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  • Thanks, Carl.

    That's actually Chemelec's coil winding jig. And, yeah, the way it's all clamped, only the center can turn, on the inside.

    The needed size and inductance of your coil will depend on the size and weight of the magnet, as well as how quickly you can dump the power through the coil. The same number of Joules, in a shorter time, will produce a stronger kick against the magnet. Remember that power is energy divided by time. One Watt is a Joule applied over a period of one second. The same energy applied in a tenth of a second would produce 10 Watts of power. So your coil's time constant will be the limiting factor, although higher voltage will give you more amps, with a given resistance, and this will produce more power in a given amount of time. Your #20 gauge wire seems to be optimal.

    The core material could be soft iron (or ferrite), so that it doesn't retain a magnetic field. Copper coated welding rods work well, as does the black tie wire used with rebar. Some people even use threaded rod, as long as it isn't harder than Grade 3. Tesla used an air core, but remember his coil was a few feet in diameter, and wasn't used for magnetic repulsion.

    If you're hoping for Radiant Energy, you'll have to have biphasic power. You'll need to apply two signals to the bifilar coil, 180 degrees out of phase with each other, from oposite directions. The frequency of these signals should match the transit time of the coil, as if the coil were a long wire antenna. So the circuit will need two branches , with both branches having the coil as a common element. In the alternative, you could use a single circuit with a spark gap, and allow the spark's crackling to produce the phases, hit or miss, from moment to moment, with the phase variance resulting from the combination of two different frequencies, from the same direction. This will depend a lot on the length of your spark gap.

    It sounds like your upcoming power supply is biphasic. But the supply frequency will have to match the coil's resonance. You may have to build a stacked coil, and adjust the interlayer capacitance. And/or you may have to raise the frequency of the transformer. For instance, a transformer will also work at 6,000 Hz, if you had an inverter which ran at that frequency.

    Good luck with your project!
    Last edited by Electrotek; 01-06-2009, 04:03 AM.

    Comment


    • pendulum attempt with Gray Tube

      Originally posted by gmeat View Post
      @Aaron

      I was a little disappointed with the ending of that last video.Get that baby fired up already .-Gary
      lol - I thought I would spare everyone the video of me pinging my needle on my multimeter and a few other goofs

      I've been working on plans for a circuit with 2 ignition coils with a common ground that charge the HV cap radiantly. I only had 1 Mallory Pro Master and didn't want to buy another.

      Turns out when I just changed a valve cover gasket on one of my cars cause it was leaking oil into the plug well, I had to change the coils because they were getting cracks where the boot goes and the contacts were all corroded. I pulled them out and put in new ones.

      Sat here day before yesterday thinking that I need 2 ignition coils for my circuit, preferably the same coils and voila! Just realized that I had 2 like ignition coils sitting on my garage floor!

      Each coil has 2 secondary outputs - 2 of these coil modules for a 4 cylinder and the secondaries fire at the same time. Anyway, just very busy with business right now but I will get it running
      Sincerely,
      Aaron Murakami

      Books & Videos https://emediapress.com
      Conference http://energyscienceconference.com
      RPX & MWO http://vril.io

      Comment


      • Aaron,

        Talk about synchronicity! The Lord shall provide!

        @Everyone:

        Mark McKay just let me know that he's sending me another DVD photo disc through the mail. (4.8 gig) So I'll soon have some more pictures to analyze. If I find anything important, I'll post it.

        Comment


        • I have already built a small variable oscillator that I have set at 6kHz and I'm hoping to drive my HV transformer with it. The HV transformer will feed the Grays tube which has a spark device in it. The Grays tube will power the coil. Is this what you're referring to as single circuit with a spark gap?. If so, then the biphasic part about applying two signals from each end of the coil, and matching the frequency (propagation time of the signal?), will allow me to produce radiant energy without the use of the Grays tube?

          If I'm off on the wrong track here, just let me know and I'll wait till the books and video's get here to figure it out. How would one calculate the frequency of a long wire antenna? Sorry for all the questions.

          Thanks,
          Carl

          Comment


          • @Spearmaster:

            You're on the right track with your oscillator. Check the last few messages in the "Regarding The Ed Gray Motor" thread. Beshires1 has just made a breakthrough in the spark gap. His system produces a complex waveform rich in harmonics and assorted frequencies. You can use his system on the input of your Gray's Tube. Otherwise, you'll have to adjust the length of your spark gap to get just the right frequencies.

            You can produce Radiant Energy without the Gray's Tube. You may have to lower the capacitance of your coil, rather than raising it. To do this, leave a small space between the turns of the coil. It's going to take some experimenting to find out the correct configuration for your coil. Otherwise, just wind a coil and take the grid output from the Tube to the center of the coil, with the coil's outer wire grounded to the Tube's spark gap input. This would be much easier than calculating the coil parameters, as a stand alone system.

            The wavelength of a long wire antenna is equal to the speed of light divided by the frequency. This is presuming the velocity of the biphasic energy remains constant from one frequency to another.

            Comment


            • Gray tube progress

              Here are a couple pics and a circuit of what have on my bench. Again, I'm not looking to recreate the whole motor, just trying to see some radiant energy on the grids.

              Right now the circuit is just set up to single fire the spark. The HV coming off the coil I estimate to be about 8KV... which will jump about a .25" gap. When I put a diode from coil primary to HV, I can get a nice plasma spark. I used a carbon rod from a D-cell with smaller gauge wire, since I was unable to bore a hole for the large rod without shattering the carbon. I'll need to get a larger block of carbon.

              Recently I have added the reverse biased gang of diodes on the LV anode, and a 12V battery to give the diodes an initial forward bias. I also have a magnetic field shroud to place over the gap if I choose to. The gap I'm using is generally 1mm or less.

              Results so far are pretty dismal. My neon bulb placed from receiving grids to ground will flash when the coil is pulsed, but it flashes whether there is a spark or not. Apparently the capacitance of the grids is conducting a little energy to the load, but it is not enough energy to move a motor, even a small 3V DC motor. Also, with the diodes in place I only get a spark every few times I trigger it. They must be shutting down pretty quick.

              At this point I'm just starting to try a hundred variations on this theme, and looking to this group for some suggestions.

              My understanding of the radiant phenomenon from Gray, Lindemann, and Bearden tells me that this effect should show up with a single spark if the circuit is properly constructed. The big question is how to tune the circuit. All the specifics are strategically left out of the patent. I didn't get the feeling that he was creating a resonant circuit, but I could be wrong. Perhaps I shouldn't be using an ignition coil for my HV, since the spec is for a capacitive discharge to the spark. But a spark is a spark, and if it's properly quenched, shouldn't we see something?
              Attached Files

              Comment


              • @What The Flux: I'm having difficulty making out your circuit; all I can get is a tiny little image.

                Gray's Tube had both an inductive and a capacitive spark. His bridge rectifier charges the cap, but it also is connected to the spark gap. It may be that you need BOTH kinds of sparks to get the effect.

                Comment


                • To get the most out of your ignition coil (better spark) attach a automotive condenser across the negative source switching device. If you are using a relay, manual switch, or whatever. The automotive condenser will increase the ignition coils output greatly, and also, protect the switching device whatever it may be, from eventual failure. (damage caused by low voltage arcing, at the chopper or voltage breaker point) The Hot lead to the coil is not chopped.
                  Last edited by Beshires1; 01-07-2009, 09:22 AM.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Electrotek View Post
                    @What The Flux: I'm having difficulty making out your circuit; all I can get is a tiny little image.

                    Gray's Tube had both an inductive and a capacitive spark. His bridge rectifier charges the cap, but it also is connected to the spark gap. It may be that you need BOTH kinds of sparks to get the effect.
                    Those are thumbnails click on them to view.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Beshires1 View Post
                      To get the most out of your ignition coil (better spark) attach a automotive condenser across the negative source switching device. If you are using a relay, manual switch, or whatever. The automotive condenser will increase the ignition coils output greatly, and also, protect the switching device whatever it may be, from eventual failure. (damage caused by low voltage arcing, at the chopper or voltage breaker point) The Hot lead to the coil is not chopped.
                      A very good point, thank you.
                      But shouldn't I use a higher voltage condenser/capacitor than an automotive one? Those are meant for 12V systems and I'm switching about 100V. Any idea what a good capacitance would be? I think automotive ones are < 1uF.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by What The Flux View Post
                        Here are a couple pics and a circuit of what have on my bench. Again, I'm not looking to recreate the whole motor, just trying to see some radiant energy on the grids.

                        Right now the circuit is just set up to single fire the spark. The HV coming off the coil I estimate to be about 8KV... which will jump about a .25" gap. When I put a diode from coil primary to HV, I can get a nice plasma spark. I used a carbon rod from a D-cell with smaller gauge wire, since I was unable to bore a hole for the large rod without shattering the carbon. I'll need to get a larger block of carbon.

                        Recently I have added the reverse biased gang of diodes on the LV anode, and a 12V battery to give the diodes an initial forward bias. I also have a magnetic field shroud to place over the gap if I choose to. The gap I'm using is generally 1mm or less.

                        Results so far are pretty dismal. My neon bulb placed from receiving grids to ground will flash when the coil is pulsed, but it flashes whether there is a spark or not. Apparently the capacitance of the grids is conducting a little energy to the load, but it is not enough energy to move a motor, even a small 3V DC motor. Also, with the diodes in place I only get a spark every few times I trigger it. They must be shutting down pretty quick.

                        At this point I'm just starting to try a hundred variations on this theme, and looking to this group for some suggestions.

                        My understanding of the radiant phenomenon from Gray, Lindemann, and Bearden tells me that this effect should show up with a single spark if the circuit is properly constructed. The big question is how to tune the circuit. All the specifics are strategically left out of the patent. I didn't get the feeling that he was creating a resonant circuit, but I could be wrong. Perhaps I shouldn't be using an ignition coil for my HV, since the spec is for a capacitive discharge to the spark. But a spark is a spark, and if it's properly quenched, shouldn't we see something?
                        I bet it is resonant action here.I asked why Gray used so big capacitor and a large current from battery for pulse.The answer is in Tesla method of translation from direct current into high frequency one.The most crude way is simple discharging large cap into a magnetically quenched spark gap.
                        So my first advice is to put magnets across spark gap, which may be complicated because spark must not be allowed to pass on magnets.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by boguslaw View Post
                          I bet it is resonant action here.I asked why Gray used so big capacitor and a large current from battery for pulse.The answer is in Tesla method of translation from direct current into high frequency one.The most crude way is simple discharging large cap into a magnetically quenched spark gap.
                          So my first advice is to put magnets across spark gap, which may be complicated because spark must not be allowed to pass on magnets.
                          I have a vinyl tube with 4 neo magnets strapped to it in an attractive configuration. This makes it very easy to slide it over the spark gap without having it discharge through the magnets. I noticed no difference in effect. The neon lamp still flashed a bit and the motors would not budge. The only noticeable difference was the volume of the spark pop, but I think only because of the acoustic resonance within the small tube.

                          But the more I think about it, there must be a difference in the characteristics between a coil fired spark and a pure capacitor dump. I would assume the capacitor would discharge exponentially until it no longer can jump the gap, whereas the coil might be a shorter steadier discharge. If I run out of ideas here, I probably should hook up my MOT and try for an HV capacitive discharge.

                          Comment


                          • @ What The Flux:

                            It looks to me like your battery has reverse polarity. The battery's function may be to provide a bias voltage to the grid. If so, the grid needs to be more negative than the input electrode, relative to the positive output electrode.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by What The Flux View Post
                              A very good point, thank you.
                              But shouldn't I use a higher voltage condenser/capacitor than an automotive one? Those are meant for 12V systems and I'm switching about 100V. Any idea what a good capacitance would be? I think automotive ones are < 1uF.
                              The condensors were designed to work across the contact breaker points, to prevent them from burning up. Your ignition coil was designed to work using 12 DC, but if your pumping 100V into the coil and it hasn't burned out, then Yes I'd say to use a automotive condensor, across the switching point. The condensors are cheap, but remember that the ignition coils secondary is wound with wire as fine as a human hair. The condensor can handle anything that the coil can.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Beshires1 View Post
                                The condensors were designed to work across the contact breaker points, to prevent them from burning up. Your ignition coil was designed to work using 12 DC, but if your pumping 100V into the coil and it hasn't burned out, then Yes I'd say to use a automotive condensor, across the switching point. The condensors are cheap, but remember that the ignition coils secondary is wound with wire as fine as a human hair. The condensor can handle anything that the coil can.
                                I'll have to respectfully disagree with you there. Ignition coils are quite hearty little buggers and can be abused a little. A capacitor is only as good as the dielectric between the plates, and the breakdown rating is usually pretty accurate. The problem is, I can't find any voltage specs on any automotive condensers, so I'm just guessing. I have found some text which says that auto condensers need to handle a few hundred volts of back EMF from the primary coil. But if I'm switching 100-150V on the primary, I would expect a back EMF of at least several hundred volts.

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