Barbosa and Leal Devices - Info and Replication Details

[clarence]

Oh really -- try a dose of this!

I wasn't suggesting to remove earth grounding from the mains neutral if it is earth grounded, I was just pointing out that if the mains neutral is earth grounded, like it is in many countries, then you shouldn't use the mains to test a Barbosa and Leal device. I have explained this many times already in this thread. The best way to test this sort of device is using a 12 volt deep cycle battery and an inverter. This way you will elimate all problems associated with mains grounds loops. However, I wouldn't suggest going out and buying a deep cycle battery and inverter for this project unless you have lots of extra money to burn, as based on the little information Clarence has provided so far about the performance of his particular setup, his device does not appear to be doing anything out of the ordinary.

It would be different if Clarence had been willing to do some proper testing and report the results back here, and then people could assess whether or not it is worth spending a bunch of money on this or not to do tests. I have done some testing with both a Barbosa and Leal single transformer and a two transformer arrangement now, and I haven't been able to see anything out of the ordinary in my tests, but then again I am not afraid to do proper testing and proper measurements to understand how the setup is really working. This is because I am interested in getting to the actual facts regardless of what the facts are. I should point out however that I don't have an extensive earth ground like Barbosa and Leal have supposedly called for, but my earth ground is still pretty decent and I did not see any unusual effects.

You should also be aware that Clarence's device arrangment is different than what Barbosa and Leal showed in their patent application docs. Clarence added another earth ground connection to the transformer input neutral wire. This allows the phase hot current to pass through the load to earth ground, and then return to the other earth ground at the transformer input via the ground, completing the circuit. It appears Clarence added this separate earth ground because you won't be able to power a load at all from an inverter if you don't add the second earth ground at the input of the transformer to complete the circuit via a ground path, but such an arrangement has diverged from Barbosa and Leal's patent, and although it allows you to power a load with an inverter, it doesn't seem to deliver any extra power to a load other than what the inverter is supplying.

Two very basic tests that should be a given that anyone testing this sort of circuit arrangement should do are:
1) properly measure and compare battery power draw to load power consumption.
2) Compare the device performance with the ground wire wrapped around the secondary wire, and with the ground wire not wrapped around the secondary wire. Is there any noticeable difference at all?

The Barbosa and Leal devices are supposed to deliver many kilowatts out to a load with only a small power input from the battery and inverter. So if the device is working properly you should be able to power loads of several kilowatts easily with just a small inverter of just a few hundred watts at most. Ask yourself why it is that Clarence needs a 3000W inverter to power only smaller loads. He should be able to power loads of several kilowatts with only an inverter of one hundred watts or so, based on Barbosa and Leal's claims. If the device can't power large KW loads with a small inverter of a few hundred watts at most, then it would appear that the device is not working.

People make all sorts of claims about free energy devices all over the internet, but before spending too much money to try to replicate such claims, in my opinion it is very advisable to do some investigation first and see if the claims being made make any sense at all and can stand up to basic examination. This is all just my point of view on the matter, and you are free to do whatever you like of course.
I think it is important to be aware of all these things before anyone spends too much money however.

these attachments are from the Fernando Demonstration in Brazil!
it is in response to Fernandos questions for infomation about their
DEVICE as you call it!

The attachment shows their response both in English and their native language.

so much for hot wind!

[BroMikey]

[QUOTE=djarno;277277]

Considering level's 'agreeable' comment I go to buy a smaller inverter.
If there is overunity I should be able to prove it that way. Also sinus is for serious equipment, but just for light testing an regular inverter should do it right?

Sincerely.


I suppose I buy a smaller one.

That should be enough to test the concept

Also let me suggest another way to protect your secondary.

Since Clarence says that when the system is IDLING

(NO POWER RUNNING) the amp draw on the big wire IS NOT large.

USE A BREAKER!!!!!!!!! USE A 40 AMP BREAK BETWEEN.

Then if the break does not POP!!!! take the breaker out.

Do you understand???? I can repeat for you.

USE a breaker to connect BIG WIRE first.

THEN TAKE THE BREAKER OFF!!!!

I hope you understand and this helps you.

This way if the connection is wrong no damage.

USE A BREAKER? DO YOU UNDERSTAND???


Good to see someone trying hard.

[level]

these attachments are from the Fernando Demonstration in Brazil!
it is in response to Fernandos questions for infomation about their
DEVICE as you call it!

The attachment shows their response both in English and their native language.

so much for hot wind!

Hi Clarence, Yes, I have read them, thanks.
Here is a quote from the PESN site about those tests:

"On December 12, Evolucoes Energia ran such a test, showing that the energy amplification effect also works when running from a battery through an inverter.
They hooked the Captor to a 90 Amp-hour battery with a DC/AC inverter that drew 21 A at 12 Volts DC that, in turn, fed the Captor with 252 W at 230 V. They then hooked a 1,000 W lamp and a 600 W heater with a total load of 1,610 W. That comes to a ratio of nearly 6.4 times the power drawn from the inverter -- not as good as what they observed at a higher power level from the grid, but definitely an overunity effect of a very significant level."
PESN rep witnesses Evolucoes Energia's Captor off-grid overunity


Based on this, if correct, they were drawing 252 Watts from the battery (21A x 12V) and powering a load of total 1610 Watts, if the heater and lamp were fully powered and the heater was turned on to max heat. If someone can replicate that, that would be impressive.

[djarno]

[QUOTE=BroMikey;277280]

Also let me suggest another way to protect your secondary.

Since Clarence says that when the system is IDLING

(NO POWER RUNNING) the amp draw on the big wire IS NOT large.

USE A BREAKER!!!!!!!!! USE A 40 AMP BREAK BETWEEN.

Then if the break does not POP!!!! take the breaker out.

Do you understand???? I can repeat for you.

USE a breaker to connect BIG WIRE first.

THEN TAKE THE BREAKER OFF!!!!

I hope you understand and this helps you.

This way if the connection is wrong no damage.

USE A BREAKER? DO YOU UNDERSTAND???


Good to see someone trying hard.

breaker is like 4 meters away .

So no, I don't add another breaker on the circuit I think

[clarence]

Pesn is a lieing fraud!- you missed the mark again!

Hi Clarence, Yes, I have read them, thanks.
Here is a quote from the PESN site about those tests:

"On December 12, Evolucoes Energia ran such a test, showing that the energy amplification effect also works when running from a battery through an inverter.
They hooked the Captor to a 90 Amp-hour battery with a DC/AC inverter that drew 21 A at 12 Volts DC that, in turn, fed the Captor with 252 W at 230 V. They then hooked a 1,000 W lamp and a 600 W heater with a total load of 1,610 W. That comes to a ratio of nearly 6.4 times the power drawn from the inverter -- not as good as what they observed at a higher power level from the grid, but definitely an overunity effect of a very significant level."
PESN rep witnesses Evolucoes Energia's Captor off-grid overunity

Based on this, if correct, they were drawing 252 Watts from the battery (21A x 12V) and powering a load of total 1610 Watts, if the heater and lamp were fully powered and the heater was turned on to max heat. If someone can replicate that, that would be impressive.

PESN and Sterling DID NOT have anything to do WITH OR FINANCE ANY PART of the demonstration event!
All of Fernandos expenses were paid for by a Friend of mine here in the USA!
Fernando made the mistake of E-mailng Sterling as a friend about his adventure there in Brazil and Sterling then fraudently claimed he had financed FERNANDO as HIS REP.for the event which was just another one of his known BALD FACED LIES! Sterling h is known for his failing mental problems by the majority of the world nowdays. a pity but true none the less!

I was given access to all of Fernandos PAID FOR information by my friend
and there is A LOT that has never been revealed and probably won't be!
so when you think you want to teach me about B&L , step back and think again! HA! HA!

[level]

... so when you think you want to teach me about B&L , step back and think again! HA! HA!

Hello Clarence. My interest here is in trying to figure out if there is something to Barbosa and Leal's claims. Most of my free time for experimenting is on other experiments of my own personal ideas and designs, but I am still doing some Barbosa and Leal experiments from time to time when I can find the time, as I still haven't ruled these guys out yet.

[BroMikey]

[QUOTE=djarno;277282]

breaker is like 4 meters away .

So no, I don't add another breaker on the circuit I think

Okay let me say again.

"BREAKER ON THE TOROID'S"

The big wire, the larger wire, put an EXTRA breaker

then you can hook it up backwards and it will be safe.

I see you do not understand. To bad 4 U.

You better get a translator.

[BroMikey]

these attachments are from the Fernando Demonstration in Brazil!
it is in response to Fernandos questions for infomation about their
DEVICE as you call it!

The attachment shows their response both in English and their native language.

so much for hot wind!

Good to C-U still spoon feeding our favorite skeptic

Great document Clarence, I gotter saved in a safe place.

Djarno has low English and is a wild card. But he is using one

breaker so this is good. Maybe he is going to win this time.

Do you think he connected the 2 toroids up backwards?

Or is Djarno only using 1 toroid? He must not understand the

past posts with diagrams and writing?

I think we need a translator.

This should be interesting, Djarno is going to be a winner.

[djarno]

Good to C-U still spoon feeding our favorite skeptic

Great document Clarence, I gotter saved in a safe place.

Djarno has low English and is a wild card. But he is using one

breaker so this is good. Maybe he is going to win this time.

Do you think he connected the 2 toroids up backwards?

Or is Djarno only using 1 toroid? He must not understand the

past posts with diagrams and writing?

I think we need a translator.

This should be interesting, Djarno is going to be a winner.

The secondary's are now winded correctly.

I'm receiving an inverter of 200 watt or so on Friday by mail of an 'supporter'.

You're English isn't the best either. Electronic wise I don't know the English words.

Adding an picture or diagram does wonders, atleast for me.

Goodnight.

[level]

The secondary's are now winded correctly.
I'm receiving an inverter of 200 watt or so on Friday by mail of an 'supporter'.
You're English isn't the best either. Electronic wise I don't know the English words.
Adding an picture or diagram does wonders, atleast for me.
Goodnight.

Hello djarno. Your English is perfectly fine. Quite a bit better than BroMikey's English. Also, it was already perfectly clear that you have the secondary wound correctly now.

[tachyoncatcher]

Progress

djarno, You're learning. Bravo to you sir! Just don't kill any chickens or yourself. A few things that I see that might be nothing or everything.

- Your primary looks to be wound around the entire toroid instead of just 160 degrees as suggested by Clarence. Aside from the unknown magnetic interference on the large inductor (wire), this can cause a larger inrush of current when you switch it on due to greater saturation requirements. Clarence's model of 160 degrees helps with this.

- Your looped wire around the large inductor is open at one end. While I have seen different versions of how it is connected, I have never seen it open, as your is.

- Your primaries look a little scorched. Brown under the tape. If your leads melt their insulation and the coating on the winding then you could have a short and might need to rewind the primaries. Disconnect your primaries and check the resistance. They should be equal. Oh, and not zero.

Welcome to the world of alternate energy. We all get there by smoking a little wire from time to time.

@Clarence, Thanks for the kind words. The respect is mutual.

Take Care,

Randy

[BroMikey]

I should have said:

PUT A BREAKER ON THE TOROIDS. But you gonna do it

the way you want. I hope you don't burn down your house

and kill yourself. Now this is good English



Personally I would use a breaker but I don't want to sound

like a broken record, twisting anybody's arm.

With a 100 amp breaker on the 400 amp wire is the

smart safe way to operate. Did you get it, that time?

The CAPTOR TOROIDAL'S use 400 amp wire so

use at least a 20amp breaker if you are not sure

if the connection you made is upside down or

backwards. Just when you think you have it

some other mistake is made.



Use a breaker on the BIG WIRE. I don't think

a picture is needed if you know English

I understand that you already have a breaker.

That is not what I have been suggesting here for 3

posts. The 400 amp wire carrying the high current

that melted in front of you is where a larger breaker

COULD be used if people want to make sense.



Every other person coming by here looking at all of these

mistakes and what the consequences might be, may

feel better about starting this experiment if a means of

setting up with a safety breaker was put into the works.



If a breaker is used in the 400 amp line to setup the CAPTOR

it will not destroy the project. Just good common sense which

most of you people seem to have very little of.

Hook it one way the breaker POPS, hook it the right way

the breaker does not pop. Come on guys make sense.

[clarence]

Missed the mark again!

Well, I can't say for sure that you don't need a pure sinewave inverter, but I would think a regular inverter should be fine if you are just testing with loads like light bulbs or electric heaters. I would think a 500 watt to 750 watt or so inverter should be more than sufficient if Barbosa and Leal's claims are valid.

@ ALL

this in the attachment is the actual battery and Inverter B&L used during their testing with Fernando present!

It is NOT a tiny inverter and NOT a small battery!!!!!!!!!!!

It was a BOSCH S4 93 AH battery and a 2000 watt/to 4000 watt and I believe the wording says its a SINE inverter.

look at the photo and take it to the BANK!!!!!

LATER,

Clarence

[level]

@ ALL
this in the attachment is the actual battery and Inverter B&L used during their testing with Fernando present!

It is NOT a tiny inverter and NOT a small battery!!!!!!!!!!!

It was a BOSCH S4 93 AH battery and a 2000 watt/to 4000 watt and I believe the wording says its a SINE inverter.
look at the photo and take it to the BANK!!!!!

Hello Clarence. No one said anything about using a small battery. I believe those particular setups you mention were claimed to be providing very large output power in the order of hundreds of kiloWatts while drawing around 500W to 1000W from the battery.

One of their other setups which I believe Fernando is supposed to have observed earlier, which I quoted the description of above, was described as only drawing 252W from the battery and inverter, and was said to be powering a load of 1610 Watts. In the tests you mention which are producing much higher output power, it was described as a 2000W inverter. I saw no mention of it having to be a pure sinewave inverter. If the information presented about the earlier test drawing 252W from a battery and inverter to power a load with 1610 Watts is accurate, then a 500W to 750W inverter should be enough to do some basic testing of a Barbosa and Leal setup, and should be able to power a load of around 1 kiloWatt or more while only drawing two to three hundred Watts or so from the inverter. It seems it is not necessary to try to power loads of hundreds of kW just in order to do some basic testing. Smaller loads can be used at first to test if there is any over unity there. You most likely don't have to run a Barbosa and Leal setup at max capacity just to see how it performs. People can start out with testing smaller loads of say hundreds of watts, and in that case you shouldn't need a really high capacity inverter.

[clarence]

No testing!

Hello Clarence. No one said anything about using a small battery. I believe those particular setups you mention were claimed to be providing very large output power in the order of hundreds of kiloWatts while drawing around 500W to 1000W from the battery.

One of their other setups which I believe Fernando is supposed to have observed earlier, which I quoted the description of above, was described as only drawing 252W from the battery and inverter, and was said to be powering a load of 1610 Watts. In the tests you mention which are producing much higher output power, it was described as a 2000W inverter. I saw no mention of it having to be a pure sinewave inverter. If the information presented about the earlier test drawing 252W from a battery and inverter to power a load with 1610 Watts is accurate, then a 500W to 750W inverter should be enough to do some basic testing of a Barbosa and Leal setup, and should be able to power a load of around 1 kiloWatt or more while only drawing two to three hundred Watts or so from the inverter. It seems it is not necessary to try to power loads of hundreds of kW just in order to do some basic testing. Smaller loads can be used at first to test if there is any over unity there. You most likely don't have to run a Barbosa and Leal setup at max capacity just to see how it performs. People can start out with testing smaller loads of say hundreds of watts, and in that case you shouldn't need a really high capacity inverter.

I don't waste time hopping down the TEST bunny trail (also known as experimenting).

I just go straight to implement and use. major difference!