Healing properties of water

[sucahyo]

I don't know, but this some consideration:

occult chemistry


Orgone generator bible


Viktor Scahuberger

[Vortex]

Mind games

Question: In what direction do the wheels on a car turn when going forward?
Answer: Clockwise if viewing the wheels from the right side of the car and
counter clockwise if viewing the wheels from the left side of the car.

Clockwise or counter clockwise depends entirely upon your view point,
left to right, right to left, top to bottom or bottom to top viewing.

The question about direction water should be rotated needs to be explained
with this in mind.

Do not trust an IMAGE or picture to tell you clockwise or counter
clockwise because an image can be flipped 180 degrees, showing you the opposite direction.

sucahyo, the occult images, as well, could be Flipped?
Use them as a visual, but keep this idea in mind.
What I'm trying to say is do not depend upon an image alone and x-ref information against other sources.
Getting it wrong would not be healthy

The "Orgone generator" image appears to be counter clockwise viewed from the bottom.
In Viktor Schauberger, April 1958, Implosion Magazine, No.114, pp 54-57
(or page pdf#194/doc#181 of The Energy Evolution - Harnessing Free Energy from Nature)
states: "Viewed from below, the whorl-pipe rotates in a clockwise direction and
without any resistance, sucks up the centripetally compressed drive-water."

The images and the words do not seem to be matching in some cases.

This question of clockwise and counter clockwise being positive (creative) or
negative (destructive) needs to be determined, set in stone, and ignore
whatever the images show us.

[Vortex]

Images can give wrong information.
This video shows a whirlpool traveling upwards Doesn't happen!

Whirlpool - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia does not address rotational direction.

Tornadoes turn counterclockwise in the northern hemisphere and clockwise in
the southern hemisphere and some rotate in the OPPOSITE Direction!!
IS a tornado a negative or positive force?
Nature creates, so a tornado is a positive force, unless it rotating in the wrong direction?.

[amigo]

My dear friends,

This is all great, but can we actually get something partical going here?

How do I make this diamagnetic water or the energized water with that special kind of current? Where are the plans, how to guide, instructions, something that will allow me to have energized water of above mentioned quality in a container in my house, within a reasonable amount of time in the near future.

Folklore aside, and all this is really folklore if nobody has been able to do it but Schauberger, let's work on a practical and easy solution to energizing water for example so we can cleanse and energize our bodies and then help everyone else do the same.

[sucahyo]

For direction here is more info:

The '500' mix fertilizer is produced according to an ancient Alpine tradition which Schauberger himself once observed being practised by an old mountain farmer who achieved amazing results from his fertilizer. The principle is like that of homeopathy. When a homeopathic medicine is made, the original remedy is stirred and shaken between the dilutions, which increase its potency. With the fertilizer a small quantity of the converted cow dung is added to water and stirred first in one direction and then in the other, so as to create vortices rotating about the vertical axis of the mixing vessel. A left-hand vortex builds up the positive energy and the right hand vortex creates a negative energy that draws in the inseminating O2. The alternating energy charge builds up the inherent energies of the 500 mix. This recalls the alternating left and right hand bends in a river building up its energy in a longitudinal vortex

Maybe we should use both direction alternately.



For practical application of the info, see magnetic water trap:
ORMUS Articles

Many people believe magnet can change property of water that simply placing big magnet in the bottom of our water can make it better.

Since permanent magnet is being used to separate diamagnetic and magnetic, I think the lower part of magnetized water is bad. Also drinking the ferro magnetic part of water trap also bad too.

I am thinking to do a linked container electrolysis . First container used for positive electrode and we use powerfull magnet here. Second container which connected to the first with small water hole used for negative electrode. I am thinking to get diamagnetic alkali water in the second container and ferromagnetic acid water in the first container.

[Vortex]

My dear friends,

This is all great, but can we actually get something partical going here?

How do I make this diamagnetic water or the energized water with that special kind of current? Where are the plans, how to guide, instructions, something that will allow me to have energized water of above mentioned quality in a container in my house, within a reasonable amount of time in the near future.

Folklore aside, and all this is really folklore if nobody has been able to do it but Schauberger, let's work on a practical and easy solution to energizing water for example so we can cleanse and energize our bodies and then help everyone else do the same.

I agree.
I have no plans, I have starting points, but ending points.
I have not found anything that isn't twisted horn, egg or some other impossible shape.

How does one meter the water, without lab work being done, to determine equipment break down or effectiveness?

A blank or juvenile water can be used as a purge /cleanse / detox

Ionizing can be done by nozzle spraying or current.
How does one meter the ionization?
Bio-magnetism can be introduced via motion.
How does on meter it?
Cooling can be introduced via motion.
I know how to meter it.

I just found this, an egg shape like an easter egg can be use inside a pipe to create longitudinal vortices .. Do-able
I would suggest the smallest easter egg you can find and clear tubing.
I have to go find some easter eggs. A air venturi tube attached would all
a visual on the vortices in the tube and add oxygen.

Farmers know about how metals magnetic effect on water and they
used different types of metal nozzles, for different reasons, to spray water on the fruit trees. I don't remember where I read it.

Let's say you created an egg shaped terra cotta container (some how).
How do you keep it from falling apart or deforming before it is fired?
If you have the answer for that one, then how do you create the container?

The container's shape isn't functional if the container is only half full?
One can create a self-filling two container system using a float valve and syphon hose ..

Make an Evaporative Terra Cotta Beer Chiller
This is the closest, amazingly cheap Terra Cotta Cottage Cooler Set, w/Stand (403-06001) was $60 out of stock or business, of course
eco-conscious water cooler
waternature information products and services concerning water and it's scientific nature

[amigo]

One of my girlfriend's friends is a pottery wiz and she could probably make anything.

I actually asked her whether she could make an egg shaped container for me couple of months ago but she was busy with something else until end of March. I guess I should follow up end soon...

Though some engineering needs to be done first, as in in/outflow of water supply, whether the water will be artificially sitrred or not, etc.

About using a magnet on the water container, is it the South pole of the magnet that should face the container. Someone was suggesting using fridge magnets as they are flat and easy to handle...

[Vortex]

Amigo, I'll buy one.
I would like the bare minimum container, the egg shape.
A passive (yet highly active) container that would just hold water as in ancient times.
If I must, I will use a dipper to get water out.

Thoughts I had about the container:
Ants and other bugs WILL seek out and fine this water, a good method to seal the top is required.
Waiting until after the container has been created to figure out how to create a seal on the top will not be fun.
The top opening big enough to allow a hand / forearm to fit into.
An everyday item would be an easy measurement gauge for the opening as well as a template for a stopper?, say a 12 oz peanut can.
I have not researched sealing methods or top shapes.
Traditional method of sealing the top had been a cloth or skin tied around a lip at the top.
As I said before, a full container is active and a half full isn't working much.
An idea I had to Auto fill the egg container.


No matter what you do, refilling the egg is going to be a pain.
The pain can be once in a while or every time you take water from it.

[amigo]

If the container is big, it will require an industrial size kiln to bake that baby. Normal pottery shops would not have a large kiln like that, but I'll worry about that when I get to that point.

First question would be what kind of a shape should the container have and how many parts (one whole, two fused together, etc). Would there be an valves on it, openings for stirring/vortex devices, re-filling, etc.

By the way, I stumbled upon the following patents on producing Microcluster Water: http://www.pat2pdf.org/patents/pat5711950.pdf and http://www.pat2pdf.org/patents/pat6033678.pdf . After a bit of search they say that Dr. Len Lorenzen is not so reputable. Though who cares if the invention works, right?

[sucahyo]

see also my post here about water healing property:
http://www.energeticforum.com/49757-post174.html

About using a magnet on the water container, is it the South pole of the magnet that should face the container. Someone was suggesting using fridge magnets as they are flat and easy to handle...

I forget the link, but once hospitalized guy suggest magnet north is facing up in placed bottom of water container. Other in subttleenergies use magnetite sorround water container in 5 day.

Thoughts I had about the container:
Ants and other bugs WILL seek out and fine this water, a good method to seal the top is required.

You don't have hole in your egg top design?

First question would be what kind of a shape should the container have and how many parts (one whole, two fused together, etc). Would there be an valves on it, openings for stirring/vortex devices, re-filling, etc.

Maybe one hole at the top is enough. Pottery should be able to make it in one piece. It should be porous if additional cooling is needed.

What is the use of microcluster water?

[Vortex]

see also my post here about water healing property:
http://www.energeticforum.com/49757-post174.html

You don't have hole in your egg top design?

What is the use of microcluster water?

sucahyo, man, you maxed out on the size of that posting you gave a link to.
well document too .. We will be coming back to that posting
for reference later...

I was trying to show the "system" for refilling the egg, not the egg.
The ah, egg, is an oval in the diagram .. I'm surprise you didn't mention that too.
The point was to show that the egg doesn't need anything special built into
it. I believe a hand/forearm size hole at the top is a good idea for cleaning
and fitting the spout into the bottom. If a refiller system is use
the top would require like a fish tank $1 one way air valve in it.
Everything special can be external to the egg container if a refiller system is
used, thus making the egg container as simple as possible, nothing custom.
Refiller system would allow maximum freedom of development and customization for whatever one might wish to do. One Egg Fits All

Yes is must be porous, terra cotta, otherwise you are wasting your time.

Amigo, Shape ... as best an egg as we can get?
The container is not for a refrigerator.. that would stop the flow inside the
container. (I would think? )
It has to self-cooled which creates the flow within.. keep the water fresh, cool and alive.

Pieces? That's up to the "pottery wiz" to tell us what's what.
Maybe a top could use this method or maybe not


Multiple pieces? Is there a non-toxic way to bond two pieces of terra cotta together, "pottery wiz" question.
I was thinking if I was going to bust up the pot I purchase to test how well
I could bond it yesterday .. but wanted to test the cooler idea first.
I have a temp gauge now.
The mixer shape is a gobble shape and that works great if you are mixing.

The refiller would work fine without a valve if one could find the right size
rubber stopper to use instead. siphon hose / tube can be any size at
all. whatever is cheapest to use. 1/4" is a bit small for getting air bubbles out
of .. but one could tap on the hose to get the air bubbles to move, maybe?
3/8" would be a safer bet.

Suggest a prototype egg of small size 1-2 gallon. To see what bug-a-boos
jump out at us. Peg holes or eyelets would allow easier egg holder stands
to be created with an option to maybe hang it from rope.

Microcluster Water, how does one meter the water?
My issue is once one does whatever they are going to do..
How do you know anything has happened.. How do you meter it?

Well it's up to the "pottery wiz" now ..

[amigo]

My girlfriend tells me (scolds me for it) that I asked her friend last year to help me with the pottery, not this year. I am at a loss that a whole year elapsed since then, and that my memory of that is so pathetic.

I am going to follow up on this shortly. 2 gallon container is 8 litres, right? That's kinda...big. I'll have to see what kind of kiln she has access to first since that would determine the size she can bake.

So definitely an egg shape, one piece if possible. The two piece I thought would be something cut in half so that one piece can fit snug into the other. Maybe have a rubber seal or something to prevent water from leaking, though I do not know how that geometry would affect the movement of water inside.

But, wouldn't we want to monitor the temperature of water somehow. Also, where would the water be drained from, or would it only be the top hatch for in/out.

And for the water movement inside, from what I recall the water would naturally move inside the egg. Or do we need some kind of an artificial vortex inducer from the top to force the vortex creation?

But then how do you know when you are done, and which part of water is good (energized) and which one isn't?

I guess this and other design questions need to be addressed first. Or maybe I need to read some of those books on Schauberger first...har...but only so many hours in a day.

[sucahyo]

It seems the water is not static, always moving inside the egg of Schauberger design. This may be hard to do, since all that we have is made from metal. Maybe wood stirer is easier to build. It seems the easiest for us to achieve this is to use single egg with vertically mounted stirrer. We may add a pipe at the bottom side for draining/collecting the water.

"As Viktor watched him stir the contents to the left with a large wooden paddle, he sang in rising tones, only to change to descending tones when stirring to the right, but all the while crumbling pieces of aluminum-bearing
clay into the water. After about an hour of these not wholly musical sounds, the peasant declared that he was finished and that the mixture was now ready for spreading over the meadow the following morning."

It seems change direction can only be done after a vortex is created. And I think the stirring device must force the water to go to the bottom to create vortex. Maybe we can use plane tail flipper design to make it work at both direction.




I think creating one piece egg is easier for pottery, if her hand can reach the inner part. Creating two part would be harder to fit unless precision machine is used.

I also still did not properly read Schauberger book yet, just word find and quick skimming. I hope I can read it soon with so many interesting thing mentioned. I even made a weird winding base from water flow direction:

See if you can notice the figure 8 winding (alternate top-bottom core).


I still don't know what it uses though, just put it in series with my transformer right now. I am thinking a figure eight one would give no inductance just like mobius/flat spiral.

[Vortex]

What's the target?

My girlfriend tells me (scolds me for it) that I asked her friend last year to help me with the pottery, not this year. I am at a loss that a whole year elapsed since then, and that my memory of that is so pathetic.

I am going to follow up on this shortly. 2 gallon container is 8 litres, right? That's kinda...big. I'll have to see what kind of kiln she has access to first since that would determine the size she can bake.

So definitely an egg shape, one piece if possible. The two piece I thought would be something cut in half so that one piece can fit snug into the other. Maybe have a rubber seal or something to prevent water from leaking, though I do not know how that geometry would affect the movement of water inside.

But, wouldn't we want to monitor the temperature of water somehow. Also, where would the water be drained from, or would it only be the top hatch for in/out.

And for the water movement inside, from what I recall the water would naturally move inside the egg. Or do we need some kind of an artificial vortex inducer from the top to force the vortex creation?

But then how do you know when you are done, and which part of water is good (energized) and which one isn't?

I guess this and other design questions need to be addressed first. Or maybe I need to read some of those books on Schauberger first...har...but only so many hours in a day.

Amigo, sucahyo and All,
the egg shape and porous material. Evaporation cools which due to the shape of the container creates a natural swirling / stirring which cools more.
The shape is so important, because without it, it does not stir itself.
No mechanical stirring is required. it's just a container. Please read on.

Amigo, I use your statements only so I can bring up talking points and to clarify some things which I think are being mixed together like a deck of cards.

The smaller the container is the easier everything becomes for the prototype, 2 gallon might be a bit large initially
See msg #62 Ovals and Egg Curves link for how to layout an egg shape 2d, which could be a template, if that becomes the target shape of the prototype. See attached image in that msg for examples of the tornado shape rounded at the top like a heart or egg.
A rubber seal is hard to come by, special order or custom made and waste of material. If a layers of bicycle inner tube could be used that would fit everybody's needs anywhere.
Amigo said: "I do not know how that geometry would affect the movement of water inside."
If the basic shape is there, seals, etc shouldn't be of much concern .. this isn't a precision machine to tap into the unknown energy, but nature's way .. she is forgiving as long as we get close. Water's way, the meandering river/stream a lump or bump here or there isn't going to hurt .. that just causes and extra little swirl in the water.

Amigo said: "monitor the temperature"
Radio shack has a Indoor/Outdoor Thermometer/Hygrometer. The one I had years ago had a probe is about 1" x 1/4" on a oh, 1/8" wire. That probably would seal ok using rubber inner tube at the lid.

Objective of the container is to provide constant movement by evaporation by porous material which cools the water. The movement maintains and enhances the water's health and allows for cooling. Cool water is healthy water. As water heats up it can not hold onto the properties it has when it was cooler. Thus the cooling of the water allows it to take on properties it could not hold when warmer. Just tossing ice in or sticking it in the refrigerator isn't the same thing due to lack of motion and vortexing.

It's both the correct movement which causes the cooling that allows the water to become more than it was before.
One without the other does not get you there, it's the combination.
That's the short story, it's more complex than this.

Amigo said:"need some kind of an artificial vortex inducer from the top to force the vortex creation"
A porous egg shaped container (PESC) vortexes all by itself.
External vortexing can only add so much upon the water.. if the water is
not cooled at the same time. Yes stirring in both directions and does impart different properties into the water. The PESC is for keeping the water from losing properties at least and enhancing at best.
You must have a PESC for storage otherwise the water degrades from stagnation. The natural combination of vortex/cooling in the PESC maintains and enhances the water.
You are seeing that great egg shaped device sucahyo posted and thinking this container is a device.. The image is a device only. The device is not a PESC which keeps the water alive.
If what you are trying to create is a device, you will still need a PESC to store the water afterwards, else it degrades via stagnation.

We at minimum need a container. Just an egg container.
Without the egg container for storage.. it does not matter what you do to the water it will degrade.

That's why I posted the siphon system to allow the addition of external water treatment ideas .. external. Parallel development of external water treatment.
Hello ... is this making sense ..

Devices are good, but it isn't the first step

A stirring device is as easy as taking an plastic easter egg and gluing a plastic string in a spiral upon it's surface.
You Do Not want to use propellers or a BLADE of any kind !!!!
You must use curves to stir, no blades.

This my understandings of what should be done,
but that's only my interpretation or say an opinion.

Can we agree that the initial target is just a container at this point?

Randy

[Vortex]

Bulkhead fitting and Spigot

Some measure should be taken to ensure a clean surface is available at the
spigot hole. A bolt with large washers could be hand tighten in the hole to
ensure there will be parallel flat surfaces, inside and outside of the spigot hole before the container is fired.

Spigots are nice but any value would work.
A spigot is a bulkhead fitting with a valve attached.

Search words: Ceramic/Porcelain Spigot/Nozzle

Bulkhead fitting is the device that allows a pipe to be sealed against a container wall without leakage.

To all maximum flexibility (options) a tee should be connected to the egg container and the spigot attached to the tee.
Most spigots are designed for horizontal mounting so using a tee provides a larger selection of spigots.

Finding a spigot with treads which can be attached to the tee becomes the only issue to resolve. The bulkhead fitting of the spigot is not used.

Bulkhead only requires one side of the container to have a seal. Any rubber
can provide the seal and can be layers of rubber, bicycle inner tube.
Threaded plastic tube is ok, providing you do not have to tighten down with much force to spread out the rubber a lot to get your seal.

An Improvised PVC Bulkhead Fitting for Liquid Storage Tanks
Amazon.com: Blue Plastic Spigot for Water Crock and Water Dispensers: Home Improvement