computer fan sg motor

[Jetijs]

Ok, I think I understood how this diode/scr triggering works now. So, look at the first picture again. We see that if the cap + terminal value is less or eaqual to the battery + terminal value - nothing will happen. We know that a voltage drop on a diode is somewhere about 0,5V, this meants that in order to trigger the SCR, the cap voltage must be at least 0.5V higher than the battery voltage. So, for example, if we want the SCR to trigger at 2V above the battery voltage, then we need to use 4 diodes in series. I hope I understood this right. Any comments are welcomed

Edit:
Ok, I played around with Ricks circuit. At first some pictures:







I wound two poles with 100 turns of AWG 27 or so wire and other two poles with 50 turns of gauge 21 wire. Soldered the circuit just like in the picture in my previous post, the one with no separate recovery winding. The only difference is that I did not have any SCRs around, so I did not use the cap and the cap triggering part, instead the recovery diode at the transistor collector was connected to the + of the charging battery and the negative terminal of the charging battery was connected to the negative lead of the primary power source. The base resistor was 47ohms with a 2k pot in series. When I finally got the rotor spinning, I noticed that I get the highest speed if my pot is turned to the least value leaving only 47Ohms for the base resistance. I could get about 2000 RPMs at 12V and about 1.8A The base resistor got really hot after a while (I used 2W resistor). I noticed that there is a sweetspot in the primary power source voltage. I used an adjustable voltage power supply as the primary power source. When I turned the voltage up till 12v the rotor spinned faster and faster, but if I got above that, the amp draw increased up to 4A and the rotor slowed down till it stopped. I can't understand this...

[ren]

Nice work Jet.

Check out my post about alternate tuning sg theres a diagram there as to how I set up the scr. Mine is the same as Ricks except the scr is in the positive leg. My understanding of the scr is that it is like a diode, but it has a gate function.

Here is a excerpt from Wikipedia.

" When the gate to cathode voltage exceeds a certain threshold, the device turns "on" and conducts current. The device will remain in the "on" state even after gate current is removed so long as current through the device remains above the holding current. Once current falls below the holding current for an appropriate period of time, the device will switch off."

I have been using a resistor in line with the diode that triggers the gate. I could be wrong but I think the voltage that builds up in the cap has to be strong enough to (a) be above the voltage of the cathode and (b) be high enough to overcome the resistance and diode to trigger the conduction.

Some one can set me straight if it isnt what is happening. Id be interested to see if there is much difference in having the scr in the positive leg or negative leg of the charging circuit.

[**~Imhotep~**]

i used rics circuit and did the dual transister design and all it did was rock back and forth and not fully spin up. any ideas? i used a smaller computer power supply fan which is a 3 inch. Could only get about 100 windings around each core. i used awg 26 wire. Any ideas why the motor would not spin up. I also tried one pole for power at 100 turns of awg 26 and the next 90 degree pole with 250 turns of thinner wire which was the trigger pole and the same thing occured it just rocked back and forth. Used a 1000kpot and a neon for each section and used 2n3055 transistors and used ecg519 for the base and emitter diode. Tried single and dual circuit just rocked. any help would be great and would be appreciated

[ashtweth]

Jet did you see my posts dood?

Here is the fan test we did today charging two 1.3aH bats from one.
Panacea Bedini Motor charging two batteries

Next step s 4 from one, i still don't know how to hook the cap pulser on it to test.

[ren]

good work ash.

In regards to the cap pulser are you reffering to the 555/opto and SCR version? I can locate a schematic if it helps, I assume you are using the standard cap and scr on that video.

[Jetijs]

Ash - great video
Can you tell me your circuit specs? How many turns of what gauge wire? What is the base resistance? RPM's? Looks very good. Why don't you try the cap pulser setup I posted above? I would try this myself but I don't have any SCR's around.
As for the specs on the fanmod in my video. The input was 12V from a 7Ah battery, there was two trigger coils wired in series and two power coils also in series. All the windings were of gauge 24 wire, don't remember how many turns, I thing there were about 100 turns on each pole. I used only one transistor in that setup. Don't remember the base resistance but there was a tinny light bulb in series with the base resistance. That was the best setup I had so far with the best speed.

Thanks,
Jetijs

[ren]

Jet or others, can you tell me if you had to change the magnet strip for it to work? I am not sure on the pole orientation of mine...

[Jetijs]

No, I used the original magnets in the strip. They are oriented in NSNS fashion. I believe this is why you can not get it to work if you use one pole for trigger coil and the pole oriented 180 degree apart for power coil.

[ren]

cool thanks Jet, I just realised I had a bad clip connector. Its up and running now.


hmmmm. I am not sure if that is the configuration Jet. If it is a NSNS four pole then the norths would be 180 degrees opposite. In this case the trigger coil would NEED to be 180 degrees for it to trigger and fire on the north no? Perhaps 90 degrees trigger coils are triggering from the south pole, i.e. trigger windings switched.

Of course this wouldnt be a problem if it is NSNSNSNS 8 pole.....

hmmmm.

[ashtweth]

okay , yup....

ill try ANY thing you guys want me to try.. thats why we are all here to work together , will get the wire gauge and info off my technical assistant night and post, let me know EXACTLY (Ash is a bit of a Dumb aXX) what you want me to build and try and ill get my assistant to build and try it and post for you guys

Ash

[ashtweth]

Ash - great video
Can you tell me your circuit specs? How many turns of what gauge wire? What is the base resistance? RPM's? Looks very good. Why don't you try the cap pulser setup I posted above? I would try this myself but I don't have any SCR's around.
As for the specs on the fanmod in my video. The input was 12V from a 7Ah battery, there was two trigger coils wired in series and two power coils also in series. All the windings were of gauge 24 wire, don't remember how many turns, I thing there were about 100 turns on each pole. I used only one transistor in that setup. Don't remember the base resistance but there was a tinny light bulb in series with the base resistance. That was the best setup I had so far with the best speed.

Thanks,
Jetijs

Okay , it was the same specs that Rick recommends with his SCH posted above, got the gauge as per the specs Rick states Number 24 gauge or thinner, we used 24, couldn't tell you how many turns just know that we crammed them on there till they we almost busted the plastic as rick said to do. Not sure of the base resistance sorry Jetijs, would we have to pull the fan art to find out?

The Fan pulls about 200 mA to charge TWO 1.3 aH bats, at around 2000 RPM.
Okay taking a look at the cap pulse above.

[**~Imhotep~**]

multi success

7 replications, all computer fans ,some I used existing windings bifiller split the common then used fourth spot for additional pin scrapped original circuit like rick did all putting out radiant cold elec. some you could see in the neons purple brush like traces just above neon glow, used many close spec transistors didnt
matter all worked, parralleled output speeded up charging original rewind rocked because magnets on fans not monopole . wow easyist replications i have ever done recharged nihms ,lead acid, zink carbon ,alkaline. as back emf was funneled off to batts current draw on source kept dropping. wow it was in my face for 30 years, been a tech along time this is just the begining the potetial is mind boggling thanks rick ,bendini, lindemann grey, leedscalnin( magnetic current)
too excited sorry for any mis spellings, on to further adaptations will post results.!!!!!!! all other researchers on this project keep going this is huge!!!

[**~Imhotep~**]

pixs and thanx

didn't forget about thanking rick, gmeat ,ren .Jetijs .theremart and ashtweth the questions and answers helped me solve certain issues. will post details of quick and easy proof of concept and tech results. here is picture of purple brush traces that Peter Lindemann has refered to in his other projects.

[**~Imhotep~**]

36 volt total white brush dartlets wow

[ren]

Just built the cap pulser guys, it rocks! Put it on my fan for fun, building another for the bike wheel.