Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera

[Ufopolitics]

Wrong, wrong and still wrong

While some of you made arguments on the "open thread" and here I performed a little quick test in the real wold!

A test-G-part "on the fly" with DC and ""DC pulses"", (groundings)!! Live and hands on!
Input; Square wave 0 and 180 deg. 50/50%.
See the picture.

When X, Y and N are open:
Output from S or X gives a strong Somewhat distorted Square Wave
(the same winding direction to the whole toroid)

With X and N closed:
the output from S, X and all other taps shrinks to tiny miniature- narrow spikes!
(the same winding direction to the whole toroid)

With X and Y closed:
The output wave are affected somewhat (in lower frequencies). Green winding with OPPOSITE winding direction 50% of the toroid.

After this, you certainly know that the correct answer from my previous post is 3)

This is my last attemt (I hope) to make understand the G-part. Unfortunately does it not work as some of you have expected. If you want to make the G-part work in your way you have to pray to some God, mentor or Figuera himself.

If YOU make it work the Figuera way we are of course willng to convert!

You have to search for the OU-producing part in the Figuera concept elsewhere!

MM: yes, some practical job can be nice. But watch out for the soldering iron.

hanon:

Regards / Arne

Seaad,

You can not draw final conclusions about Part G by building it or simulating it, based on the completely wrong, opposite and distorted construction approach , which diverges completely from the already specified patterns

You have so many wrong concepts above that are hard to cite, but I will try to bring up just the primary, essential ones which differ from original spec's.

1- You are using Square Wave, Not good, it is not an abruptly, steep, radical raise and fall signal. Besides you drop it to zero, which collapses the field, also a negative way to replicate this component.

The Signal must be slowly, gradually ascending as the same way it must drop slowly and smoothly downwards, and never reaching zero values.

2-You are using Opposite plus Independent, separated windings, And Both are completely far from the original specified spec's.

It is just ONE winding, same awg, same direction through the whole toroid core.

Just based on the two wrong methods you have utilized and cited above, your results are completely off, and far away from original part G construction.

You have completely wasted all your time by doing all this work.



Ufopolitics

[hanon1492]

TO ALL,

You ignorant souls, do you honestly think the most ignorant of them all HANON can really pull such a devise out his tiny little mind. the most ignorant of them all, that had to ask every time what Doug said. you little f-in man you are.


go F all your selves. i will not share with stupid dumb ass wipes. you people are no better than OU.

lets see how dumb you are, ops ! you already showed it buy posting the same crap for three years and that was some one elses work not yours.

piss ant men acting as girls. i hope your wives know your ball less.

SEADD;

go F your self IDIOT.

i deleated for a reason..... Doug was right.
i will NEVER share with you communist bastards again.

BYE F-IN BYE

MM

I quote the patent text and sketches and you insult me again, and again. It is clear that you do not like that I quote the patent. And this because the variable reactance/inductance toroid that you claim is not described there.

Let people choose the method they prefer to move the two fields in unison. If they choose the toroid it may work, because it worked for your mentor, but let them read the patent and choose how to move the fields.

I wont insult you. Everyone here has already grasped how you are and how you behave. I only tell you that your education is lacking everywhere.

[Ufopolitics]

The Missing Link on Figuera...

Hello to All,

It is very disappointing to see the way this nice thread has become lately.

@Hanon and all:

The Part G may not be directly expressed on the Patent itself...however, resistance was cited by Figuera just to put it as an EXAMPLE, which means that NOT necessarily needs to be the PERFECT AND ONLY WAY to build the real Machine.

Translation to Hanon, so there could not be any "gaps" in understanding:

La Parte G puede que no esté enunciada directamente en la "mismísima" patente...sin embargo, la resistencia fué citada sólo a modo de EJEMPLO, lo que significa que NO necesariamente es el imprescindible y ÚNICO MÉTODO existente para construir la Máquina.

Every existing Electric Generator out there, MUST HAVE, a Component which is "CAPABLE TO SELF EXCITE" almost from zero, or from a very low, almost insignificant small amount of either energy...or magnetism. And so, this SELF EXCITING COMPONENT MUST WORK "IN CRESCENDO" as either the frequency, speed, or ANY other means that DRIVE IT increases.

A bunch of Resistors or even the MOST SOPHISTICATED ELECTRONIC CIRCUIT AVAILABLE UP TO NOW...would NEVER, EVER be able to accomplish the TWO MAIN AND ESSENTIAL PROPERTIES CITED IN BOLD LETTERS ABOVE.

Do not FOOL Yourselves.

We ALL need a Component, a part, that can do the TWO above cited Properties, and AGAIN, below.

1- Start from "SCRATCH", ZERO, generating Energy, even in small amounts or with a very tiny "JUMP START"...just like in a Generator a very tiny, magnetic reminiscence DOES EXACTLY THAT JOB.

2- BE SELF GAINING, "IN CRESCENDO" AS DRIVERS (MECHANICAL OR SOLID STATE) ARE INCREASED.

Just like in ANY Generator out there...either brushed or brushless, with a tiny amount of WHATEVER, in the case of the brushless...a very minimal charge in the RUNNING AC Cap would be enough to start it from scratch.

Part G does exactly that function...

That it may need some modification?...possible...Could be, HOWEVER, Majority of comments here contributed to piss off the only person who proposed it here, BEFORE start building it and testing it for LATER IMPROVEMENTS!!!

FINALLY...we all need that "magic" component, whatever name you wanna call it...G, X, Y or Z...do not matter names...but we need that.

A Closed resistor based or electronic based system would never produce more at secondaries that what it takes it to run, so it would never, ever be self sustained.


That is exactly the reason why, the Figuera Patent has been out there all "free of charge" for 108 years ...and still no one has been able to make it work since it was published back in 1908.

OH!!...and it "looks" SO F SIMPLE UH?!


Keep dreaming, until the day you all wake up...or find that other "someone" who could lead to success...good luck...and keep same methods of communications...they work "very well"...

Yeah right!!


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

I quote the patent text and sketches and you insult me again, and again. It is clear that you do not like that I quote the patent. And this because the variable reactance/inductance toroid that you claim is not described there.

BLUE ARE MY TRANSLATION

Hanon,

Tienes toda, absolutamente toda la razón.

You are completely, absolutely correct.

Sin embargo, Figuera sólo cita La Resistencia a modo de EJEMPLO. (si sabes lo que es un "ejemplo" ¿correcto?) Pues entonces, analiza de nuevo...ejemplo, significa que NO NECESARIAMENTE fuese el UNICO MÉTODO de construir dicha Máquina PERPETUA.

However, Figuera only cites Resistance as an EXAMPLE (Do you know what "example" means right?) Then, analize it again...example means that NOT NECESSARILY must be THE ONLY METHOD to build such PERPETUAL Machine.

Let people choose the method they prefer to move the two fields in unison. If they choose the toroid it may work, because it worked for your mentor, but let them read the patent and choose how to move the fields.

Hanon,

Tantas Generaciones han tenido EXACTAMENTE la misma información citada en esa Patente o todas juntas...por Ciento Ocho Laaargos Años, amigo!...y hasta ahora...no ha habido UNA SOLA PERSONA EN TODO ESTE PLANETA...CAPAZ...de reproducirla y que trabaje como dijo Figuera...!!??

So many Generations had EXACTLY the same info as cited on that Patent or all of them together...for One Hundred and Eight Looong years friend!...and up to now...there has not been ONE SINGLE PERSON ON THIS WHOLE PLANET...CAPABLE...to reproduce it and that works according to Figuera descriptions...!!??

No te parece que TODOS ESOS DATOS JUNTITOS..NOS LLEVAN a una SIMPLE Y SENCILLA CONCLUSIÓN...?


Don't You think that ALL THAT LITTLE DATA ALL TOGETHER...TAKE US ALL to a SIMPLE AND EASY CONCLUSION...?

...DE QUE LE FALTA "ALGO" A TODAS ESAS PATENTES PARA QUE EN REALIDAD FUNCIONEN?

...THAT THERE IS "SOMETHING" MISSING IN ALL THOSE PATENTS IN ORDER FOR ALL OF THEM TO REALLY WORK?

NO TE PARECE HANON?

DON'T YOU THINK SO HANON?

En vez de CONTRADECIR O TRATAR DE IMPROVISAR -TODO EL MALDITO TIEMPO- ANTES DE CONSTRUIR LA DICHOSA MÁQUINA...PORQUÉ NO PUEDEN (TODOS) SIMPLE Y SENCILLAMENTE escuchar...para aprender de alguien que sólo trató de enseñarnos a todos aquí SU PROPUESTA?

Instead of CONTRADICTING OR TRYING TO IMPROVE -ALL THE DAMN TIME- BEFORE CONSTRUCTING SUCH MACHINE....WHY CAN'T YOU (ALL) SIMPLY AND QUIETLY listen...in order to learn from someone that only tried to convey here HIS PROPOSAL?

Lo que veo, observo de todo esto...y que me resulta verdaderamente ASQUEROSO, es la reacción Humana ante alguien que sólo quiso enseñarnos su propuesta con mucho deseo...pero que gradualmente, poco a poco... lo fueron enfureciendo con puras TONTERÍAS Y COMENTARIOS PURAMENTE RIDÍCULOS ,ESTÚPIDOS E IGNORANTES.

What I can see, observe about all this...and that it is truly DISGUSTING, is the Human reaction towards someone who only wanted to show us his proposal with a lot of desire...but gradually, little by little...kept upsetting him with all kind of PURE FOOLISHNESS, AND PURELY RIDICULOUS, STUPID AND IGNORANT COMMENTS.


Honesta y Sinceramente

Honestly and Sincerely


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Farewell...

AM ALSO DONE HERE.

You all need it

When I open my new Thread on Repulsion Generators...You will all see, observe and realize that the Part G WORKS BEYOND FREAKING BELIEF.

NO BS there as I would NOT tolerate it.


Good Bye Guys and Good Luck!!


Ufopolitics

[Cadman]

Marathonman, really sorry to see you go. My best wishes to you.

I really wonder if there are now more than two people posting on this forum who are sincere about collaborating and recreating a Figuera generator. There does seem to be an abundance of posters who wish to mislead and hinder such effort.

@Ufo,
I hope you don't allow yourself to be distracted and misled by bistander. That person is so full of himself that now he is arguing that the right hand rule can not apply in a toroid when powered with opposite polarity coil segments. Someone remind him how iron reacts in the core of a powered electrical coil please. On second thought, don't bother.

@All,
I don't know. Maybe this isn't worth it but I'll give it one more shot.

Part G.
This consists of two components.
1. A resistance
2. A switch, or commutator if you prefer.

The resistance.
Is just that, a resistance.
If you want to use wire wound resistors then go right ahead.
If you wish to use impedance then go right ahead.

Both can be used to run this generator. However if you decide to use impedance then you better spend some time learning about it if you are not already knowledgeable. If you need to study up on it then get some old books and study them, don't be listening to self proclaimed know-it-alls on the forums.

Several people who should know better have said that a toroid was never mentioned in the patent so it is a divergence from the patent and should not be confused with the patent and/or will not work. That is utter nonsense.

If you want to use a straight core for your impedance then do so. It will cost you extra wire and iron to make it work.
If you want to use E-I laminations, go for it. It's a good choice if you have enough material to get the job done.
If you want to use a toroid then you have chosen the most efficient magnetic circuit available for your inductance. It will produce the highest impedance with the fewest turns of wire because it is the most perfect magnetic circuit of these 3 choices. No splits, no joints and the more perfect magnetic circuit increases the self induction.
The bottom line here is the impedance of part G must produce the proper output wave form along with sufficient current for your particular generator design. That's the minimum requirement.

Lastly:
If you are trying to create your impedance resistance with any of these 3 methods then:
STOP TRYING TO FEED ANY KIND OF VARYING ELECTRICAL SIGNAL THROUGH IT.
FEED IT CONSTANT CURRENT DC ONLY.
PART G CREATES THE WAVE FORM FED TO THE COILS, IT DOES NOT RECEIVE IT.


CM

PS. Ufo, sorry to see you are out of here too. Good luck with your endeavors.

[hanon1492]

AM ALSO DONE HERE.

You all need it

When I open my new Thread on Repulsion Generators...You will all see, observe and realize that the Part G WORKS BEYOND FREAKING BELIEF.

NO BS there as I would NOT tolerate it.


Good Bye Guys and Good Luck!!


Ufopolitics

I am sorry for that.

You may read all my post in a row and see how I asked and behaved with MM. Always polite. The problem is his attitude against anyone who just ask or doubt of his design.

FYI The patent was buried in the patent archives until january 2011. Therefore it was not availaible to read until that date, and translated into english until 2013. So, not so many generations has failed to reproduce it.

I think part G really may work, because it worked for MM mentor. But MM was telling that just the toroid works, and this is not what the patent says. He was just focusing in the part G as the essence of the device, while the patent just say that when one set of electromagnet is at maximun the other is at minimum. Nothing about a toroid. He was interpreting at will the patent text. I wont discuss that anymore. The patent is there for anyone to be read.

As always I have said , move the fields with any method you want.

[Ufopolitics]

@Ufo,
I hope you don't allow yourself to be distracted and misled by bistander. That person is so full of himself that now he is arguing that the right hand rule can not apply in a toroid when powered with opposite polarity coil segments. Someone remind him how iron reacts in the core of a powered electrical coil please. On second thought, don't bother.

CM

PS. Ufo, sorry to see you are out of here too. Good luck with your endeavors.

Thanks Cadman,

Don't worry, We would be in touch, as I know you are a REAL BUILDER and do not waste time on BS simulations which don't work whenever we are building a NOVEL INVENTION.

Simulations were conceived exclusively and ONLY for things that have been built...all their software is full of "built in" data which is based on "prior art"...not new, novel developments, programs will either crash or try to "parallel" (cross-reference) from possible existing answers.

Only stupidity could seek for an answer from an Invention on a simulation, expecting it "includes" Artificial Intelligence...of High IQ.

Part G works Cadman, no matter what anyone here tells you, it is just a matter of thousands of hours working and developing it the right way...plus tons of patience to pursue it.

I hate to say this to you now and here...but honestly, Bistander and Cifta are correct in most of their answers. The only thing is that they are based on existing material, they are like a "living and talking" best Classic Reference Book on this Fields available....They both have so much experience on this Fields with Classical beliefs, that is very hard for them to accept absolutely anything that drives them outside of their higher education levels.

A Closed Toroid core is still an "Enigma" related to magnetism properties. And so, it is very hard to grasp some real (Classic) properties it may have.

But there are always "ways" to "go around" these properties.

For example, If you carefully analyze Part G...You will realize it has "Two Tempos" or Two Cycles, Two Strokes which are exactly divided by their Output Ports, which are apart by 180º...And If you could note this essential part...then you can see that in this two terminals, all Flux, All Currents EXIT and/or INTAKE the Toroidal Core towards/from the Primaries.

Which means it "resets" Cycles after it EXHAUST and/or INLETS its FLOW through this Two Ports. Whether to Disburse, or Receive Flows.

Can you conclude something out of this simple analysis?


Kind regards friend


Ufopolitics

[marathonman]

Marathonman, really sorry to see you go. My best wishes to you.

I really wonder if there are now more than two people posting on this forum who are sincere about collaborating and recreating a Figuera generator. There does seem to be an abundance of posters who wish to mislead and hinder such effort.

@Ufo,
I hope you don't allow yourself to be distracted and misled by bistander. That person is so full of himself that now he is arguing that the right hand rule can not apply in a toroid when powered with opposite polarity coil segments. Someone remind him how iron reacts in the core of a powered electrical coil please. On second thought, don't bother.

@All,
I don't know. Maybe this isn't worth it but I'll give it one more shot.

Part G.
This consists of two components.
1. A resistance
2. A switch, or commutator if you prefer.

The resistance.
Is just that, a resistance.
If you want to use wire wound resistors then go right ahead.
If you wish to use impedance then go right ahead.

Both can be used to run this generator. However if you decide to use impedance then you better spend some time learning about it if you are not already knowledgeable. If you need to study up on it then get some old books and study them, don't be listening to self proclaimed know-it-alls on the forums.

Several people who should know better have said that a toroid was never mentioned in the patent so it is a divergence from the patent and should not be confused with the patent and/or will not work. That is utter nonsense.

If you want to use a straight core for your impedance then do so. It will cost you extra wire and iron to make it work.
If you want to use E-I laminations, go for it. It's a good choice if you have enough material to get the job done.
If you want to use a toroid then you have chosen the most efficient magnetic circuit available for your inductance. It will produce the highest impedance with the fewest turns of wire because it is the most perfect magnetic circuit of these 3 choices. No splits, no joints and the more perfect magnetic circuit increases the self induction.
The bottom line here is the impedance of part G must produce the proper output wave form along with sufficient current for your particular generator design. That's the minimum requirement.

Lastly:
If you are trying to create your impedance resistance with any of these 3 methods then:
STOP TRYING TO FEED ANY KIND OF VARYING ELECTRICAL SIGNAL THROUGH IT.
FEED IT CONSTANT CURRENT DC ONLY.
PART G CREATES THE WAVE FORM FED TO THE COILS, IT DOES NOT RECEIVE IT.


CM

PS. Ufo, sorry to see you are out of here too. Good luck with your endeavors.

Thank you CADMAN
Very elegant and well said. i'm glad three of us here doesn't have our head stuck up our back side.

the lastly part is EXACTLY the reason why i chose the timing board i have. to EXACTLY mimic the rotating brush ONLY, allowing part G to do it's job as intended.

MM

[marathonman]

QUOTE;
"Can you conclude something out of this simple analysis?"

YES I CAN, that you don't have your head up your back side like most on this thread.

IMAGINE THAT !



MM

[Ufopolitics]

New Thread?

QUOTE;
"Can you conclude something out of this simple analysis?"

YES I CAN, that you don't have your head up your back side like most on this thread.

IMAGINE THAT !



MM

MM,

Wanna open a New Thread?

Let's call it "FIGUERA PART G DEVELOPING OR DEVELOPMENT SYSTEMS" or whatever name you could think off...

We could share there all our ideas calmly...a BUILDING THREAD, NO BS!!!

What do you think?

Opening it would take seconds...and no one would go there to bother Us.

And if they even show up...WE WILL KICK THEIR BUTTS...


And tell them like Trump says...SIT DOWN!!...SIT DOWN AND SHUT THE F UP!!...

Let me know


Regards


Ufopolitics

[seaad]

Seaad,

You can not draw final conclusions about Part G by building it or simulating it, based on the completely wrong, opposite and distorted construction approach , which diverges completely from the already specified patterns You have so many wrong concepts above that are hard to cite, but I will try to bring up just the primary, essential ones which differ from original spec's.
1- You are using Square Wave, Not good, it is not an abruptly, steep, radical raise and fall signal. Besides you drop it to zero, which collapses the field, also a negative way to replicate this component.
The Signal must be slowly, gradually ascending as the same way it must drop slowly and smoothly downwards, and never reaching zero values.
2-You are using Opposite plus Independent, separated windings, And Both are completely far from the original specified spec's.
It is just ONE winding, same awg, same direction through the whole toroid core.
Just based on the two wrong methods you have utilized and cited above, your results are completely off, and far away from original part G construction.
Ufopolitics

Thanks Ufopolitics for the reply without calling me an ant
""You can not draw final conclusions about Part G by building it or simulating it"": How should we do then if we not can (are allowed to) neither build / test or simulate?
And if we don't builds anything then we are not allowed to write on this forum.
The rest of your quote we have to consider of course, but MY intention with my experiment was to test and confirm the behavior of cw AND ccw on that toroid (G-part) not a complete Figuera -test. I still don't belive in using the same winding direction all over the toroid with the beginning and end of the wire connected together, until that have been tested and proved to operate.

And I agree to Cadman saying use a toroid if you want.

Ufopolitics says later here #1440: ""but Bistander and Cifta they are like a "living and talking" best Classic Reference Book ""
I'm glad for that because we certainly need their help also.
Arne

[Ufopolitics]

Thanks Ufopolitics for the reply without calling me an ant
""You can not draw final conclusions about Part G by building it or simulating it[/SIZE]"": How should we do then if we not can (are allowed to) neither build / test or simulate?
And if we don't builds anything then we are not allowed to write on this forum.
The rest of your quote we have to consider of course, but MY intention with my experiment was to test and confirm the behavior of cw AND ccw on that toroid (G-part) not a complete Figuera -test. I still don't belive in using the same winding direction all over the toroid with the beginning and end of the wire connected together, until that have been tested and proved to operate.

And I agree to Cadman saying use a toroid if you want.

Ufopolitics says later here #1440: ""but Bistander and Cifta they are like a "living and talking" best Classic Reference Book ""
I'm glad for that because we certainly need their help also.
Arne

Could you just build Part G in "miniature"?

Not thinking about making thousands of Kilowatts?

Just need to be patient...and good skilled with "fine miniature arts"...

Just an idea.


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Thanks Ufopolitics for the reply without calling me an ant
Arne

You still an ant...

Why on this world do you think I suggested a miniature (very, very small) build?

[Cadman]

Thanks Cadman,
I hate to say this to you now and here...but honestly, Bistander and Cifta are correct in most of their answers. The only thing is that they are based on existing material, they are like a "living and talking" best Classic Reference Book on this Fields available....They both have so much experience on this Fields with Classical beliefs, that is very hard for them to accept absolutely anything that drives them outside of their higher education levels.

A Closed Toroid core is still an "Enigma" related to magnetism properties. And so, it is very hard to grasp some real (Classic) properties it may have.

Yes, Citfa and bistander do provide correct information and answers, usually, not always with bistander. To proclaim there cannot be a field in two directions in a toroid is nonsense. That very use of a toroid was not only known about over 100 years ago, it was implemented in one of the most famous early electric motors in history. A toroid with a continuous winding in which currents traveled in opposite directions with opposite magnetic polarities involved. In fact, it was said to be one of that motor's most significant aspects. Do you know which motor I am referring to? I'll bet you do.

But there are always "ways" to "go around" these properties.

For example, If you carefully analyze Part G...You will realize it has "Two Tempos" or Two Cycles, Two Strokes which are exactly divided by their Output Ports, which are apart by 180º...And If you could note this essential part...then you can see that in this two terminals, all Flux, All Currents EXIT and/or INTAKE the Toroidal Core towards/from the Primaries.

Which means it "resets" Cycles after it EXHAUST and/or INLETS its FLOW through this Two Ports. Whether to Disburse, or Receive Flows.

Can you conclude something out of this simple analysis?


Kind regards friend


Ufopolitics

Yes! I conclude that you actually studied the circuit drawings of the Figuera/Buforn patent and understand them!
Seriously, you are talking about the recycling and reuse of the current, aren't you? If so, I thought that part was obvious. Where else is it to return to other than part G?

Regards,
CM