Figuera Device, Part G Continuum.( Serious Builders Only)

[Cornboy 555]

Thanks MM, bistander, interdesign, and seaad, my very bad.

I got confused between the commutator connections and the toroid connections.

Yes commutation on the inside should be good and hopefully easy to machine.

Seaad's comments, about not enough induction in the toroid core to control the current, have me concerned. Also the results from other builders in this regard.

So thinking on this further, using a ring distributer G, connected to low resistance primaries, on my setup the resistance of the exciter circuit will be almost non existent, which i believe is the way to go for instant hard hitting induction with just a small fluctuation of the split positive feed from G.

Maybe what we need is a fine wire preliminary winding on the toroid, a winding that will take the core right to saturation, and be adjustable with a Dc feed from a PSU, this could also help tune the self sustaining feed from the secondary after start up.

Then wire the heavy G splitter winding over the high resistance high induction winding, similar to a MAG AMP.

Do you guys think this is a viable way to control the current in this device?

If so, i am sure Simulation Seaad could work out, in a flash, what gauge and number of turns would be required to take our individual cores to almost saturation, and adjustable back to 0 saturation and what current would be needed to achieve it.

Just some thoughts, what do you guy's think?.

Please respect MM's wishes, and only answer here if you are a builder.

Best Regards Cornboy.

[marathonman]

Part G

I personally would test what you have and go from there. Figuera or Doug never mentioned another winding on the core so i don't think it would be a good idea.
once when i spoke to Doug he mentioned having to move the connection around a little to balance the output to the primaries that is why i chose bare wire and coating just the sides for no shorting between winding's allows me to move a connection point if i have to even though i have it bolted together it can still be modified as i have more wire.
the weather is keeping me from working on a house so this in turn is delaying the parts i need for testing.
Also bringing part G close to saturation would not be a good idea as any part brought close to saturation will start to behave erratically. the extra headroom i have spoke about in part G is just for this purpose, no saturation.

Quote;
"So thinking on this further, using a ring distributer G, connected to low resistance primaries, on my setup the resistance of the exciter circuit will be almost non existent, which i believe is the way to go for instant hard hitting induction with just a small fluctuation of the split positive feed from G."

i completely agree but please keep in mind the what ever your output is of your secondaries the primaries split that load so each primary is accountable for half the flux required for your secondary output with part G dropping the currant less than half way down just enough to fluctuate the field between the primaries to clear the secondary of the low primary.

just my two cents worth.

PS. i would not put to much faith in a simulation, real world tests are the way to go.

MM

[Ufopolitics]

Ufo,

Base line setup:
Input 3V, 3A
Output: 8.45V, 0.55A DC rectified
9 watts in, 4.6 watts out

Using the above wiring configuration:
Input: 5.7V, 2A
Output: 7.5V, 0.40A DC rectified
11.4 watts in, 3 watts out.

No changes were made on my input resistance on the neg lead from the battery. The change in input volts and amps were due entirely to the changed wiring connections.

Regards,
Cadman

Hello Cadman,

Thanks for making this primary suggested test!

The point here is not about reaching OU, but being able to compare our output when we have taken off all jumpers, plus having each adjacent element attached, resulting in five...which actually what is doing is expanding to ON Time of brush.

Now, please Cadman, could you do same test without jumpers, but now having single elements at commutator.(not attached)..resulting in eight total terminals (including the two outputs)

Intended to use same running speed as same tested conditions as in previous test you did.


Thanks friend!


Regards


Ufopolitics

[Cadman]

Ufo,

I need you to clarify.
Using your illustrations above, which commutator segment numbers(s) do you want attached to which toroid segment number?

Regards,
Cadman

[Ufopolitics]

UFOP;

Very interesting Inductance displacement concept. i did not know a motor would do that by changing the com to a smaller one. it does sound very reasonable and does fit the outcome you guys are experiencing. thus the comm being to small the field is shrinking instead of growing larger as it should and is actually reducing induction instead of increasing it or at the very least it is out of sink.

Thanks MM,

Yes, and I have tested this same rotary switch with other set up which do not use a Part G...same thing.

This Figuera design with the jumpers is a very interesting, but when we try making it on a commutator... the On timing displacement are too short related to the travel distance on Part G and so to each primary as well.

Remember that in the Figuera patent He does mention a "Commutator" but was only to convert AC to DC from second secondary to self sustain system...but when he writes about the single positive brush...then he refers as running inside "A Cylinder" where Brush sweeps from in-center-outwards, which is a completely different concept as a commutator. Then he literally mentions about "encrusting pieces of the resistors within this Cylinder Inner walls which were made of an insulated material...

Why would Figuera had to go through all this trouble on his long and detailed explanation on the rotary switch structure when he could have just written "A Commutator and Brush with jumped wires" as it would do the job as well?

so it must be concluded that a direct brush to wire contact would not experience this outcome of the comm as the radius is quite larger and thus both are in sink.

Mm

Not only they are in sync...but the actual positive input feed is injected directly to each windings in a smoother way than jumping from segments of windings...so there would be plenty of time for Inductance to develop without being interrupted, jumping from tap to tap.

What happens to Inductance and mmf force in the "in between" of two taps?

Definitively, since it is kind of a "no input" or an "idle stage" there...it should be a decay on power to then suddenly rise up...not smooth at all.


Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Ufo,

I need you to clarify.
Using your illustrations above, which commutator segment numbers(s) do you want attached to which toroid segment number?

Regards,
Cadman

Sure can:

[IMG][/IMG]

It don't need to be exactly as shown...as it depends on how many winds you've got on Toroid Core...so, space them apart as best as you could.

Please remember to use same conditions as previous test on everything.

Basically exact same Input as exact same RPM's...

Then if you could... when you put it all back together like Figuera in the connections, with jumpers etc,etc...then test with same Input and same speed.


Thanks Friend


Ufopolitics

[Cadman]

OK, will do. I can't tonight but will try to get it done tomorrow night.

BTW, the baseline figure I gave earlier is the Figuera setup with all the jumpers etc.

Regards,
Cadman

[Ufopolitics]

OK, will do. I can't tonight but will try to get it done tomorrow night.

BTW, the baseline figure I gave earlier is the Figuera setup with all the jumpers etc.

Regards,
Cadman

Ok, but the Base Line Input is different in V &A from the Test V&A ?

You should use same Input for all tests, as same speed.

Anyways, that is why I mentioned it again...


Thanks


Ufopolitics

[Grey Wolf]

Builder new to forum

Hello to all,
Although I am new to the forum I have been building and testing for more than 4 years. I have a completed device that I will share as well as some completely different interpritations of the patent drawing.
First of all, I believe the patent is a complete illustration of the device. The resistor'R' in the drawing IS NOT a separate resistor but represents the total resistance of either the 'N' or'S' set of seven coils. If the N couls are numbered from left to right, the N1 coil would get full voltage if the commutator is on the #1 position.
All seven of the coils are connected in series and the #2 wire connects between N1 and N2. The #3 wire connects between N2 and N3. This continues in this manner until you connect #7 between N6 and N7. There is a jumper wire ( which in the drawing shows to be just a half of a resistor leg) connecting to #8. #8 and #9 are connected together and are joined to S1 above the N7 coil. Coils S1 to S7 are numbered from right to left or reverse of N coils.
There are NO BRIDGE CONNECTOR BETWEEN THE 'N' COILS AND THE 'S' COILS. Only #1 and #16 and #8 and #9. There IS A JUMPER between #7 and #8 and a jumper between #15 and #16.
All the 'S' coils are also connected in series and are connected in similar fashion as was the N coil series.
This should be enough to get your thinking caps on a start a good discussion. As in told UFOPolitics in a privite dialog to him, "Sometimes we get so close to the forest that we can't see the trees" Thanks ,Grey Wolf

[marathonman]

Page 1

So you have a completed device, well does it, your completed device run as in a good output? you never said and what is your output of your so called completed device and where are the pictures of the completed device. i am sure after 4 years you have pics of such device which are stated as one of the rules of page 1 of this thread and at my discretion as it is my thread.
Quote;
"First of all, I believe the patent is a complete illustration of the device"
then you are living in a fantasy as the patent clearly states it is illustrated in it's most elementary form for comprehension thus you would be completely incorrect.
but if you do have something worth while then by all means please proceed.
Thank you and have a nice day.

UFOP;

Please remember Figuera NEVER said resistors, he says resistor or resistance and that one end of the resistance is connected to set N and the other to set S so that basically blows the guy above statement out of the water so to speak.

MM

[Cornboy 555]

Welcome Grey Wolf, great to see you here, and thank you for sharing.

It would be greatly appreciated if you could share the details of your build with us, some photo's or drawings will help understanding your device.

Many Thanks, Cornboy.

[Grey Wolf]

I do have many photos and diagrams of my work. I am having difficulty in posting photos that are on my cell phone. I am still testing and have just recently gotten my device reconfigured to what I feel is the correct build out. I am NOT SKILLED in diagnosing the out put of my device and this is where I need some help from those on the forum.
My latest test shows 13.8 volts out put as AC current. My N and S coils each have 325 turns on 16 ga. Copper wire in three layere over a laminated 6 layer iron core of cold rolled steel. Each electromagnet coil can lift 5 pound when charged with 12 volts. Each of these 14 coils are shaped like an E without the center bar. 7 wound clockwise and 7 counterclockwise.
Another area of my uncertainty is how the 'Y' coils are wound. What I have are like a capital I with the same 325 turns of 16 ga. Wire.
I will try to send photos again but I will send them separately because the last time I tried, I lost the typed text and all. Hope this adds some insight. Grey Wolf

[marathonman]

Cores

So it sounds like your core are built like the original start of the other thread in which basically failed and is completely different from what we are working on.
as for the photos, you can start photo albums in your profile page then link them to your post. it allows for quite a lot of photos.
as for the secondary, it is wound according to present day winding tech.
Good luck.

MM

[Grey Wolf]

Need help on how to upload photos to forum

I am not able to upload photo. I need some help.Grey Wolf

[marathonman]

Profile page

if you click on your name in your post then click view profile. you can add photo albums. click photo albums then add photo. after photo is uploaded click to view photo then copy top url and paste in the box insert image, the yellow mountain above on the action bar then post. do this while logged in. or you can copy url from pic hosting site and paste in the box then post.

MM