Single Wire Power - A Search for Ambient Power to do Wwork

[med.3012]

I'm not interested in attacking Meyl, but since others keep referring to him/his diagrams which are clearly wrong....

in my point of view and regarding the difficulty in this field it's necessary to have the most open mind... someone maybe wrong in my eyes but correct in other notion.

referring to something don't mean they are correct , don't accept something unless you are sure about it, again it's a way to think in different ways.

[Bob Smith]

Bob Smith
Fascinating thought. So are you saying that even when we are using a battery for our local power source dipole - it is still an open circuit thus in some way connected with the ambient?

Is this the mechanism that Bedini talks about (paraphrase) relative to the Bloch wall (neutral space between poles) that pulls in or pushes out vectors until local equilibrium is produced, as a fundamental natural force of creating energetic balance?
Bloch

Hello David
That's precisely what I'm saying on both accounts. In the first instance, we know that the two poles of the battery interact with the ambient environment, effectively polarizing the space around them - who knows how far these fields of polarization extend? Is it not rather audacious to maintain that a battery - whether standing alone or as part of a circuit - is completely closed off from the local ambient environment?

In the second instance - this is an interesting concept. The way I understand it, these vectors entering the pulsed coil thru the bloch wall are scalar in nature. That is, they are not transverse EM lines of force, but rather longitudinal EM lines of force. Where do these lines of force originate? If you read Ken Wheeler, he speaks about what is popularly known as the "Bloch wall", as the "dielectric plane" of a polarized coil or magnet. If I'm reading Wheeler correctly, the longitudinal vectors are convergently entering the dielectric plane between the two divergent magnetic field vortices, coming from the dielectric medium, otherwise known as the aether. In the case of the magnet, it seems that its fixed angles of atomic precession creates a permanent set of conditions which allow the dielectric lines of force to converge from the ambient medium/aether at the dielectric plane and diverge at its polar ends. I think it's safe to say that the same holds true with the pulsed electromagnet (coil), in terms of converging dielectric from the ambient/aether at the bloch wall/dielectric plane, though in the coil's case, the atomic precession is not fixed, and shifts with each pulse of charge.
Bob

[Bob Smith]

Hi DrGreen I am busy with a single wire antenna system which I have to say isn't the huge success I was hoping for. Feeble I expected! infinitesimal Isn't helping my cause, more cable and better insulators required I suspect.
Regarding Meyl and EPD for that matter Its a lot of head scratching before I can even start to get the gist of what they are saying .
Certainly Meyl says in this Interview that the kits he sells are manufactured and sold by students working at his University on a 'non profit' basis. I see at 1H43 he says ' we don't need all these physicist's they can go do something else' … I don't think that's quite what the physicist's have in mind ! 'something else' doesn't sound like a well paid life of Riley to me.
Anyway right or wrong here's prof Meyl on the subject he says he doesn't need or want to make money from his kits “ I am a professor I'm (well) paid by the state” (0H 41 min)
https://vimeo.com/41021469
“This would be called over unity” (0H34 min) “The earthing would always be required” (0H39min)
In short if you would like to review that 15 min of video OH30 to 0H45 Prof Meyl seems to contest the discussion here.
I have emailed prof Meyl previous to writing. He was kind enough to reply but unfortunately he made it clear he is not prepared partake in open forums. Fair enough I guess .
I post the link to his video for your interest. As I wrote previous if it doesn't oblige and charge my battery It won't hold my attention long.

Duncan
Just a thought -- sometimes placing a resistor, say between 25-100 ohm between your positive input and your circuit will wake it up to the ambient effect by blocking current (but allowing voltage). Sounds counter-intuitive, but worth a try.
Bob

[dR-Green]

Regarding Meyl and EPD for that matter Its a lot of head scratching before I can even start to get the gist of what they are saying .

What are you experimenting with?

On Meyl, as I've said he will only confuse matters further. It's best to go back to the basics. That's why Eric made the Crystal Radio Initiative. Once you understand the basic principles on an engineering and practical level then you can make more sense of a lot of things. But none of that is based on free energy. Except in the case that you get the AM radio station to pay for charging your batteries.

https://vimeo.com/41021469

33:50

Yes, we could reproduce all his findings, that these scalar waves have very special properties, they are not shield-able by a Faraday cage, they are quicker than the speed of light, they are carrying energy...

39:10

Some people say "why are you using an earthing line?" Well, in Tesla's writings you know that Tesla was always using the earthing. If you switch off the earthing, the received energy is zero. So it stops at once. This is what Tesla said.

Now why would that be?

Could it be that the energy is transmitted through the wire and NOT the air? ... "This is what Tesla said" in fact. So what on-the-bench evidence since 1999 makes him think that a Faraday cage would shield anything?

Also in another video he puts his hand near one of the "spheres", and observes as the received energy disappears. He confidently claims that he's shielding the transmission between transmitter and receiver. Aside from the fact that all other parts of the coils are exposed to each other and his hand is shielding nothing, he is apparently also completely oblivious to the effect that his body capacitance has on the coil, and the effect that will have on the coil's resonant frequency therefore tuning. Of course the light went off, it's no longer in tune so nothing is working.

Meyl is inventing a narrative that extends over the horizon. Compelling. But when the traditionalist hear him Scalar speak, they dispatch the dinosaur brigade. They have one singular objective - to eat the invader at all cost.

The term Scalar Wave is an oxymoron, as scalar is part of the propagation constant that is NOT A WAVE!

Scalar explained…:
…for those who’s minds have been polluted by the prevalent quantum goddess reality:Let us turn to the Heaviside Equation which is the most fundamental equations in all of Electrical EngineeringRG + XB) + j (XG – RB) = propagation constant squaredwhere:R resistance in Ohms
G conductance in Siemens
X reactance in Henrys per second
B susceptance in Farads per second

Therefore:

RG is the scalar or DC component that is NOT A WAVE,
XB is the longitudinal or AC component and is an alternating electric wave

XG is the transverse or OC component and is a forward moving oscillating electric wave. RB is the transverse or OC component and is a reverse moving oscillating electric wave

This equation allows for all electrical conditions in time and or space and combinations thereof. The example equation is the dimensions of time (see: Steinmetz Theory of Transient Electric Waves and Phenomenon and also my paper: Symbolic Representation of the Generalized Electric Wave.)

Example:

The air in the room; the room is filled with air and has atmospheric pressure of 2998 mB, your stereo is blasting away, the speakers are creating longitudinal waves having length and frequency and exert a oscillating force centered on 2998 mB (+ or – 10 mB)

RG is the air pressure, a scalar
XB is the sound of the stereo, a longitudinal wave

XG = RB, thus no transverse waves exist (XG – RB) = ZERO

Hence (RG + XB) is what is going on in the room, the disinformers have convinced you that this whole quantity (RB + XB) is scalar, RG is the only scalar component. It is DC and has NO FREQUENCY, no WAVELENGTH and thus NO WAVE! SCALER = NO WAVE – GET IT???

As the wave density changes from lower to higher on the energetic scale, do you believe (example) that a Gamma ray has more net power than say a UV ray?

This is not a pound of feathers versus a pound of gold type of question. Maybe the unit of measure is a one minute emission of HF versus LF.

Secondly, do you believe that these waves interact in any way with the ambient that may become a component of their net available charge?

On a practical level the available energy depends on the propagating medium. What blocks one allows another to pass easily.



In the case of HF and LF, high frequencies radiate from conductors more easily. So if you are inputting the same amount of energy then the radiated energy should be greater at higher frequencies. That's one of the reasons Tesla used (relatively) low frequencies.

Is there a particular definition for the aether being used here?

[mikrovolt]

Dr Meyl's transmitter as an open source has brought attention to the study and discussion.
Right or wrong the exploration of claims have remained without extensive proof still the process
of taking it apart and examining it should be useful. In order to lay it to rest or to
use it I think it is fair to set aside intention and focus on facts and evidence.
OS:Tesla, Meyl, and Jackson's Wireless Aetheric Power Transmission - PESWiki

Because I have built several devices like this after studying Stiffler's SEC.
I was forced to remove the schematics and comments because his partner got angry.
many friends have told me there is no magic I can only say that there are more questions than answers.
I still talk to my friends but don't bring up Stiffler it is human nature to have forbidden topics.
Stiffler had his share of disbelief and prefers to work privately is a shame.

I have noticed that some Russians have used the term "Pure Potential" and the definition
with some benefit of doubt has meaning other than conventional use of the term.
There are some interesting theory in part in this pdf taken from JD Jackson's electrodynamics book.
http://www.physics.rutgers.edu/~rmag...cs/jackson.pdf


The video Steve Jackson makes a presentation. I think however comparing a transverse transmitter
using the same energy would be a better control rather than the fm radio and also choice of
material used with a faraday cage can make a difference.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...Pa73NNsA#t=152

In a simalar way Dollards L-wave transmitter penetrating a mountain would be an interesting
expirament to test or compare to other transmitters. The expirament having a control
can be helpful. That's were you need a good replication.

[DavidE]

dR-Green

I just wish you would spend as much "energy" breaking down the walls, as you do holding them up.

The way you chose to answer my wave density question was a dodge.

Disappointing.

[dR-Green]

dR-Green

I just wish you would spend as much "energy" breaking down the walls, as you do holding them up.

The way you chose to answer my wave density question was a dodge.

Disappointing.

Of course it was a dodge. If you look on wikipedia then it tells you the energy associated with types of radiation/frequencies so I'm not really sure what you mean.

What walls are you referring to? How is saying that Tesla's MONOPOLAR transmission system in opposition to Meyl and his through-the-air effectively two pole nonsense diagrams holding anything up? If you want to see lines going through the air joining a transmitter to a receiver then just learn about normal radio transmission. If you want to take down walls then tell the physicists that the energy is not going through the air, which is the truth of the situation.

[Ernst]

On Meyl's work

Meyl's work is interesting because he makes interesting mistakes, both in his theoretical and in his practical work. That is why you should study it. Copy it and learn from his mistakes.

I too had a short email conversation with him. It ended abruptly when I pointed out his mistake (explained in the above video).


Ernst.

[med.3012]

normal radio transmission. If you want to take down walls then tell the physicists that the energy is not going through the air, which is the truth of the situation.

please take a look at Tesla patent in the following photo........

[med.3012]

In Tesla wireless transmitter he used standing waves technique through the earth surface, the air terminals together work in resonance, the receiver/transmitter terminals make a kind of capacitor... here i think that the interaction is between air strata with the earth surface according Tesla patents! if i understand it correctly there is a kind of mutual induction which make the system to work as serial parallel resonating at the same time, air parts are parallel resonance system but the earth connection are serial resonance through standing waves node and anti node point ... this what make the transmitter take a very few power when the receiver have a much higher power, in both places we have serial/parallel resonance working together.. but in reverse manner , if the transmitter end with parallel resonance ( few power consumption ) the receiver will end up with high power consumption because it will end in the earth connection that provide this kind of serial resonance connection!

[dR-Green]

please take a look at Tesla patent in the following photo........

Application filed September 2, 1897

However surprising, it is a fact that a sphere of the size of a little marble offers a greater impediment to the passage of a current than the whole earth. Every experiment, then, which can be performed with such a small sphere can likewise be carried out, and much more perfectly, with the immense globe on which we live. This is not merely a theory, but a truth established in numerous and carefully conducted experiments. When the earth is struck mechanically, as is the case in some powerful terrestrial upheaval, it vibrates like a bell, its period being measured in hours. When it is struck electrically, the charge oscillates, approximately, twelve times a second. By impressing upon it current waves of certain lengths, definitely related to its diameter, the globe is thrown into resonant vibration like a wire, stationary waves forming, the nodal and ventral regions of which can be located with mathematical precision. Owing to this fact and the spheroidal shape of the earth, numerous geodetical and other data, very accurate and of the greatest scientific and practical value, can be readily secured...

This mode of conveying electrical energy to a distance is not 'wireless' in the popular sense, but a transmission through a conductor, and one which is incomparably more perfect than any artificial one. All impediments of conduction arise from confinement of the electric and magnetic fluxes to narrow channels. The globe is free of such cramping and hinderment. It is an ideal conductor because of its immensity, isolation in space, and geometrical form. Its singleness is only an apparent limitation, for by impressing upon it numerous non-interfering vibrations, the flow of energy may be directed through any number of paths which, though bodily connected, are yet perfectly distinct and separate like ever so many cables. Any apparatus, then, which can be operated through one or more wires, at distances obviously limited, can likewise be worked without artificial conductors, and with the same facility and precision, at distances without limit other than that imposed by the physical dimensions of the globe.

"The Future of the Wireless Art" by Nikola Tesla - 1908

[dR-Green]

Tesla

To be more explicit, I take a very large self-inductance and a comparatively small capacity, which I have constructed in a certain way so that the electricity cannot leak out. I thus obtain a low frequency; but, as you know, the electromagnetic radiation is proportionate to the square root of the capacity divided by the self-induction. I do not permit the energy to go out; I accumulate in that circuit a tremendous energy. When the high potential is attained, if I want to give off electromagnetic waves, I do so, but I prefer to reduce those waves in quantity and pass a current into the earth, because electromagnetic wave energy is not recoverable while that [earth] current is entirely recoverable, being the energy stored in an elastic system.

Counsel

What elastic system do you refer to?

Tesla

I mean this: If you pass a current into a circuit with large self-induction, and no radiation takes place, and you have a low resistance, there is no possibility of this energy getting out into space; therefore, the impressed impulses accumulate.

Counsel

Let's see if I understand this correctly. If you have radiation or electromagnetic waves going from your system, the energy is wasted?

Tesla

Absolutely wasted. From my circuit you can get either electromagnetic waves, 90 percent of electromagnetic waves if you like, and 10 percent in the current energy that passes through the earth. Or, you can reverse the process and get 10 percent of the energy in electromagnetic waves and 90 percent in energy of the current that passes through the earth.

It is just like this: I have invented a knife. The knife can cut with the sharp edge. I tell the man who applies my invention, you must cut with the sharp edge. I know perfectly well you can cut butter with the blunt edge, but my knife is not intended for this. You must not make the antenna give off 90 percent in electromagnetic and 10 percent in current waves, because the electromagnetic waves are lost by the time you are a few arcs around the planet, while the current travels to the uttermost distance of the globe and can be recovered.

This view, by the way, is now confirmed. Note, for instance, the mathematical treatise of Sommerfeld,[*] who shows that my theory is correct, that I was right in my explanations of the phenomena, and that the profession was completely misled. This is the reason why these followers of mine in high frequency currents have made a mistake. They wanted to make high frequency alternators of 200,000 cycles with the idea that they would produce electromagnetic waves, 90 percent in electromagnetic waves and the rest in current energy. I only used low alternations, and I produced 90 percent in current energy and only 10 percent in electromagnetic waves, which are wasted, and that is why I got my results. . . .

You see, the apparatus which I have devised was an apparatus enabling one to produce tremendous differences of potential and currents in an antenna circuit. These requirements must be fulfilled, whether you transmit by currents of conduction, or whether you transmit by electromagnetic waves. You want high potential currents, you want a great amount of vibratory energy; but you can graduate this vibratory energy. By proper design and choice of wave lengths, you can arrange it so that you get, for instance, 5 percent in these electromagnetic waves and 95 percent in the current that goes through the earth. That is what I am doing. Or you can get, as these radio men, 95 percent in the energy of electromagnetic waves and only 5 percent in the energy of the current. . . . The apparatus is suitable for one or the other method. I am not producing radiation with my system; I am suppressing electromagnetic waves. . . . In my system, you should free yourself of the idea that there is radiation, that the energy is radiated. It is not radiated; it is conserved. . . .

... Tesla

All right, I will explain that.

In my first efforts, of course I simply contemplated to disturb effectively the earth, sufficiently to operate instruments. Well, you know you must first learn how to walk before you can fly. As I perfected my apparatus, I saw clearly that I can recover, of that energy which goes in all directions, a large amount, for the simple reason that in the system I have devised, once that current got into the earth it had no chance of escaping, because my frequency was low; hence, the electro-magnetic radiation was low. The potential, the electric potential, is like temperature. We might as well call potential electric temperature. The earth is a vast body. The potential differences in the earth are small, radiation is very small. Therefore, if I pass my current into the earth, the energy of the current is stored there as electromagnetic momentum of the vibrations and is not consumed until I put a receiver at a distance, when it will begin to draw the energy and it will go to that point and nowhere else.

Counsel

Why is that, on your theory?

Tesla

I will explain it by an analogue.

Suppose that the earth were an elastic bag filled with water. My transmitter is equivalent to a pump. I put it on a point of the globe, and work my little piston so as to create a disturbance of that water. If the piston moves slowly, so that the time is long enough for the disturbance to spread over the globe, then what will be the result of my working this pump? The result will be that the bag will expand and contract rhythmically with the motions of the piston, you see. So that, at any point of that bag, there will be a rhythmical movement due to the pulsations of the pump.

That is only, however, when the period is long. If I were to work this pump very rapidly, then I would create impulses, and the ripples would spread in circles over the surface of the globe. The globe will no longer expand and contract in its entirety, but it will be subject to these outgoing, rippling waves.

Remember, now, that the water is incompressible, that the bag is perfectly elastic, that there are no hysteretic losses in the bag due to these expansions and contractions; and remember also, that there is a vacuum, in infinite space, so that the energy cannot be lost in waves of sound. Then, if I put at a distant point another little pump, and tune it to the rhythmical pulses of the pump at the central plant, I will excite strong vibrations and will recover power from them, sufficient to operate a receiver. But, if I have no pump there to receive these oscillations, if there is nowhere a place where this elastic energy is transferred into frictional energy (we always use in our devices frictional energy -- everything is lost through friction), then there is no loss, and if I have a plant of 1,000 horsepower and I operate it to full capacity, that plant does not take power, it runs idle, exactly as the plant at Niagara. If I do not put any motors or any lamps on the circuit, the plant runs idle. There is a 5,000 horsepower turbine going, but no power is supplied to the turbine except such power as is necessary to overcome the frictional losses.

Now the vast difference between the scheme of radio engineers and my scheme is this. If you generate electromagnetic waves with a plant of 1,000 horsepower, you are using 1,000 horsepower right along -- whether there is any receiving being done or not. You have to supply this 1,000 horsepower, exactly as you have to supply coal to keep your stove going, or else no heat goes out. That is the vast difference. In my case, I conserve the energy; in the other case, the energy is all lost.

Counsel

Mr. Tesla, does that not presuppose that the fluid must be incompressible?

Tesla

I should say so, and electricity, whatever it is, certainly it is incompressible because all our experiments show that.

Counsel

Now, if you were giving that a name, what principle would you say was involved by which the radiation loss, where there is no receiver, becomes a gain or a conservation where there is a receiver?

Tesla

There is no radiation in this case. You see, the apparatus which I devised was an apparatus enabling one to produce tremendous differences of potential and currents in an antenna circuit. These requirements must be fulfilled, whether you transmit by currents of conduction, or whether you transmit by electromagnetic waves. You want high potential currents, you want a great amount of vibratory energy; but you can graduate this vibratory energy. By proper design and choice of wave lengths, you can arrange it so that you get, for instance, 5 percent in these electromagnetic waves and 95 percent in the current that goes through the earth. That is what I am doing. Or, you can get, as these radio men, 95 percent in the energy of electromagnetic waves and only 5 percent in the energy of the current. Then you are wondering why you do not get good results. I know why I do not get good results in that way. The apparatus is suitable for one or the other method. I am not producing radiation in my system; I am suppressing electromagnetic waves. But, on the other hand, my apparatus can be used effectively with electromagnetic waves. The apparatus has nothing to do with this new method except that it is the only means to practice it. So that in my system, you should free yourself of the idea that there is radiation, that energy is radiated. It is not radiated; it is conserved.

Counsel

Right in that connection, and to illustrate your theory, I would like to know whether you consider that the radiation from any wireless station is wasted or conserved, or whether the effect produced by any of them today is due to this conductive action, so far as it is effective.

----------

[dR-Green]

Tesla

Absolutely -- the effect at a distance is due to the current energy that flows through the surface layers of the earth. That has already been mathematically shown, really, by Sommerfeld. [See editorial note p. 75.] He agrees on this theory; but as far as I am concerned, that is positively demonstrated. For instance, take the Sayville antenna. Professor Zenneck took me out and gave me the particulars. I went over the calculations and found that at 36 kilowatts they were radiating 9 kilowatts in electromagnetic wave energy. They had, therefore, only 25 percent of the whole energy in these waves, and I told Professor Zenneck that this energy is of no effect -- that they produce, by the current, differences of potential in the earth, and these differences of potential are felt in Germany and affect the receiver; but the electromagnetic waves get a little beyond Long Island and are lost.

I have an idea that [you] will get the best picture of the process in my system of transmission if you will imagine that the earth is a reservoir, say, of fluid under pressure -- that is the potential energy -- and at my plant, operating a distant tuned circuit, I must open a valve and enable that energy to flow in. It is exactly that way. The energy is all conserved, whether it is vibrating or purely potential. Whatever the transmitter does in the receiver, the effect is simply to open a valve, as it were, and permit energy to flow in.

Now, of course, the hardest thing to understand, if one is not a specialist in that line and has not spent years, as I have, in experiments and thought in that direction, is how can a plant like that be economically operated when we know that there are mountain peaks everywhere? Those peaks are antennae; they are likewise charged. Well, it took me a long time to find that out. To give you an idea, let us take a big, enormous mountain like the peak of Tenerife. That is a big mountain that rises out of the sea and goes up to 17,000 or 18,000 feet. Naturally, that is a tremendous antenna, everybody will think. Without calculating, without passing through the experience I have gone through, you will say that peak alone will take away more energy than all the antennae you can put up all over the world. That is not so.

The peak of Tenerife has no more capacity than something like 100 centimeters [110 picofarads], and it will be charged to a very low potential, whereas my antenna could be charged to a very high potential. I can show that the mountain would not absorb much energy, not 0.0001 percent of that my antenna would. I could put my antenna right close to the peak, and it will take 10,000 times more energy.

You must simply realize that the earth is, so far as it is mechanically looked upon, like a rough ball; but when you look at it electrically, it is a polished ball. Lord Kelvin has already, in his papers on atmospheric electricity, of which he kindly sent me two copies -- he did not stop at sending me one -- grasped that; he considered the distribution of electricity on the globe, and came to the conclusion that the capacity of definite terrestrial areas does not increase sensibly with elevation.

You see, the electrical surface density on the highest peaks is not any more than just a fraction of 1 percent greater than on the sea. So that the whole thing, to my mind, appears as a wonderfully providential arrangement, and we can by this means realize things so marvelous that one would be almost afraid to talk about them; and the apparatus -- I do not say that because I am the inventor -- the apparatus is practically the Lamp of Aladdin.

Nikola Tesla On His Work With Alternating Currents -- Chapter IV - 1916

[dR-Green]

In Tesla wireless transmitter he used standing waves technique through the earth surface, the air terminals together work in resonance, the receiver/transmitter terminals make a kind of capacitor... here i think that the interaction is between air strata with the earth surface according Tesla patents! if i understand it correctly there is a kind of mutual induction which make the system to work as serial parallel resonating at the same time, air parts are parallel resonance system but the earth connection are serial resonance through standing waves node and anti node point ... this what make the transmitter take a very few power when the receiver have a much higher power, in both places we have serial/parallel resonance working together.. but in reverse manner , if the transmitter end with parallel resonance ( few power consumption ) the receiver will end up with high power consumption because it will end in the earth connection that provide this kind of serial resonance connection!

The operation of the receiver depends on the transmitter. No transmitted power = no received power.

The operation of the transmitter is independent of all else. It works the same whether a receiver exists or not.

It doesn't require that a receiver exists on planet earth to change its characteristics in order to make it transmit energy.

[med.3012]

The operation of the receiver depends on the transmitter. No transmitted power = no received power.

The operation of the transmitter is independent of all else. It works the same whether a receiver exists or not.

It doesn't require that a receiver exists on planet earth to change its characteristics in order to make it transmit energy.

@ dR-Green thanks a lots for the very interesting info about Tesla, will be discussed later !