Big Joule Theif

[Bodkins]

Antenna Electret

YouTube - Atenna Electret

YouTube - Why

I think this is whats needed and what tesla had around the spheres?
Make one round a bulb? like Lidmotor with the hot and cold thing
YouTube - A Thief with a super cap
Bx


this video is what Primary Phyics is all about!
YouTube - strange phenomena
I also have some videos explaining Primary phyics please check them out.

[Xenomorph]

@Lidmotor: 30 WATT lamp!!!
I wonder what happens if you put 2 or more horse-shoes closely in parallel together, so the charge and discharge parts are minimally close?
Maybe this can help you realize the battery switch for your boxed circuit:
Feedback To Source

I`d be interested to know how you finally handle the charging side.
Judging from your videos, you charge a cap first, put it under load with a night-light and dump it into the charging battery.
Would the charging battery still be connected with its negative the the source batteries plus?
I have just experimented with a bridge rectifier, but it did not work at all.

[shlodo]

I love this coil!

@Lidmotor: 30 WATT lamp!!!
I wonder what happens if you put 2 or more horse-shoes closely in parallel together, so the charge and discharge parts are minimally close?
Maybe this can help you realize the battery switch for your boxed circuit:
Feedback To Source

I`d be interested to know how you finally handle the charging side.
Judging from your videos, you charge a cap first, put it under load with a night-light and dump it into the charging battery.
Would the charging battery still be connected with its negative the the source batteries plus?
I have just experimented with a bridge rectifier, but it did not work at all.

@Xenomorph
Great link, Ive been trying to find a battery swapper circuit for ages.

About the charging, ive found the diode off the Collector to the positive of charge battery, negative back to plus on source. just like the Bedini. But i think with this circuit u'll have to cap pulse it by building up the charge first...


I finally mustered up the patience to wind Slayer007's Big Torroid coil. And it works great!! It can easlily light a big flouro with 3V, but not those CFL's for some reason.
I love the amount of light u can get with little current. Im gonna Replicate Lidmotors pulsed inverted circuit to steal some more Joules!

the coil is a bifillar 0.4mm 30 turns, the secondary is 0.3mm 530 turns. Ive found the charging on this coil is not as good as my last Joule THief with o.4mm 90 turns.


I think charging and amp draw is quite dependent on the coil and amount of turns. with the 90 turns coil I can charge a cap up to 230Volts, but with the 30 turn coil I only get about 60-70 Volts (without fluoro connected).
It will charge a big battery but not very well.
So i think u can wind coils more suited to charging, or more suited to lighting if u want

@Lidmotor - great work with the 30W globe! cant wait to use your circuit!

-shlodo

[slayer007]

@ Everyone

This project is really coming along thanks to iput from everyone.
It sure is an exciting circuit, and the numbers lidmotor is getting with the 555 timer pulse is great.. This circuit is much more efficient at lighting CFLs than the radiant oscillator.

Just wanted to thank everyone working on this... great effort guys.

I came across this circuit the other week and thought u might be able to do something similar to the 555 pulse idea. Its a simple led flasher using a 2n2222 as a negistor... NEGATIVE RESISTOR
The circuit is even simpler than the 555, it only uses a 2n2222, resistor and cap.
I build one and it draws less than 10mA to operate.. the circuit i found is only for 12V and im trying to modify it so it will work on lower voltages.

All you have to do to change the frequency is change the value if the Cap. Its not as versatile as the 555 but i thought it might be of some interest.

Simplest_LED_Flasher_Circuit
-shlodo

shlodo that does work very well to light a cfl.
It's allmost the samething Aromaz was doing with the ignition coil cfl.

I'm running it off 10v it draws around 170Ma.
But it will light a 13W cfl I'm using the toroid I have for the JT.

I didnt use the cap or the 1K resistor and the base of the 2222 I ran back to the cfl.
I'm allso using the 2222 to trigger a 3055 thats running the JT.

[Lidmotor]

Charging with the 555/JT

@Lidmotor: 30 WATT lamp!!!
I wonder what happens if you put 2 or more horse-shoes closely in parallel together, so the charge and discharge parts are minimally close?
Maybe this can help you realize the battery switch for your boxed circuit:
Feedback To Source

I`d be interested to know how you finally handle the charging side.
Judging from your videos, you charge a cap first, put it under load with a night-light and dump it into the charging battery.
Would the charging battery still be connected with its negative the the source batteries plus?
I have just experimented with a bridge rectifier, but it did not work at all.

@Xenomorph--- I am trying to do the charging without using a cap pulser. I'm using a 1N4007 diode off the transistor going into the charge battery and then (-) of the charge battery back to the (+) of the source battery. This is Bedini SSG style charging. It is tricky. The voltage is not a problem but there has to be some amperage to push the energy into the battery and that robs energy from the flourescent. It's a "Thief" stealing from himself. I'm still working on it. You can always fill up a cap and dump the energy into the battery but that is another circuit and takes more energy. "Rroge5" over on Youtube suggested using the 555 circuit to regulate the charging. When the bulb is not firing, pulse the charge battery. It is worth looking into. As far as swapping the batteries is concerend, I will use a DPDT switch in the boxed version. Just flip the switch every 12 hours or so.

@Shlodo----I will have to try that 2N2222 blinker circuit. That might be a REALLY simple solution to turning on and off the JT.

Lidmotor

[Xenomorph]

@Lidmotor
Thanks for explaining it.

When the bulb is not firing, pulse the charge battery

Hmm, that would have to be a really fast charging cap, as it has to charge above 12V in about 1/100 of a second. So a 50V 0,1uF or lower cap.
I gotta try that. It is a smart suggestion indeed by "Rroge5", makes the circuit very efficient doing multiple jobs.

[Lidmotor]

@Lidmotor
Thanks for explaining it.

Hmm, that would have to be a really fast charging cap, as it has to charge above 12V in about 1/100 of a second. So a 50V 0,1uF or lower cap.
I gotta try that. It is a smart suggestion indeed by "Rroge5", makes the circuit very efficient doing multiple jobs.

If you try that let us know if it works. I just ran the round 30 Watt bulb for 24hrs staight and it did what I wanted and charged up the 2nd battery without a cap so it may not be necessary to pulse the charge. I ran the test at 7 volts with a 50 milliamp draw. The light was on low light of course but still enough to read by at night. I may run a test at full brightness which runs at 11 volts and 150 to 200 milliamps. That is about the heat tollerance limit of the parts I'm using.

Lidmotor

[shlodo]

@Lidmotor

I ran the test at 7 volts with a 50 milliamp draw. The light was on low light of course but still enough to read by at night. I may run a test at full brightness which runs at 11 volts and 150 to 200 milliamps.

What size battery were u charging into Lid? I cant seem to charge battery and keep the light going together, its one or the other it seems.

When the bulb is not firing, pulse the charge battery

Thats a good idea, i see one problem though. U would have to put the 555 on the back end not the front, interrupting the HV line and shifting it to the light then to the cap/battery. The 555 would probably get zapped with HV.
U would probably need to use a relay or something to isolate the chip.

Ive seen some Solid State relays. they have No moving parts. Ive tried cap pulsing before by building up charge in a cap and using a Relay to dump into battery. But because of the High Potential as the relay makes contact a bit of energy is lost by producing a spark. I reckon a solid state relay would eliminate this.... Again i haven't tried it yet.

Also perhaps the simple NEGISTOR circuit i posted above might help instead of the 555. i dont think it will mind the HV as much. its only a 2n2222 cap and resistor.


@Slayer

shlodo that does work very well to light a cfl.
It's allmost the samething Aromaz was doing with the ignition coil cfl.
I'm running it off 10v it draws around 170Ma.
But it will light a 13W cfl I'm using the toroid I have for the JT.
I didnt use the cap or the 1K resistor and the base of the 2222 I ran back to the cfl.
I'm allso using the 2222 to trigger a 3055 thats running the JT.

So thats why the Aromaz circuit worked. Apparently there are few transistors that have this NEGISTOR effect and the 2n2222 is one of them.
Wow u got it working without the cap?! but then theres no way of modulating the ON time??? Im building a JT mood light and was gonna use the circuit to ease on and off slowly

@Lidmotor

I will use a DPDT switch in the boxed version

For the life of me I cant seem to figure out how to use a DPDT switch to flip flop the batteries?! Can u post a circuit of the wiring?

-shlodo

[Xenomorph]

@shlodo

Thats a good idea, i see one problem though. U would have to put the 555 on the back end not the front

Hmm, why? The charging part is NOT on the HV side in Lidmotorīs circuit, it comes off the collector in the LV part, so there is no danger to the 555 at all.

[Lidmotor]

Charging

@Sholdo--- Getting the bulb to stay on with the charge circuit hooked up was a BIG problem for me. I could not get it to happen at all until I put the 555 circuit on. Then it would only happen with the round or U bulb. The way I get it to work is to get the bulb to turn on first and then connect the charge battery. The return from the charge battery has to go to the (+) side of the source battery. I think that my voltage regulator also helps.
The DPDT on this circuit will not work like it did on the LED JT circuit where both the charge and source shared a common ground. What I figured out on this circuit was to use (2) DPDT switches that each have an off position in the middle. The way it would be wired would to use either battery as a source alone or one as the source and one to charge. The Bedinis SSG circuit is just like this one as far as the wiring of the source and charge batteries are concerned. There must be a diagram around somewhere for the manual switch circuit. Maybe if someone knows of one they can post it here.

Lidmotor

[shlodo]

Lighting / Charging Switcher

@shlodo



Hmm, why? The charging part is NOT on the HV side in Lidmotorīs circuit, it comes off the collector in the LV part, so there is no danger to the 555 at all.

@Xenomorph

Well first of all the charging part can be HV (not as High as the Neon side). With my 90 turn coil I got 500V voltage spikes. I have not scoped this coil yet but its definitely enough to light a neon so we know its more than 90V.

My idea is to have a relay switching between:
1. lighting the Big Fluoro off the secondary coil
2. charging a cap off the Collector

We do this fast enough so that we do not notice the pulses in the light. Its hard to charge a light the Fluoro at the same time so why dont we do one when the other is off.

It removes the 555 from the front and puts it to the back. The JT will have full on time but im sure we could get better charging out of it.

Check out the attachment, I drew up a circuit. I was just about to try it today... I had the 555 built, got the relay switching, then it died on me!! Damn!
-shlodo

[shlodo]

2xAA's running 40W Fluoro Tube

Thanks to Slayer & Lidmotor for helping me build this, and to evryone else working on this project - cheers
YouTube - Joule Thief 05 - 40W Fluoro Tube on 2 x AA's

-shlodo

[Jetijs]

I just wanted to say thank you for all the great work you guys have done on this. This is some amazing light output for that much input powerand you still get most of it back in the charging battery. Great stuff

[Xenomorph]

@Shlodo:
I am tempted to kindly ask you (and please forgive me if you have thought about that in the first place), but you did protect the 555 timer with a diode right?
The BEMF from the relay coil can damage the timer.



If you did then it is weird that the timer died.

There is nothing to say against charging from the HV side, i just pointed out that Lidmotor does it on the LV side as to not steal energy from the CFL.
Slayer007 has gotten great charging from the HV side with his big joule thief.

The idea to split the timing signal to do different jobs is viable, on HV or LV side is viable and needs to be tested.
The bottleneck could be the relay, as they usually dont switch as fast, but 100 Hz should be doable. Iīd prefer MOSFETs over relays, but thatīs a matter of taste hehe

EDIT: I am just looking at your circuit. It would work to put the 555 timer entirely onto the HV side, however the initial purpose to actually use the timer would be given up. It was put onto the LV side by Lidmotor/Kubikop with a good reason, because it is supposed to save energy on the transistor operation by running it on a low duty cycle.
Your circuit would have it running all the time, consuming more energy.
I dont wanna discourage you from building it though. It can always serve to learn something new.

[slayer007]

Thanks to Slayer & Lidmotor for helping me build this, and to evryone else working on this project - cheers
YouTube - Joule Thief 05 - 40W Fluoro Tube on 2 x AA's

-shlodo

Very Nice video shlodo.

The light looked nice and bright.

Really I was kinda surprised you got that much light out of the yellow toroid.

I think you get it to work a lot better with a differant toroid thats ferrite.

But you still did it and a very nice job to and thanks for the notice ant the end.