Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera

[seaad]

Häpp!!

Liquid rheostats used as motor start switches, about 1900

Let a small motor pull the handles of two rheostats back and forth in opposite way.
Connect the rheostats to the primaries N and S . And TAA-DAAA . . you have got a Clemente Figuera generator.. . .



/ A

[SlickDick]

I don't think so.

MM, got anything to support your statement?

bi

Did MM ever support any of his statements? Answered a question directly? Or build anything for that matter?

[marathonman]

Resistance

ALL;

What the heck is a rheostat,.....resistant wire and where in the heck did you get a liquid rheostat?
at the turn of the century think about what was used and quite being naive. there is nothing to prove just stop being so ignorant.

Slick dick;

who ask your government misinformant arse. how much did you get paid last week to run your mouth and how many sites do you misinform to. probably a lot. Obama is gone so you be gone to misinformant.
From now on i'll call you CNN for short or even Mr. DUH !.

Quote;
:Or build anything for that matter?:

and that is coming from CNN's mouth as a reputable source that had built absolutely NOTHING on this forum but run his BIG FAT F-IN MOUTH. i have built more that all you fools and i share. sure i am limited on funds but at least i build and not run my mouth like all you FOOLS.
all of you people are Hillary hilarious.

MM

[BroMikey]

Did MM ever support any of his statements? Answered a question directly? Or build anything for that matter?

You missed to many classes. First you need to sit and listen to UFO
then in about a year you will catch up. These guys are doing great.

Here is the deal. Instead of rotating the arm to switch the windings
or fields the brushes rotate requiring far less input power to do switching
but with no mechanical?

This is the part I am DUH on also. I missed class also. Anyway from what
I gather the brushes rotate and the windings are switched.


But with no mechanical left over such as we find in a conventional
motor I am looking for the goal of these experiments. Not that I think
that there is no goal, because I know UFO is to smart for that.

If I were to guess knowing what I have learned with DC brush switching
effects, I would say that the input for rotating a set of brushes is the
poor mans device used instead of advanced electronics.

Since the system probably switched a dc source the setup should keep
the run battery up if done right. It seems that many experimenters use
dc switching done by brushes that offers very abrupt connect and
disconnect.

Very inspiring examples. Cornboy has a beautiful m-o-o-o-chine

Someone can fill in the blanks where I missed it. I won't comment
again because I am not building this exact version.

[Allcanadian]

@seaad

Liquid rheostats used as motor start switches, about 1900

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquid_rheostat

What a brilliant idea, thanks

I understand most don't get this so it may help to enlighten some people what we Engineers like myself actually do.

Fist we have a simple "Liquid rheostat" ... fair enough but what do you see, where is the application?. At which point logic and reason should enter the equation and we see the distance between the electrodes and the electrolyte determine the resistance of the circuit. So we take a 3" PVC tube with two output electrodes N and S inside the tube opposite each other and a central offset rotating electrode we will call (+). Next we fill the PVC tube with water and add KOH or salt and we have a near infinitely variable self healing variable frequency rheostat with the outputs having a phase difference of 180 degrees not unlike the Figuera device. The materials including a variable speed DC motor to rotate the offset center electrode should cost around $40 and a few hours to assemble.

Fair enough however this simple device also solves many other problems. Now suppose I want a three phase driver with a variable offset, variable frequency and a clean variable resistance waveform at let's say an input of 50KV. What other components could I use to do this very same thing?. Well there are no components you can buy I know of to do this and even if you could it would cost tens of thousands of dollars not $50 and a few hours of your time.

Now let's say we built a commutator like many of the builders have shown with tightly spaced bars around 1mm apart. What can we expect?, well first after adding carbon residue from the brush we can expect even medium voltages to start bleeding across the bars like a sieve. Where a $40 liquid rheostat with the proper electrolyte could handle 30KV without even breaking a sweat through multiple paths of various phase differences. You see this is what real Engineers do, they see something simple everyone overlooked and find as many applications and solutions to seemingly impossible problems as they can.

This seemingly uninteresting device called a liquid rheostat is a gold mine in my opinion and I have already devised 20 different applications in the last hour. The unfortunate truth is that if we are not solving the problems we face then we are not moving forward. The more problems we solve the more idea's we get to solve other problems and the whole fiasco starts snowballing until the solutions are coming so fast and furious we can't keep up any more. This is how Engineering and Inventing works... take a simple idea and run with it to see where it takes you.

AC

[seaad]

Liquid rheostats . ."In some designs the electrodes are fixed and the liquid is raised and lowered by an external cylinder or pump."

Part-G . .I said: "Ignorant yes I admit that." about the part-G. And I mean how it should produce OU. And that "fantasy?" storage priciple. It's not as a switched DC-DC coverter coil ! ?

Kick back, how do you / we get rid of that? See start of discussion pic!

Regards / A

[Allcanadian]

@seaad

Kick back, how do you / we get rid of that? See start of discussion pic!

Your asking the wrong questions on the wrong level in my opinion. There is a saying... the enemy of my enemy is my friend. You see simple statements can have profound meaning so long as they have meaning to us on some level. We get to decide the meaning because we are not others any more than others could be us, we are unique. If the Lenz effect is your enemy then what is the enemy of the Lenz effect?... is it your friend and your solution?.

Do you want to get rid of it?, can you get rid of it? and if not what other options do you have?. You need to start asking meaningful questions if you want to get meaningful answers.

I have a trick which has served me well over the years. Take something simple like a coil of wire and ask the question... what could I do that truly is different?. If I wanted to demonstrate something different to others, something unknown to me at this time, what are the possibilities?. Obviously if you do not understand how a coil of wire works then your possibilities are very limited. You see your subconscious mind already knows the answers however it won't tell you because you will not accept it anyways. As if to say I don't want to see this so don't show it to me because I cannot accept it.

As such you have already decided you do not want answers and your mind is simply following your own orders which is kind of ironic. Your asking your mind to think of something it has never thought of based on other thoughts you cannot accept. So your mind starts thinking, have you been sniffing glue because this is a contradiction in terms and it does not compute. So you need to ask the right questions in a context which has meaning to you... not how do I do something I think is impossible but something which is different. Different is good impossible is bad however in time they may end up being the same thing.

Another trick is to get up and go to the bench in the middle of the night or very early in the morning when our mind is clear but still disoriented in a sense. This disrupts the normal flow of thought and in this time we are more open to new thoughts. This is why Tesla used to go on three or four day benders with no sleep and in a way it is like being so tired we forget to fall back on our normal train of thoughts and accept new ones.

AC

[seaad]

Allcanadian; Thanks for your somewhat deep answer! (or my bad English understanding)
You say among things: "you have already decided you do not want answers and your mind is simply following your own orders"
Oh Yes! I want answers. But I'm maybe not the right person to put the right questions. English is not my basic language for instance. Maybe you want to take the "asking baton".

I want a discussion here with wild ideas, trying to find the secrets. You found my Liquid Rheostat a brilliant idea, leading you to 20 (new?) own ideas. A wild idea can obviously elicit many other ideas.
And I want to understand what is causing that alleged power storage in the "part-G" for instance, with a good explanation (pics), without the only word "shove" things (magnetic fields) here and there.

Regards / Arne

[Ufopolitics]

The Answer is in the simplest method(s)

Oooh!...and it is "kick back" ...not "back kick"...
Ufopolitics

How do you / we get rid of that??

Start of discussion, see pic!

Regards / Arne

Seaad,

Thanks for correcting my English...however, it is allowed to reverse noun-adjective to adjective-noun for a long time ago, recognized by the Real English Language Academy (awards?...)...did you know that?

Meaning, I can say "Soldier Blue" or "Blue Soldier"...both ways are just fine...

So, getting back to Back-Kick or Kick-Back...from induced...it depends how you are doing the Exciting Signal...

For example, I am using right now Exciting Coils where I do not need to "force" the retracting stage...I let them do it at idle (when they are disconnected)...just as a response-reaction from previous expanding action. Meaning, the new Expanding Field would direct the retract stage on the other coil, as the current flow reversed direction.

We are "complicating" Figuera simple machine like there is no tomorrow...for example, Figuera never wrote to "alter" existing structure from Generators...but we are doing it...and that's plain and simply wrong!!

The only and main idea that Figuera gave us, is to Mimic the "Close and Far Field" that takes place in the exciter field rotation...without the rotation...

Now the question, where is that "Kick-Back" in the typical Generators?

Answer: No where...non existent.

So why are you (we) getting it?...just because you(we) are doing the Exciting Process (which belongs to typical generators) the Wrong Way.

If we get the right TIMING as the right FIELD MAGNITUDE on the Exciting Signal, we should not get any kick back.

The "Kick-Back" is a result from an Over-killing and excessive Exciting Signal...so the Induced must shut it back.

A typical generator Exciting System could start with very low voltage on a cap or magnetic reminiscence and build up into a higher Voltage and right amperage just by reaching the operating RPM's...

And so, we can do exactly the same process, but instead of using RPM's on the whole Magnetic Field CARRIER (Massive and Heavy Iron Rotor with Coils), we apply it ONLY, to the weightless, friction-less, mass-less Non Physical Field FLUCTUATIONS, while coils and iron cores are completely static.


Hope you understand...


Regards


Ufopolitics

[marathonman]

[QUOTE

The "Kick-Back" is a result from an Over-killing and excessive Exciting Signal...so the Induced must shut it back.

A typical generator Exciting System could start with very low voltage on a cap or magnetic reminiscence and build up into a higher Voltage and right amperage just by reaching the operating RPM's...

And so, we can do exactly the same process, but instead of using RPM's on the whole Magnetic Field CARRIER (Massive and Heavy Iron Rotor with Coils), we apply it ONLY, to the weightless, friction-less, mass-less Non Physical Field FLUCTUATIONS, while coils and iron cores are completely static.

[/QUOTE]

The results you have been getting i would tend to agree, you are over exciting your primaries and since we are only moving the massless weightless field it does not require massive power to move it. and while you may be getting this over kick back, it seems that it should still be required to suppress the incoming supply and feed part G but in a rather toned down scenario. the high pressure is still going to form in the low primary whether you choose to ignore it or not. it still has to go somewhere so why not use it to your advantage.

as for the magnetic reminiscence, it is not present in the Figuera device so it has to be replaced or induced every time you start the machine. it takes time, as in a short operation of the device to get up to operating condition as according to doug.
once the fields are up to operating conditions it takes very little power to move the massless weightless field. once it reaches this condition it will self sustain.

MM

[Ufopolitics]

[QUOTE=marathonman;299185]

The "Kick-Back" is a result from an Over-killing and excessive Exciting Signal...so the Induced must shut it back.

A typical generator Exciting System could start with very low voltage on a cap or magnetic reminiscence and build up into a higher Voltage and right amperage just by reaching the operating RPM's...

And so, we can do exactly the same process, but instead of using RPM's on the whole Magnetic Field CARRIER (Massive and Heavy Iron Rotor with Coils), we apply it ONLY, to the weightless, friction-less, mass-less Non Physical Field FLUCTUATIONS, while coils and iron cores are completely static.

Hello MM,

You were missing a closing bracket (]) on the first QUOTE code...

The results you have been getting i would tend to agree, you are over exciting your primaries and since we are only moving the massless weightless field it does not require massive power to move it. and while you may be getting this over kick back, it seems that it should still be required to suppress the incoming supply and feed part G but in a rather toned down scenario. the high pressure is still going to form in the low primary whether you choose to ignore it or not. it still has to go somewhere so why not use it to your advantage.

OK, but am not getting any kick back at all...my system is now running super smooth...

Kick back was brought by Seaad and his simulations...

as for the magnetic reminiscence, it is not present in the Figuera device so it has to be replaced or induced every time you start the machine. it takes time, as in a short operation of the device to get up to operating condition as according to doug.

Exactly, and same way you said before that Figuera used resistors just as an example...I would say that he represented a Linear Field Displacement by means of exampling also.

Remember Figuera's primitive generators cited on Patent were from Pixii and Clarke?...well, even those two were Rotary Type.

A Linear set up is inefficient for many reasons...

First off, Primary Field Fluctuations are very limited and pretty small displacement...versus in a Rotary System with only 20 to 30 degrees we get from the far, centered and close fields in milliseconds.

Second, the method to reduce currents in primaries weakens field, so, the whole repulsive field strength decays in a 50%...while we could run this system without altering currents nor voltage and really "mimicking" the real generator structure.

Magnetic Reminiscence only works on a Rotary System...even if we don't move Inducing-Induced Coils/Cores like Figuera style...just by placing a center steel rotor with two tiny magnets apart by 180º and use it as a Fan to cool coils...it won't affect if generator is loaded, rotor is just used for starting generator from zero power.

All of the above have nothing to do with either Part G or Resistor Type Figuera's Concepts...it only refers to Primaries-Secondaries relationship.

once the fields are up to operating conditions it takes very little power to move the massless weightless field. once it reaches this condition it will self sustain.

MM

Agreed with above...


Regards


Ufopolitics

[bistander]

Idea

...
I want a discussion here with wild ideas, ...

Why not use a PLC for the switching control in part G? Would eliminate rotary device. Replace with cheap automotive style cube relays turned on/off in any sequence/timing you want. You could even use Hall effect devices to sense magnetic field as inputs.

bi

[Ufopolitics]

Why not use a PLC for the switching control in part G? Would eliminate rotary device. Replace with cheap automotive style cube relays turned on/off in any sequence/timing you want. You could even use Hall effect devices to sense magnetic field as inputs.

bi

Hello Bistander,

Excuse my ignorance...but what the heck PLC stands for?

About relays...automotive type...are made for one contact then stay closed...not for higher frequencies at high amps response kind...they will lock up-stick together plates...

Thanks

Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

More "wild" ideas?...got it...

Hello,

Actually this is the method am using right now...

Commutator all jumped upper-lower like Figuera...PLUS also bridged at horizontal plane from center, left and right EXCEPT at CENTER vert plane...leaving just eight continuous contact elements on each side...pulsing two primaries (1 and 2) brush above, 1 then 2...brush below 2 then 1...this creates two positive square waves at opposed exact timing...meaning, when one is up other is down...and so two Bulbs blink exactly like with part G (Open)...kind of a "Push-Pull at unison.

When a Primary is "Collapsing" (actually at high speeds never gets to fully collapse, but Retracting) the other one is ON, so its Field "pushes" currents on its direction...

Longer ON time of 180º is perfect at 3600 RPM's...for each primary.

This dual square inverted signal is very simple to reproduce with 555 Timers triggering and a couple of high speed FET's...plus it could be easily "smooth out"...or rounded up.


Excellent and very strong Induction!!


Regards


Ufopolitics

[bistander]

Plc

Hello Bistander,

Excuse my ignorance...but what the heck PLC stands for?

About relays...automotive type...are made for one contact then stay closed...not for higher frequencies at high amps response kind...they will lock up-stick together plates...

Thanks

Ufopolitics

Hi Ufo,

Your ignorance is forgiven, same as I ask for myself.

PLC = programmable logic controller.

Probably right about swithing millions of times on those cubes. Could be a starting point with low freq and then go to solid state.

PLCs are relatively inexpensive with deals on used ones. They're pretty easy to program using ladder logic graphics instead of computer coding. Guess I'm not familiar enough with them to say if it's a good idea or not. I've seen them used on a number of test set-ups which I worked on. Just an idea. Take it or leave it.

Regards,

bi