Motor Generators

[BroMikey]

you better let me get you the rights ohms value first

here look at this http://physics.bu.edu/~duffy/ns543_s...nt_class07.pdf

it shows that a 100w bulb running at 120v has a resistance on the wire filament of 144ohms. so selecting a 500ohm 50w might work better

Another way is to short the coil when starting then switch to load.

So as not slow down start up the right resistor needs to be selected probably a high value to keep the delay close.

You could always start it up and see which resistor can be used to slightly load while not causing a run away condition. This is where you are. Slow down.you know how shorted coils act

[Turion]

As I recall, ANY load across the coil on start up gives you the lenz reaction because you have not reached the RPM to achieve neutral Lenz. It’s not a problem when you have only ONE coil, but you’re dead in the water when you try to do it with 12 coils.

[Turion]

Got the Beast together and the motor mounted. The bolt holes in the frame don’t quite line up so I need MORE time to deal with that and I’m not in the mood. Only have an hour to work before I am done for the day, so will see how much of my light board I can get rewired. Might get some time this evening, but not likely.

9BBAD390-CA9B-4DF2-BD5A-DDEDEA498030.jpeg

[BroMikey]

As I recall, ANY load across the coil on start up gives you the lenz reaction because you have not reached the RPM to achieve neutral Lenz. It’s not a problem when you have only ONE coil, but you’re dead in the water when you try to do it with 12 coils.

True, at 77v and 1.35A using ohms law the bulb resistance is 57ohms
What do you think would happen if a 5000 ohm was placed there instead?

I don't know if you want to take the time. Use a rheostat to find a 1/4w drain

I buy 50w ones, here is a beauty

https://www.ebay.com/itm/18508280974...sAAOSwqFZgrX8v

Find a desired minimal drain start at 5000 ohms and inch downward

A 1/4 watt will not bother the motor but the meters will notice

[wantomake]

To All’
Good to see someone is still working here. Just checking in and hope it all goes well.
wantomake

[Turion]

Bro,
That would probably work, but I would have to have one for each coil pair, which is 6 x $25.00 to do something that I think moving the meters to the other side of the switch will take care of. I'll try that first. Luckily, it is the first of the month, and I have a monthly budget to spend on this stuff, but unfortunately, I am in the hole after spending so much on 6 spools of wire, and I need a couple months to catch back up to zero. It seems no matter how hard I try there is always SOMETHING I need that I can't do without. And the independent testing is another $700.00. I can't win.

[Turion]

The last of my coils will be here between 10-11:00 today. After that it’s all on me. So far my rotor is not turning as freely as I would like. Will run the machine for the first time today and see if I can figure out what the problem is. It may be nothing but the heavier rotor, or it may require I tear it all apart to see if I can adjust something. The amp draw of the motor will tell me. I know what my friend was able to achieve with the same setup (but different motor)

https://youtu.be/9XnhiWuc3oE

Since my buddy was able to run his DC motor on 100 volts at 2 amps or 200 watts to achieve 1100 rpm, if I am in the ballpark for those results, I will call it good and move forward. If not, it may take some time to figure this out. Anyone unhappy with the progress I have made on this project and wants to whine about it can always build it themselves. But they won’t. Still working on rewiring my light board too.

[Turion]

The motor was pulling well over 15 amps to turn the rotor, and when I disconnected the belt drive, the shaft was hard to turn by hand. With all the bolts loosened, the shaft turns with MINIMAL effort, but with everything tightened down, it does not turn properly, so somewhere something is in a bind. The coils came this morning and we spent a couple hours trying to figure out what is binding where. No luck. So this evening I disassembled EVERYTHING and just clamped all the pieces of the coil holders together with the bearings in place to make sure the center hole was in alignment all the way through. It is as far as I can tell. At least it the rotor shaft slid all the way through and fits into both bearings, and turns. Not as freely as when everything was loose, but not as tight as when everything was bolted together, so I need to look for where the shaft is rubbing on plastic and see if there is anything I can do to solve that problem. I have a few more things to try before I just give up and take it to a local machinist to see if they can solve it. If one of the two bearings isn't sitting flat against the case like it should be, that could be the problem. Almost impossible for me to tell. Tomorrow is another day.

[Memphis]

Hi Turion, it could be that the shaft is straight and the bearing housing is aligned, but when you tighten the rotor or stator walls they touch on the outer circle of the bearings, you have tried to insert thin washers on the shaft from both sides bearings?

[Turion]

I tried all kinds of stuff today, and I MAY have figured it out. In the attached photo you can see a large countersunk hole that the circular metal plate on the rotor would recess into, allowing the rotor to be closer to the coil holder. For WHATEVER reason, when the rotor turned, the plate on the rotor would rub against the wall of this circular opening during about half of its rotation. I have no idea why. Also, there are four Allen wrench bolts shown in the picture. They secure the two halves of one side of the the coil holders together in the middle, and "clamp" the bearing in place that fits in a compartment between the two halves. I didn't realize that if I tightened those four bolts TOO tight, it would clamp the bearing and not allow it to turn, even though the center race on the bearing is not being clamped.

Unfortunately, I took the rotor off the shaft yesterday, believing I would need to have the shaft checked for straightness. Doesn't look like it needs to be, but since I put it together with lock tight, I need to let the bolts soak in acetone for a while before wire brushing them and reapplying lock tight to reassemble it. So, tomorrow is another day.

Edit: I DID get the light board rewired today. I still need to strip all the ends of all the wires on all the coils in order to connect them up to the loads, so I have some work left to do besides assembling the machine. But it gives me something to do while I wait on the acetone, if it isn't done with its work in the morning.
PROBLEM.jpg

[Turion]

Still have wires to strip and holes to drill and tap to bolt the coil holders in place, but I will get the RPM meter set up tonight or tomorrow and can start loading coils into the machine and adjusting it. I was incredibly happy to see 26 volts and 4.4 amps as the unloaded input of the machine. All my calculations have been based on 7 or 8 amps input. I don’t know if it was at 2800 RPM so it may cost me more than that. But it was exciting for me to finally have it (the NEW version) running on the bench.

https://youtu.be/f-AuRDqQecA

Hey bi, you ready to make that bet yet?

[alexelectric]

The work continues and improving the prototype, thanks for the videos that illustrate us better, Mr. Dave, effort and tenacity will have its reward

[Turion]

So, lots of things done today. The RPM meter is all set up running on a separate power supply. Although I had to take it APART again because of some issues that it was in the way of working on. The RPM of the machine was about 1500 RPM with the input I had yesterday. It took me 30.2 volts at 8.7 amps to get the RPM up to 2800 RPM, and that is unacceptable.

I'm going to have to change the gears. So I took the gear off the motor and the one off the generator shaft and I will go to Sacramento either tomorrow or Tuesday to see what I can find. Probably call a couple places tomorrow and figure out a plan. Maybe a bigger gear for the motor or a smaller gear for the generator shaft, or both. Got the whole unit moved over to the rolling cart that will remain its home for the foreseeable future and I can reclaim my table saw for other purposes.

All the coil bobbins have to be slightly sanded to get them to slide into the holder correctly. The two end pieces of each bobbin have a sharp edge on them, and that needs to be blunted. Just takes time. Also, all the 3/4" holes in the machine at the center of each coil holder need to be sanded, and I am working on that, one hole at a time, as I prepare each coil and fit it into the machine. The metal that sticks out of the coil 1/4" to fit closer to the magnet needs to be filed, and I have a whole process for that. The video of what I worked on today is below.

https://youtu.be/bOv-SV9rQFA

[alexelectric]

Greetings Mr. Dave, are you doing this test with the pure magnets without the coils? , another video guide thanks

[Turion]

I'm not sure what you mean by "Doing this test with pure magnets without the coils."
So here's what I intend to do. (And remember..."coils" INCLUDES the cores)

1. Get the machine up to 2850 RPM with no coils in place, as that is the "ballpark" required for "Neutral Lenz" with these coils.
2. Determine the EXACT RPM required to tun the machine at "Neutral Lenz" with the coils I am using by putting two coils in the machine under 300 watt load.
3. Record the Amp draw and Voltage at the target RPM with NO COILS in the machine.
4. Add two UNLOADED coils and record the change in voltage and amp draw necessary to maintain target RPM.
5. Keep adding pairs of coils until all six pair are in the machine, recording amps and voltage required at each step to maintain target RPM.
6. Take all coil pairs but one out of the machine, and adjust to "Neutralize" the magnetic drag, and record volts and amps required to maintain target RPM
7. Continue to add coil pairs, adjust to neutralize each pair, and record volts and amps required to maintain target RPM
8. Place a coil pair under 300 watt load, and record any change in input voltage and amps or in RPM. Record output to load in volts and amps
9. Add loads to each of the rest of the coil pairs in turn, recording changes in input voltage and amps and in RPM for each added coil, and the output in volts and amps to each load for each subsequent coil.
Measure total input to motor under full load of 300 watts on each coil pair and total output in volts and amps to all the loads.

I figure the MAXIMUM output of this machine will be around 1800 watts. That's because the coils I am using do not have the solid iron cores. I could put THOSE coils in in the machine and produce the power I have produced in the past, (1800-20000 watts) but what good is it if you can only run it 30 minutes at a time before it overheats. Except to prove it does what I have always said it will do.