Thinking ahead to Prius conversion

[rickoff]

I have a 2007 Toyota Prius which I have been very happy with. I have averaged better than 54 miles per gallon of gas used, with no modifications to the original design. In looking ahead, though, I would like to be able to nearly eliminate the need for gasoline, and be able to run mainly with the electric motor. As a test, I took the Prius out on the highway at a speed of 65 miles per hour, and allowed the engine to run out of gas. I wanted to see how far I could then proceed on the 67 hp electric motor alone before the battery pack was depleted. I was able to go only 3 miles before this occurred, even though I slowly reduced my speed. I have read about conversions that replace the stock Panasonic 202 volt, 6.5 Amp-hour, 168 cell nickel metal hydride battery with one of greater capacity, and that utilize a home plug in attachment to maintain a relatively high charge prior to departing on the road, but such conversions are very expensive. One man I read about shelled out $32,000 to convert his brand new Prius. Also, once the higher capacity battery loses about half its charge, the gas engine will then kick in and work harder to maintain the charge. I have thought about Hydrogen boosting, as I currently do with my Mazda pickup truck, and that would definitely get me more miles per gallon. Even with Bob Boyce's Prius installation, though, he only achieved around 60 mpg at best. So I am wondering what might be the most cost effective way to keep my stock Panasonic battery optimally charged without relying on the gas engine. The Prius is designed to keep the battery charged to between 40% and 60% of capacity, as that provides for longest battery life of about 10 years. This also provides a reserve capacity to store energy from regenerative braking, which is important in the Prius. The Prius system actually uses two motor/generators to provide both motive and regenerative power. So without changing any of that, it seems that if I could maintain the battery at say 55 percent of charge with some added charging device, the gas engine would not need to kick in at all, except for high speed, hill climbing, and acceleration assistance requirements. For those reading this post, what would you suggest as the most cost effective method of maintaining the battery charge? Perhaps a self-oscillating solid state device? I'd love to hear what John Bedini, Tom Bearden, and Peter Lindemann would suggest, and I welcome thoughts from all interested forum members.

My best regards to all,

Rickoff

[ashtweth]

rickoff's , Bob Boyce converted his with a simple brute force Hydroxy booster, but you can get almost as good (i am told better) by doing what the guys for silicon chip magazine did so look for (its an Aussie mag) silicon chip and try to contact these two guys

Performance electronics for cars--Mag
silicon chip--Mag

julian edgar
john clark

Ask them about the modification they did on their Prius they got better then Bob boyce with out a booster just by tweaking, so imagine both systems. Rickoff, thats a good attitude, don't be satisfied till perfection, you can get more

Ash

[rickoff]

Re: Silicon Chip mag article

Hi Ash,

Thanks for the suggestion. I believe this is the article you are referring to:
Silicon Chip Online - How to get more than 100 MPG from a Toyota Prius

From what is described in the article leader on this page, the modification consisted of adding a large Lithium-Ion battery pack and using E-blocks and Flowcode as a control system. The result was a 100 mpg Prius.

Another Lithium-Ion battery pack conversion, by HyMotion, converts the Prius to a 100 to 150 mpg plug-in Hybrid. 150 MPG Toyota Prius with aftermarket lithium-polymer battery pack Recharging from home AC takes 6 hours, and allows you to drive 40 miles before the LI battery is depleted, at which time the stock Prius system takes over.

Now both of these aftermarket systems would be nice to have, but are very costly. The price of the HyMotion system, for example, is about $10,000 installed. My preference, as mentioned in my first post, is to find a way to keep the stock NiMh battery charged without using the gas engine to do that. I basically want to utilize a "free energy" device, either solid state or electromechanical, to keep my battery charged as I drive. It would have to be a device capable of maintaining a single battery which is always under load, so no battery swapping or on-off interruption pulsing cycles could be utilized in charging the 201.6 volt NiMh battery pack.

Any other ideas?

Added footnote: I did send an e-mail inquiry to Julian Edgar, and received a quick response from him advising me to look at the modification articles at AutoSpeed.com. I found a regenerative braking modification there that will yield better gas mileage during times when light braking activity occurs. See Browser Warning for the modification. I will incorporate that idea, however nearly all our driving is done under highway conditions requiring very little braking. I will continue my quest, and welcome all suggestions.

Best regards,

Rickoff

[ashtweth]

Thanks for that info Rickoff , ill add it in the EV write ups i am doing

Okay let me think, what about Bob's modification? You only need an inverter, Variac and of cause a 101 plates . He does have a sophisticated set up which he dials in for the power. Okay ill ask Bob and post that in the hydroxy forum for you

[rickoff]

Boyce setup

Hi Ash,

I have already looked into the Boyce 101 plate system, and have a copy of the d9.pdf document which provides full construction details. I downloaded that from the Peswiki site at and I know you also have that file at Panacea. At this point I'm not sure what I will actually end up deciding upon for my Prius conversion. Perhaps it will be a combination of things. There is absolutely no room in the engine compartment for the addition of any device larger than a harmonica, so if I use something like the Boyce system then it has to go inside the cargo area beneath the hatchback door. That worries me somewhat, because of the long routing of the HHO supply tube to the engine, which must either pass directly through the passenger area, or directly below it. Also, the only separation between the electrolyzer and the passenger area would be the back seat. And as I pointed out in my first post on this thread, I would still be buying gas. The Boyce electrolyzer is not a total solution. If I add a device of any size to my cargo area, then I would prefer to add something that is a battery charging device rather than a fuel device. And to that end I am open to all suggestions. If I can't come up with a suitable battery charging option for my 202 volt NiMh battery, then I will probably opt for using metal hydride hydrogen storage tanks that I can recharge at home. United Nuclear United Nuclear - Hydrogen Fuel Systems uses a set of 4 small tanks in the cargo area of their 350 Corvette to achieve a range of 350 miles on hydrogen only. They have developed a new "Smart Tank" system which should increase the Corvette's range to 450 miles. So just think of the range that my fuel thrifty Prius could achieve in comparison! I should be able to go 1,000 miles or more on 4 of the small tanks while another set is being recharged, and never buy gasoline again. This type of conversion would cost about half as much as the HyMotion LI battery pack addition mentioned in my last post. And if I use a Bedini machine and solar panels to power the Hydrogen generator then my refills will have zero cost beyond the initial investment. I am still open to any battery charging ideas, though, so will gladly consider any and all suggestions along those lines of thought.

Thanks, Ash, and best regards to all,

Rick

[Redmeanie]

Here You Go...

I just saw this and thought about what you want to do...Click here and go about 4 issues down! Silicon Chip did a write up on how to do a 100mpg Prius..

Magazines - Silicon Chip - 2008

[ashtweth]

Lee you are fox man
Rickoff, do yoiu know i mean the Brute force 100 cell ? Thats the one Bob uses in his

[rickoff]

Replies

Lee and Ash,

Yes, if you look back through my posts you will see that I am aware of the Bob Boyce Prius conversion and the Silicon Chip magazine Prius conversions too, and also the reasons why I don't want to go either of those routes. Both conversions are expensive, and neither is a complete solution for me that would eliminate use of gasoline. That's why I would prefer to either use a battery charging solution, or convert to metal hydride Hydrogen storage cylinders - "Smart Tanks," as mentioned in my last post.

Any more ideas?


Thanks, Rick

[Bob Boyce]

Any progress Rick? It's been a long time since your last post.

I don't hypermile my Prius, so without the booster running I only get about 42-45 MPG. In fact, I drive it fairly aggressive. The booster I run now is a complete B3 kit from Hydrogen Garage, with the current regulator set to 5 amps. The system is wired up to my hybrid drive system so that the booster is on only when the engine is running. The B3 is so small that it can be installed in the drivers side front fender of the newer Prius models, but in my older NHW11 Prius I put it into the passender side rear fender - opposite of the 12V battery.

I did a plug-in mod on my Prius for a while. I had added a couple of used NHW11 HV battery packs and a switching interface. I charged those added HV battery packs from solar power when I was parked at home. Problem was, I travel too much to rely on the solar charging at home. So I removed the added HV battery packs and went back to just the single original factory HV battery.

I then built a HV version of my toroidal system for the factory HV battery. It sends charge all of the time, whether I am driving or parked, I really need to set up a SOC monitor to shut down the charging when the HV battery gets up to around 95% SOC because it will overcharge if I do not shut it down during extended parking. The higher voltage of my NHW11 HV battery as compared to the newer model Prius HV battery makes messing with this a lot more dangerous.

Bob Boyce

[ashtweth]

Hi Bob good to see you back!!

Rick.Bob et ALL. Looks like Dr Derek has also been getting some success boosting a Prius with a HYDROGEN (not hydroxy) gas splitter. You can get kits or make them from open source plans.

we just finished and install on a 2010 Prius, we averaged mpg on city streets of between 75 and 100 miles per gallon in rush hour traffic. Speed of 40 mpg consistently was at the 100 mpg mark, I took some pics will send them tonight of the install and dash mpg readout.

http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/8206/priustwo.jpg
http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/5...laywhh2ins.jpg

Of cause prob wont compare to Bob's big unit, you get a great brute force 101 pate cell and a RESEARCH resonance prototype with Bob's, you cant get that out of a normal hydroxy booster

Ash

[renaud67]

I then built a HV version of my toroidal system for the factory HV battery. It sends charge all of the time, whether I am driving or parked, I really need to set up a SOC monitor to shut down the charging when the HV battery gets up to around 95% SOC because it will overcharge if I do not shut it down during extended parking. The higher voltage of my NHW11 HV battery as compared to the newer model Prius HV battery makes messing with this a lot more dangerous.

Bob Boyce

Hello Bob,
is your setup is avalaible or could it be for the new model of prius ?
How many does it cost?
Reagards
renaud

[ashtweth]

Guys guess what is worth the most in the prius? Its not the car or the engine its the steering or breaking system which is worth a lot Just spoke to some one who got it repaired cant remember which one it was , be careful when driving that car!

[renaud67]

One could be wound for the lower voltage of the newer model 168 cell HV Prius battery (nominal 202V), similar to the one I wound for the older model 228 cell HV Prius battery (nominal 274V) in my Prius.

I am not taking on any more independent evaluators for testing prototypes of my toroidal charging system. This is due to several information leaks from members of the earlier evaluation group. Leaks that did not help others to replicate the board design due to specialty component specifications that were not shared with the evaluators. However, I might consider a "black box" type of test for a Prius setup, where the board is sealed in a faraday cage, potted in epoxy.

Cost is relative, as the cost on my earlier prototype boards worked out to be about $300 per board due to the specialty components required. It was amusing to see those that attempted to copy my board, comparing the design to a simple $30 PIC or Arduino board. They found out otherwise when they failed.

Bob Boyce

Hello Bob,
I know your problems with several of your prototypes ... testers
I think that 300$ is much lower than the first kit (I guess engine.us :PHEV 2KWH Kit for $1,995) to expand the batteries capacity.
you should consider that.

regards
renaud