Figuera Device, Part G Continuum.( Serious Builders Only)

[GlenWV]

Ampacity

Greetings all:

My commutators have arrived, but I think that they are going to be a bit on the fragile side for this application.

I found this: https://www.toledocommutator.com/

They seem to have everything.....(dear Santa...)

My question is: How to size the things? How many amps do we need for the commutator brushes, and collector rings to handle?

The #8 bare copper is good for at least 40 amps, and the #6 should be good for 50.

I think MM's FETs are rated pretty high. (Reminds me, my UTSource order hasn't arrived yet. Gotta go look in on that.)

So, are we going to hit it with that much??

Another thing, would a higher number of commutator bars be helpful? Like 36 would make one tenth of 360 degrees. Or, would that just complicate tuning?

Perhaps I am over thinking this thing.

Merry Christmas to all,

Glen

[Ufopolitics]

Mechanical or Solid State...

Greetings all:

My commutators have arrived, but I think that they are going to be a bit on the fragile side for this application.

I found this: https://www.toledocommutator.com/

They seem to have everything.....(dear Santa...)

My question is: How to size the things? How many amps do we need for the commutator brushes, and collector rings to handle?

The #8 bare copper is good for at least 40 amps, and the #6 should be good for 50.

I think MM's FETs are rated pretty high. (Reminds me, my UTSource order hasn't arrived yet. Gotta go look in on that.)

So, are we going to hit it with that much??

Another thing, would a higher number of commutator bars be helpful? Like 36 would make one tenth of 360 degrees. Or, would that just complicate tuning?

Perhaps I am over thinking this thing.

Merry Christmas to all,

Glen

Hello Glen,

Are you going to make the mechanical rotary switch or electronics first?

As you know I am doing mechanical switching...and so I can only tell you about it so far...'

I am currently test-feeding system with batteries...non regulated... and even batteries disbursing only 2.5 amps on first tests...it blew the copper wire (actually melted it) that comes from the slip ring fixed brush. it was from a car alternator slip ring brush...and they are not good. So I changed the whole thing to a double motor brush with heavier wire...and now it works excellent. Got brush from one of those cooling fans motors, they are rectangular so fit two on the aluminum sliding channel I built out of a square tubing.

Below are couple of pics to my new slip ring dual brush assy...

[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

What I see on this system, is that because of the so low resistance, it amplifies the effect of currents even being as low as 2.0 amps making them act like 10 amps.

My recommendation is to go above the running amps spec's as related to all connectors and fasteners involved. Plus everything must be very tightly attached.

And so, once everything is set tight and firm...plus the right gauges correct...system will not even spark at any of the brushes...do not ask me why this happens....because I really can not explain it either.

I would be calculating the MM recommended spec's...which are 50 Volts and 4 to 5 Amps...but like I said...these 4 amps will act like 10 or 15 amps due to low resistance.

In the first running minutes electromagnets will get warm...but as system stabilizes it will start cooling off...not Toroid Part G though...This Part would be a freezer...


Regards


Ufopolitics

[marathonman]

Low Sparking

It was relayed to me as to your effects of almost zero sparking. also that once the system was running very little brush wear occurred which is rather mind boggling. your twin brushes still need some wear to completely line up faces so this is very good news. i see some slight burning at the brush, i hope further wear will fix it.

very odd action from the amperage especially since part G allows only so much currant through the system. this is something that i did not anticipate and i do apologize for that. seems we need to monitor this through out the build.

very glad to hear your freezer part G works as planned. i never had a doubt in my mind just waited for everyone else to catch up to the technology.

outstanding news great work UFOP.

MM

[Ufopolitics]

It was relayed to me as to your effects of almost zero sparking. also that once the system was running very little brush wear occurred which is rather mind boggling. your twin brushes still need some wear to completely line up faces so this is very good news. i see some slight burning at the brush, i hope further wear will fix it.

very odd action from the amperage especially since part G allows only so much currant through the system. this is something that i did not anticipate and i do apologize for that. seems we need to monitor this through out the build.

very glad to hear your freezer part G works as planned. i never had a doubt in my mind just waited for everyone else to catch up to the technology.

outstanding news great work UFOP.

MM

MM,

Those brushes have been to hell and back......the burning is not from these tests.

And yes, every wire and bolt must be rated for higher amperage...just for safety....and 10 gauge is perfect for wiring all.

I had some gator clips...and they got really hot...which means losses...no good...All wires must be the same gauge attaching all connections.

Even though, there is one thing I forgot to mention...I am only testing one small set of primaries...not the real deal am building, which are heavier in mass and thicker wires...I am sure as you have said, there must be a kind of "Inductance Balance" between Part G and Primaries...so the inductance "network" works fluently back and forth without any differences.

The fact that Part G is that cold...may mean that must Inductance is finding too much reluctance (resistance) at Primaries...which is no good for them, as they will do get hot if there are too much difference.

Inductance Balance is the name of the game here...

The Induction at secondary is really awesome friend!...the more small motor spins...the brighter the bulb gets without source being any higher.


These are just preliminary testing and I need to make many more...with the real primaries and full wiring with right 10 gauge..


Regards


Ufopolitics

[marathonman]

Part G

This is good, i do see the battle scars on them and yes balance between primaries is very essential and mandatory for proper operation.

Confucius say; man who use inductance to control currant stay cool when electrified.


"The Induction at secondary is really awesome friend!...the more small motor spins...the brighter the bulb gets without source being any higher."

and just think, a few months ago you never new what joy you were heading in to.

Figuera gets my vote for physicist of the century, the rest are all clowns.


MM

[marathonman]

Cores

Just finishing up some loose ends before i start the inter connections. looking for a heavy duty motor and commutator to test while i finish up the electronics. still need the Mosfet board and Mosfets thus the commutator and motor for testing are cheaper.



MM

[marathonman]

Motor

Found what looks like a very good candidate for motor drive to test part G.

also they carry the controller plus a heck of a lot of other things one might want or need.
pic below is motor, as you can see very good size and robust.
just about the size of my cores after i cut them.....nice !



or this one.

3-PHASE BRUSHLESS MOTOR, USED | All Electronics Corp.



UFOP;

what do you think of these motors ??????

MM

[Shadow119g]

Stuff

Wow that motor looks great



Motor looks great!


Two coils finished. I do not recommend my version of winding coils on cores. Use
bobbins instead like MM did.

I got worried about traces of iron or steel in my brass connecting screw for my coils.
I did a test with my biggest magnet and I think brass is fairly pure. The brass screw
just falls off my finger smashing magnet!

Shadow

[Ufopolitics]

Found what looks like a very good candidate for motor drive to test part G.

also they carry the controller plus a heck of a lot of other things one might want or need.
pic below is motor, as you can see very good size and robust.
just about the size of my cores after i cut them.....nice !



or this one.

3-PHASE BRUSHLESS MOTOR, USED | All Electronics Corp.



UFOP;

what do you think of these motors ??????

MM

MM,

You know the ones I have used so far are brushed motors...no controllers required but my other 18V 3A PSU...where I can regulate separately V & A.

I have no experience adding such load as brush with springs plus counterweights on a 3 phase BLDC.

However, by the Body size I like the upper one...lower seems too small body.

And "cheap" small controllers when loaded, FET's will start heating up...rather use good ones which have better heat sinks, and FET quality...more money though.

So, IMHO, I highly recommend to go simple by using brushed ones...no controllers.

EDIT...BUT...in the RC World you will not find a Brushed Motor that would fit this job...since all are wound with heavy wire...and so, are amps hogs...plus heat galore...

Mine I got them from 12V Power Fans...battery operated...

Regards


Ufopolitics

[marathonman]

Pic

Shadow;
I looked at pic twice....what is it????
and what is wrong with your bobbins Shadow ????

yes that motor does look great for many projects. the first one is absolutely beautiful but second one is less amperage.

that is great your brass is non magnetic as heating would be an issue.

UFOP;
thanks.... and yes, i like the top one also and if it comes down to it ill build a robust controller my self as i have many parts on hand.
i see they are going bonkers over core.
one man's failures are another man's gain.
well no eddies/hysteresis is all i can say.

Mm

[Shadow119g]

brass screws

I was concerned about traces of magnetic materials in the brass. The picture shows a brass screw hanging in front of my huge magnet not being pulled toward it like the two steel measuring squares being magnetically attached to the magnet.
So far, I am happy with my bobbin less winding's, but?
The bobbins were machined for a pressed fit on the iron round bars. I had two break because they were a little to small. The worst part of it is I have to use my metal lathe to wind my cores because there is no way to attach the round iron bars to my $45.00 winder.
All and all I think your bobbin idea is better all around.
Thanks,
Shadow

[Shadow119g]

shadow119g STUFF

Here are three completed components.


http://www.energeticforum.com/attach...ra-stuff-2-jpg

[Cornboy 555]

Nice job on your coils Mm and Shadow, and your switching UFO.

@ Shadow, what kind of switching are you going to use?.

Finally got some free time to work on my switching today, hopefully will be able to post some pics soon.

Regards Cornboy.

[Cornboy 555]

Hi all, have test drove my switch, and was surprised just how smooth it was first go.

Took it up to about 3000 RPM, no trouble.

Ahh well, no excuse now, will have to chop up my tranny,s to make primaries and secondaries, winding will be a *****, being rectangular.

All the Best, Cornboy.

[marathonman]

Nice work also

Thanks, nice work your self Cornboy.
maybe try some bobbin construction, sure makes winding a whole lot easier. slipping on bobbins is easier than winding direct on cores.

oh and when your cores are finished and pumping out some serious va. all the pain in the arse work will seam trivial and most likely forgotten.

MM