Tesla coil, Standing Wave and Earth Cannection

[BSpg]

Hello Everyone,

I'm just finishing a new video.
I was inspired with this Tesla's drawing:


This drawing shows my three experiments:


I cannot interpret the third experiment, if I use the same logic as in the previous two experiments.

How is reflected standing wave at the third experiment?
Or is reflected on the ground surface, or somewhere inside the earth?


I do not use such a large power, but as Tesla was said - there being no diminution in the intensity of the transmitted impulses?

Thanks,
Spigel

[Jeff Pearson]

Where is video??

[BSpg]

Where is video??

Video will be finished tomorrow.

[BSpg]

Hi,
video is completed:

Basic Tesla's Experiments (Part 7) - Standing Wave, Node, Reflection

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkMndCsNRQU

Thanks,
Spigel

[dR-Green]

How is reflected standing wave at the third experiment?
Or is reflected on the ground surface, or somewhere inside the earth?

Perhaps this could be interpreted in the following way - Tesla's drawing:

It's exactly like Tesla's drawing. The wave is reflected off the boundary of the earth at the opposite side to the transmitter. The activity on the surface is like a shadow. Based on a wave travelling through the centre of the earth at the velocity of light, the average propagation velocity along the surface is Pi/2*c, and everything ends up at the same resonant frequency as given by Tesla.

[Ernst]

In your drawing you seem to forget that as a current flows through the Earth, the Earth also adds some inductance.
It is just like an ordinary resonating coil; part of it acts as inductance and part as capacitance. There is no sharp line between them, towards the end the current gets less, so also the inductance gets to play a smaller role, while at the same time charges get compressed so capacitance starts to play a larger role.

I do not remember that drawing of Tesla. Where did you get it from? Looks like a patent application?


Ernst.

[BSpg]

Hi dR-Green,

it would be interesting if it happened in my (third) experiment.
I use very little power compared to the Tesla device. L2 is loosely coupled, excited with a maximum of 100W.

Thanks,
Spigel

[BSpg]

In your drawing you seem to forget that as a current flows through the Earth, the Earth also adds some inductance.
It is just like an ordinary resonating coil; part of it acts as inductance and part as capacitance. There is no sharp line between them, towards the end the current gets less, so also the inductance gets to play a smaller role, while at the same time charges get compressed so capacitance starts to play a larger role.

Regarding the earth inductance and capacity, in any case, it is okay.
But I'm not sure it gives the answer to these questions:

How is reflected standing wave at the third experiment?
Or is reflected on the ground surface, or somewhere inside the earth?



Spigel

[Ernst]

I don't think it is reflected, you'll need significantly more power for that. What you see is a current being sent into and drawn from the earth because of the magnetic effects produced by the primary winding(s). The Earth just acts as a giant reservoir of electrical charge.

You are using a transistor driven coil. That is nowhere near the power of a spark gap driver. Power being energy per time unit. you can increase the power by decreasing the switching time. And since there is no semi-conductor that can switch as much current in as short a time, a spark gap will always win (in terms of power).
With a spark gap coil and a power input of about 800 W you can (if all is well dimensioned) see streamers that grow in length. I believe that is because of the reflection at the other side of the Earth (which takes 85 ms round trip).
Below 800W with the same coils I could not obtain this effect, so I expect that the minimum amount of power to get a reflection is near this 800 W, which is incidently close to the 1 HP that Tesla mentioned.


Ernst.

[BSpg]

I don't think it is reflected, you'll need significantly more power for that. What you see is a current being sent into and drawn from the earth because of the magnetic effects produced by the primary winding(s). The Earth just acts as a giant reservoir of electrical charge.
Ernst.

I think that this explanation is just fine. Only, I do not have a case of inductive coupling than the capacitive coupling between L1 and L2.

You are using a transistor driven coil. That is nowhere near the power of a spark gap driver. Power being energy per time unit. you can increase the power by decreasing the switching time. And since there is no semi-conductor that can switch as much current in as short a time, a spark gap will always win (in terms of power).
With a spark gap coil and a power input of about 800 W you can (if all is well dimensioned) see streamers that grow in length. I believe that is because of the reflection at the other side of the Earth (which takes 85 ms round trip).
Below 800W with the same coils I could not obtain this effect, so I expect that the minimum amount of power to get a reflection is near this 800 W, which is incidently close to the 1 HP that Tesla mentioned.

I am aware that the power of my device is too small to get a feedback signal. In addition, L2 generates a sine wave. It is better as you do, use a short powerful impulse. A short pulse can excite any resonant system that vibrates at its resonant frequency.

Thanks and

Spigel

[dR-Green]

A strange request...

Evidently I was sent a PM asking me to remove my post that has Tesla's diagram in it from the thread, apparently due to uncertainty over the copyright. It's all over the internet and is Tesla's diagram so I don't think that's a problem. Even if it was a problem I'm not sure what bearing it would have on this thread, and the image is hosted on another member's web site. On top of that, the person who requested I remove Tesla's diagram himself has a post and a video on youtube containing more of Tesla's diagrams. So

[mikrovolt]

The bric and mortar museums of turn of the century polished brass technology exist and are spread over the world. They get their share of peculiar spies and critics and sometimes need
assistance from a security person. I am not aware of any Tesla copyrights on his inventions
of special classification however there are some that feel there are death rays and earth quake machines out there. This concern was more pronounced during various periods. A sign of the times ?

[Ernst]

I have re-drawn these Tesla drawings (I had not seen them before) and shared them with BSpg. Since I created those drawings I own all rights.
BSpg showed me his copies, which I used to create mine. Then I removed his copies so, there can be no copyright infringement.
If BSpg agrees, please re-post my drawings for which I grant everyone the right to copy and use in any way they see fit.


Ernst.

[BSpg]

Evidently I was sent a PM asking me to remove my post that has Tesla's diagram in it from the thread, apparently due to uncertainty over the copyright. It's all over the internet and is Tesla's diagram so I don't think that's a problem. Even if it was a problem I'm not sure what bearing it would have on this thread, and the image is hosted on another member's web site. On top of that, the person who requested I remove Tesla's diagram himself has a post and a video on youtube containing more of Tesla's diagrams. So

Hi dR-Green,

I am sorry and thanks for that.
I was surprised when I noticed that this Tesla's drawing was not published on the Internet. The drawing was published in a magazine 25 years ago. Subsequently, I found that this drawing already been published on the Internet:
Val - Znanje - Portal za razvoj svijesti | Nikola Tesla o 21. stolje?u - 1937.g. - i nau?ni komentari | Godine, Energije, Beograd, Nikole, Sredstva, Zemlje,

I'm not a lawyer and I find it difficult to judge what is okay and what is not. Of course, there are enormous Tesla's drawings on the Internet, so I suppose that can be freely used.

BSpg

[BSpg]

I have re-drawn these Tesla drawings (I had not seen them before) and shared them with BSpg. Since I created those drawings I own all rights.
BSpg showed me his copies, which I used to create mine. Then I removed his copies so, there can be no copyright infringement.
If BSpg agrees, please re-post my drawings for which I grant everyone the right to copy and use in any way they see fit.


Ernst.

Hi Ernst,
unfortunately, I'm can not say anything about it, because I'm not a lawyer. Does this new drawing can be considered as a copy of a copy is hard to say. You alone decide what you want to do, I can not for it to bear any kind of responsibility and also can not make decisions.

Otherwise, it is nice of you, regarding free drawings.


BSpg