Atomic hydrogen furnace with COP of 21

[mikrovolt]

going back to the atomic torch.

The oxygen and hydrogen are mixed in the right ratio so the
gases swirling through the conical nozzle exibit a suitable flame,
there is a small blue cone at the nozzle which is approx 1340 degrees F

after the cone is an arc of 440V 400hz that ionizes the hydrogen.
When the ionized hydrogen hits the metal it gives off much energy in the form of heat. (The cutting process is with the addition of oxygen as a jet )

My question regarding radiation has never been answered. I believe a Geiger counter would show significant levels. Better yet if it could be shown to be safe that would be good. I could never find out about radiation and the atomic torch. I could never understand why governments have not published this information because if it is atomic then that would be a public safety concern and not for a backyard project.

[james west]

j l naudin tests showed no radiation, and states it is a total clean and safe process
Radiations measurement on the MAHG v2.0 by JL Naudin

[SilverToGold]

going back to the atomic torch.

The oxygen and hydrogen are mixed in the right ratio so the
gases swirling through the conical nozzle exibit a suitable flame,
there is a small blue cone at the nozzle which is approx 1340 degrees F

after the cone is an arc of 440V 400hz that ionizes the hydrogen.
When the ionized hydrogen hits the metal it gives off much energy in the form of heat. (The cutting process is with the addition of oxygen as a jet )

My question regarding radiation has never been answered. I believe a Geiger counter would show significant levels. Better yet if it could be shown to be safe that would be good. I could never find out about radiation and the atomic torch. I could never understand why governments have not published this information because if it is atomic then that would be a public safety concern and not for a backyard project.

I believe it is only the Hydrogen reaction in the arc that is of concern. Not actual "burning" of hydrogen with oxygen, though some of that would occur since it is being done in atmosphere.

I agree, there would probably be radiation emitted. But what type of radiation? If there is more than just plain x-rays (that we see from most spark gaps) but alpha (charged He atoms), beta or neutron radiation - that would mean that some nuclear process is happening (as Lyne states is the case).

To put this plainly, there is low energy transmutation occurring. This is against standard physics and the lies they promote. So you will NOT be hearing about this in the mainstream.

And what makes you think that the government cares about what happens to you or me? They make us undergo dangerous radiation exposure at the air ports and even send deadly levels of x-rays through you on the streets?

YouTube - FEDs Using Mobile X-Ray Vans To Do Drive-By Scannings

LOL, government cares about us? The US government with the Israeli government even participated in the genicide of many thousands of dark skinned Sephardic Jewish children with x-rays.

YouTube - The Ringworm Children 1 of 5

These are the last people I want telling me what is healthy for me.

[SilverToGold]

j l naudin tests showed no radiation, and states it is a total clean and safe process
Radiations measurement on the MAHG v2.0 by JL Naudin

He did his reaction in a sealed metal container. That means there was NO radiation leakage, that does not mean that there is no radiation occurring inside the metal container.

[mikrovolt]

After reviewing the Mollard test 2005 by Naudin labs and the Langmuir paper I believe that more intensive investigation is needed to bring the findings out in the open. Credible speakers that are unbiased need to debate whether an enclosed xray source and public safety should be prohibitive in light of the continuous problems associated with fossil fuels.

[james west]

@silvertogold
though naudin only used a low power corona discharge for his reaction it was only effectively shielded by a porcelain sleeve and a thin copper bell. I believe you need lead to shield from x rays. your own link refers to x-rays being used to see through vehicals.

[Savvypro]

I'm posting this in response to the misconceptions that have been brought up in the recent posts, that have already been covered in this thread and have been stated by a couple of people...

First off: there is no oxygen involved, this is not the same process as Browns Gas. Although there are similarities, this atomic hydrogen process only deals with the splitting of *hydrogen*. From the two proton state to the single proton state.

Which allows for the giving off, of energy in the following way (copied from post 19):

Your theory is simular to that of Tom Bearden (on THE ATOMIC HYDROGEN REACTION), where he states the following:

In modern quantum field theory, the charge (such as a proton which is atomic hydrogen without its electron) is considered an infinite bare charged mass in the middle surrounded by infinite virtual charged masses of opposite sign. The difference between the two infinities is finite, so the external observer looking through the "shielding screen" of the outer charge sees its difference with the sign of the inner charge, and thus sees a finite value for the inner charged mass, even though infinite charges are involved. In short, he "sees" or observes the standard textbook value for the charge and its mass. But by the asymmetry of opposite charges, two infinite charges of opposite sign can in fact pour out EM energy indefinitely (unceasingly). The original charges of the early universe have been doing so for some 14.7 billion years, assuming the best observational determinations of the age of the universe.

With the discovery of broken symmetry in 1957, one of the proven broken symmetries is that of opposite charges. The classical "isolated charge" (such as the proton/atomic hydrogen), is actually a charge ensemble of opposite charges. Hence a priori the "isolated charge" (classical view) must demonstrate the asymmetry of opposite charges in the quantum field theoretic view. This means that the charge really does continuously absorb virtual photon energy from the vacuum, coherently integrate it into observable photons, and re-emit that EM energy as real, observable photons radiating in all directions at light speed. This radiated real EM energy establishes and continuously replenishes the associated fields and potentials of the source charge, radially outward at light speed. So atomic hydrogen (the proton) does indeed continuously extract virtual energy from the active vacuum, integrate it into real observable energy, and radiate that real EM energy outward.

The furnace is just the contained version of the hydrogen welding torch - just contained in order to reuse the hydrogen. The atmosphere (plus Oxygen) is removed from the container to prevent explosions when the hydrogen is being used.

The hydrogen welding torch is still in use today, if it emitted radiation it would have been known about in its 50+ years of use. And Irving Langmuir would have detected it when he came across the phenomena and then subsequently created the atomic hydrogen welder. But one can never be too careful.

[james west]

further questions

In the atomic torch explanation it gives the temperature at the metal surface and not a flame temperature. The atomic hydrogen recombines to diatomic at the metal surface. Why is this ?
Why can’t the atoms rejoin within the flame?

If the electric arc was just breaking the covalent bond then surely they would recombine at will, within nanoseconds, and the heat will be found within the flame.
If the arc is also ionising the hydrogen then the electron is taken away leaving a proton.
Then the proton will only be able to recover its electron energy from the metal ?
Naudin mentions a small electrical gain within his circuit, is this why?
Internet explanations of the atomic torch only give the energy to break the diatomic bond as 422KJ which is then later recovered, giving a COP 1…..so the hydrogen is not being ionised then?
For the electric current to travel through the hydrogen gas, surely the gas has got to ionise before it becomes conductive?

Also interesting that Wikipedia give a totally different explanation of the effect….

“The arc is maintained independently of the workpiece or parts being welded. The hydrogen gas is normally diatomic (H2), but where the temperatures are over 600 °C (1100 °F) near the arc, the hydrogen breaks down into its atomic form, simultaneously absorbing a large amount of heat from the arc. When the hydrogen strikes a relatively cold surface (i.e., the weld zone), it recombines into its diatomic form and rapidly releases the stored heat.”

If this was true then the high temperature would be seen in the flame as the atomic hydrogen acts as a conductor for the heat to the metal, wouldn’t it?

[james west]

further thought
.....if it only takes 600 deg to split the hydrogen then surely as long as the weld area is above this no further atomic hydrogen would recombine...???

[SilverToGold]

@silvertogold
though naudin only used a low power corona discharge for his reaction it was only effectively shielded by a porcelain sleeve and a thin copper bell. I believe you need lead to shield from x rays. your own link refers to x-rays being used to see through vehicals.

Yes, if there were xrays and his detector was designed to detect xrays you're correct. But there may be other types of radioactivity such as alpha, beta or even neutrons that are generated and these would be possibly harder to detect than plain x-rays. Also x-rays would be emitted preferentially along a certain axis... was his detector on that axis?

The stronger the x-ray, the greater the penetration depth. Could be his were weaker x-rays and not able to penetrate his shielding.

Remember, x-rays are only one form of radiation. I'm personally more interested in nuclear radiations than "ordinary" x-rays.

I honestly don't know what is generated and the only way to really find out is to do it.

[SilverToGold]

From William Lyne's book "Occult Ether Physics"

1) From Van Nostrand's Encyclopedia of Science “Hydrogen molecules dissociate to atoms endothermically at high temperatures (heat of dissociation about 103 cal/gram mole) in an electricarc, or by irradiation.” “...the hydrogen atoms recombine at the metal surface to provide heat required for welding.”

2) From "Text-Book of Inorganic Chemistry" London " - “Langmuir (1912) discovered that hydrogen at low pressure in contact with a tungsten wire heated by an electric current is dissociated to some extent into atoms:”.... ‘This absorbs a large amount of energy, about 100 kcal Per gram-molecule. “
“... The atomic hydrogen formed is chemically very active. Atomic hydrogen is formed when an electric arc between tungsten electrodes is allowed to burn in hydrogen at atmospheric pressures (Fig 106)”.
“Atomic-hydrogen blown out of the arc by a jet of molecular hydrogen across the arc, forms an intensely hot flame, capable of melting tungsten (m. Pt. 3400 °). This flame obtains its heat from recombination of hydrogen atoms to H2.”
“Hydrogen being set free in a chemical reaction is often more reactive than hydrogen gas.”
“...the activity of such nascent (newborn) hydrogen, in the act of liberation from its compounds, is due to the hydrogen being in the atomic state.”

Note the word it ABSORBS a large amount of energy. That energy did NOT come from the spark, it was absorbed from the ether.

In summary, it takes 103 cal/ gram mol to disassociated the H2 into two H atoms. They recombine later and release 109,000 cal/gram mol. That is over a 1000 gain in energy and this is all from standard reference materials! This is not William Lyne saying this.

The Wiki link's explaination is bogus. Disinformation by academia to throw you off the track and keep the lie of Einsteinianism and it's finite dying universe intact.

Go read Lyne's book is you want more info, he explains it better than I can here.

[SilverToGold]

I don't buy Bearden's Relativistic explaination. Virtual photons? Quantum Field (ie Relativity, space-time curvature, time dilation mumbo jumbo)? He obviously buys fully into the Einsteinian lie. This goes against Tesla's theory of the universe and common sense.

As far as Langmuir, he did his work prior to 1912, I don't think he was very aware of radiation or much less how to detect it. Curie only won the Nobel Prize for radiation in 1903 (though Tesla was ahead of her in knowing about radiation). I could be wrong but it wasn't a simple matter of just going to Radio Shack and buying a radiation detector in 1912.

I'm posting this in response to the misconceptions that have been brought up in the recent posts, that have already been covered in this thread and have been stated by a couple of people...

First off: there is no oxygen involved, this is not the same process as Browns Gas. Although there are similarities, this atomic hydrogen process only deals with the splitting of *hydrogen*. From the two proton state to the single proton state.

Which allows for the giving off, of energy in the following way (copied from post 19):

The furnace is just the contained version of the hydrogen welding torch - just contained in order to reuse the hydrogen. The atmosphere (plus Oxygen) is removed from the container to prevent explosions when the hydrogen is being used.

The hydrogen welding torch is still in use today, if it emitted radiation it would have been known about in its 50+ years of use. And Irving Langmuir would have detected it when he came across the phenomena and then subsequently created the atomic hydrogen welder. But one can never be too careful.

[james west]

thank you for clarifying this topic for me. you have all been very helpful
br
james

[Savvypro]

I don't buy Bearden's Relativistic explaination. Virtual photons? Quantum Field (ie Relativity, space-time curvature, time dilation mumbo jumbo)? He obviously buys fully into the Einsteinian lie. This goes against Tesla's theory of the universe and common sense.

As far as Langmuir, he did his work prior to 1912, I don't think he was very aware of radiation or much less how to detect it. Curie only won the Nobel Prize for radiation in 1903 (though Tesla was ahead of her in knowing about radiation). I could be wrong but it wasn't a simple matter of just going to Radio Shack and buying a radiation detector in 1912.

Bearden's explanation is just one that explains what's happening better than other explanitions that I have seen. To paraphrase Lyne, Langmuir just assumed the excess energy was there in the atoms all along, based on Einsteinian lies.

Langmuir is sure to have known about radiation, considering where he worked and did his research. The point still stands, the atomic hydrogen welder has been in use for over 50 years, a long enough period where access to radiation detection equipment has been common place. If there was even a slight hint of potential radiation danger, wikiganda would be leading with it as the reason not to use it and why it isn’t used as widely as the current inferior and inefficient methods.

But as I said in my previous post: one can never be too careful - it's better to be safe than sorry.

The 109,000 cal/gram figure you state is on the low end as in post 43 I posted the following:

I may be wrong but based on the figures Lyne gives and others that I have seen from other sources like the work of Irving Langmuir.

Hydrogen gives off about 130,000 calories/gram-atom (I have seen figures of 140,000 and 150,000 calories/gram-atom) - the 130K figure is from Irving Langmuirs work. Lyne himself only states 108,897 calories/gram-atom.

For hydrogen it only takes 103 cal/gram to dissociate the atoms.

While helium gives off about 460,000 calories/gram-atom from Van Nostrand's Scientific Encyclopaedia which Lyne references and their is also a copy of the page on the yahoo group.


Question to all: anyone know how much it takes to dissociate helium?

Even the low end figure is nothing to sneeze at. It's still over 1000 time more out then put in.

Personally, the problem with this process is in the name - people automatically assume that it's a nuclear reaction - just because of the word atomic.

[james west]

Sorry, I have some more questions if you could help.
Whilst hunting around on the www I found a statement that said heating within electrolysis cells was partially caused by the recombination of atomic hydrogen to diatomic……seems possible, what do you think? I personally would of though if this was the case then a large temperature rise would be seen.
The other question I have is about the lyne atomic hydrogen furnace. He shows from his sketch that an electrolysis cell with lead cathode produces atomic hydrogen. I have done a general search on this and cannot find anything. Has anyone tried this? I would assume that the volume produce as per Faradays equation would be doubled due to the hydrogen being atomic. ???