Basic Free Energy Device

[voltan]

ok. i rewound the rc motor with awg 34 magnet wire like before with 2 opposing coils.i used a bit over 7 meters,about 100-120 turns each coil and it measures 8.4 ohms dcr.
now it's a motor.it's easy to start from 6 volts and up.it goes well for 1 phase out of 6 driven half the time.
i got timing lights hooked up,but nothing to point them at yet.
t1 is a mje 340 and only gets warm at 13.8 v.next step is to try dual iso trafo timing on it.
3 phase motors have various combinations of coil and pole counts.before you go rewinding a motor draw a sketch of the poles and coils as a visual aid to understanding the characteristics of that combination. the floppy hub motor was 12 coils 16 poles,so i could run it on 1 or more factory wound phases as the 4 coils in each phase/strand all send a coherent bemf signal.i.e all face the same pole at exactly the same time.
this motor with 12 coils and 14 magnets can only give a coherent signal for zero crossing points for any 2 opposing and counterwound coils on the stator.hence my interpretation of it as a 6 phase motor.also if you rewind 2 opposing coils in 1 of these motors remember to divide the magnet count by 2.if you get an even number wind both coils the same way,say both cwise.if, like this motor 14 magnets divided by 2 = 7,then wind 1 coil cwise,the other ccwise as they face a north and a south simultaneously.
between being delta wound and the factory winding strategy wtf? these motors must seriously push against themselves and generate lots of avoidable heat in their standard application.maybe that's why it was $3 + shipping. could be 1 of a dud batch.nuthin else wrong with them.pull it apart,rewind it thus,drive it thus and happy days.i think it would be powerful and efficient with 6 windings, each switched with 1 of these timing circuits.more so if the revolt scheme can be successfully applied to this motor. *turns out that's a yes.
it has absolutely no ability as a flywheel.adding some inertia would probably be essential for a motor-gen/3bgs application.it has a 3mm shaft.
i found it handy to join 2 equal lengths of wire with a blob of solder,or you could just find the middle of a length, and a bit of heatshrink on top, and hold that with a thumb to the core of the stator to get started and wind each side from there.that way the turns can be got fairly even without having to count.just match the lengths.but then i'm just an amateur.
cheers.

[Turion]

Have faith

All I have to say is that you won't be disappointed. The sad thing is, I only see one person doing ANY work on their own on this thread. Everyone else is sitting around waiting for Matt to disclose stuff on the motor. He will. But I doubt we will share anything on the forum beyond that.

The idea was to work as a GROUP and figure out how to build the best motor, the best generator, the best 3 battery setup and the best switching. If we're going to have to do ALL of it ourselves, why should we share with anyone? We have a motor that works. We have a gen that works. But I know of at least THREE ways the gen can be improved already. I have been working with the 3 battery setup for 8 years now and have built lots of tesla switch configurations, but I know Matt has gotten run times in HIS setups that make my efforts look sick, and with REAL loads, not just a little light bulb.

You all have the pdf of the basic motor THAT WORKS. You could all have been experimenting to make it better. But like I said in my first post on this thread. Lots of folks with theories and no builders. Matt has a better design of the motor, and then some electronics that take it to a whole new level. The motor design is all we promised, and since nobody else is even attempting to TRY and work on this on their own, who knows whether Matt will feel like sharing that electronics info or not. Because you CAN get there without it. And that was our point. We already know enough to make a working device. We just have to DO it. If you wind a couple coils and have a rotor with magnets on it, and turn it with this motor, you will see more out than in IF you run it on a 3 battery setup. How far you take it beyond that is up to YOU. We're probably not going to give it all away. All we said was we would show it can be done. And if people were working we would try to help.

Now Matt may have a different opinion and he does all the heavy lifting. He may be willing to share everything. I'm just along for the ride, but I BUILD stuff. Even when it doesn't work, I build it and try to make it better.

[altrez]

I build stuff. I am a builder. I just got an ass chewing from my girl for spending money on yet a another meter an analog simpson. I bought the plans for the Switch. I am working on it for this project.

There are some of us who can see the reason for your frustration, but damn Dave you need to calm down a bit. We don't even have the plans for the motor yet!

No disrespect..

-Altrez

[laserjo]

I Like Build To

DAVE i like to build to but like some people at this time of the year
are on holiday in the sun but do want to take part when i get home.
ps. gone to bar

[voltan]

hi all.i got the rc motor running how i like it.c2 is 200 uf,preferably low esr or motor run caps if wound with thicker wire. c3 makes it quieter,(more spike activity than the other 2 motors.it needs more work as i haven't got it so the transistors stay on for the duration.they seem to chatter a bit.it was faster with the previous circuit.) a cap across a fwbr in it's place charges up to 78v when running on 15.6v at about 2000rpm.).maybe i should work on recovering some of that. c3 is 3.3 uf, bipolar. the resistors are now 150 ohms.3k-3k mini isolation transformers,mje340's and 1n5189's.everything runs cool,as at 15.6v it draws 49ma.it's very easy to start from 8v and from 10v or more it feels smooth and sounds ok,though it does have a bit of a note.i might be able to get it to run quieter and faster with more tweaks.it's not big on revs but it does have some torque.loading it by pinching the shaft doesn't affect the functionality of the circuit,to my relief.i been wondering if the 'using the same power twice' scheme could lose the plot when a motor is loaded,but it's all good.now i got something with an output shaft i can do a lot more with it.
***fast forward to post 460 on page 16 for a better circuit that splits the input voltage with 2 caps that drive the motor in ac and has looped spike recovery.i like it.
cheers.

[Sawt2]

I have been wanting to try my hand at winding a motor like is outlined in matt's pdf that randy showed. i have quite a few of these 24 volt wheelchair motors that are 16 pole motors. I know matt is working on a different type of winding but i think i would still like to try winding a pulse motor as in the pdf. My question is, does it matter which pole you start winding on as long as you put the wires to the right contacts on the commutator? I did mark the contact that I started the unwinding process. I included a pic of the armature.


image.jpg

The original Matt Jones pulse motor pdf says to use #23 gauge wire, I believe 50 turns with a single strand, and with that you can build Matt's original pulse motor design. It's an awesome little motor and I have been using it for a year. You can use that motor with a 3 battery setup to see proof of concept, and it WILL WORK.

[Sawt2]

Matt
Thank you for your response, i have a couple of those motors that are 4 pole, they are waiting and willing for your new motor ideas. On this 2 pole i was just wanting to rewind as a pulse motor, as referred to by randy on this thread. I just wasn't sure if there is a specific spot on the armature that you have to start winding or is it, wherever you start, then follow the pattern laid out on the pdf. I've never rewound a motor and thought this was something i might be able to do to "get my feet wet".

The motor I am working on is the same. Just lower impedance. The point of it is to set the current flow and control the speed with voltage, while recovering a portion of the input power. SO far it seem to be working. Now I am working on several gens to supplement power without a reduction in Torque or an increase in amp draw.

Anyway of your have 4 magnetic poles in the stator and they are NSNS then it will work the same way I am doing it. If not and your willing to work on it maybe we can figure out a way to make 2 pole work. If you want...

Get all the details together on you motor including running behavior stock IE RPM's, voltage and current draw without a load. If you can measure the induction on the coils that helps.

Let me know.

The goal is to try to create Boost circuit with the motor. SO you have to calculate a bit. The induction on the motor is variable when it runs so I have been trying some different formulas to try to make it predictable but with no resolve. You just have to play it by ear but you can get real close the first time.

As far as everything else goes I am trying to wrap it up by next weekend But no promises.

Matt

[altrez]

Matt,

Do I need to buy a different model Razor scooter motor then the MY106's I got at the start of the thread? Also I think you posted it already but what type of wire are we going to use?

Thanks!

-Altrez

[voltan]

sounds good matt.i thought this wire chart might be useful.the wire i used on the rc motor is probably 34 awg comparing the resistance.i'm not sure how max amps is derived.i will check that out a bit more.ok.according to wiki,magnet wire is rated thus.
in practice maximum current density can vary from 2.5A/mm squared for a wire isolated from free air,to 6A/mm squared for a wire in free air.
i guess that's for constant dc.not sure how you factor for pulsed dc and the start up condition.
cheers.

[tachyoncatcher]

My question is, does it matter which pole you start winding on as long as you put the wires to the right contacts on the commutator?

Hi Sawt2,
No, it doesn't matter where you start. Just as long as you know whether your brushes are wired 90 or 180 degrees apart. I have worked on both. As far as wire, 23 or 24 didn't matter in that pdf. I had 23, Matt had 24, for our purposes at the time, it was close enough.

I have no idea what Matt and Dave have been working on lately, as I took what I learned and moved on to later works of Tesla. But, the clue "low impedance" makes me think you may be introduced to bifilar windings in a similar configuration as the pdf, so you may want to wait for Matt's lead before winding that rotor.

Good Luck,
Randy

[Sawt2]

Randy
Thank you, i have some of both kinds. (90 & 180 deg.)

Hi Sawt2,
No, it doesn't matter where you start. Just as long as you know whether your brushes are wired 90 or 180 degrees apart. I have worked on both. As far as wire, 23 or 24 didn't matter in that pdf. I had 23, Matt had 24, for our purposes at the time, it was close enough.

I have no idea what Matt and Dave have been working on lately, as I took what I learned and moved on to later works of Tesla. But, the clue "low impedance" makes me think you may be introduced to bifilar windings in a similar configuration as the pdf, so you may want to wait for Matt's lead before winding that rotor.

Good Luck,
Randy

[Sawt2]

Matt
Thank you, i am looking forward to what you have come up with. I have seen some real interesting things with these standard motors and the 3 bgs, it will be interesting to see what happens with a pulse type motor.

No the motor you have is fine if its a my1016. #24 awg and I think its .5 mm.



The 4 poled will work just fine. Demo one of them and make sure you can get all the wire off. Clean any sharp edges. You might have a different induction so come time to run it you might not get the raw effect. Thats not a problem though. I concocted a pretty neat driver the other day. Some of the parts were underrated so it burned up but as soon I can afford it i'll get some parts and test it out. Right now I am thinking it may reduce current draw from the battery by 10 fold and keep the power system in tact so the motor still has all the torque and speed. Or in other words Keep consumption down to 10%-15% percent of total power in the motor. No promises though.


I'll post motor instruction along with some tips and tricks videos, soon.

Matt

[wantomake]

Second go round

Matt,
I've got two my1016' s. One is still full motor but the other is stripped of wire and ready for rewinding . Will need to order some 23 awg wire and will wait for further post from you.

Dave,
Today got the old 3BGS set up again and ran some interesting but strange test, as usual, got the radiant aether feeling again.

Hooked the my1016 motor between #1 and #3. Put a load on #3 of 2x 50 watt bulbs in series. But connected a APC unit( device used to power pc if power outage, ) to #1. Then plugged a 12v charger( one used for those small cars for kids)into it and started charging #2. The motor increased rpm's and cooled down some...????? #1 and #2 kept charge for two hours but did start to drop in voltage.

So increased the load on #3 will try this for next two hours and see the results.

Sorry for the basic details, but if I get good results then will post input,output, amperage and any information needed.

Still at it,
wantomake

[altrez]

Matt,

Will this work for the wire?

http://smile.amazon.com/Magnet-Ename...24+magnet+wire

-Altrez

[Turion]

altrez,
That should be enough to wind the motor, but if Matt is using the same wire on the generator it won't be enough for both. I think the motor will take between 450-500 on its own, and I imagine the generator will take the same. I would hate for you to be short of having enough to do both. But Matt can speak to the details better than I can. I haven't seen what he is doing with the generator at all.

Dave