Efficient Carburetor designs

[Guruji]

Hho

Is it safe to run an engine on HHO cause Ravi had said that after two months the engine has to be rebored when run by HHO?.

[Jetijs]

I have not tried that, I have used hho on the engines only as a booster and in this case you can use it nonstop. My fathers car runs with a booster and improved mkileage (about 16%) for two years now without any problems. As for the 100% hho fuel I would think that you would need to change the timing, because the fuel burn speeds are different and use at least some percentage of gasoline mixed with oils to provide lubrication for the pistons and other internal engine stuff. Anyway, I have not tried that as I have not found a way to generate hho with COP>1.

[dutchdivco]

Jetsis

Looked into this pretty extensively.My conclusion, for what its worth, is its a lot more complicated than you might think, at first glance.
One thing you might look at; Coat the top of your pistons with 'pure' palladium.As the temp in the combustion chamber approaches 1000 degrees F., this will catalyctically crack the fuel, into Hydrogen and Methane, and ignite it.No liquid unburned, (or partially burned, or burned too late in the cycle to give any realistic power). I purchased 2 books, 25 'leaves' each, of Palladium Leaf, 99% pure, from an art supply place.At that time cost about $50/book.Mu intention, if I ever get to it, is to use that with salt water and electricity, to plate the top of the pistons with palladium.First time I start it up, gonna stand waaaaaay back tho!
BTW, some of the vaporising of the fuel occurs during the downstroke, AFTER the intake valve has closed. The vacuum created causes vaporisation.When gasoline vaporises, it gets very cold.It therefore absorbs heat from the top of the piston, valves, etc, cooling the cylinder just prior to the next combustion cycle.Without this cooling effect, things get hot quick.Jim

[faramog]

Gents - a really interesting and useful thread. I had no idea how much information or experimentation is there to look at.

Strickes me from a helicopter view that heating is not the answer due to complex fractional nature of the petrol (or diesel). You would inevevitably fraction is sequence of lightest first and likely lead to corrosion or clogging effects.

I seem to remember some writing on hydroxy creation using electrostatic resonance or something (a bit fague- sorry), so perhaps the notion is no so much pure vapour as extremely small droplets. The droplet sizes creates during normal carb operation are relatively high leading to inconsistent burn and there is no reason (maybe) that small 'clumps' of droplets would not act more like a vapour. The absolute energy recoverable may not be as much as with a pure vapour, but the need to turbo the fuel flow to modulate the mass balance could be diminished making a simpler and cheaper solution.

Of course... I am probably talking tosh !

[dutchdivco]

Hey, all

Bought several 120v a/c air ionising units, new surplus.These are like the units on air putifiers.Planned on running them with an inverter, and inserting the 'discharge needle' into the air intake stream.Never got around to doing it, yet.It should eliminate the need for an air filter, although would have to clean the air intake tube the needles are inserted into, every so often.This would be a no resistance rather than low resistance filtering system, and yet would get all particulates, of any size.Also, it would ionise the air, and so any H20 molecules in the air would be 'split' into hydrogen and oxygen, and even could use water injection to increase amount of hydroxy.Anyway, still have sitting on shelf, but haven't got around to yet.
Might want to read materaial on " Theoldone" website.Guy has done some fascinating work.For instance, he found that air/fuel charge is stratified; 'lightest' easiest to vaporise and ignite 'fractions' are located at top of cylinder and, in clearly dilineated layers, work down to heaviest, most difficult to vaporise and ignite fractions laying in a layer right on top of piston.
One of his tricks, which he says but doesn't emphasise, is closing the intake valve early.If the piston is continueing to go down the cylinder with the intake valve closed, you get vacuum.Vacuum, or negative pressure, is 1 way to 'encourage gasoline to vaporise.As it vaporises, it absorbs tremendous amounts of heat; from piston, cylinder walls and valves; thus cooling chamber.This in turn allows him to re-engineer engines with much higher compression ratios, without encountering pre-ignition detonation.
While his work has all been on race cars, he makes it clear that his work is to get the most energy out of a gallon of fuel.After all, if a race car can go with 1 less pit stop than its competitor, it will win.Anyway, lots of good stuff there, but he doesn't hand it to you on a platter; you have to dig it out, read between the lines, etc.Google theoldone, should find the links.I'll see if I have them favorited, and post em if I can find them.Jim

[Gdez]

Electrolyzing Gasoline

I was wondering if anyone has tried to electrolize gasoline in an HHO setup. It sounds dangerous, and I am not recommending anyone to rush out and try it. Since plastics are derived from hydrocarbons, you would think that hydro carbon fuels would not carry a current very easily, but Lead or other additive might adittives might have an effect. Sounds crazy but, just wondering if anyone has given it any thought. Also Jetsis and Dutchdivco... like your posts, very informative.

[FRC]

Gdez

Here is a way to vaporize gasoline.

YouTube - Ultrasonic Gasoline Vaporizer by Sul-tech

FRC

[Gdez]

Thanks frc

Liked the vid. Seems too simple. What about the additives that are supposely added to prevent a pogue style carb from working? Do they end up as residue I wonder? How would running this vapor through a regular carb work?

[FRC]

Liked the vid. Seems too simple. What about the additives that are supposely added to prevent a pogue style carb from working? Do they end up as residue I wonder? How would running this vapor through a regular carb work?

I was hoping to try it on my Dodge van which is already on gas and propane.
A hose to the air cleaner forced by a fan . Also want to try water or a combination of both.

FRC

[Jetijs]

Liked the vid. Seems too simple. What about the additives that are supposely added to prevent a pogue style carb from working? Do they end up as residue I wonder? How would running this vapor through a regular carb work?

I also tried the ultrasonic vapor setup, but not in car, just for a test, here is a video:
YouTube - ultrasonic gasoline

I don't know about additives in fuels, they could prevent what I am intending to do with the fuel - cracking it into propane and butane, no vapors. But to test this out I will use homemade diesel and gasoline made out of polyethylene, this is simple to do and cheap, also I will be certain that there is nothing else in the fuel than hydrogen and carbon, no additives. If this works on my fuel and not with commercial fuels, then we have a case

[dutchdivco]

If thats your approach

Then your thinking has gotten away from the original post of vaporising gasoline. Not critisising, just noting.Actually, thats the way my thinking went, as well.
Again I would point to the idea of putting a catalyst in the cylinder; paladium or platinum coating the tops of the pistons is the most logical.Expensive stuff, but don't need a thick coating.Thats why I bought 2 books of "Palladium Leaf" from an art supply store.
Plating is pretty bsic; just suspend the piston upside down, so the top is submerged in an electrolyte solution.Suspend the 'book' of paladium lesf in the solution as well, hook a cathode to 1, and an anode to the other.
As the temperature approaches 1000 degrees F., in the chamber, your fuel will be catalyctic split, into hydrogen and ignited and burned.
Might need water injection, periodically to keep the palladium clean.Might also want to plate the face of the valves.
Only question is could the engine handle the heat of the hydrogen burning?
Anyway, never done it, but would like to try.Like others, got a lot more projects on the drawing board, than I can ever get too Jim

[FRC]

Thanks dutchdivco

Thanks dutchdivco for the info on where to get palladium. I have wanted to
get some for quite a few years now, but for another purpose.

FRC

[dutchdivco]

If you have a problem

finding it, e-mail me, i think I've got it in my favorites.You do understand its leaf; its so thin that if you lay a piece of it on the flat palm of your hand, and blow on it it will end up across the room.The leaves are about 2 1/8" x 2 1/8" by infinitesimally thin.Anyway, have fun playing with it.Jim

[Gdez]

HHo micro torch

@ stealth
Since burning hho can produce high temps what about a mini torch to get the vaporizing temp? In the first hho video I saw a cuople years ago, the guy takes a hho torch and heats a brass ball to red hot in seconds. His torch was not very small but, it seems that a small heat exchanger would be possible to build, especially if it is to only heat a small tube for vaporization, as mentioned above with the pogue carb.

[dave_cahoon]

On the FLY

@jetijs

Take any old engine running good on propane or gasoline and twist off the muffler and any manifold or piping, easy to do on single cylinder engine.

In dark environment run the engine open exhaust mode. You will see a blue flame protruding from the valve about 4inches like a blowtorch. In that plume of burning materials is the energy to Crack on the fly. If you plumb to far away from the exhaust valve, your *test tube* wont be in the flame. Addition of air with the exhaust gas may help get a better flame in the plumbing.

Now how to vaporize heavy oils?? Need a vapor carby to feed the cracker.

How to get the oil to the hot spot with out it coking up at the delivery point?
How to meter out the very small amount of heavy oil that converted to propane runs the engine.?? A small amount of liquid oil makes a larger volume of propane.

Last, Using some humidity (again a wee bit goes a long way) maybe do the water shift reaction and make syngas/producer gas as a final product.

The geet system can setup most of those conditions in a simple way.
its the vapor carby for oils that is the stall point for me.

Dave

PS Partial oxidation experiment take the mesh from your ultrasonic gasoline experiment. With 2 lighters. Light a lighter and hold the mesh above the flame such that 90% or more is snuffed. Then with the second lighter ignite the gasses above the mesh. Next step is a tube with mesh on each end and a ignition system inside. In the draft of an engine.

Yes heat and vacuum are keys. Once you get it.