World´s most efficient water heater and No 1 group of free energy research etc...

[dambit]

Well, this is a bit disappointing...

Peter Lindemann I am disappointed with your tone, why are you so aggressive against Witts and Sir Timothy, are you afraid of them threatening your "FE community position" or is it something else that bothers you? Just tell us now please.

Your tone is below par, why this aggression? If you are that good that you can ridicule these guys show us some of your stuff Peter and become the king. It is good there are authors about FE but even more important are the builders of working devices and I don´t see them many places.. Eric Dollard and Bedini built stuff and they are/were your friends but I don´t see them attacking colleagues like you do here. And frankly speaking have you never been wrong about FE tech like Ed Gray´s engine? Maybe you are making a mistake, just consider it..

"How you know other people is how you are" - an old saying that tells us alot..

Peter since you are so active here why don´t you contact Sir Timothy for a personal demo so you can become friends again and check back with the rest of us here and tell the truth about Witts to everyone.. BECAUSE IF THEY ARE FOR REAL YOU WANT EVERYONE TO GET THIS TECH RIGHT? Or is your personal pride making you irrational?

I am sure Witts would like to show you some stuff, ie a working Mylow motor. So go and visit them please!

Yes Witts should open source some stuff asap but they just came out of a cave 200 years old, give them some time to update their homepage...

I suggest we get some testimonies published here FOR FREE with Witts permission that I will now ask for... It is funny 20 USD upsets some people because if you run a scam and steal 20 USD from someone´s pocket the rumour will spread quickly in places like this one!

@Sucahyou, I have a different picture about nano tech than you have, I suggest you read about crystals and how you cut them and which types of machines are needed for which sizes and geometries. There are many excellent web sites. One thing is for sure, money is needed. And about Keely, Hans Von Lieven says it all, he spent 30 years studying Keely and he is a professional physicist and a clever guy. Keely spent like >1 billion USD(in today´s money value) in 10 years on perfecting his machines mechanically, he was a builder like noone else in my opinion... If you are familiar with organ builders working methods you might understand Keely better.

Time will tell who is doing good things and who is not. Look at other people in order to find their strengths, the weaknesses are there to be filled in by their friends.

Hi Gauss,

No need to stress , nobody is not attacking you, only the so called "Knight" and his group.

Keeley and his devices are indeed complex. As are the principles by which they operate. However, if he was able to construct them in the late 19th century with hand tools and lathes, I suspect it shouldn't be too much of a challenge for todays machinists to replicate, not to mention cheaper. I'm not saying they will work as expected, Keeley never taught anyone how to do what he did. (That we know of)

Cheers,

Steve


P.S I also take donations, so feel free everyone to send me money.

[Guest]

Hi Stevie,

who is "Knight" and his group... I am not informed feel free to update me.

As for Keely I believe his geometries are very complex to build with any types of machines available, free form here we go. And yes nobody knew how they worked but some people got a clue about what he was about, noteably Tesla who realized his chance to replicate was by using electronics. But we can see his "funny" coils bear alot of resemblance to Keely´s shapes.

Stevie link in your homepage and give me a good Youtube movie and you will have 20 bucks from me and no complaints...

[Armagdn03]

It would seem to me, that many people today think that what they do not understand, must be complex.

Most of our learning institutions focus on specialization the higher in the system one climbs, and most of the respected positions in the field are held by specialists. Its almost as if, knowing a tiny portion of something, very well, is respected.

instead of finding truth in the commonalities, similarities, patterns, and rhythms nature provides, we have spent our time dissecting and compartmentalizing the so called "knowledge" we have gained, when really we have gained tons of data, with little knowledge to back it up.

A person who bridges the gap between disciplines, or has a good understanding of cause (not effects) usually doesn't explain things as "complex", and can usually convey their understanding in a simple concise way.


Those are the people id pay 20usd to listen too.

[Mark]

I'd gladly pay $20 to go on a tour and see all of their free energy devices. Maybe they should open up a tour!

[esaruoho]

hi. i've spoken with thrapp now three times, twice by phone and once by skype.

im interested in seeing the videos that they would want to post, but it seems that until someone creates them a pay-per-view streaming website i.e. "donate $$ and see this video, donate $$ andsee that video", the majority of their content wont be posted.

for the past year or so it has been their objective, as far as i can see from the conversations, to set up such a pay-per-view website, but the volunteers who have approached them to create a website, do not have that type of experience. they might know joomla and html (this i surmise from the previous witts site running on joomla, and the current one being html only)), but the volunteers dont necessarily know how to set up a "adobe media streaming server", as a mate of mine suggested. and setting that up would cost a few thousand dollars, etc.

so yeah its an interesting situation. they have voluntary web designers, but they are pretty untrustworthy (the joomla site never got finished, the current one has not been updated for 2 months and is in full control of the webmaster who just doesnt seem to get around to updating the site).

so thats the witts website then, doesnt have the content it could have, and who knows when there will be a pay-per-view WITTS video archive that people can watch upon paypal donation.

my personal opinion is that they should just sell dvd's, as it would be easier and faster to set up than a whole pay-per-view media-streaming-service -- not the kind of a thing a notepad+HTML wielding volunteer will be able to do.

what i did recently was send 30$ to them and ask to be sent one of those quantum energy enhancer technology things, that they mention in the waterfuelmuseum#2 + sterling's interview of thrapp. i just thought, here's something, lets see how it works.

after having ordered it, i got to talking with thrapp a bit over skype, and volunteered to create a tiny little HTML page. as those who have been paying attention to the 3 interviews know, thrapp has been talking about those quantum dot energy enhancer technologies, and those quantum mileage boosters and all that. as i have no experience with either, i cant say anything about it, no kneejerks here "for" or "against" (im sure the rest of the audience will provide those).

so my current status is: im waiting for writeups and images for the gift page from thrapp/witts. what the idea is is this: a description of a device and a image of a device, that one can order from witts, by sending them a specific amount of money via paypal.

now, the reason why im doing the page, once i get the data, is 1) because the webmaster doesnt update the pages 2) im interested in what kind of tech and how expensive it is that they are willing to part with 3) there was talks of also making plans available for those who support witts via paypal.

so nows a good chance for them to show what they have available. so far, as far as i can see, it seems to be: quantum dot energizers, quantum mileage boosters, and that solar panel modification or quantum solar panels or wotever. and some plans.

again, everyones made up their mind about these guys, the usual movers and shakers have weighed in, but im still trying to approach them from the "what-if?" angle.

so try not to freak out on me for posting this, ok?

i hope ill have the gift page running soon with the details, but its really up to them to decide if they want to send the images + data + have me do it. they are still hoping that the webmaster of the current server would just update the pages. after looking at the page source code i realized he's not even using a content management system, so its all by hand, not necessarily the best way to set things up.

so, again, as with everyone else, "only time will tell" (goes for searl,orionproject,witts,bearden -- the lot who would like some paypal money donations or are seeking 10,000$ to 12,000,000$ or 3 million to build a factory or wotever).

btw, they updated their FAQ site recently, check http://witts.ws/faq.html.

well, i've got a lottery ticket for a 10,2million euro lottery and will be seeing which people from my lottery-winning-shoppinglist will get money from that ridiculous pile (once i get it) and yep, i'll be seeing what kind of stuff magnacoaster+witts send you over once you send them heaps'o'cash.

[WeThePeople]

hi. i've spoken with thrapp now three times, twice by phone and once by skype.

im interested in seeing the videos that they would want to post, but it seems that until someone creates them a pay-per-view streaming website i.e. "donate $$ and see this video, donate $$ andsee that video", the majority of their content wont be posted.

For the love of pizza,
really?!

PPL (Pay-Per-Learn) ??? !!!

I admire your resilient optimistic "What If" approach to them,
but really...

Does anyone have any FREE TO BE SHARED
(What I thought was the theme of this forum)
ideas on heating water besides this?

Gosh thanks

[ashtweth]

The "important" facts still remain tho, he has handled EVERY THING he has done wrong, it all has been a PR nightmare and also has given the impression to many (including myself , as a friend was asked for money just to see his device to help him!) of DOUBT.

There are many steps to a successful device, we have out lined them for all engineers on the panacea site, especially in the "how they went wrong" page. (REFRESH)
How they went Wrong

We also just filmed this to help others. We have shown in case file after case file the SAME consistent mistakes, is thrapp making the same? he already has.

The more money people give him, the more mistakes he is going to make IMO.
Look at doctor Stiffler, look at the SEC, look at how ozzie freedom made millions on his open source e books, he could of got remuneration and SAFE dissemination this way YEARS ago, i rest my case.

Ash

[sigzidfit]

WeThePeople,

There's tons of info on allegedly super efficient water heaters in the popular FE and patent literature. I have not seen much evidence of successful/useful amateur replications or widely available or inexpensive manufactured units using the same principals.

Maybe a half dozen or so, at least, ways to skin that cat so to speak.

I started a thread on this forum called "Eleven Orders Of Magnitude".

Rex Research has compiled excellent reports on devices by Frenette, Perkins, and Griggs which are all mechanically simple nuclear fusion reactors utilizing cavitation by sonic energy. Look for the blue luminescent steam.

There was an old guy from NZ that had a sonic device driven by AC current that boiled a beverage in a cup RAPIDLY. His name escapes me. It was discussed on this forum a while back but again no independent replications that I am aware of. And again, not enough data or skill for me to take a whack at it.

Allegedly super efficient water heating by another mechanically simple method utilizing magnetic induction is documented in patents by Troy Reed and a company "MagTec". There are manufactured units based on these patents.

Also, check out the "friction steam boiler" thread on this forum.

There's plenty if you look for it.

Then again you can buy a $10 heating element at any hardware store that will convert electricity to heat in water at over 90% efficiency. So I guess another question one may ask is; What do I do with the heat I make? If it's all wasted in transmission/conversion to/by the desired body part what good is it?

Peace
PJ

[sigzidfit]

Oh yeah I made a movie about this haha.

YouTube - No Soup For You

[Aaron]

some comments

Free is good but here's the thing.

Just about all the info in any E-books on energy, etc... is all free in pieces scattered all over the internet, etc... so there really is no justification for anyone to say they "have" to pay for the info.

But when it comes to paying for information that "should" be free, well, it takes the author(s) time to compile all this info info one single place that is in a nice package for anyone to SAVE TIME if they just by the book or video.

Most people interested in studying these energy topics are NOT doing this as a living. They are doing it as a hobby or something part time but it doesn't pay the bills.

For some of us, info that is released, research in front of and behind the scenes is actually how some of us make a living. Some of us make a living by doing this full time. If we gave away all our work for free, we will have to go on welfare and be burden to society and become nothing but a problem instead of being a part of the solution.

For one thing, again, most of all of this is free on the net... and anyone that does do this for a living or part of their living deserves to get paid for putting countless hours into compiling the info for others.

I don't know if Witts deal is real or not...have been aware of his things over the years and nothing has ever been shown. If he wants to sell his videos or whatever, then he should have the right to do it without anyone judging him. BUT... there is no such thing as a REQUIRED DONATION so I totally agree with Peter...it isn't a donation they are seeking.... they are seeking an outright payment for their info so they should just call it what it is... a payment. In either case, I know someone that met with T.T. and saw convincing demos of different things...but again...nobody has ever duplicated any of their claims that I know of and nobody has even been given any plans or anything to tell them how....so it looks like for now and into the wild blue yonder....the jury will remain out on all of this groups stuff.

I think it is great someone can make so much money on a book like Water 4 Fuel but personally, I wouldn't be able to sleep at night knowing that I'm telling people to put a glass jar of explosive gas under their hood.

I see some people knocking Peter's books and vids but the fact of the matter is that his book on the Gray motor single handedly kicked off an entire resurretion of interest in that technology into the free energy world and regardless of his ideas...the Gray technology is back on the map because of Peter's efforts.

Some people can talk about Peter just writing books and making vids but I don't think anyone has been to his shop as much as I have and if anyone thinks he just writes books and doesn't build...we'll they just have no idea who Peter is. He has a crazy amount of projects that he has built at his shop and I've personally worked with quite a few projects hands on with him there myself and just because everything isn't posted in the public forums doesn't mean there aren't things going on behind the scenes. Everyone is entitled to their own proprietary information.

John Bedini has given out profound amounts of information for free...profound for anyone that really understands it or takes the time to. I've known John for a while and have been to his shops countless times over the last 10 years and am aware of a lot of the politics involved in this stuff from the perspective of the free energy experimenters world. There is also a lot of stuff he is entitled to keep to himself.

There is a LOT of good things that do come out of free sharing. The water spark plug technolology, Imhotep/Slayer/Lidmotor efficient lighting circuits etc...

Much of what is in my book The Quantum Key is freely spread in bits around the net...some is not and some is my own innovation and I'm totally comfortable charging money so people can get the whole package that I took time to assemble in one easy download.

Energetic Forum is full of free information and sharing and only a small percentage of people will fully apply what is freely shared. But that applies to anything and not just free energy stuff.

What I see is that as long as there is enough sharing to give out enough info so that people can learn and actually build things that work, that is part of the solution. But another part of the solution has to be people that do this for a living for being compensated by taking that to the next level to make it even easier for people to go from A to B or A to Z with whatever. I just hope that people that do this in part or whole as a business are just honest about what they're doing.

Ash is right, this whole Witts group deal could have made a fortune selling the information long ago. They could still give out enough information to help people and still go patent the stuff and license it out at the same time. People do this all the time.

Look at a lot of the scientific journals...many of the published articles are goldmines of information if they're understood...and what winds up happening after that information is published is that you see some patents spring up soon after or a few yeras after. I run into that all the time while researching.

Anyway, just a few thoughts.

[esaruoho]

There was an old guy from NZ that had a sonic device driven by AC current that boiled a beverage in a cup RAPIDLY. His name escapes me. It was discussed on this forum a while back but again no independent replications that I am aware of. And again, not enough data or skill for me to take a whack at it.

Peter Davey.
Peter Davey | MERLib.org.

again, resonance, keelybased stuff (but without knowledge of keely, at least on peter davey's part). keelynet did a good bunch of text about this, and as you know, rexresearch have a page on this guy too. its here:
Peter Davey -- Sonic Resonance Boiler

[Aaron]

heat pump water heater

p.s. The most efficient water heater you can get right now for about $400-$500 USD is simply a heat pump water heater...you can fit it to just about any hot water tank...takes about 600 watts instead of a couple thousand watts and is a COP over 2.5 I believe. Same hot water for 1/5 or so of the normal heating elements. That IS VERY EFFICIENT water heating.

Here is an example of one - there are other companies with similar products.
Airgenerate.com | Adaptive Energy Solutions

[esaruoho]

PPL (Pay-Per-Learn) ??? !!!

how's PPL any different from selling energy from the vacuum dvds?

[sigzidfit]

Roger that Aaron.

My first successful attempt at the production of "alternative energy" was helped by a complete set of technical info and construction plans freely available on the internet. As I progressed in the study and began plotting and planning to acquire the parts necessary to construct the device, I found someone willing to sell a finely crafted in welded stainless turn key device for a little less than I could by the parts for. I joyfully ponied up the less than $500 the small company/manufacturer in Texas was asking for it and a few days later...I wasn't just thinking about it, I was doing it. Now that's good business.

Peace
PJ

[Guest]

Well, I believe Peter should stand up for himself Aaron, no need for you to defend him, he is a grown up and he should behave like one. Does he want to go and visit Witts and find out the truth or not and tell the rest of us? Or is he scared of finding out the truth? And bring Sterling Allanwith him to tell us all the truth.

It is ridiculous critizicing their claims if you don´t want to go and check it out for yourself. If they are as good as they claim to be and at the same time amish they have a different view of life, economics and business than the rest of us. That we must respect. So please go there and have a look and then tell us the truth.