Using a car to generate emergency electricity

[9trayeri]

I have seen it in project almanac movie. But I don't know how it works overall. I never did it and never tried it.

[wrtner]

With all the people currently without power and devastated due to hurricanes of one name or another, and those due to be hit at the weekend (possibly with alligators crawling around in the flood water in Florida) we ought to be able to tidy up this project and steer people towards getting temporary electricity from their cars and a genny head.

Who will tie up the loose ends and turn this idea into a method -
Who will even demonstrate it on site somewhere?

[spacecase0]

I would think the easiest way to do this would be to replace the AC compressor with a generator head
trying to get power off the wheels is needlessly complex

something like this
NorthStar Belt Driven Generator Head — 10,000 Surge Watts, 9600 Rated Watts, 18 HP Required | Generator Heads| Northern Tool + Equipment
lots of trucks and some cars have enough room in the engine compartment for something like that.
sure it would not be near as much power as the car could produce,
but most people don't have the ability to distribute the power to more than one house anyway, and 10KW is more than most people are going to need for one house anyway.

[wrtner]

I would think the easiest way to do this would be to replace the AC compressor with a generator head
trying to get power off the wheels is needlessly complex

something like this
NorthStar Belt Driven Generator Head — 10,000 Surge Watts, 9600 Rated Watts, 18 HP Required | Generator Heads| Northern Tool + Equipment
lots of trucks and some cars have enough room in the engine compartment for something like that.
sure it would not be near as much power as the car could produce,
but most people don't have the ability to distribute the power to more than one house anyway, and 10KW is more than most people are going to need for one house anyway.

That unit seems excellent. We could use a higher power one to make the most of the average car.

I don't know what an AC compressor is, and Google has left me dazed and confused.

Distribution could be by means of rubber sheathed cable. TRS cable is used extensively in theatre. 15amp connectors would be better than the crappy 13amp nonsense that we all have to use. But each consumer would need a three way two pole switch (discussed above, and can be surprisingly expensive) connected to their consumer unit.

I see one car supplying half a street of houses, so long as they organise a rota for the use of high power items (LX cookers, washing m/cs etc).

The thing is this: this weather problem may well get worse and worse.

[dragon]

These connect directly to the PTO of a tractor NorthStar PTO Generator — 27,500 Surge Watts, 24,000 Rated Watts, 48 HP Required | PTO Generators| Northern Tool + Equipment

Assuming there is gas or diesel fuel available it seems there are numerous ways to attain electric power without re-engineering a basic automobile.

[spacecase0]

I don't know what an AC compressor is, and Google has left me dazed and confused.

air conditioning compressor.

people will do a similar thing to get compressed air out of there cars (usually jeeps)
seems just as easy to put a generator in there (and I have seen it done before, just cant find the website to show everyone )
and enough people don't really care about air conditioning in the car that I figured it would be worth mentioning.

I like that PTO version of the generator

[wrtner]

These connect directly to the PTO of a tractor NorthStar PTO Generator — 27,500 Surge Watts, 24,000 Rated Watts, 48 HP Required | PTO Generators| Northern Tool + Equipment

Assuming there is gas or diesel fuel available it seems there are numerous ways to attain electric power without re-engineering a basic automobile.

Re-engineering? You take off a wheel.

Yes, but they are VERY expensive, bulky, a nuisance to store and prone to needing maintenance.

[wrtner]

air conditioning compressor.

people will do a similar thing to get compressed air out of there cars (usually jeeps)
seems just as easy to put a generator in there (and I have seen it done before, just cant find the website to show everyone )
and enough people don't really care about air conditioning in the car that I figured it would be worth mentioning.

I like that PTO version of the generator

In England, our idea of AC is that we have a handle in the door and it most conveniently winds down a window.

its an interesting approach but I doubt that there would be space for a genny head that takes proper advantage of the power of the engine.

[spacecase0]

In England, our idea of AC is that we have a handle in the door and it most conveniently winds down a window.

its an interesting approach but I doubt that there would be space for a genny head that takes proper advantage of the power of the engine.

you are correct, no car is going to have the room for a generator that takes proper advantage of the power of the engine, I have worked with them in the past, they are larger than most car engines.

so that is why I offered an easy solution that would run a house
even if your cars don't come with air conditioning installed, there should be an empty spot for another belt and the mounting bracket holes already there, so it should not be to much work to install.
from what I read, you can get 20KW through a belt, so a 10KW generating head would be pretty easy. and it is enough power to run most houses.

taking proper advantage of the car engine would require putting the generating head where the transmission is.

if you connect it to 1 wheel, you will wear out the differential quite fast.
if you connect it to 2 wheels in a 2 wheel drive car, that would work better, but the device is likely to cost you more than just replacing the transmission with a generator head (and essentially turning a car into a generator only)
also, if you are planning on running some sort of tire contact to transmit power, remember how much power you loose in the transmission and in the tires, so you can't really take proper advantage of the engine that way either.
I do like the idea of taking a car and making it a dedicated generator,
should be lower price than buying a generator of the same size,
and replacement parts will cost less and be easier to get.
but what are you going to do with something like 100KW anyway ?
generators like that typically put out way higher than the voltage used in a home, then you need the distribution transformers to drop the voltage down. the costs start getting quite high for that kind of setup. and it also is going to take up lots of room, my guess is quite a bit more space than a car would, so at that point, why are you trying to get electricity from a car you can also drive ?
just seems to me that you are not going to easily take advantage of all the power a car has to offer.
maybe take a 4 wheel drive setup installed in a 2 wheel drive (maybe a jeep), then attach the generating head on the drive shaft that connects to the front.
some sort of slip connection that can be locked (because you are not driving around with a generator that large), but then you still will need a big transformer...
also with the 10KW generator, you can set the throttle at the needed RPM and your load will not require changing that setting,
if you are getting 100KW out, you are going to need a governor to set your engine RPM by changing the throttle.

[wrtner]

1. even if your cars don't come with air conditioning installed, there should be an empty spot for another belt

2. and the mounting bracket holes already there, so it should not be
if you connect it to 1 wheel, you will wear out the differential quite fast.

2a. but what are you going to do with something like 100KW anyway ?

3. generators like that typically put out way higher than the voltage used ...

4. why are you trying to get electricity from a car you can also drive ?

1. ...on the grounds that cars are designed for Euro and US markets? Interesting. I'll have a look.

2. This is an emergency temporary measure only. Fuel costs will make the LX will be quite expensive

2a. This will power several streets of homes (with distribution - rubber cable, 2p3t switches etc.)

3. We should expect to use mains voltage gennys.

4. During the emergency, one would wish to dedicate the car to providing power

Of course, dropping the prop shaft would put us in a new league but it may be best to start small and work upwards.

Thanks for your PTA genny link. And of course, if anyone has a tractor, they are home and dry.

[thx1138]

Welder/generator

I live in an area subject to hurricanes. I bought a gasoline powered portable arc welder that also has outlets for 120V AC and 240V AC (US). They are typically used for powering grinders, drills, etc. while doing welding work. But it can partially power a home with 5KW. That's sufficient for an emergency.

I built a 3 conductor cable of #6AWG to go between the generator plug and the dryer outlet which, since it is a high load circuit, has its own circuit connected directly to the breaker box. The breaker box also has a mains disconnect built in.

So turn all breakers off (they're dead already), use the disconnect to isolate the breaker box from the mains, connect the cable between the generator and the dryer outlet, start the generator, and turn the dryer breaker on. Since it's 240V, it is feeding both buss bars of the breaker panel.

Now selectively turn breakers on to power a few lights, refrigerator/freezer, stand alone freezer, and outlets in the master bedroom. I have a window A/C unit for emergencies that I install in a master bedroom window.

So now my food won't spoil, I have a few lights and one air conditioned room to sleep in. Our hurricanes usually happen during the hottest part of the summer so air conditioning is important.

The engine on the welder/generator has its own governor for dealing with varying load due to welding and it works the same with the power outlets. The power isn't particularly clean so I don't run electronics from it other than what's in the refrigerator. There's no way around that if I want to keep the food. The standalone freezer, an older model, doesn't have electronics.

Since the mains are disconnected at the breaker panel, it doesn't matter when the power comes back on. When that does happen I just shut everything down, disconnect the generator, turn the mains disconnect and breakers back on, and get on with life.

I originally bought the welder because it was on sale and I wanted a welder but the AC electrical circuits have come in handy. It got me through for nine days one time when the power was out.

It burned a gallon of gas about every 18 hours so it's important to stock up on gas before the storm hits. The welder originally had a one gallon gas tank but I have since retrofitted it with a five gallon tank.

IMO, anyone who could build the other circuits/mechanicals described here could probably use a welder, so get a portable one with electrical outlets.

For cold weather use, it could probably heat one room and keep the food.

The only thing I used my truck for was to go get gas for the generator after the stores were open again and listened to the radio for emergency bulletins since I didn't want to power my TV with the generator power. I do have to store the welder/generator but that's much easier than storing an extra car and if I do need to evacuate I still have the truck available without having to disconnect anything, take it off jack stands, etc.

[wrtner]

.
Its a good solution, thx, but I have in mind providing for a street of houses, given enough 2p3w switches, plug boards and heaven only knows how much TRS cable (and a schedule to stop everyone putting their washing m/cs on at the same time).
.

[ElectricMick]

Puerto Rico without power for 3 - 4 months. Also Dominica in trouble.

a thought struck me. we do not need a car in perfect shape. could be washed into a river, half crushed or whatever. if it can be brought on to dry land, blocked up to sit fairly horiz., carb stripped and washed out, electrics dried out and checked out, bores checked for any water - Then if the engine can be made to run and there is power to any driven wheel, then we are in business !!!

[wrtner]

"Cruise control" looks an important part of all this.

Does anyone know if this be retro-fitted? Can cruise control from one car be fitted to another? What, in practie and in reality, is cruise control?

[ElectricMick]

Could u use an old fashioned engine governor?