The Great Global Warming Swindle

[Shamus]

Thanks for that Peter. Here's even more good news: Scientists are starting to speak out against the manmade global warming agenda being pushed by the IPCC and Al Gore.

.: U.S. Senate Committee on Environment and Public Works :: Minority Page :.

[ANTIQUER]

Science & observation & fanatics, Oh My!

Hi Jibb;

As far as the changes in the permafrost and polar ice caps the video Peter posted contained scientific charts and observations which showed this has happened before, sometimes to an even greater degree, but eventually reversed and stabilized. I'm not looking for a discussion here, just using this to make a point.

I think this illustrates the problem in a nutshell. Everyone has their own set of data to support their opinion while ignoring other data for whatever reason.

Here's a video I haven't seen mentioned here which seems to suggest our own pollution is keeping us cooler, not warmer.

NOVA | Dimming the Sun | Discoveries in Global Dimming | PBS

I agree with Peter this should be studied by a competent panel of unbiased scientists who consider all the facts objectively, but where to find them? Especially since they always seem to be financed by some hidden agenda. How do we eliminate the political/financial special interests who motivate the fanatics? Looks like it will take someone above our pay grade to figure all that out, providing they even exist.

Meantime, I agree with Ash we should concentrate on just cleaning the environment up for the reasons he gave until someone comes up with a viable solution to "Global Warming", if there is one.

Al

[Peter Lindemann]

More Recent news

Hi Guys,

Here's a link to an article from BBC about the recent Climate Conference that just concluded in Poznan, Poland. The main issues are Political maneuvering, funding for Developing Countries, Carbon Taxes, etc.

BBC NEWS | Science & Environment | Mood mixed as climate summit ends

Peter

[ashtweth]

Thanks for all the links Peter . Updating the pages with them.

Ash

[jibbguy]

What is "cyclical" iyo? And does that matter anyway it's if happening now?

It's interesting that "Chemtrails", are by definition, "pollution"

Regarding just how long it's been since the millions of acres of permafrost now quickly thawing has been frozen, and what that means...

Ground Frozen Since Ice Age Thaws and Collapses | LiveScience

Climate warning as Siberia melts - environment - 11 August 2005 - New Scientist

U.S. Geological Survey
Climate Change Impacts on the US: Alaska. Educational Resources

 Alaska permafrost thawing, Siberia frozen peat bogs melting, Arctic Yedoma releasing hot spots of bubbling methane    The WE News Archives      

Melting of permafrost could trigger rapid global warming warns UN

[vzon17]

Trigger???

Melting of permafrost could trigger rapid global warming warns UN[/QUOTE]

Ah ha ha ha ha, pretty dam funny, sunset could trigger darkness too, we are all doomed !!

The UN has about as much credibility as hollywood in my book.

Nothing personal against you jibbguy keep up your posts, its good to have lots of info.

The reason people attack the messenger is that they know deep inside that its balloney and don't want to invest a lot of time gathering the facts to argue or debate with those that have taken it to themselves to own certain beliefs.
I can look at the belief of santa Claus and see it for what it is without a lot of scientific research or facts to back up my assesment. the same with global warming. once you know certain key facts then ten thousands points against it won't mean anything.

And this is because when you choose to believe something you can always find mountains of proof to support your belief. doesn't matter which side you choose.

And thene there is reality. it exists and functions regardless of what anybody believes or thinks. Base ones thinking on reality and a lot of stuff falls away.

So have you seen the tundra melting? probaly not, have you seen a polar bear? probably not, have you seen the water rise. probably not. All the info we get to support our sides is all hearsay on most levels. we don't need a commity of scientists to figure it out. all we need is one man that is submersed in the facts by dircet experience and measurment and then you have something to work with. Anything that has a political or news media source is by its very nature suspect and most likely false and dishonest and you will have a very high percentage of correctness by discounting those sources. included in those sources are any government involved studies.
If you fill your book with biased info you get a biased conclusion. that is why its a religion, because its a collection of believersl that have no facts to back up their beliefs. And thtey defend them with fanatic zeal.

So the way I approach it is I go against what the wide spread belief is and in most cases that is the reality of the situation, works in climate, works in health , works in energy, works in philosophy and politics. commonly held belief is usually wrong, so most people believ in man made global warming so I say there is a 99% chance they are full of it.
And gathering facts for one side and gathereing facts for the other side does not resolve that answer as there is some much info on either side. that more won't solve it.
So they say there is global warming caused by man, and they all fear the consequesces. so how do they know the consequensces are to be feared. maybe they are beneficial. Its all speculation.

[Peter Lindemann]

More Recent News

Hi Guys,

Here's the latest article from BBC. 2008 was cooler than last year and the coolest, overall global temperature since 2000. Predictions of "no further warming" in the next ten years clearly show the "Global Warming" bias as it is reported.

But the data is there. How embarrassing for the "true believers" as the CO2 rates continue to climb straight through the new cooling trend.

Enjoy,

Peter

BBC NEWS | Science & Environment | This year is coolest since 2000

[ashtweth]

Keep em coming please Peter. Does any one remember the Al Gore Doc where he stated that they the Congress, wrote a memo to politicans to go forth and give the impression to the public that global warming is more of a Myth then reality. Maybe that was part of his Disinfo tactics...dunno always wondered about that one

[vzon17]

Hi Guys,

Here's the latest article from BBC. 2008 was cooler than last year and the coolest, overall global temperature since 2000. Predictions of "no further warming" in the next ten years clearly show the "Global Warming" bias as it is reported.

But the data is there. How embarrassing for the "true believers" as the CO2 rates continue to climb straight through the new cooling trend.

Enjoy,

Peter

BBC NEWS | Science & Environment | This year is coolest since 2000

Well according to the finding by some scientists on the global warming swindle movie they figured out that the C02 follows global warming by 800 years, so if that is correct then the C02 rising now is from the warm globe 800 years ago.

USATODAY.com - Tree rings show Earth was warm 800 years ago

Co2 does not drive climate as it is only a tiny fraction of one percent of the air and the part that man creates is only a tiny fraction of that, which amounts to next to nothing. So if Co2 is rising as much as they say then its just part of the natrual cycle, the Ocean gives it off and absorbs it, its is our natural buffer of Co2, jelly fish farts, yikes

[Peter Lindemann]

New Discovery of Sun's Influence

Hi Guys,

Just ran into this. The article discusses the discovery of a rhythmic expansion and contraction of the Earth's atmosphere caused by the Sun. Very interesting.

Sun Induces Strange 'Breathing' of Earth's Atmosphere | Wired Science from Wired.com

Enjoy,

Peter

[jibbguy]

Perhaps some of you here are only interested in facts if they fit YOUR beliefs.

Regarding the arctic tundra melting.. Several years ago i did travel to Alaska and visited an Exxon facility there on business. Lol i had a chartered Alaska AL flight all to myself to Fairbanks, they really needed my services at the time . I also have film i shot that week of glacier faces falling off. That same glacier has moved back several kilometers since i have been alive; at a highly accelerated rate from previous centuries. I did see some permafrost melt (...and the ground WAS very dark when compared to snow... and absolutely covered with mosquitoes and other little flying bugs lol), but the point is that if you want to disbelieve established facts like this, then there is no reasonable argument to make with you.

Again with the "religion" ad hominems lol. It is meant to deflect from facts, and paint those that point out the facts as somehow "tainted" because of their excess zeal. But whether or not i or others are overzealous doesn't have a tinker' damn to do with the glaciers and permafrost melts. They do exist and any numbers of red herrings and straw men won't change that.

As i said the reasons for global warming/climate change are debatable. But the current physical results of it really are not. Until you show some proof that all these scientists, including NASA and Geo Survey peeps are lying about what is happening in the Arctic Circle, South America, New Zealand, Antarctica, the Alps, and elsewhere (many of whom are from foreign countries who don't give a damn about our "red and blue" politics)... Then it is rather silly to simply deny it.

Again, the sun COULD have something to do with it (...just as CO2 could); but taking some recent data and extrapolating it to be the reason of the current melt-off is rather tenuous.

[Peter Lindemann]

No Argument

Perhaps some of you here are only interested in facts if they fit YOUR beliefs.

Regarding the arctic tundra melting.. Several years ago i did travel to Alaska and visited an Exxon facility there on business. Lol i had a chartered Alaska AL flight all to myself to Fairbanks, they really needed my services at the time . I also have film i shot that week of glacier faces falling off. That same glacier has moved back several kilometers since i have been alive; at a highly accelerated rate from previous centuries. I did see some permafrost melt (...and the ground WAS very dark when compared to snow... and absolutely covered with mosquitoes and other little flying bugs lol), but the point is that if you want to disbelieve established facts like this, then there is no reasonable argument to make with you.

Again with the "religion" ad hominems lol. It is meant to deflect from facts, and paint those that point out the facts as somehow "tainted" because of their excess zeal. But whether or not i or others are overzealous doesn't have a tinker' damn to do with the glaciers and permafrost melts. They do exist and any numbers of red herrings and straw men won't change that.

As i said the reasons for global warming/climate change are debatable. But the current physical results of it really are not. Until you show some proof that all these scientists, including NASA and Geo Survey peeps are lying about what is happening in the Arctic Circle, South America, New Zealand, Antarctica, the Alps, and elsewhere (many of whom are from foreign countries who don't give a damn about our "red and blue" politics)... Then it is rather silly to simply deny it.

Again, the sun COULD have something to do with it (...just as CO2 could); but taking some recent data and extrapolating it to be the reason of the current melt-off is rather tenuous.

Dear Jibbguy,

I honestly believe that everyone in this thread agrees that the climate has been warming during most of the last century. Clear records show that this particular warming cycle began in about 1650. This was a full 100 years before the beginning of the "industrial revolution" and the slow beginning of the burning of coal to drive steam engines in the late 1700's. If there was no significant rise in CO2 levels between 1650 and 1780, then it is reasonable to ask what caused THAT warming?

It is also well documented that carbon burning increased rapidly after WW2, but global temperatures dropped from 1940 to 1970. What caused THAT cooling while CO2 levels were rising? These are reasonable questions.

Yes, the permafrost is melting. Yes, the glaciers are melting. The evidence is, as you say, overwhelmingly obvious. The intelligent and respectful discussion here is about WHY! We all would like to understand the genuine CAUSES of what we observe, and that includes Climate Change.

I would enjoy it if the TONE of this thread reverted to a more respectful and civil discussion, with plenty of room for differing points of view.

Peter

[anut]

Here are some comments from a near-death experience surviver (i.e. nder). This nder is not a scientist, but apparently he has predicted the 911 event before its happening:

"Our scientists, politicians, powerbrokers, celebrities, and talking heads in the media seem to be powerless and clueless in trying to explain why all these things are happening. Even on global warming, the scientists cannot seem to agree on what is causing the world to be so out of balance. Perhaps they are clueless because they are only looking on a physical level for an explanation for global warming, not recognizing that it may be what we are doing, or alternatively, what we are failing to do on a spiritual level that is affecting the planet in ways that cannot be explained through science. That is, unless scientists focus more attention on a super-microscopic level and recognize that the intelligent plan that guides the universe, the life force of energy that controls all particles of matter and all living things, has become so corrupted by an increase in dark energy that the planet and its inhabitants are reeling on a downward course into an abyss of chaos and confusion.

By tuning into the TV Weather Channel from the comfort of our homes, we can view global satellite images of the weather patterns that are affecting the planet, but we still cannot find an explanation for why the weather patterns are so out of balance. Perhaps what we all need is a Spiritual Weather Channel, so we can then view all of the destructive spiritual storms that are raging throughout the planet as a result of all the dark and negative energy created by the violence and war, the materialism and greed, and the disrespect for the sanctity of human life at all levels of life from conception to natural death, particularly with the unfettered experimentation on human life itself. Have you stopped to think for a moment how God is viewing our activities right now?"

Source: Mission of Angels Foundation - [ 2006 Messages ]

I am not sure if the so-called dark energy that this nder referred includes "fear". If it does, and given his track record is worth considering, perhaps we should stop killing our fellow human beings and other animals, because the fear of being killed is also a kind of fear. Our instinctive fear of being killed also logically makes the philosophy of killing universally unethical.

[CaptainScat]

we have a spiritual weather channel, the 700 club

as far as not killing goes does this extend to plants? and if no, why?
does this extend to microbes? and if no, why?

surely you realize life feeds on life?

[Peter Lindemann]

Lots of Fun!

Hi Guys,

Just a little bit of local news here from Spokane, in the Eastern Washington area. Today, the city and all outlying areas are completely shut down, after a record shattering snowfall of 17 inches in the 24 hour period that ended at midnight last night. The fun part is that it is STILL snowing, with no let-up in sight. Storm totals for Northern Idaho, including Coeur d'Alene and Post Falls are in the range of 32 inches so far, and growing.

Local TV programming is all Emergency Weather Alert up-dates on all channels. Police are telling everyone if you have a regular two-wheel drive car "don't even think about getting out and driving". Even 4 wheel drive vehicles are getting stuck and sliding off the freeway.

All schools, Universities, City Hall, Post Offices, Doctors offices are closed. All plowing crews are on 24 hour rotations with private contractors adding to the efforts.

Looking out the window as I write this I am seeing some of the heaviest snow of the storm with near "white-out" conditions.

Lots of Fun!

Peter