Splitting The Positive

[BroMikey]

What BroMikey is doing now falls more under his motor/generator thread

If you HAVE a modified razor scooter motor........

the battery rotating circuit

a generator that will speed up under load, you have it all.

Peter Lindemann gave it ALL away at the last conference, and then sold a video that shows it ............

Hello Turion-Man

I quite agree about how the pathway has been paved by our leading
inventors and that people must be in denial about the idea presented.
I will say that some of the younger guys are no doubt already doing
this. This is because that the younger men have all of the energy.

While the guys on the groups never seem to do anything but draw
pictures others are building still some do both. Yours truly.

In your above statement the part where the generator section speeds
up under load reaches out and grabs me. I mean here we are
presented with a modified motor that already can be producing excess
under the right conditions then to think the wasted mechanical in this
setting could actually assist rotor action and further reverse any drag
giving extra again then the additional generator coils as many as you
can possibly mount will not only add huge amounts of power to the
COP but continue to assist rotor action to a potential run away
status.

These systems will dominate the future of renewable energy. No wind or
sun needed. I have been studying "ACCELERATING UNDER LOAD" coils
as per THANE HEINS. As you have already stated that you can and have
used many size wire/length coils where you were able to cause an
acceleration under a load if the critical freq is reached. As Thane Heins
puts it "THE CRITICAL MINIMUM FREQUENCY" which is another way of
saying that at a certain frequency and above, will cause the assistance
to the rotor we are looking for.

So far many inventors have attempted to explain this assisted rotor
phenomena with each one stating they are not sure if their expressions
best describe what might truly be happening, leaving the door open to
welcomed speculation by those qualified to make these advanced
judgements.

According to THANE our motor technology of 100 years old requires
every motor to run against it's own will to do so. In other words the
incoming north or south pole is always resisting the approach at the
rotor pole and also wants the magnet pole to stay TDC once it is
there. Anyone who understands that will understand the rest.

We want a delay in the coils response to the approaching pole.

[BroMikey]

Update rotor details

Let me start by saying that all repeats are good to help me focus
even better on this machine. Hats off to the makers of the build.

Now let's make sure everyone clearly understands that what you see here
is information derived from many men and has nothing to do with me as far
as me creating all of these builds.

On to what I have always wanted to know. Not all questions are listed with only a few answers.

1) How much does the modified motor draw?

2) How much can I recover of the running current?

3) How much does the mod motor draw with rotor?

4) How much does the mod motor draw with rotor and magnets?

5) How much does the mod motor draw with rotor, magnets and cores

6) How much does the mod motor draw with rotor, magnets, cores/coils?

7) How much does the mod motor draw with rotor, magnets, cores/coils
in shorted position?

8) How much does the mod motor draw with rotor, magnets, cores/coils
in generator position?

9) How much does the mod motor draw with rotor, magnets, cores/coils
in generator position while speeding up under a load?

10) How much generator current is produced from a single core in normal
generator mode without the condition of acceleration under load.

11) How much current increase to the prime mover (MOD MOTOR) during
normal generator mode?

12) How much current reduction will occur for the MOD MOTOR when
the acceleration under load condition is reached?

13) How many regular generator coils can be added to the rotor at how
much increased power draw to the prime mover?

So far I have a few answers. To me these answers are what it is all
about. Without these questions and many more being answered the path
to improved design is not part of the research.

Questions like, 14) when a generator coil is constructed to produce
acceleration of the prime mover does current recovery surpass friction
and boost circuit losses?

My rotor magnet mounts are all placed around the rotor with some filing left
to do. The rotor weights 3 pounds approx and takes extra power to get it
up to speed. Without the rotor the current draw is 1 amp at 12vdc.

With the flywheel rotor the current draw on start up starts at 5 amps
for 1 second and each second drops 2 amps til a 1.3amp running current
is realized. Perfectly balanced, zero vibration over 1000 RPM's (Not sure yet)

My next set of tests will be to see how much current increase with occur
to the prime mover with a single Ferite core positioned 1/4" from the rotor's
20 magnets. No magnets have been installed so far

Since all magnets have cogging when iron comes into close
proximity a record of the increase should be noted.

Hypothetically if the Ferrite cogging increases draw to the prime mover
100ma can a wound ferrite core offer 100ma to replace the loss?






[VIDEO]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttZEttQn00A[/VIDEO]

[BroMikey]

Hello TURION

Good to see you are still alive and kicking after all you have faced here
recently. Looks like you even went on vacation. Not a bad turn
around, not bad.

I will keep in mind that the core material plays a big roll in how much
current I can drag in. I will be happy to see the break even point after
the initial recovery of the bulk of the watts running in the prime mover.

I have not calculated anything. I have a disk (metal rotor) that is 10"
diameter than selecting thru trial and error the proper even displacement
of a randomly chosen magnet group. Just a collection on hand of what is
available to me. No graphic plot, no real rhyme or reason for dia. of magnets.


I'll continue in the next post

[BroMikey]

A shot in the dark as the old saying goes.

The "C" core arrangement may increase the frequency and based on coil
calculations an individual setup might require this as an enhancement. My
first coil plan (Another guess) will use bifilar so I can play with 2 different
lengths at the same speed. A further confirmation that I am headed in the
right direction for wire size and length might be seen when switching back
and forth from a short length of wire of low impedance to double that.

Here is what I do know.

Standard coils are low impedance on a pump motor for a washing machine
use a "C" core shape with 24awg at 130feet of wire on BOTH SIDES. Now
looking at the standard engineering models I have my starting point.

There are many values of Ferite ranging from HF to LF and the LOW FREQ
Ferite can directly replace the 150 year old iron bars using all standard
engineering numbers. This is why Ferite blocks are not as easy to tailor
in research as compared to the PERMALLOY tape counterpart.

What you are saying is that I should not select a ferite core that is such
a high frequency that will starve my current draw at low frequencies.

Thanks again and this has been on my mind since my ferite is out of a
flyback transformer. Maybe some welding rods or blacksand or who knows.

[BroMikey]

That's Alright Anyway Do it.

Hello Mr Dave

That is quite alright because I wouldn't be able to do exactly like you
anyway. I do appreciate your kind regard for suggesting you guys would
lend a hand, after I asked a million questions with no answers.

I didn't want to rub in the fact that nobody has all the answers.

Now, all seriousness set aside (Like Peter says) I would like to say
again that there are many who have done low lenz generators all over
the web including John B. The biggy is getting the scooter motor re-wired
to where she does what it is suppose to. After that hurdle we are left
with an easier task, making generator sections sized for the optimum
capacity of the MY1016.

The brushes are good for 10 amps but 5 amps would last much longer
not to mention all the heat ramming 10amps down a tiny wire.
The 20awg I am using fits great at 100 turns on my scooter core, by
my chinny chin chin. Just big enough.

At 12vdc it runs at 1 amp

At 14.75vdc it runs 1.4amps

This data is for running naked, no rotor.

As I progress I will share my findings, I am in not hurry. My rotor is coming
along great and does free wheel at 12vdc around 1.3amps. So we can see
that 300ma must be recovered to break even but when the core goes no
this 300ma figure might be 400ma, I don't know. I don't know anyone who
do research like I do.

In other words there is no thorough systematic data one step at a time
that shows the increase that the rotor plus cogging will develop so the
math can be done.

What needs to be done is to get enough back with 1 coil because 10 coils
that are dragging down the system will only make it worse. 1 coil that
produces acceleration to the rotor however slight while collecting generator
coil power (The amount is not important) at the same time.

It is the principle of the thing my dear boy wattson
AN OLD ENGLISH ADAGE

I am sure you would be the first to agree. We sure have been blessed
with plenty of others research to work with like Tesla and people who
are making extended core lengths to use as a delay. Or we could look at
THANE'S work.

Tinned wire over copper gives a skin effect, high frequency diodes,
switched recovery for coils are down the road. I have not even figured
out what the current draw jumps to under cogging at many different
gaps. 1/16" - 1/4"

This has been my question for 2 years and no one I have ever watched
on youtube has ever addressed these basic steps for low lenz generator
research. And I have watched 100's upon 100's.

Here is what SHOULD be shown. This message is for the group coming.

1) How much current does the mod motor draw all by itself

2) How much does it draw with a rotor pushing magnets and coils?

3) How much does it draw in open circuit connection (Idling)

4) How much does it draw generating?

Not the gen coils, I am talking about the prime mover.

How much? How much does cogging cost me?

[BroMikey]

Let me also add what I have been working on. I bought three tiny
hall switch circuits with amp built into the board all about the size of your
thumb. I am mounting a 3" ring off the hub so I may put a magnet on it.
It is important to get good readings for rpm's.

Handhelds are fine for some so bring a large supply of batteries, not me
I want it to run all of the time. Without that any research done is only
a pretty good guess. Got to set up things to be good accuracy. These
cheap-O meters drift 10-20 rpm's while your hand moves.

I'll be showing off coming up.

[RAMSET]

Cyril's Musings [member Smudge

Dave
Investigating the proper core material for replications would be a good idea
here Cyril has started some musings in this area ,and apparently the results are starting to show promise .

Magnetic Compression Study" by Cyril Smith
see also here
The Musings of Smudge [Cyril Smith

respectfully

Chet K

[BroMikey]

Matt's first prototype was only four magnets on
the rotor and two coils. He used a stock motor with a timer to pulse it and
his output was more than double the input, plus it sped up under load.
That was the basic machine I replicated, and we realized that the
rewound razor scooter motor would take us to where we wanted to go.

My frustration is that this is absolutely the answer everyone on these
forums has been looking for, yet how many of us are actually building
these simple devices? It just kills me.

Dave

Wow that's right I almost forget that. This encourages me when I think
of how simple that experiment was. Let us remember the starting point
of one another's hard work.

You must remember that 1000's never speak and some are finding this
message just now and repeating the very same thing. If no one talks the
old messages will often lay dormant and people will begin to ignore the
data thinking is must have been superseded or irrelevant.

That is just the way it is, the squeaky wheel always gets the grease.

Your entry has made me realize that my 20 pole rotor could offer
an increase about the early findings. Since we have the easy build
prime mover modified scooter motor we have the advantage over those
experiments that lead to it.

As you have stated before many variables enter into the math. Such as
the core material data. The reason Thane used Permalloy instead
of Ferite is not because one has a different content than the other. The
big reason is vibration although when you think about the film sheeting
(as expensive as it is) being cut into perfectly formed shapes to match
the geometry of a rotor we might laminate 2 or more perm numbers into the
same core. So this add flexibility to alter core effects. But that is for
another day.

All we need is the Mod Motor to start and people who know their batteries
will be shocked at the new revelation when the special motor runs between
positive terminals for free.

I have the parts to make the treadmill motor do that very same thing, we
will see. Now these patents you have quoted and men who lived in the
early 1900's have shown that something special happens when sparking
brushes made of graphite switch coils very abruptly.

We have our foot in the door. Let's proceed. You know me I can ramble
on for long periods at times exploring my need to experiment to get those
answers I have always wanted. Just thinking out loud. Some one could
try the bucking coils or maybe you already have.

It's good to see you back strong.

[BroMikey]

Dave
Investigating the proper core material for replications would be a good idea
here Cyril has started some musings in this area ,and apparently the results are starting to show promise .

Magnetic Compression Study" by Cyril Smith
see also here
The Musings of Smudge [Cyril Smith

respectfully

Chet K

Hey Chet

how the hell are ya? I am an open door for your posted info.
And to anyone else, especially those who can verify any of this by
personal experiment as some of our fearless leaders have. Thanks Guys. I'll always be there to give you a good rap on the back for all of your
blood sweat and tears.

That is where we all thrive. I guess it's my turn now.

[RAMSET]

@Bro
Always looking to add to the "collective" understanding...
@Dave
I suppose the best path towards one hundred replications ,is one very clear
and well explained experiment which shows an anomaly which science has no explanation for ?

focusing in on the place where energy could be interring a system and making it repeatable on anyone's bench ... I believe this is the purpose of Smudges Musings and his ultimate goal, [ as well as the open source engineers who assist him.



respectfully
Chet K

[BroMikey]

I found a boost converter that does not seem to use large capacitors
If has a 96% conversion efficiency and this may not be enough.

It can be clearly seen that no large capacitors are required to operate
this board but I do not know what other obstacles are present for using
this board with the 3 battery gen.

The peak efficiency figure of 96% is reached at 40% of the circuits
maximum capacity. 250w X .4 = 100w ceiling

http://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-DC-boost-converter-Constant-Current-Mobile-Power-supply-250W-10A-LED-Driver-/181940997254?hash=item2a5c874c86:g:ZlsAAOSwxN5WVAX J





Module name :250W boost constant current module


Module properties: non-isolated step-up module (BOOST)


Input voltage: DC8.5V-48V


Input current: 10A (MAX) exceeds 8A please enhance heat dissipation


Quiescent current: 10mA (12V liter 20V, the output voltage, the higher
the current will increase too quiet)


Output voltage: 10-50V continuously adjustable


Constant] range: 0.2-8A


Temperature: -40 to + 85 degrees (ambient temperature is too high, please enhance heat dissipation)


Operating frequency: 150KHz


Conversion efficiency: up to 96%


Overcurrent protection: There


Input reverse polarity protection: Yes,


Installation: 4 3mm screw holes


Connection method: Connection Output


Module size: Length 70mm width 36mm height 13mm


Single module: 50 g



Applications:


1, DIY a power supply, 12V can input and output can 12-50V adjustable.


2, the power supply for your electronic device, according to your
system can set the output voltage value.


3, as the car power supply for your laptop, PDA or a variety of digital
products supply.


4, DIY a mobile notebook power supply: 12V coupled with high-capacity
lithium battery pack, so you can go where light where books.


5, solar panel regulator.


6, to the battery, rechargeable lithium batteries.


7, driving high-power LED lights.

[desa]

Hi Bro.
I am interested in hall sensor for RPM detection, could you please post info wher to get it. Thanks to your info and encouragement I replicated Matts motor and getting same results as you. I posted it on the Basic Energy Device forum. I am presently finishing generator and would post results soon.
David.

Let me also add what I have been working on. I bought three tiny
hall switch circuits with amp built into the board all about the size of your
thumb. I am mounting a 3" ring off the hub so I may put a magnet on it.
It is important to get good readings for rpm's.

Handhelds are fine for some so bring a large supply of batteries, not me
I want it to run all of the time. Without that any research done is only
a pretty good guess. Got to set up things to be good accuracy. These
cheap-O meters drift 10-20 rpm's while your hand moves.

I'll be showing off coming up.

[BroMikey]

...................
Okay I want to share with you my slow progress but progress
never the less. This rotor has 24 cylindrical shaped neo 42's
press fitted to the sleeve and nut combination for saftey
as well as using this arrangement to adjust generator core
tolerances.

It is so heavy now after getting all 24 installed that it has become
impossible to mount it directly onto the modified scooter motor.

I have need of larger bearings for a bigger shaft.

I will take some pictures at a later time. The drawing shows my
design




Rotor build

[BroMikey]

Progress update

[SIZE="3"][FONT="Courier New"][I]





Here is my arbor/shaft for my high speed saw blade populated with
magnet fixtures and magnets. Any old thrown out Table-Saw hardware
fits the bill. Inexpensive, high precision.

The scooter motor can easily pull the rotor but for purposes of making
my setup live longer the 5/8" arbor is best. Now I can throw a rag joint
on between Matt's modified motor shaft and rotor shaft

SOME TESTING

I have found that the amp draw of 1.1amp-1.3amp that the
Matt mod motor is pulling using the 3 batteries offers a huge amount
of torque that is unaffected by additional magnet weight.

I have also put cores (Without coils) near the rotor magnets while
running and surprisingly the amp draw did not go up. Only one core
is what I used yet I still expected an amp increase. Nope.

Now I will change shafts and make some custom "C" core bobbins
with built in mounts, probably out of fiberglass board and resins so it
is thin, strong and can stand a small amount of heat without turning
to jello.

Bee C-in-ya

[BroMikey]

Here are the parts I have at present. The rotor is done, the bearings
and tubing frame work as shown in this drawing. In progress.