The Dipole

[Sephiroth]

Hi Allcanadian,

I like how you compare em forces with physical ones. What I found most interesting is the comparison between inductance and inertia.

but in the physical world, inertia is pretty much a constant. For example, and object will show x amount of resistance to changes in velocity and that object will then require x amount of force to bring it back to its original velocity.

But with electronics we can play around with this rule.

If we were to use a standard bedini circuit as an example, say we charged 2 coils in parellel and it took x amount of energy to get the "electrons" up to speed. We then discharge the coils in parellel and they then apply x amount of force to the charging battery.

But what if we set it up so that there was less inductance (inertia) when charging the coils and more inductance (inertia) the moment they discharge.

In the physical world, wouldn't this be the equivalant of using 1 joule of force to bring an object up to 1 km/h and then it exerting 2 joules of force once it hits something?

To give you an example of a circuit that I think incoporates 2-stage inductance see the schematic below. This is the circuit I am currently testing. It isn't showing twice the input on the output but charge rate is still good.

note. I try alot of variations of John's circuits and as usual I do not suggest that it is an imporvement over the original circuit. I try variations just to see what happens so I can better my understanding. This is just an experimental model.

[Allcanadian]

@Sephiroth

But what if we set it up so that there was less inductance (inertia) when charging the coils and more inductance (inertia) the moment they discharge.

LOL, I like your style, we should never be afraid to think outside the box. It seems that it's always the things I can't imagine that hinder my success and once realized I wonder how I could have missed something so simple.

[Shamus]

All models break down at certain points, you just have to know where and when that happens. For example, General Relativity is a better model than Newtonian Mechanics, but it doesn't mean that NM isn't a good description for around 99% of all cases we care to think about.

At any rate, I was thinking about those mechanical analogies and how they relate to, say, a simple relation like E = IR. Using the mechanical analogies, this means that Pressure and/or Force = Velocity x Friction which makes sense, at least to me. Some investigation into relations like these may yield fruit.

[patmac]

Battery Charged - > Low Impendance
Battery Discharged - > High Impendance

Capacitor Discharged - > Low Impendance
Capacitor Charged - > High Impendance


Battery is air pressured and capacitor is a vaccum pump

[Sephiroth]

i just figured it out... the scenario I posted above does indeed work with the analogy of kinetic energy.

Let's say the two coils are charged in parellel using 1 amp, so that would be 500ma per coil.

Then they are discharged in series therefore doubling the inductance (inertia).

Well inertia can be thought of as MASS!

So if we were to put this in physical terms, a 1kg object is brought up to 1 meter per second using 0.5 joules (this is the charging of the parellel coils) and then we are adding an extra kilo to the object that is already in motion which slows it down. As the energy is conserved, this brings the object down to 0.7 meters per second but it now weighs 2kg.

So it looks like in the scenario above, with perfect inductors, the flyback current from the coils in series would be 30% less than if they were discharged in parellel but this causes an interesting phenomonon as I pointed out in the Bedini Scope Shots thread where the time of the flyback current is extended.

There are other interesting effects but I'm not telling yet more tests needed.

[gotoluc]

For example take a 12v battery connect a 6v low turn(resistance) AC motor or rectified DC motor and a 24v/1000uF cap in series. The cap charges and the textbooks tell me I must discharge the cap for the circuit to perform work again as the cap cannot discharge into the battery at the same potential. But instead of wasting energy by discharging the cap I charge a seperate large self-inductance (coil)with the 12v battery and use the high potential inductive discharge from the inductive coil to discharge the cap in an opposite direction through the motor into the battery--a charging condition. In this case the inductive discharge acts as a switching mechanism setting the whole series circuit (battery,motor,cap) into a series of oscillations and the motor spins performing work. I have discharged the battery in charging the seperate inductive coil but I have also charged the battery near equally through the cap and motor with the inductive discharge, the energy dissipating as a series of oscillations in the circuit including the battery. I am not claiming anything here, I am just pointing out that you will not find this circuit in any text book, I designed it based on a very simplistic understanding of the properties and of the components and qualities of current.

Hi Allcanadian,

I'm happy to see you at the Energetic Forum and hope you enjoy the quality of the group here.

I have been playing around with series circuits for a couple of weeks now and enjoy seeing the different effects. Could you post the circuit you are mentioning above please. I would like to try it. I know your description explains it but I always have a mental block when reading and visualizing things I need pictures.

Thanks for your great sharing

Luc

[Allcanadian]

Hello Luc
I posted the circuit below on the left, Im pretty sure this is correct but I am doing it from memory, I will check my notes later when I get off work There is a certain quality that an inductive discharge has that allows it to blow through a coil or lightbulb with little effect, but as soon as even a small external current is applied then the inductive discharge will manifest it's power. So I simply added a DC motor to keep a small current flowing in the circuit, it is as if the small current acts as a braking force to the inductive discharge producing a larger current. The circuit to the right is similar, the inductor L1 opposes the input current pulse but the low turn motor will not offer as much opposition. When the current is cut off the motor acts as a generator and energizes the inductor. A single pulse of current to the circuit will magnetize the inductor for a few seconds which is quite a long time considering the duration of the input. I use this circuit to act as a super slow motion inductance when that property is required.
Regards
AC

[gotoluc]

Thanks for the quick reply Allcanadian

I've been playing with a dimmer switch, an inductor, a capacitor and a light bulb which are all in series and using 170vdc which comes from the 120vac grid through 1:1 isolation transformer, through a FWBR and on the DC legs is a 330uf 400v capacitor to clean the DC which gives me the 170vdc for the circuit.

I have an interesting revving sound I can create that sounds just like an electric motor but it is coming from my inductor (no motor attached)

I'll shoot a video of it tomorrow since it's easier to understand when you see and hear it. I'm not claiming anything here, it's just interesting.

Thanks for the circuit ... I have an excellent DC motor for the test, it puts out about 2 watts just by turning the shaft by hand, so once the momentum is going it can put back much of the power. I'll try it tomorrow.

Stay tuned for the video

Luc

[gotoluc]

Hi everyone,

here is the video I said I would do of the Inductor revving sound.

Link: Inductor Inertia Sound Demonstration test - Energetictube.com - Where technology goes LIVE!

Luc

[Allcanadian]

@luc
Excellent job, I think you are going to find a simple truth very few people understand. That is transistors, contacts and other switching mechanisms are obsolete and not needed, they hinder the efficiency of circuits. The inductive discharge can add to the input or it can stop the input current or both producing a true self-oscillating circuit. The benefits of this should be obvious---there is almost no limitation on the potential or current other than the conductors themselves, you can switch thousands of amps at thousands of volts at very high frequencies.
Regards
AC

[gotoluc]

@luc
Excellent job, I think you are going to find a simple truth very few people understand. That is transistors, contacts and other switching mechanisms are obsolete and not needed, they hinder the efficiency of circuits. The inductive discharge can add to the input or it can stop the input current or both producing a true self-oscillating circuit. The benefits of this should be obvious---there is almost no limitation on the potential or current other than the conductors themselves, you can switch thousands of amps at thousands of volts at very high frequencies.
Regards
AC

Thanks Allcanadian

Luc

[bobo36us]

Allcanadian, Gotoluc, all..........

many of you in this thread have a pretty good understanding of the dipole, and radiant energy. Can you guys give me some feedback on a question I had a few weeks ago?


Background
The bigger the "Inductor", the bigger the "Inductance", correct?

Example: On Page 25 of this document http://free-energy-info.co.uk/Newman1.pdf Joe Newman states that if we take an air coil of 40 gauge wire , 1000 feet long, and having a resistance of 1,049 ohms, then pulse a 100 Volt, 95 Milliamp current to it, that the resulting inductance would be .003 henries. No big deal, right?

But then he goes on to say, that if we take that same 100 Volt, 95 Milliamp current and put it into a much larger coil, say 5 gauge wire, measuring 3,348,000 feet, to EQUAL the EXACT same resistance as above of 1,049 ohms, that the inductance is now a phenomenal 8,000,000 times greater, or a whopping 25,700 Henries!


Question
Why aren't we just pulsing larger coils????
Why do we need motors, spinning magnets, spinning wheels, rotors, brushes, commutators, etc.

Wouldn't it be simpler just to pulse larger coils with a chip or oscillator?

Obviously, the example above with 3,348,000 feet of 5 gauge wire (and weighing 335,469 pounds) is a little extreme, but what about 10 pound coils, or 20 pound coils, or 50 pound coils?

What about wrapping some coils of wire around that car sitting in our driveway or garage that never moves. Would the iductance created be the equivilant of a much larger coil?

If any of this sounds viable, what would such a circuit look like? Anything like this?

[Sephiroth]

You pay for higher inductance. As Allcanadian said, inductance can be thought of as inertia.

So if we have low inductance we can charge a coil very quickly with a very sharp short pulse. With high inductance it will take longer to charge the coil to the same level using the same voltage.

[Gre]

What about wrapping some coils of wire around that car sitting in our driveway or garage that never moves.

What would this achieve?

[Allcanadian]

@bobo36us

Why aren't we just pulsing larger coils????
Why do we need motors, spinning magnets, spinning wheels, rotors, brushes, commutators, etc.
Wouldn't it be simpler just to pulse larger coils with a chip or oscillator?

The question I would ask is why? What is it you expect to gain from pulsing a large coil? If there was a gain in energy what is the mechanism for this gain? If I had to guess I would say the very long conductors produces a time delay between the energy entering the wire and leaving, this time delay produces capacitive effects between the conductors. In which case you may be right Take a very large coil and pulse it with fast rising and falling (impulsive) potentials. The higher the potential voltage the larger the capacitive effects, so the qualities of the current applied and the properties of the circuit will determine the effects produced.