Fraud: Laws of Thermodynamics

[SidL]

Post deleted. Mods, please delete thread. Thanks.

[Ufopolitics]

Excellent Book!

Hey SidL,

Great work!

Absolutely agree with your thoughts in a 100%.

I hope you will change some minds around here...it is definitively needed!

Nature is always a Two way flow...so, why do we build one way machines and batteries?

For example, Magnetic Fields are considered a One Way flow by actual Science...typically from North to South...not true...Magnetism is a Universal, Natural Phenomena...and math and mankind science does not apply there.

Everything obeys a Natural Principle...a Universal one.

We have designed machinery, and basically related to Energy transformation based on one principle...

"Where to put the Meter$$"

Simple


Regards and good luck!


Ufopolitics

[bistander]

Opinions

Hi Ufo,

You have your opinions. I see the electric machines and batteries as bi-directional or two-way. Batteries can charge and discharge. Electric dynamos can motor or generate. And magnetic fields do not flow. But we've been through this before.

Regards,

bi

[bistander]

Perpetual motion

Hi SidL,

Instead of writing a book about it, why didn't you just build it?

Welcome to this board,

bistander

[Ufopolitics]

Money...$$$

Hi Ufo,

You have your opinions. I see the electric machines and batteries as bi-directional or two-way. Batteries can charge and discharge. Electric dynamos can motor or generate. And magnetic fields do not flow. But we've been through this before.

Regards,

bi

Bistander,

It seems you also have a problem understanding me...

I meant a "Bi-Flow" without having to pay to obtain the second one...

Just like Clouds transform into rain and then again and again and no one have to pay for them to keep going on and on...and so with must Natural Processes mentioned on this book plus many more we could see and feel everywhere around us...

Batteries can not "self-recharge" as they loose power...we have to re-charge them for their limited life...and we pay for it with $$

Electrodynamic Generators can't output more than Prime Mover spends...so, we have to keep adding Fuel...which bolts down to $$

Electric Motors can't do just a prime work then keep going on and on without an input...meaning some $$ spent.


Ufopolitics

[bistander]

Bistander,

It seems you also have a problem understanding me...

I meant a "Bi-Flow" without having to pay to obtain the second one...

Just like Clouds transform into rain and then again and again and no one have to pay for them to keep going on and on...and so with must Natural Processes mentioned on this book plus many more we could see and feel everywhere around us...

Batteries can not "self-recharge" as they loose power...we have to re-charge them for their limited life...and we pay for it with $$

Electrodynamic Generators can't output more than Prime Mover spends...so, we have to keep adding Fuel...which bolts down to $$

Electric Motors can't do just a prime work then keep going on and on without an input...meaning some $$ spent.


Ufopolitics

OK Ufo, that wasn't clear. But your cloud rain analogy is often called the water cycle. It is dependent on the energy from the sun. And to charge your battery or run your motor, you could also use the energy from the sun. So what's the problem? Nobody does that for you for free, I guess?

Regards,

bi

[Ufopolitics]

OK Ufo, that wasn't clear. But your cloud rain analogy is often called the water cycle. It is dependent on the energy from the sun.

And the sun...how long has it been around?

And to charge your battery or run your motor, you could also use the energy from the sun. So what's the problem? Nobody does that for you for free, I guess?

Regards,

bi

Oh, that sounds so convincing!!

No problems at all...

That means I should remind Tesla Motors CEO, Elon Musk...that he could add some solar panels (just a few centimeters would be enough to feed everything, right?...) on his design...and that would cycle the whole thing Uh?

So, now the Tesla could run without stopping for a re-charge?

Geez, why We did not think of this before...

Bistander, you're so smart!!


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

The fact about Thermodynamic Laws...

The Thermodynamic Laws only work on Closed Systems.

Nature is an Open System...Universe is an Open System...and their Cycles are produced "naturally" within open environments.

The minute we start conceiving Open Systems...Thermodynamics will not apply.


Simple



Ufopolitics

[bistander]

Hello Bistander, thanks for your input.

Indeed a very pertinent question. The answer is simple, money. Building stuff is not free of charge, and if I could, I would not be talking, I'd be doing.

Yet, a-step-at-a-time hurts no one. There is still service I feel I can render, which is to the minds of those with resources to build stuff. If you look at the book cover, the image there represents one of several ways in which an electric car can generate its own electricity, and I came up with more ways after I finished the book. My CAD skills only go so far to illustrate, but think about it, can one not mount a generator into the wheel system of an electric vehicle to charge the batteries when in motion? Is that a technical challenge, or is that a mental one?

And thank you SidL for your reply.

Battery powered electric vehicles already have a generator connected to the wheels which is used to charge the battery when the car is in motion. This either slows the car or prevents gain in speed going downhill. It is called regenerative braking. The energy put into the battery during regeneration comes from the kinetic energy gained from the reduction of speed during braking or the potential energy associated with change in elevation (gravitational). Technically this works very well.

Regards,

bi

[bistander]

No, that's not what I meant and I'm aware of regenerative breaking.

Take a look at the attached photo. A second pair of wheels has been added to which a generator is mounted, using the relationship between the rotating wheel and stationary hub--the red and blue portions. While the electric car does its thing, those 2 generators generate electricity.

What do you think?

Say at a constant speed on level terrain, the generators will require more energy input than they could provide to charge the battery so vehicle range is reduced.

[bistander]

I don't follow. With a rotating wheel acting as a rotor around a stationary stator hub, what more energy is required? The system is passive and merely leeches established motion. Let me give an analogy, its like mounting a small electric windmill on the top of the car to generate electricity every time the car is in motion. That is what the picture in the diagram describes. The only difference is that the "wind" is the rotating tyres. There are even simpler ways.

"leeches established motion" meaning sucks the life blood from that motion. And energy is the life blood of that motion. So the generator sucks energy from the vehicle motion requiring the motor to put even more energy into the vehicle motion to maintain speed and cover conversion losses.

[bistander]

Say it takes 10 kW from the motor to push the EV at 50mph. The motor takes 11kW from the battery to make the 10kW required mechanical power. So your generator needs 11kW electrical output just to keep the motor running (more if you want to charge the battery also). For the generator to output 11kW electrical, it requires 12kW mechanical input. Where does this 12kW mechanical power come from? The only place on the EV is the motor (unless it's a hybrid). Now the motor must output 22kW (12 to feed the generator and 10 to move the car). To output 22kW mechanical power, the motor needs 24kW from the battery and generator combination. The generator electrical output is 11kW.

So with the generator, to maintain 50mph, you use 13kW from the battery (24-11). That is 2kW more than the 11kW needed from the battery without the generator. 18% increase in power to go the same speed using the generator means a much shorter distance per battery charge.

[bistander]

The mechanical power will come from the generator attached to the tyres.
I am not sure you understand me, so let me put it another way.

*Battery energises motor.
*Motor turns the wheels (moves the car)
*Generators attached to other wheel systems in the already moving car generates electricity as the car moves. It is analogous to the windmill generators, where the wind is the moving car or rotating tyres.
*Electricity used to recharge the battery.
*Battery energises motor--the cycle repeats, i.e. "perpetual motion."

It really is that simple.

How difficult is it for the rotating tyres to have magnets mounted to them to induce current in the winding attached to a stationary hub?

You say "The mechanical power will come from the generator attached to the tyres." You have to put mechanical power into the generator to get electrical power out of the generator. That's how generators work. And you always have to put more power in than you get out. That's loss.

[bistander]

Is the tyre not already turning? Is that not mechanical power otherwise wasting away? We have been wasting it all away for decades. That's all I am saying.

Turning? No. That's not mechanical power. Mechanical power (rotational) is the product of angular velocity (turning, as you say) and torque. Torque on the generator is a force opposing rotation. The larger the electrical load, or electrical power output from the generator, the more torque will develop opposing rotation which means more power needed to move the car.

[citfta]

SidL,

What Bistander is telling you is absolutely correct. It takes real mechanical energy to turn a generator. If you put an electrical load on a generator it takes mechanical power to turn the generator. You say you are familiar with regenerative braking, but it appears you are not. Regenerative braking works because we use the motor as a generator to recharge the battery. That mechanical load of recharging the batteries is what slows the car down during regenerative braking.

If you can find someone in your area that has a bicycle with the little generator that mounts on the wheel you can try a simple experiment. Ride the bicycle on smooth level ground and notice how much energy it is taking for you to pedal the bicycle. Now turn on the headlight that is connected to the generator. You will feel the bicycle slow down and you will be able to tell you are having to pedal harder because you are now having to add mechanical power to the generator so that it can light the headlight.

Respectfully,
Carroll