ENLIGHTENED MAGNETISM (The Full Proof of Ken Wheeler's Theories)

[Ufopolitics]

Ufo,

nice explanation. While thinking about your view of magnetism I'm trying to understand how the model you are presenting fits some very basic experimental results. The simple case is the single straight wire where a current is forced into: how does your model fits in this case ? How does the model explains the force and magnetic field associated to that ?

Thanks,

nathan

Hello Nathan97,

Could you be a bit more specific, a drawing or more detailed explanation about the straight wire?

You are not referring to a single wire moving along a uniform magnetic field and connected to a galvanometer right?

Thanks


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Thank You UFO, I see my answer now. You are a fun wiz-kid
cause you know how to explain things and have some great graphics
tools at your disposal. Let the nay sayers perch on a limb and roll their
eyes cause that is all they were pre-programmed to do

As for you recent entries? God Almighty fella I am still reeling from the
overload/back slash dude I love your stuff.

I been waitin on you and you have gone the extra mile here.

The Modified Motor works something like this if I read my UFO's right.

Thanks BroMikey,

You know I have piles and piles of this stuff scattered all over my hard drives...meaning this is not something I made up a few minutes ago...lol

I am just very happy because most of my testing are resulting very positive with the machines am working on, confirming all these old CAD's Graphics, so I decided to keep posting all this data...


Regards Friend


Ufopolitics

[bistander]

There is always a climbing sine (slope up)...a peak sine (top)and a downhill sine stage (slope down) ... if all conductors are cut with same magnitude, angle, etc, like you are writing above...how could this happen according to you?

Hi Ufo,

It is because of difference in flux density around the air gap. So I don't understand your "same magnitude" comment. And you also have the sum of the series connected coils. The voltages generated in the coils vary with the coil's position. The total voltage is what shows at the terminals.

bi

[bistander]

E1 and E2 are just the Exciter Coils connected to Diodes, then to Rotor via brushes.

The green coils are the Generating Coils.

The empty gaps are just like that, empty.

But maybe you did not understand the diagram windings, I am just representing the upper side of each coil, but they wrap around below as well which is not shown. Label L# are for each coil to correspond with the other side. like L1 to L1, L2 to L2 and so on.

I made Graph bigger and without any fields, just plain wiring to see it better:

[IMG][/IMG]

Yep Ufo,

My bad. Sorry. Ignore that comment.

What I meant to relate was that in the shown rotor position the output is zero or where the sinewave crosses zero. The peaks will occur when the rotor is 90° away. Is that the way you see it?

Regards,

bi

[bistander]

AC generator

Hello to All,

I spoke on previous post about Cycloids in Induction...well here I would expand just a bit...

Cycloid is the Magnetic Field Rotational Continuity of Flow through Time.

To visualize this better, look at below Graph CAD:

[IMG][/IMG]

Above are the same basic concepts as previous generator I have shown, except that here it is based on Eight Single Independent Coils (Not Overlapped), and spaced apart in order to simplify understanding.

The Rotor is the same type, a main coil fed by linear DC, in order to maintain a static polarization. But it could easily be just a permanent magnet...

The point here is to show how each rotational polarization, by Influencing each ferromagnetic core, transfers its flow converting it in an electron traffic at the coil winds...that we all know as Energy...or Electricity...

So, North Spiral (Blue) is spinning CCW and South Pole (red) CW...and this is referenced based on setting our point of view right at the center of rotor axis.

Generator rotor, looking from above is turning CW (like most of them do)

And to picture this Sequence in a linear fashion let's look at Graph below, where we are observing only a half turn progression of rotor:


[IMG][/IMG]

The timings are matched every 180º where T1 is the position represented on graphic of rotor magnetic field aiming at Coil 0º North, and Coil 180º South. And if you notice the coils winding are both the same direction, except one in front of the other (don't get confused by the mirror geometry) however, each end terminals are generating opposite voltage polarities.

This starting Coils are generating the starting Cycloids for North and South, being South Negative (Magenta half Sinewave) and North Positive (Cyan color half upper sine). So, it is understood that when rotor pole face is fully aligned with coil core face the Cycloid (half sine) would be at peak level, whether negative (South) or Positive (North))

I know by first time looking at this Graphics seems complicated...but it is not, and the more you familiarize with them, the more you understand the simplicity behind this process. It is just a matter of comprehending the 3D Space and getting inside of them...

In the real Electric Generators Coils design is overlapped, having a much wider center common core configured by many elements, normally this center core area is about the same area of each rotor pole, this is in order to obtain one full sine wave cycle (Half Positive-Half Negative) in just half turn of rotor, based on a simple two pole home generator.


Regards


Ufopolitics

Hi Ufo,

This took me a while. But I think I see. You show basically a 4 phase AC generator. So wouldn't the output waveform look like this 3 phase except with a forth hump? See below.

BTW, you do some nice graphics. Impressive.

Regards,

bi

[Ufopolitics]

Three Phase Overlapped Sinewave

Hi Ufo,

This took me a while. But I think I see. You show basically a 4 phase AC generator. So wouldn't the output waveform look like this 3 phase except with a forth hump? See below.

[IMG][/IMG]

BTW, you do some nice graphics. Impressive.

Regards,

bi

Hello Bistander,

Thanks, having full control over 3D Graphics and software is an enormous help to visualize this whole magnetism "enigma"...

Now the final sinewave result depends upon the way we connect the induced coils.

For example, a much more simple approach than the one you have shown above:

[IMG][/IMG]

Above is just Three Coils (Instead of Six) showing the sequence every 120º, and independent output terminals for each, at right is the output sinewave result.

If You noticed , in my eight coils two pole rotor, I did not connect the only two coils between them, I just let them as open terminals to show how voltage is reversed at North and South Polarization respectively.

Also, the main point to observe in both pics above, is that peak sinewave is reached when rotor coil and induced coils are fully aligned-engaged.


Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Yep Ufo,

My bad. Sorry. Ignore that comment.

What I meant to relate was that in the shown rotor position the output is zero or where the sinewave crosses zero. The peaks will occur when the rotor is 90° away. Is that the way you see it?

Regards,

bi

Hello Bistander,

Ok, let's take a look at simple Images I just picked from a simple search about Sinewave Vs Rotor Turn Position for two pole rotor...:

[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

In both simple images above (from different sources) the only two induced coils are connected in series, and basically, rotor has been paused every 90º...1,2,3,4 and A,B,C,D respectively.

Notice that 2,4 as B,D are Peak Sines, whether positive or negative, then notice in All those stages the rotor is fully engaged-aligned to the induced coils.


Now look at another image based on the same type of arrangement, two pole rotor, just sweeping two coils in series (simplicity is beautiful!!) which give us the rotor angles positioning at right, plus the sinewave timed for each angle below:



Note at 90º and 270º are peak sinewave values, and that takes place when rotor is fully aligned with both coils in a straight line.

Now, it is understood that North giving positive and South Negative peaks respectively, is only due to the direction of our induced coils windings...so, this is completely relative.

The main point here is to compare this angles for peak sine again my previous 3K Generator...where the only difference is that four (4) coils are overlapped at each side just like I show below:

[IMG][/IMG]

Which may look complicated like that, but it is nothing more than "spreading a single coil over Space/Time"...so look at image below:

[IMG][/IMG]

Where I have numbered each coil (L1,L2,L3 etc,etc), exactly as prior image.

The Sine graphic for the sweep of this kind of overlapped wiring would just vary because the peak time would be extended through time, due to the adjacent overlapped coils.

Hope all this graphics help you to see it clearly. And responds your question.


Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Two Different type of Generating Coil Winding...

Hello again,

Ok, in order to define the two main winding types on generating coils we may find in a typical two pole rotor generator:

We Start from the original single coil winding which is:

[IMG][/IMG]

And note I have numbered each loop as L1, L2, L3, L4 on one side and L5, L6, L7, L8 on the other across at 180º, which are represented by just one turn, but understand this is for simplicity in the CAD as in reality it consist of several turns per each loop.

Now we have:

1- Generating Coils Overlapped through Space/Time, which is based on my previous graphics on the 3K Gen.:

[IMG][/IMG]

Where Loops are overlapped by jumping just one core element and following the same overlapping direction for both opposite groups.

So we have the following time sequences for half rotor spin inducing coils pairs:

L1 and L5 are across by 180º at Time 1 (L1-L5=T1)
L2 and L6 are across by 180º at Time 2 (L2-L6=T2)
L3 and L7 are across by 180º at Time 3 (L3-L7=T3)
L4 and L8 are across by 180º at Time 4 (L4-L8=T4)

After above sequence Rotor starts sweeping same Coils routine per time but, with the opposite polarization from rotor.


And like I wrote before, this type of winding give us a longer duration peak, spreading through time sine wave. Realizing it will also give us a prolongation of Lenz Forces as we step rotor advancing.

Then we have:

2- Single Coil spread in Space Only:

[IMG][/IMG]

Note here a single Peak would be obtained within a single Time period.

This would be a single peak, but much stronger than a single peak from previous drawing at a paused timing (say T1).

Note the Coils here are spread Only through Ferromagnetic Core Space

It would be a one time peak, but stronger in magnitude (higher peak) as it is the sum from all previous overlapped ones considering the same number of turns and same gauge wire would be used. The same way, we would also have a higher impact Lenz reversed force per one time when entering or leaving the peak sine timing at loaded generator.

Hope you all understand this posts so I can move to next and more advanced stages...


Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Wrong Symbols could feed wrong info...

Hello again,

While I was looking for images on this matter, I found a few which state this kind of symbols for the generating coils...:

FIG 1 :WRONG SYMBOL POSITIONING OF STATOR (RELATED TO ROTOR) CREATES CONFUSION:

[IMG][/IMG]

Note that above static coils symbols are different in positioning from the ones seen previously like:

FIG 2 :RIGHT SYMBOLS POSITIONING OF STATOR COILS (RELATED TO ROTOR) AS THEY ARE IN REALITY:

[IMG][/IMG]

And that could create big time confusion, since we may think coils are not straight and aligned with rotor...but side ways.

And this is the completely wrong interpretation!

Just because of a symbol positioning in a drawing...


Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Another way to look at it ...

Hello again,

This is another way to graphic the way Induction takes place from the Load and Current direction disbursed per Rotor Cycle...:

[IMG][/IMG]

Note that the times there is (exist) current at load, regardless of flowing directions, is when rotor coil (Magnetic Field Bisector or Center Axis) is fully aligned with Generator Field Coils. Or, whenever Sinewave is at its Top Peak Values.

The same exact way works for DC Induction Generators:

[IMG][/IMG]

Except that Current Direction is the same for both aligned rotor coils positions related to the stators N to S B Field Vector.

Taken from:

Lesson in Electric Circuits Vol II


Regards


Ufopolitics

[bistander]

Sinewaves vs rotor position

Hi Ufo,

Thanks for taking the time to search for references. As you suspect, I do it a lot. And on this particular subject I find a tremendous number of incorrect diagrams. I think this is due to these diagrams and tutorials being authored and edited by non-experts and simple explanatory diagrams being considered good enough for the casual reader and correct detail not being necessary.

There is a conceptual difference between how I view magnetic circuit and the way you do. Essentially connecting lines of flux vs spiraling corkscrews. Even though you apparently consider me an avid subscriber of convention on magnetic theory, one place I do deviate is with coil turns. I consider the conductor, not so much the turn, as most do. I think "turns per coil" misleads many.

So back to the discussion at hand:

Hello Bistander,

Ok, let's take a look at simple Images I just picked from a simple search about Sinewave Vs Rotor Turn Position for two pole rotor...:

[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

In both simple images above (from different sources) the only two induced coils are connected in series, and basically, rotor has been paused every 90º...1,2,3,4 and A,B,C,D respectively.

Notice that 2,4 as B,D are Peak Sines, whether positive or negative, then notice in All those stages the rotor is fully engaged-aligned to the induced coils.


Now look at another image based on the same type of arrangement, two pole rotor, just sweeping two coils in series (simplicity is beautiful!!) which give us the rotor angles positioning at right, plus the sinewave timed for each angle below:



Note at 90º and 270º are peak sinewave values, and that takes place when rotor is fully aligned with both coils in a straight line.

Now, it is understood that North giving positive and South Negative peaks respectively, is only due to the direction of our induced coils windings...so, this is completely relative.

The main point here is to compare this angles for peak sine again my previous 3K Generator...where the only difference is that four (4) coils are overlapped at each side just like I show below:

[IMG][/IMG]

Which may look complicated like that, but it is nothing more than "spreading a single coil over Space/Time"...so look at image below:

[IMG][/IMG]

Where I have numbered each coil (L1,L2,L3 etc,etc), exactly as prior image.

The Sine graphic for the sweep of this kind of overlapped wiring would just vary because the peak time would be extended through time, due to the adjacent overlapped coils.

Hope all this graphics help you to see it clearly. And responds your question.


Regards


Ufopolitics

I contend all of the above is off by 90°. Here are several references which support my side:





Ref: DIRECT CURRENT GENERATORS







Ref: http://www.uq.edu.au/_School_Science....html#32.5.6.2

So I'm saying you're 90° off with your interpretation. It's probably no big deal, unless you're designing a generator or motor. It sould be somewhat easy to test, but realize it is unlikely to produce a signal resembling a sinewave unless you use that commercial generator you have. And then realize that the magnetic axis (S to N) is at 90° to the centerline shown in the nice image below.



Regards,

bi

[Ufopolitics]

Two Simple Diagrams...not mine.

Hi Ufo,

Thanks for taking the time to search for references. As you suspect, I do it a lot. And on this particular subject I find a tremendous number of incorrect diagrams. I think this is due to these diagrams and tutorials being authored and edited by non-experts and simple explanatory diagrams being considered good enough for the casual reader and correct detail not being necessary.

Hello Bistander,

In your above words I agree in a 100%, and basically that is the main reason why about this particular conflict that exactly set us apart by 90º difference.

And am not saying it is just "you and me" here...I wish so...It is a Global Misunderstanding...

Let me explain...

Normally it is said that "A Motor is just a Generator, as a Generator is also a Motor" ...and am pretty sure you have heard of such affirmation...Well, I believe for people who do not understand fully both kind of machines, this statement could really bring some confusion.

Now, let's analyze an AC Two Pole Rotor and Two Stators...As Motor AC Feed...:

[IMG][/IMG]

Image taken from:POLYPHASE MOTOR DESIGN

(And please, take a good look at that site, and tell me the Author(s) are not "trained" or don't have the experience enough as to post the wrong images and wrong definitions-explanations...please do!)

Now this is exactly the same arrangement as the AC Generator, except that there is no "load" at the end terminals but an AC Sinewave Symbol, meaning, we are feeding it with AC for Motor Operation.

If You note, the times when the rotor is fully aligned with stators coils, that is the time when Stators are Not receiving Current, other words, zero sinewave values (the author does not show arrows with letter "I") for Intensity or Current (same deal). Meaning Motor can Not receive any current when aligned with stators or motor would definitively be locked up.

AC Motor can only receive the peak sinewave (current feed) when it is Not Aligned with Stators, as shown in Steps#1 and Step#3

And this principle is applicable to almost every single motor in the world...even commutator DC Motors, or Brushless DC Two Phase or Single Phase...I mean all...they must be timed to turn on Armature coils whenever they are Off Dead Center to Stators. Or they will -for sure- lock up.

Now, let's use the same, exact Set Up from above, but applying it to an AC Generator (same image I posted previously):

[IMG][/IMG]

Image taken from: BASIC AC THEORY

So, here we are just turning the rotor mechanically by a prime mover, meaning, using it as a Generator (note is written "Load" at the end terminals from stators).

And it is understood that A Motor could be a Generator as well, but, it is quite obvious its functions would be Opposite to each other applications.

Therefore, here takes place, exactly the opposite...Induced Current is Generated when Stator Coils and Rotor are fully aligned. While whenever is Off Stators absolutely no current is generated.

And this is exactly the known issue with Motors being slowed down by the "Generator Effect"...and yes, this effect takes place exactly when stators are aligned with rotor poles for all kind of motors...not after, not before.

There is a conceptual difference between how I view magnetic circuit and the way you do. Essentially connecting lines of flux vs spiraling corkscrews. Even though you apparently consider me an avid subscriber of convention on magnetic theory...

Oh, I am quite aware of such differences...and believe me...I feel sorry for you...





















Just kidding!!

...one place I do deviate is with coil turns. I consider the conductor, not so much the turn, as most do. I think "turns per coil" misleads many.

Regards,

bi

There is absolutely no way, any motor or generator would work at all if only would have a "conductor" and not several Turns of coil windings...

So, definitively, I do consider number of turns, gauge, etc, at the time to evaluate any Electrodynamic Machine.


Regards


Ufopolitics


EDIT 1: And finally Bistander, make sure all those images you are searching for and posting here...come from a good source, basically I always make sure that Author(s) are the ones writing as posting images...whenever you go to this huge sites servers for education (edu), must have in mind, like you wrote before...that many not knowledgeable people are the ones in charge to edit and post images...so errors are galore.

[bistander]

Qualifications

Image taken from:POLYPHASE MOTOR DESIGN

(And please, take a good look at that site, and tell me the Author(s) are not "trained" or don't have the experience enough as to post the wrong images and wrong definitions-explanations...please do!)

OK Ufo,

I'd say not too strong of a background or credentials in electric machinery or magnetic theory. Author is an instructor at a technical college specializing in instrumentation and controls. He says on LinkedIn: Specialties: Technical writing, technical instruction, electronic circuit design (including PCB layout), computer programming (C mostly), technical drawing, welding (gas and arc), machine maintenance, basic machine tool operation (metal lathe mostly), curriculum development, public speaking.

With a 2 year degree (ATT) from Skagit Valley College and some time at Perry Technical institute, I'd say his formal education is weak. He may be a fine technician and instructor, but I see nothing (in a quick search) which would qualify him as an expert in magnetic circuits or electric machinery.

bi

[bistander]

Credentials

EDIT 1: And finally Bistander, make sure all those images you are searching for and posting here...come from a good source, basically I always make sure that Author(s) are the ones writing as posting images...whenever you go to this huge sites servers for education (edu), must have in mind, like you wrote before...that many not knowledgeable people are the ones in charge to edit and post images...so errors are galore.

Hi Ufo,

I usually do not check out the credentials or the references where I gather illustrations. I mostly use the images to show what I'm talking about because, unlike you, I am unable to draw to wonderful diagrams on the computer. I do attempt to include the source of the images which I barrow so the reader can see for themselves the original context and investigate further.

Regards,

bi

[Ufopolitics]

Bistander,

Take a look at this image...:

[IMG][/IMG]

It reads:

Fig. 1.20 Schematic cross section of a synchronous machine with a cylindrical round-rotor (turbogenerator). This is the typical design for all large turbogenerators. Here both the stator and rotor windings are installed in slots, distributed around the periphery of the machine. The lower part shows the resulting waveforms of a pair of conductors, and that of a distributed winding. The formula giving the magneto-motive force (mmf) created by the windings.


Note that Magnetic Axis -at bottom Figure- is exactly where sinewave center peak is, as well as the Two Conductors Dead Center which configures the loop.

Image above from P 19 of this pdf:PRINCIPLES AND OPERATION OF SYNCHRONOUS MACHINES

Read the references at the last page...and consider if it is worth believing it or not.





Thanks


Ufopolitics