Big Joule Theif

[NickZ]

Guys:
Although I have not had problems with the Jt transistor overheating, I have notice that if I remove the led that is across the C and E rail, everything gets very, very hot. If I left it like that, the transistor would melt down. But if I use one low voltage 2 volt red Led bulb there (between the C and E rail), there is absolutely no heat. The point being that it may be important to include at least one led between the rails, even at the expence of it lowering the secondary voltage output, by a little bit. No heat may also be related to longer run times or duty cycles, as there is less waisted energy.
NZ

[pentiger]

Guys:
Although I have not had problems with the Jt transistor overheating, I have notice that if I remove the led that is across the C and E rail, everything gets very, very hot. If I left it like that, the transistor would melt down. But if I use one low voltage 2 volt red Led bulb there (between the C and E rail), there is absolutely no heat. The point being that it may be important to include at least one led between the rails, even at the expence of it lowering the secondary voltage output, by a little bit. No heat may also be related to longer run times or duty cycles, as there is less waisted energy.
NZ

Wow Nic, great idea. I will have to try that, how about a small resistor instead.

Unfortunately today I will not be able to test anything so maybe tomorrow.

Good luck.

[Tectalabyss]

@ Tectalabyss,
I see. That point (E-C) is normally 1 LED or neon to show the oscillator is running, nothing more. Many remove it once a stable secondary load is established to reduce primary current draw from the battery. The paralleled LEDs there are lit by the feedback signal, but are also still on the source battery side using battery current too. Most use a separate winding(pickup) on the toroid to run them. This way all they see is the voltage developed by the collapsing magnetic field of the oscillator, never actually connected to the battery side, and totally isolated.
That should help your time run. Lidmotor has a good example of that with Jennas light vid. He has a 3" toroid running a CFL. The JT is only ringing the toroid, everything else is picked up from the tertiary(3rd) winding. He has room in that vid for many more separate windings too. Its pretty impressive to watch when you think of what its doing. I'll find the link if you need me too.

Edit: Actually, the one LED/neon also protects the transistor from HV spikes till a load is used to do more than just a simple JT circuit. Needed to clarify so ppl didnt start blowing transistors!

@ Vaporizer.
Thanks for the reply,That was with a small 1" toroid and a small secondary I have even tried running a 1" toroid small secondary nothing on the e/c secondary running back to run battery on another 1" JT 1" with a secondary.
(You make things clear and I for one am glad to have you Here on Energetic Forum) Thank you. Tec

[Tectalabyss]

Guys:
Although I have not had problems with the Jt transistor overheating, I have notice that if I remove the led that is across the C and E rail, everything gets very, very hot. If I left it like that, the transistor would melt down. But if I use one low voltage 2 volt red Led bulb there (between the C and E rail), there is absolutely no heat. The point being that it may be important to include at least one led between the rails, even at the expence of it lowering the secondary voltage output, by a little bit. No heat may also be related to longer run times or duty cycles, as there is less waisted energy.
NZ

Hello NickZ and all.
What voltage are you running type transistor? I have never had a problem with heat on my transistor unless i tried to run to high a voltage with or with out anything on the e/c do you think maybe that is whats going on ? Tec

[pentiger]

hello I found something and wanted to share with you guys.

Buy Solar light, outdoor solar light, Solar led light, wholesale Solar Powered 60 Blue LED Christmas String Fair Lights at Aliexpress.com

commercial Joule thief with 60 leds.

pentiger

[NickZ]

Pentiger and All:
I just bought something very similar to those Solar Christmas lights, but without the solar part.
My light set has a mode controler, 50 leds lights, but runs on 120 volts AC power instead of solar. I had to cut the three Led lines all to pieces to get it to work with my newest joule thief circuit. As there were various resistors inside the three lines. Jeanna helped me out on how to go about it, which really did help.
Pentiger- It may not be a Jt inside the lights controler but instead a Led driver circuit.
The 3 inch coil that you have looks great, just keep trying different transistors and resistors, until you get it to work the way you want it to. You really need to get some small pots to help tune it, and tuning may be all you really need to do, to get it right. Good luck with it.
Tec: I use various transistors, like the Tip3055, 2n2222A, 2k2222, or whatever works, although many transitors can function to some degree, there are big differences between each one. And the heat issue is fairly complicate when tryng to get more output. Finding the right components for the job is the trick, and building a Jtc that will Resonate with the particular toroid coil, without heat, or quickly draining the run battery's charge.
Jeanna suggested to try a thousand things...
NZ

[Tectalabyss]

Pentiger and All:
I just bought something very similar to those Solar Christmas lights, but without the solar part.
My light set has a mode controler, 50 leds lights, but runs on 120 volts AC power instead of solar. I had to cut the three Led lines all to pieces to get it to work with my newest joule thief circuit. As there were various resistors inside the three lines. Jeanna helped me out on how to go about it, which really did help.
Pentiger- It may not be a Jt inside the lights controler but instead a Led driver circuit.
The 3 inch coil that you have looks great, just keep trying different transistors and resistors, until you get it to work the way you want it to. You really need to get some small pots to help tune it, and tuning may be all you really need to do, to get it right. Good luck with it.
Tec: I use various transistors, like the Tip3055, 2n2222A, 2k2222, or whatever works, although many transitors can function to some degree, there are big differences between each one. And the heat issue is fairly complicate when tryng to get more output. Finding the right components for the job is the trick, and building a Jtc that will Resonate with the particular toroid coil, without heat, or quickly draining the run battery's charge.
Jeanna suggested to try a thousand things...
NZ

Hello NickZ and All.
I've also tried many transistors even some of the older ones I had pulled from old tv's an radio's back in the day when they weren't that old I am still learning the newer electronics My job over the past years have been 3 phase 480 volt industrial Maintenance.I believe the JT or some variation of it could be used for a better power supply sadly I just don't have the skills to be of much help. Tec

[pentiger]

Hi Guys,

I found a problem with my toroid. I was getting upset seeing my volts go down so I almost quit then accidentally I touched the secondary winding an felt volts going trough my fingers. Then I held one end of the wire from the secondary and run my fingers trough the winding and in multiple places I felt these sparks.

I guess that here lies my problem. The wire shorts out with the toroid and I that's why It drains battery like that.

If you think that it shouldn't matter please let me know.

Thanks, pentiger.

[SkyWatcher]

Hi pentiger, That was what I thought might be happening, short circuit to core. I use either electrical tape or masking tape to prevent short circuit to core and prevent enamel from scraping off. On one toroid I wound with 26 gauge without using tape, at almost every turn the enamel was scraped off, which can either short to adjacent coil or core. Good luck.
peace love light
Tyson

[Tectalabyss]

I agree

Hi pentiger, That was what I thought might be happening, short circuit to core. I use either electrical tape or masking tape to prevent short circuit to core and prevent enamel from scraping off. On one toroid I wound with 26 gauge without using tape, at almost every turn the enamel was scraped off, which can either short to adjacent coil or core. Good luck.
peace love light
Tyson

I very much agree with Skywatcher I've had the same thing happen myself I have dipped my toroid in enamel paint and let it dry and re-dipped a few time's Then wound my coil with good result's Good luck Tec

[pentiger]

Thanks guys,
Back to the drawing board for me....

I will have to unwind it and paint it.

Happy Thanksgiving everyone.

Pentiger

[NickZ]

Pen:
Have you rewound the primary and see if you still have a problem. Maybe using different turn ratios. I use a 20 - 20 turns for my primary, but, if I don't use a pot while running on even a single AA battery with nothing on the C and E rails, the transistor will get so hot in less than one minute that you can't hold it, or touch it. But, if I lower the input a bit, and have a red led between the rail, there is no heat. Everything run cool and last a long time. If there is excesive heat in the components, there is waisted energy, and shorter run cycles.
Secondaries windings can also show wierd side effects, like one wire lighting the Leds, and things like that. So, it might not be a short in the coil, just because you feel the juice by touching the coil, as the Surface of the secondary wire is also conducing. As the secondary voltage gets higher, and higher, the radiant effects show up. That's where the magic is, and where tuning is most important. If we can get the Jtc coil to resonate, the input voltage can be turned way down to almost- practically....nothing!!?
Pen: Have you tried running your set up without anything connected onto the secondary? Just on to the transistor C and E, using one led, and a single AA battery. Will it run like on that, with no heat build up, and also will it last alot longer than what you are now getting by connecting through the secondary?
NZ

[pentiger]

Pen:
Have you rewound the primary and see if you still have a problem. Maybe using different turn ratios. I use a 20 - 20 turns for my primary, but, if I don't use a pot while running on even a single AA battery with nothing on the C and E rails, the transistor will get so hot in less than one minute that you can't hold it, or touch it. But, if I lower the input a bit, and have a red led between the rail, there is no heat. Everything run cool and last a long time. If there is excesive heat in the components, there is waisted energy, and shorter run cycles.
Secondaries windings can also show wierd side effects, like one wire lighting the Leds, and things like that. So, it might not be a short in the coil, just because you feel the juice by touching the coil, as the Surface of the secondary wire is also conducing. As the secondary voltage gets higher, and higher, the radiant effects show up. That's where the magic is, and where tuning is most important. If we can get the Jtc coil to resonate, the input voltage can be turned way down to almost- practically....nothing!!?
Pen: Have you tried running your set up without anything connected onto the secondary? Just on to the transistor C and E, using one led, and a single AA battery. Will it run like on that, with no heat build up, and also will it last alot longer than what you are now getting by connecting through the secondary?
NZ

Hi NZ

My latest primary ratio is 4,6 as in one of Jenna's setups. I guess this works better for me, but it's really true that there is a short in the secondary. With this setup I was able to light 64 leds at full brightness from 2.3v. The short circuit however drains my batteries and the transistor is not even warm.

I will rewind it and see then. I am also waiting for the really big toroids, like the ones Lidmotor and Jeanna used. I will be getting coated ones that will work best.
I did try to run it without load on the secondary and it was still lowering my voltage on the batteries however at much slower rate.

For now I will have to stop testing because the whole thing has to be re-winded.

Pentiger

[Tectalabyss]

Hi NZ

My latest primary ratio is 4,6 as in one of Jenna's setups. I guess this works better for me, but it's really true that there is a short in the secondary. With this setup I was able to light 64 leds at full brightness from 2.3v. The short circuit however drains my batteries and the transistor is not even warm.

I will rewind it and see then. I am also waiting for the really big toroids, like the ones Lidmotor and Jeanna used. I will be getting coated ones that will work best.
I did try to run it without load on the secondary and it was still lowering my voltage on the batteries however at much slower rate.

For now I will have to stop testing because the whole thing has to be re-winded.

Pentiger

Hello Pentiger and All.
If a toroid has sharp edges you can put some type of thin tape over them to protect the magnet wire while you are winding this will help keep the enamel on the magnet wire from being shaved off while winding.hope this help's Tec

[pentiger]

Hello Pentiger and All.
If a toroid has sharp edges you can put some type of thin tape over them to protect the magnet wire while you are winding this will help keep the enamel on the magnet wire from being shaved off while winding.hope this help's Tec

Hi Tec,

I was thinking about a spray paint - KRYLON Amazon.com: Krylon Spray Paint, 12 oz Emerald Green: Home Improvement or one of these products Caswell Inc. - Plasti Dip Products

I am thinking about the masking tape as well, but since I will be rewinding 360 turns I would like it to be more permanent.

I will let you know.

pentiger