The bistander thread

[BroMikey]

My thoughts as expressed on the forum a
re MY thoughts. Should I choose to remove them, that is my business. ...
about the generator. When I have THAT back together I will definitely
have some things to say.

Can hardly wait and meanwhile I am doing my best to move forward.
Bi will sit on his hands demanding to be won over when he could do
something, a shameful waste of valuable time soaking in disbelief.

It is so clear now and becomes obvious, then you wonder how you
could have been so blind. If people would just try, but they don't.

[Quantum_well]

Something to think about.

You have a motor turning a generator, you apply a load to the generator and the drive motor speeds up.
What is happening? The drive motor speeds up because the unloaded generator was acting as a magnetic brake.
The only scenario I can see where it would be an advantage is if you were already operating at 100% and adding extra load caused a speed up.

[Turion]

Magnetic Brake

Quantum_Well,
You ASSUME the generator is acting as a magnetic brake because you haven’t built the machine nor tested it and know NOTHING about it.

When the motor is run on 24 volts all by itself, it runs at one speed and amp draw. When the rotor with magnets is added that speed goes down slightly and the amp draw goes up slightly. When the 12 coils with iron cores are placed in proximity to the rotor the rpm of the motor goes down and the amp draw goes up.

So far this is all normal reaction you will see with any motor/ generator combination where there are iron cores in the coils.

When the opposition magnets are put in place the rpm of the motor goes up to what it was before the 12 coils with iron cores were put in place and the amp draw goes down to what it was before the 12 coils with the iron cores were added.

So now you are back to paying for two things: 1. The cost of running the motor in the first place 2. The additional cost of turning the weighted rotor.

When the generator is put under load the motor speeds up to an RPM greater than that which it attained when running on 24 volts with NO rotor in place. The amp draw of the motor is LESS than what it was running on 24 volts with no rotor in place.

These are the facts. Believe them or don’t. But don’t tell me they are not the facts when you have not built the machine. I don’t kneed your theories or your thoughts. I need your actual observations of a working machine.

[BroMikey]

Dave is right of course, when a regular motor is connected to a generator
shaft and current begins to be drawn off the generator side, the motor
amp draw climbs up proportionally.

So conventional is more amps in to get more amps out, simple.

With these new generator heads input amp draw remains constant. The
amp draw does not change from idling all the way up to full load. The
reasons for this has been explained. The reasons are above most
peoples ability to grasp and this is because they have not understood
the motor generators running for the past 100 years.

It is time for a cool change. Thx to Dave's hammering you
guys might catch on. imagine that.

[bistander]

New claim

Quantum_Well,
You ASSUME the generator is acting as a magnetic brake because you haven’t built the machine nor tested it and know NOTHING about it.

When the motor is run on 24 volts all by itself, it runs at one speed and amp draw. When the rotor with magnets is added that speed goes down slightly and the amp draw goes up slightly. When the 12 coils with iron cores are placed in proximity to the rotor the rpm of the motor goes down and the amp draw goes up.

So far this is all normal reaction you will see with any motor/ generator combination where there are iron cores in the coils.

When the opposition magnets are put in place the rpm of the motor goes up to what it was before the 12 coils with iron cores were put in place and the amp draw goes down to what it was before the 12 coils with the iron cores were added.

So now you are back to paying for two things: 1. The cost of running the motor in the first place 2. The additional cost of turning the weighted rotor.

When the generator is put under load the motor speeds up to an RPM greater than that which it attained when running on 24 volts with NO rotor in place. The amp draw of the motor is LESS than what it was running on 24 volts with no rotor in place.

These are the facts. Believe them or don’t. But don’t tell me they are not the facts when you have not built the machine. I don’t kneed your theories or your thoughts. I need your actual observations of a working machine.

When the generator is put under load the motor speeds up to an RPM greater than that which it attained when running on 24 volts with NO rotor in place. The amp draw of the motor is LESS than what it was running on 24 volts with no rotor in place.

Hi Turion,

This appears to be a new claim. Up until now, it has been that the motor speeds up under load compared to no load, rotor, cores and coils in place for both measurements. Please support your new claim.

Regards,

bi

[Turion]

New Claim?

This is not a “new” claim. This is EXACTLY what I have said all along. From DAY ONE. Just because YOU haven’t bothered to read the threads is not MY fault. I’m sure that I have said this EXACT same thing SEVERAL times over the years. And YES it is ALSO a speed up over what it is WITH the rotors and coils with iron cores in place, which I ALSO said. My machine is adjusted so there is NO speed up under load. Just NEUTRAL. Because THAT is the point where you get the MOST output from the generator. You CAN have “speed up under load” but the generator output goes down. Why would I want THAT? But just because I don’t WANT it doesn’t mean it isn’t possible. You have to take the input in volts and amps to the motor and compare it to the output in volts and amps from the generator to see where you want your machine to operate. ANY change to the EXACT specs I gave for this machine affects those numbers. And by the way, better that 80% of the input to run the motor CAN be recovered. That is also a fact. If you use the modified motor and IF you use the correct circuit. Peter demonstrated the recovery at the conference. I have been saying it for YEARS. Just because YOU haven’t seen it doesn’t mean it isn’t real.

bi,
I owe you absolutely NOTHING. I have provided information and an opportunity. That is all I am going to provide. I have gone WAY out of my way to help committed people replicate any part of this they choose to replicate. What you do or don’t do with it is up to you. I could care less. We have moved on way past this machine simply because it is obsolete. Not because it doesn’t work. When I have TIME I will definitely put the generator back together, and when I do, I hope Aaron will let me show it at the conference. Then LOTS of folks can see it run and not on some silly video that could be faked anyway. Until then, do what you want. You have no idea how hard we laugh at you because of what we know that you don’t, and all because you are too stubborn to listen. But life is about choices. You make yours, and I will make mine.

[bistander]

Claim

This is not a “new” claim. This is EXACTLY what I have said all along. From DAY ONE. Just because YOU haven’t bothered to read the threads is not MY fault. I’m sure that I have said this EXACT same thing SEVERAL times over the years. And YES it is ALSO a speed up over what it is WITH the rotors and coils with iron cores in place, which I ALSO said. My machine is adjusted so there is NO speed up under load. Just NEUTRAL. Because THAT is the point where you get the MOST output from the generator. You CAN have “speed up under load” but the generator output goes down. Why would I want THAT? But just because I don’t WANT it doesn’t mean it isn’t possible. You have to take the input in volts and amps to the motor and compare it to the output in volts and amps from the generator to see where you want your machine to operate. ANY change to the EXACT specs I gave for this machine affects those numbers. And by the way, better that 80% of the input to run the motor CAN be recovered. That is also a fact. If you use the modified motor and IF you use the correct circuit. Peter demonstrated the recovery at the conference. I have been saying it for YEARS. Just because YOU haven’t seen it doesn’t mean it isn’t real.

bi,
I owe you absolutely NOTHING. I have provided information and an opportunity. That is all I am going to provide. I have gone WAY out of my way to help committed people replicate any part of this they choose to replicate. What you do or don’t do with it is up to you. I could care less. We have moved on way past this machine simply because it is obsolete. Not because it doesn’t work. When I have TIME I will definitely put the generator back together, and when I do, I hope Aaron will let me show it at the conference. Then LOTS of folks can see it run and not on some silly video that could be faked anyway. Until then, do what you want. You have no idea how hard we laugh at you because of what we know that you don’t, and all because you are too stubborn to listen. But life is about choices. You make yours, and I will make mine.

Hi Turion,

As per usual, you cannot simply supply claim support, a reference or evidence that I request. I've not been a member as long you. But in my four and a half years, I've read every post of yours concerning motors and generators, and posts on the subject by anyone else. This is the first time I've seen a claim that:

#1.) A motor runs at no load without a rotor attached to its external shaft at a certain RPM and current draw (amps), say from a 24V battery.
#2.) A generator's rotor is connected to that motor shaft with generator coils connected to a load, while the source 24V battery remains the same, and the motor increases RPM and reduces current draw(amps) compared to the values seen on #1.

That was your new claim. You say it is not a new claim. Please show me where you have demonstrated or otherwise claimed it previously. Or where anyone has ever done this.

Otherwise if you can't, then I say you're just pulling BS out of the blue. And don't try to put it on me. How can any reasonable human being expect someone else to search for, find or prove something he doesn't believe exist?

Regards,

bi

[Turion]

Time

bi,
Nor am I going to waste MY time trying to go back and find this information just to prove it to YOU. You are not worth my time. I’ve said it before. I know I have. Take it or leave it. I really don’t care.

[bistander]

But you don't mind waisting others' time

bi,
Nor am I going to waste MY time trying to go back and find this information just to prove it to YOU. You are not worth my time. I’ve said it before. I know I have. Take it or leave it. I really don’t care.

Just like you. You come to a thread which I started (can't say it is my thread.... Aaron owns it), you make a new claim and then refuse to support that claim. This is just another example of you stating falsehoods. I certainly don't believe anything you say.

Regards,

bi

[Turion]

Replications

If you will remember, I have a detailed history of my generator. Matt built the first one, which worked. I built a medium sized one, which worked, so I built a big one, which also worked. Then Matt decided he would share a small prototype that EVERYONE could replicate, because my big machine is just too expensive. But because of people like YOU, he abandoned that project. I have one of the prototypes and I also had it up and running. Oh,and it worked.

Here is the post where he disclosed data on THAT machine and a video of it running. Now you can call us liars. We don’t care. The TRUTH is that we have built machines that we have had up and running on the bench to put meters on and actually measure things. All YOU have is your opinion and your mouth. Neither are worth anything.

—————

https://youtu.be/yjT-KHowI6I

So here is a little video of the gen running. Shows some of its potential.
In actual fact is I have one coil that is short of wire and it is bogging down the gen under load about 140 rpms. But I'll get that fixed.
Overall the motor is cranking out really well at 5000+ rpms with gen at idle at 25 volt 3 amp. The gen is putting out 80+ volt open with no load.

The great thing about this little setup is the gen peaks its its current while running the motor about 8 volt (1500 rpm) and after that it winds up the voltage. All generators may be like that I am not positive. But at high rpms you get small voltage drop and all your current is available.

I am pretty positive now that I know the current draw of the motor under load I can get the driver going and least cut that in half.

Dave's version of the gen is speeding up under load at least at the moment without rectifying the output. He'll be home next week to add the rectifiers.

I hesitate to put out any literature on the gen until he tested his. We are also going to have results on a different build of the same model.

So before the gen is published I hope to have the motor driver running.

Stay Tuned.
Matt

[bistander]

Thanks

If you will remember, I have a detailed history of my generator. Matt built the first one, which worked. I built a medium sized one, which worked, so I built a big one, which also worked. Then Matt decided he would share a small prototype that EVERYONE could replicate, because my big machine is just too expensive. But because of people like YOU, he abandoned that project. I have one of the prototypes and I also had it up and running. Oh,and it worked.

Here is the post where he disclosed data on THAT machine and a video of it running. Now you can call us liars. We don’t care. The TRUTH is that we have built machines that we have had up and running on the bench to put meters on and actually measure things. All YOU have is your opinion and your mouth. Neither are worth anything.

—————

https://youtu.be/yjT-KHowI6I

So here is a little video of the gen running. Shows some of its potential.
In actual fact is I have one coil that is short of wire and it is bogging down the gen under load about 140 rpms. But I'll get that fixed.
Overall the motor is cranking out really well at 5000+ rpms with gen at idle at 25 volt 3 amp. The gen is putting out 80+ volt open with no load.

The great thing about this little setup is the gen peaks its its current while running the motor about 8 volt (1500 rpm) and after that it winds up the voltage. All generators may be like that I am not positive. But at high rpms you get small voltage drop and all your current is available.

I am pretty positive now that I know the current draw of the motor under load I can get the driver going and least cut that in half.

Dave's version of the gen is speeding up under load at least at the moment without rectifying the output. He'll be home next week to add the rectifiers.

I hesitate to put out any literature on the gen until he tested his. We are also going to have results on a different build of the same model.

So before the gen is published I hope to have the motor driver running.

Stay Tuned.
Matt

Well Turion, thanks for trying, but that video contradicts your latest claim. Matt claims motor no-load at 25V is 1.9A at 5300RPM. His test with the generator attached at 25V showed 3A and 5080RPM.

Regards,

bi

[Turion]

Lol

As usual, you pick out the part that you THINK you can use to discredit rather than focusing on the important parts. You are absolutely correct about the numbers you quoted. So with the coils in place that machine drew more amps than WITHOUT them in place. It had NO magnetic neutralization in place, so that’s exactly what I SAID happens. That supports MY position that coils (with iron cores)in place cause magnetic DRAG that magnetic opposition neutralizes.

What you miss out on is how much it took to turn the motor and how much the generator was putting OUT. Did you happen to notice THOSE numbers? And that was without running it on the proper circuit and recovering 80% (or more) of the input.

[bistander]

Changed the subject.... as usual

As usual, you pick out the part that you THINK you can use to discredit rather than focusing on the important parts. You are absolutely correct about the numbers you quoted. So with the coils in place that machine drew more amps than WITHOUT them in place. It had NO magnetic neutralization in place, so that’s exactly what I SAID happens. That supports MY position that coils (with iron cores)in place cause magnetic DRAG that magnetic opposition neutralizes.

What you miss out on is how much it took to turn the motor and how much the generator was putting OUT. Did you happen to notice THOSE numbers? And that was without running it on the proper circuit and recovering 80% (or more) of the input.

Turion,

Please stick to the subject. I am looking for you to support this new claim:

...
When the generator is put under load the motor speeds up to an RPM greater than that which it attained when running on 24 volts with NO rotor in place. The amp draw of the motor is LESS than what it was running on 24 volts with no rotor in place.
...

Or as I rewrote it:

... This is the first time I've seen a claim that:

#1.) A motor runs at no load without a rotor attached to its external shaft at a certain RPM and current draw (amps), say from a 24V battery.
#2.) A generator's rotor is connected to that motor shaft with generator coils connected to a load, while the source 24V battery remains the same, and the motor increases RPM and reduces current draw(amps) compared to the values seen on #1.

That was your new claim.
...

I acknowledge that you and Matt have built interesting apparatuses and commend you guys for that. I just want to see supporting evidence for the specific claim which you made and I have highlighted. Show me where you have made that claim before, or better yet where you have verified it. I don't think you can.

Regards,

bi

[Turion]

New claim

It is not a new claim. It is what I have always said. It costs you a certain amount to turn a rotor. When you understand magnetic neutralization and how to wind coils correctly it costs NOTHING more to add as many coils (with iron cores) around that rotor as you want. If you do it correctly, it can cost you LESS, but you do not get the maximum generated power. 👍

And when I get my generator back together I will be happy to show EXACTLY that at the next conference, if Aaron let’s me. I should be done in plenty of time for that.

[bistander]

New claim

It is not a new claim. It is what I have always said. It costs you a certain amount to turn a rotor. When you understand magnetic neutralization and how to wind coils correctly it costs NOTHING more to add as many coils (with iron cores) around that rotor as you want. If you do it correctly, it can cost you LESS, but you do not get the maximum generated power. 👍

And when I get my generator back together I will be happy to show EXACTLY that at the next conference, if Aaron let’s me. I should be done in plenty of time for that.

If it is not a new claim, then show me the post or other place where you made that specific claim. What you elaborate about above is not relevant to your new claim. You were very specific when you wrote this new claim even capitalizing several words. This is a new claim by you without foundation.

Regards,

bi