The bistander thread

[BroMikey]

If anybody is interested here is the small school boy machine running at 1750 rpm's showing a 294 hertz or 294 divide by 10 magnet pole X 60 sec to get RPM of of hertz = 1750. Very slow where the big machine uses a 10" rotor with 20 magnet poles and runs at over 4000 rpm.

[bistander]

Notice the precision popsicle stick shims.

Screenshot_20210529-001620-283.png

Think his core is dead nuts to +/- .001"?

(Images previously posted on this forum by BM.)

bi

[BroMikey]

Notice the precision popsicle stick shims.

Screenshot_20210529-001620-283.png

Think his core is dead nuts to +/- .001"?

(Images previously posted on this forum by BM.)

bi

Here is what needs to be understood about this giant motor using a plastic rotor with small weak magnets and a coil the size of a spool of thread. The motor will consume 65% of it's FLA with no rotor. With the rotor that is so small the amps will not change. With a coil and rotor the 65% mark would still not be reached. A motor like this is a poor choice for accurate testing UNLESS a VFD is used to dial past this problem. It is possible. A motor like the one in the picture might have a FLA (full load amps) of 10 amps and so 65% would be 6.5amps regardless.

What we need is a small record player motor that teeters on the edge of barely turning the rotor BEFORE cogging coils are added one after another. Then you can see slight increases where on a motor this large you might need a 30" rotor with 10-20 one pound magnets to reach this limit. 6.5a X 120v = 780 watts. I run a rotor this size on 10 watts.

And that coil holder bolt will giggle like a Palm tree.

[Quantum_well]

This YouTube guy has the right idea. There's no way most of you lot are getting accurate results with drive motor current and it's all too easy to fool yourselves.

https://youtu.be/1Pd0lUKWe7o

I wonder if the video will pass bistander scrutiny?.

[bistander]

This YouTube guy has the right idea. There's no way most of you lot are getting accurate results with drive motor current and it's all too easy to fool yourselves.

https://youtu.be/1Pd0lUKWe7o

I wonder if the video will pass bistander scrutiny?.

Thanks.
I like this guy. He does a nice job. He flies past the dynamometer trunion bearing mounting pretty fast. But I watched his other vid and he covers it in detail. I don't see where he balances (static calibration) the torque arm system, but overall he's got a good system.

Another thing comes to mind. He treats the dynamometer as a motor with his power supply. Realize it is actually a generator so needs an electrical load to apply torque opposing rotation and dissipate power. I've used shunt wound DC motors with an adjustable power supply on the field and big low ohm resistor across the armature. A PMDC motor will work for the dynamometer needing no power supply but using a variable resistance across the armature.

His other vid. *

https://youtu.be/1Pd0lUKWe7o

Nice vids from this guy. I approve.
bi

*Hmmm. Edit. Just checked video link. Looks to be same as supplied by q_w. I must have somehow skipped part the first time I viewed it. Oh well.

[BroMikey]

HOW ABOUT THIS MOTOR FOR YOUR 8 OZ ROTOR?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=itDcOSK_5Rg

[BroMikey]

All these motor video's are not going to make your thread look intelligent but if you insist. Get a good look.

[Quantum_well]

I just feel that Bro' either doesn't understand or won't accept the value of torque/rpm analysis. With a proper set-up the drive motor size (within reason) has no bearing on the power it is outputting. The example I gave was doable by most who post on here and it avoids a $2000 dollar investment in the kit needed to use a rotary sensor.
Having said that I really enjoyed the YouTube links Bro' put on. There's a huge amount of skilled work in reconditioning these big motors. I had always wondered how all those coils were put into a motor.I had a go at rewinding a small motor and I managed to get it looking somewhat like although it never ran satisfactorily.

[BroMikey]

I just feel that Bro' either doesn't understand.....

Having said that I really enjoyed the YouTube links Bro' put on.

I understand they are just regular old boring motors that operate at 70-80% max under full load conditions. A person does not need a high dollar torque apparatus, Dyno or anything of the sort to run legit tests.

Point being, run your rotors with a motor suited for the load. An 8 oz rotor needs about 5-10 watts to get it to speed. Not 500 watts. Use a motor that leaves a little head room so if the motor turns the rotor at 20v X 500ma without cores makes sure your motor has a max rating of 1 amp. You put a well pump motor on it and you will never be able to measure changes. Torque will be great but out of bounds.

[bistander]

7th graders pulse motor, 4-5 watts input to turn rotor 4000 rpm for large 8" disk and many heavy magnets. Now add regenx coils

interesting.

Screenshot_20210601-201616-091.png
Screenshot_20210601-201652-927.png

_____________

$250 is how much 7th grade lunch money? Pretty smooth running. No core in the main coil. Looks like it tries to cog on the sense coil core, although it appears to be brass bolt. Maybe it settles with magnet near hardware for bracket.

bi

[BroMikey]

interesting.

Screenshot_20210601-201616-091.png
Screenshot_20210601-201652-927.png

_____________

$250 is how much 7th grade lunch money? Pretty smooth running. No core in the main coil. Looks like it tries to cog on the sense coil core, although it appears to be brass bolt. Maybe it settles with magnet near hardware for bracket.

bi

Yes we were all told that core material plays a major roll in cogging as well as energy harvesting. It is not my fault that inventor continue to use soft steel bolts or other expecting world shattering results. All they get is wasted heat. Ferrite when used is often a little better than solid iron slugs. Looks like a 3D print job at school science class.

[Quantum_well]

Harvesting the decay and running LEDs. I suppose that's what Bedini was doing, Thane Heins ditto,
this is probably more efficient than either of the aforementioned.
My grandson
I'm very proud!

IMG-20210530-WA0002.jpg

[bistander]

Hi q_w,
good looking fellow with nice pet!

In a PWM speed control you need a good fast freewheeling diode. It puts the stored energy to good use during the off time portion of the duty cycle. Doing anything thing else with it will prove to be determental IMO.
Only a month until the conference. Anybody heard from Turion? He never did respond about Greyland's progress. Or black beauty's twin.
bi

[BroMikey]

Hi q_w,
good looking fellow with nice pet!

In a PWM speed control you need a good fast freewheeling diode. It puts the stored energy to good use during the off time portion of the duty cycle. Doing anything thing else with it will prove to be determental IMO.
Only a month until the conference. Anybody heard from Turion? He never did respond about Greyland's progress. Or black beauty's twin.
bi

Looks just like who? The pet? or the boy?

Dave needs to keep quiet, now leave him alone til he appears publicly. Save your money so you can buy the plans, books and maybe even a kit someday. You have pestered Dave 6 year now, don't you think that is long enough to get the answers you needed to build? Show us your operating machine.

[Turion]

Greyland is doing poorly and is no longer working at his shop. The machine he had, he has turned over to his son and his son's friend, who I have been working with to obtain samples of different core materials for testing. That machine is unsafe at any speed, and almost impossible to keep adjusted properly, which is why I was reluctant to do anything with it. I will spend my time on the new machine.

The individual who made the two Black Beauty machines is a machinist, and doesn't know much about core materials. He is waiting for me to produce some results so he knows what cores to put in the machine. So it's all on me now.

My house is basically finished. I spent the last few days taking loads of yard waste and construction debris to the dump, and hauling stuff from the garage at that house to my new house. The shop at my new place is a disaster right now since everything from the old house has been dumped there, everywhere, So I am working to shovel enough stuff aside to do testing. I am running out of time before the conference, but I intend to present there as planned. Then the results will be shared. The house will be listed on Zillow as of Tuesday. The good news is, I am finally free to spend the majority of my time on continued research. I am sure there will be projects that come up around the new place, but NOTHING like a complete remodel.