that Duncan's explanation of series resonance producing the effect has a lot of merit.

@ Machinealive, please keep up the good work friend.

All the best everybody, Cornboy.

[Ufopolitics]

Happy Holidays

Hello to All,

I am wishing everyone of you are passing great times together with all your loved ones...

Thanks Machine Alive, and great you are doing all that work, Imperial is a good and robust machine.

Cornboy, hope we could see soon , early next year yor MAG 3 running!

Turion, like I said in Citfta's Thread...I wish you the best in the 3BGS Project.

Erfinder, That design on the wound-pulsed Stator, I posted, I disclosed it...and from there, many are free to experiment and develop as much as they want ...then come back and show improvements and "how to's" achieve those better performance to work...that is the true spirit of the Open Source.

Member Netica replicated it successfully:

Stator Winding for Asymmetric Motor, by netica. Video 5 - YouTube

I had great success with that Stator wound in that fashion, I classified it in the "Asymmetrical Universal Machines" as I have tested them with AC and they perform even better than with DC. (much less sparking also)

One thing that We never tried on this design, was to rotate looped, overlapped coils at rotor, no commutators, just looped (shorted) closed coils overlapped...in order that each would be energized (turned On) at a certain angle related to stator projection and off in the adjacent angle...in a sequential fashion...

As to the design of Dave Bowling and Matt Jones, I say "great!"...but to me is not a robust Motor Design, like to apply it to many poles configurations, due to too much space taken for just one coil, not allowing for Interleaving of other coils) ...however, it serves in the 3BGS fine...and that is great...but, for Motor Work, it is not "expandable" as to wind Sequentially and Overlapped Coils to obtain a Robust and scalable performance. But then again,, it could be a very good Generator Machine.

@MonsieurM: Monsieur, that Priest Patent was brought here in the very beginning of this Thread, comparing it with mine...as well as saying it was just like mine...it is NOT. If you notice, it is the same winding pattern as Alexander's Patent of Motor-Generator.

@All: Like I have written before, we could expand knowledge and development as our minds and possibilities allow for...no one is restricting anyone here to do so...on the contrary, I have always asked for it to be done...that is the only way to Success, working as a Team, and presenting all data and analyzing it in the Open Source.

Patents have killed progress all along their existence...Patents presents everything in the most "general" way in order to be "protected" from being copied or reproduced, what's called fraud...but, it happens that "fraud" is also a form to replicate them, in order to develop ideas and technology...which they prohibit as a "legal way to do it". That is why I support Open Source.


Regards to All, and Happy Holidays!


Ufopolitics

[asollid]

Hi Machine alive It will be very interesting to see how you rewind a rotor radially as shown in UFOs drawings on page 194. The rotor you are talking about is an axially wound rotor so the cores are all wrong for a radial winding. The core UFO shows is basically a square block.

[machinealive]

@asolid
I wound a small rotor, I posted on the figuera thread, just 2 coils 90* apart, between rotor poles, close enough. it was wound bifilar, I was seeing if I could get 2 ac voltages 90* out of phase.

Simple 2 phase - YouTube

It was not pretty but it served it's purpose. Then I unhooked the ac, and turned the bifilar's into single coils, 90* apart. Ran it as DC motor
DC motor - YouTube

Something seemed bent so I wound another small rotor, but still not quite working right.

So, that seemed close enough for me, it terms of winding like pg 194.

I'm saying this because, after I thought about it, the only way to wind imperial this way would be to make the stator a 2 pole. Tesla showed in a patent how he wound a 4 pole, but really, I don't think it is the same
here is one patent where he winds a 4 pole. To me, not the same, I don't feel like redoing magnets into 2 poles.
Tesla Patent 390,415 - Dynamo-Electric Machine or Motor

I still have the exciter that was in the big gen, it has two big wound stators, if I really need to scratch that itch. Thing is, besides the priest patent, I want out of brushes as well. I gotta keep going with my builds, using magnets or closed coils on the rotor, instead of stator. Vive le telsa!

Sorry, but I bit off a little too much there , I hope the small red 2 pole in the above vids, showed enough. the little motor was rated at 1/8 Hp I believe, cant make out ratings. maybe someone wound something similar size UFO style.

later