Don't attempt this radiant energy experiment.

[Sputins]

Mmm, I started out on that post because I wanted to say something. Then in the excitement of writing I forgot what I wanted to say.... And now I remember again....

There is (is there) a chance that, just like my TRD a geigen müller tube responds to a number of different things.
A geigen müller tube is basically a vacuum tube in which a gas gets excited by high energy radiation. But we know that a luminous tube lights up in the vicinity of a Tesla coil because the low pressure gas inside gets excited. That looks very similar to me, so could it be that a geigen müller tube also responds in the vicinity of a Tesla coil?

The experiment shown in the video at 1:45 (or thereabout) does actually indicate that this may not be the case. Alpha radiation will probably not reach the tube over that distance, beta radiation would have been blocked by the aluminium, so that leaves EM radiation or particle radiation (of a not yet recognized type).
EM radiation comes in 3 types of which only 1 (transverse EM radiation) is recognized. Tesla mentions particles of some type that travel faster than light, which are obviously also not recognized. So this alone gives you 3 alternatives besides the possibly dangerous TEM radiation.

So, if these radiations are TEM, could these be harmful?
Looking up the BD10A Tesla coil, we learn that it produces 10,000 to 50,000 V @ 500 kHz.
That is less than 1/3 of the voltage in a dentist x-ray machine (150 KV).
Since the energy of the radiation is reason for it being harmful to living tissue and this energy depends on the voltage, I would think that the experiment in this video does not pose any threat to anyone. Or at least not through TEM radiation.

In my experiment with Tesla's single terminal vacuum tube (high vacuum, described in his patents 685,957 and 685,958) at roughly 1.2 MV I have until now not found much evidence of TEM radiation. There could be some, but certainly not much.

I am not saying that everyone should now ignore pomodoro's advice. One should always use as much common sense as one has available, and in may cases more.


Ernst.

I agree here entirely Ernst.

Yes, it is true. RF can send a Geiger counter mad. I know that for a fact.
A friend of mine experienced this first-hand. He was experimenting with Blacklight devices and found his Geiger counter went crazy around RF. It is a design flaw around many common Geiger counter circuits.

My friend (An electronics guru) re-designed and produced a Geiger counter specifically for use around RF fields where the RF would not interfere or produce a false positive with RF. I believe he even has these as kits for sale or the boards at least.

Also the video does not give a value of the X-Ray radiation reading that is being claimed. What is the count? What level?

By the way I am a current holder: “License to Use or Handle Radioactive Substances”; “Licence to Operate An Ionising Radiation Apparatus” and also a Radiation Safety Officer.

So I'd have no issues reproducing this experiment.

[pomodoro]

Gents

Here is my latest video and last test of the setup. In this video Pb only is shown to block the rays.

I hope many of you will replicate this cheap experiment, especially if you already have a quality Geiger counter.

For replicating please use a new 'vintage' bulb. High vacuum electron tubes are useless as a small amount of residual gas is required. This is extremely important. You must use the vacuum bulbs exclusively.

The long ones as Dollard and I both used are best. The prettier bulbous ones were not as strong.

The Geiger counter needs to be of good quality with all metal construction and not some of the digital ebay toys. You may need to put the plastic ones in a metal box.

Be sure to obtain a strong pulling affect on the foil and keep the KVs at maximum.

Keep Geiger close enough for a good reading from the vintage bulb but with absolutely no signal when discharging through any type of normal fluoro or incandescent bulb. You should find that sparking the wire to the foil will also give no signal.

The video is intended to show that Xrays are present. A proper licensed Xray authority should be contacted for definitive readings.





VIDEO LINK https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Als9E0lntec

[thx1138]

Another good video. Thanks.

If I remember correctly, some of the Bedini builds used thoriated (Thorium treated) welding rods as coil cores. It might be advisable to see if they are putting out any radiation while running.

[Ernst]

Would these do, for the experiment that we should not do?

I should have asked before I ordered them, but they make a nice ornament if I can not use them .

I will also try the Tesla design tube (single aluminium half spherical electrode) at low pressures instead of high vacuum. Funny actually, that this thread was opened just when I started on my vacuum tube tests.

If you can get lead such as they use for roofs (sheets of 1 mm thick), then you can test how many sheets you need to stop the radiation, or to reduce it to half the original strength. That will give you some information on the energy of these rays.

I think your conclusions, based on the current understanding, are quite good. There is just one strange thing about this experiment and its results.
Let's say that the filament is at a 50KV level compared to the outside of the bulb. That means that electrons can reach a maximum energy of 50 KeV. That is not much.
In a röntgen tube electrons with energies of 150+ KeV are thrown on a high density target (often tungsten), so to slow them down as quickly as possible producing the most "bremsstrahlung". Not only is the energy less in your case, also the target (glass) has a much lower density.
If "the current understanding" is correct you can at best produce some very soft x-rays, maybe even just outside the UV-range. I'll have to read up on how to calculate this because this is all too long ago for me...

It will take some time before I get the tubes, but I can evacuate a Tesla tube to a few microns and see what it does.

Thanks for sharing the "forbidden experiment" . Once I have results worth mentioning, I'll post a video.


Ernst.

[Michelinho]

Hi thx1138,

I've seen the rumors of a station built in Canada but no photographs or legal documents proving it existed. I think most of that story came from Matthews as well.

The Tower was built in Ste Flavie if memory serves me well and my partner visited the site and like in Long Island, only the cement slab remains.

Take care,

Michel

[pomodoro]

Ernst those bulbs will all give some Xrays. I have tested the round one and
although less powerful it still gave a reading. The only other one I have tried is the long one, which was the best out of the two. It could also have to do with the degree of vacuum in them.
Which shape did you get?

In my powder Xray diffractometer I use a maximum of 35KV. Below 20KV I don't get enough Xrays, so 50kV should be enough.

You can also try powering the bulb with mains and putting the tesla on the glass bulb, perhaps with an Al foil cap. I'd assume you need a high current tesla coil to keep the 50kV across the bulb then as the resistance in the tube would be quite low , but who knows? I won't try it as I've been exposed enough.



As a final test to remove all doubts I irradiated a radiation badge for 45 seconds two feet away from the tube, which would be about the dosage I copped.

I will know in a week or two what those results are.

and happy replicating.

[Ernst]

Here some pics taken during the evacuation of the Tesla tube.
Quite decorative.
The coil produces about 10 KV at 374 KHz, only 1/5 of the BD10A coil, and at none of these stages I can detect x-rays, and neither is aluminium foil attracted (maybe just a little bit when the "milky white light" appears)

I do not have a 50 KV coil handy here...

With a high vacuum tube there is an eerie pale blue-greenish light which is difficult to photograph, a small attraction to the alu-foil and no definite signs of x-rays (my GM counter is in the post).


Ernst.

[pomodoro]

Hi Ernst, you need to reach the stage where no streamers are visible. Forget any condition where sparks,arcs or glow discharges occur.

The device I have is essentially a HF spark tester, used to determine how much vacuum is present in a glass structure.

The green fluorescence on the glass is a good indication. Electrons are slamming against the glass causing it to fluoresce green.

Unfortunately, the 10kV is much too low for any descent Xrays.

[Ernst]

Hi thx1138,

The Tower was built in Ste Flavie if memory serves me well and my partner visited the site and like in Long Island, only the cement slab remains.

Take care,

Michel

The story as I heard it is that during a holiday to Canada, Tesla built this second Wardenclyffe.
First, knowing Tesla's passion for completing this project, it strikes me as unbelievable that Tesla makes no mention of this anywhere. Nor does he seem to try to provide his proof through the second tower.
Second, the phrase "during a holiday" sounds as if during a rainy Saturday afternoon he didn't have anything to do and so he build a second Wardenclyffe tower. Is that believable to anyone?
Third, there is no historical evidence (newspapers etc.). (if there is, please provide a link! I would be very interested!)
Think of how much time would be involved and how many people. And think of articles like this one. Think of the money involved, where did he get that? why didn't he use it to complete the first tower?

The cement slab your partner saw could be from anything....

The story appears very unlikely to me.....
Make that "extremely unlikely".

Ernst.

[thx1138]

The story as I heard it is that during a holiday to Canada, Tesla built this second Wardenclyffe.
First, knowing Tesla's passion for completing this project, it strikes me as unbelievable that Tesla makes no mention of this anywhere. Nor does he seem to try to provide his proof through the second tower.
Second, the phrase "during a holiday" sounds as if during a rainy Saturday afternoon he didn't have anything to do and so he build a second Wardenclyffe tower. Is that believable to anyone?
Third, there is no historical evidence (newspapers etc.). (if there is, please provide a link! I would be very interested!)
Think of how much time would be involved and how many people. And think of articles like this one. Think of the money involved, where did he get that? why didn't he use it to complete the first tower?

The cement slab your partner saw could be from anything....

The story appears very unlikely to me.....
Make that "extremely unlikely".

Ernst.

I think the conjecture about the Canadian Wardenclyffe-like transmitter probably comes from Arthur Matthews who has no credibility.

I was interested about what he said about Tesla's car in the following article but his statements just don't make sense. One statement is "Another one of his great inventions was the electric car. He built the first one in 1897 and he drove from New York City to Buffalo, New York and it had an average speed of 94 miles an hour."

First the roads of the day wouldn't allow that kind of speed and everything else I've read about it said it was a 1931 Pierce Arrow which would have been rather hard to come by in 1897. I don't think anyone would want to do 94 MPH in any of the 1897 automobiles.
1897 automobiles

And what Matthews states about the Canadian Wardenclyffe-like installation has the same tone of just whipping one together. And there's no explanation of the power source. We have to remember that Wardenclyffe used a steam powered generator as the source of the power to transmit.

The first part at the following link is Matthews talking about he and Tesla building a transmitter in Canada.
Arthur Mathews about Tesla

THE WALL OF LIGHT - NIKOLA TESLA AND THE VENUSIAN SPACE SHIP

Google search "arthur matthews nikola tesla"

It looks like Arthur Matthews might have been the first scammer to make a buck off Nikola Tesla's name.

[Ernst]

I have looked into this Arthur and my conclusion is that he is a joke.
Even more so than G. Vassilatos.

Arthur mentions:
a colour tv, a voice operated typewriter, a translator device for any language....
After reading that, the tears in my eyes prevented me from reading more of his BS.

Tears of laughter, tears of pain, I don't know, my mind went blank.


Ernst.

[j dove]

Ernst ,

I have myself done this experiment and no Tesla coil is needed to accomplish it .
I used a hair pin circuit with my own home made HV capacitors . I used a old microwave oven bulb as they seem to work the best but even an regular incandescent bulb will work but not as strong a reaction .
The metals I used to experiment with were al , cu ,ar ,pb,
Fe . All were attracted to the bulb and remained so even after it was shut off for up to 10 seconds . All metals were grounded so to alleviate any static attraction .

I used 10kv a.c. as a power source and detected no radiation .

Maybe if higher levels of power are used it my well be as stated , but the experiment can be reproduced at safe levels . I believe Mr. Dollard knows what he is doing and since neither he or I were present we can not comment .
If anyone feels unsafe in this experiment then don't do it .
Yes all precaution should be taken to be safe , but in all fairness was only his reproduction of the experiment he can speak for and give valid claims to . Most certainly not mine ,and mine were done several years ago as were Mr. Dollards with no present or lasting effects .

As to the production of artificial radiation by Mr. Tessa
I believe that he did accomplish this . You need only look at the work of Mr. Lebonn to see how it's done . Also the work of another French physicist who's name escapes me at the moment . I believe he also used carbon rods in his experiments , much like the gray tube has a carbon resistor and was said to give off beta radiation .
Anyway all interesting stuff , be safe but don't stop experiments because of some radiation . Shield it and continue .

Best to all,

Jeff

[pomodoro]

The monitor resuts are back!

And I have to eat my words.

The badge received zero uSv of photon energy.

I'm still confused, but it looks like no Xrays are produced.

I'll have another look at this one day, but hopefully someone else can do some further investigations with faraday cages and the like.

[Ernst]

Thanks for the update!

I think that only makes it more interesting!


Ernst.

[RAMSET]

Thanks for the report !

I think you initial words of caution were very important for experimenters
to read. X Rays or similar need safe protocols in place ...so Ernst can play
with them ...

thank you very much for sharing !

Chet