Atomic hydrogen furnace with COP of 21

[Tishatang]

Yahoo Group: Lyne Atomic Hydrogen Furnance

Hi Savvypro and All

Here is link to Yahoo Group. William Lyne regular contributor. Activity on it comes and goes. Maybe you all could contribute there as well as here. Get more minds working on this concept. I am not in a position to help right now.

lahf : Lyne Atomic Hydrogen Furnace

Tishatang

[Savvypro]

Hi Savvypro and All

Here is link to Yahoo Group. William Lyne regular contributor. Activity on it comes and goes. Maybe you all could contribute there as well as here. Get more minds working on this concept. I am not in a position to help right now.

lahf : Lyne Atomic Hydrogen Furnace

Tishatang

Already a member - I've read all the posts and it seams like everyone is still in the design process (although Lyne may have built a working model).

Your right about the activity coming and going, apart from 2 recent posts one asking if the group is dead and the other asking about a missing file there hasn't been any real activity in some time.

[Tishatang]

@Savvypro
Here is a crazy idea I had some time ago. It is based on the theory that more energy is gained in the form of heat and radiation upon recombination than the electrical energy uses to separate the hydrogen molecule. In other words, the process gains energy when the separate H+H recombine to form H2. At least, in my mind, this is the basic explanation of the Lyne process.

I was going to use an old 40 gallon propane tank from an old vehicle conversion I have. It has an access plate on the side. I was going to install the high voltage electrodes inside. I would place the tank vertical with its round ends at the top and bottom. I would then apply vacuum and empty the tank. I would then fill a very small amount of H2 into the tank. Turn on the voltage and let it run from a safe distance. Little by little, I would increase the amount of H2 in the tank and see if the tank would start to get warm with a remote sensor. My idea is that as the electrodes separate the H2, the H+H would rise to the top recombine and fall down the sides, meet in the middle of the bottom and rise to the electrodes and be separated again and the cycle continues. Otherwise, a convection heater with no moving parts. If the theory hold true, there should be a point that is safe from explosion that produces heat as a stand alone heater.

This is my backyard mechanic approach, not scientific for sure. But had most of the materials on hand. But now I am in another country and far from the resources back home.

Just thought I would share for what it is worth.

Tishatang

[Savvypro]

@Savvypro
Here is a crazy idea I had some time ago. It is based on the theory that more energy is gained in the form of heat and radiation upon recombination than the electrical energy uses to separate the hydrogen molecule. In other words, the process gains energy when the separate H+H recombine to form H2. At least, in my mind, this is the basic explanation of the Lyne process.

I was going to use an old 40 gallon propane tank from an old vehicle conversion I have. It has an access plate on the side. I was going to install the high voltage electrodes inside. I would place the tank vertical with its round ends at the top and bottom. I would then apply vacuum and empty the tank. I would then fill a very small amount of H2 into the tank. Turn on the voltage and let it run from a safe distance. Little by little, I would increase the amount of H2 in the tank and see if the tank would start to get warm with a remote sensor. My idea is that as the electrodes separate the H2, the H+H would rise to the top recombine and fall down the sides, meet in the middle of the bottom and rise to the electrodes and be separated again and the cycle continues. Otherwise, a convection heater with no moving parts. If the theory hold true, there should be a point that is safe from explosion that produces heat as a stand alone heater.

This is my backyard mechanic approach, not scientific for sure. But had most of the materials on hand. But now I am in another country and far from the resources back home.

Just thought I would share for what it is worth.

Tishatang

Tishatang,

Your theory is simular to that of Tom Bearden (on THE ATOMIC HYDROGEN REACTION), where he states the following:

In modern quantum field theory, the charge (such as a proton which is atomic hydrogen without its electron) is considered an infinite bare charged mass in the middle surrounded by infinite virtual charged masses of opposite sign. The difference between the two infinities is finite, so the external observer looking through the "shielding screen" of the outer charge sees its difference with the sign of the inner charge, and thus sees a finite value for the inner charged mass, even though infinite charges are involved. In short, he "sees" or observes the standard textbook value for the charge and its mass. But by the asymmetry of opposite charges, two infinite charges of opposite sign can in fact pour out EM energy indefinitely (unceasingly). The original charges of the early universe have been doing so for some 14.7 billion years, assuming the best observational determinations of the age of the universe.

With the discovery of broken symmetry in 1957, one of the proven broken symmetries is that of opposite charges. The classical "isolated charge" (such as the proton/atomic hydrogen), is actually a charge ensemble of opposite charges. Hence a priori the "isolated charge" (classical view) must demonstrate the asymmetry of opposite charges in the quantum field theoretic view. This means that the charge really does continuously absorb virtual photon energy from the vacuum, coherently integrate it into observable photons, and re-emit that EM energy as real, observable photons radiating in all directions at light speed. This radiated real EM energy establishes and continuously replenishes the associated fields and potentials of the source charge, radially outward at light speed. So atomic hydrogen (the proton) does indeed continuously extract virtual energy from the active vacuum, integrate it into real observable energy, and radiate that real EM energy outward.

On the setup I've been looking (more like thinking) at something along the lines of your setup - mainly to try and reduce the complexity of the furnace idea. Something without the pumps and doesn't need to be heavily machined.

My only stumbling block is converting the energy out put into useable electricity without boiling water, I know about Charles Brown's heat-to-electricity converter . This would be ideal if mass produced but it's not. Then again I might be wrong, in which case

[Tishatang]

Yes, most of the designs out there are complex requiring pumps, heat exchangers, etc. I wanted to keep it simple. Heat for my house for the year is more than my electricity expense living in a northern latitude. If I could heat my house cheaply, I would be a happy man.

Actually there is a way to generate electricity without boiling water. Years ago maybe in the 1960's they invented a wire that lost its strength at low temps.

They were offering samples cheap and had an open call for inventions using it. On of the designs offered was a slow moving turbine that the wires turned a vane. The wires alternately heated and cooled as they revolved around the turbine housing. There was a hot water side and a cold water side. The greater the difference in temp, the more power. As I recall, it was practical as low as maybe a 50 degree difference? It turned slow, but the strength of the wires offered great torque as they straightened out. Therefore, one could gear up the ration to spin a regular generator. It has faded from view, maybe classified? Don't recall the name. Maybe someone else can offer input? Probably in old issues of Popular Science or Mechanics Magazines?

Food for thought?
Tishatang

[Savvypro]

Yes, most of the designs out there are complex requiring pumps, heat exchangers, etc. I wanted to keep it simple. Heat for my house for the year is more than my electricity expense living in a northern latitude. If I could heat my house cheaply, I would be a happy man.

Actually there is a way to generate electricity without boiling water. Years ago maybe in the 1960's they invented a wire that lost its strength at low temps.

They were offering samples cheap and had an open call for inventions using it. On of the designs offered was a slow moving turbine that the wires turned a vane. The wires alternately heated and cooled as they revolved around the turbine housing. There was a hot water side and a cold water side. The greater the difference in temp, the more power. As I recall, it was practical as low as maybe a 50 degree difference? It turned slow, but the strength of the wires offered great torque as they straightened out. Therefore, one could gear up the ration to spin a regular generator. It has faded from view, maybe classified? Don't recall the name. Maybe someone else can offer input? Probably in old issues of Popular Science or Mechanics Magazines?

Food for thought?
Tishatang

Tishatang,

I don't think there would be a problem creating a big enough heat difference with the atomic hydrogen process. The problem may be in that it may create too big a difference between hot and cold.

But as long as the chamber where the atomic hydrogen is being recombined doesn't melt - use of heat pipes or even using water that is pumped through cavities in the chamber wall do.

The water could then be used for heating a home - you may have to let it cool a bit first - or just use a lot of water system.

[Savvypro]

This has been bugging me all day so I'm just going to get it off my chest.

----====[ Warning Crazy idea ahead ]====----

It could be possible to create an Iron Man arc reactor using the atomic hydrogen process (or even with helium). I told you it was a crazy idea.

Then again the reactor uses Palladium which can absorb up to 900 times its own volume of hydrogen in it's hydride form. Also it's called an arc reactor, an arc is used to split the hydrogen and to recombine it in the atomic hydrogen process.

Could the powers that be have slipped that into the film to expose people to the idea and prepare people for the possibility of having that type of technology in the future when or if they ever decide to release it.

Back to the crazy idea:

A small tokamak, some magnetic confinement. How to harness the power is the issue - as this is a crazy idea how about some miniature super-conducting thermo electric junction plates where the recombination takes place or around the tokamak walls. the power output may not be as high as 1 gigajoules.

----====[ End of Crazy idea ]====----

Their you have it, before you lynch me - my excuse :

I'm delusional it's been a long day and need my sleep. After all the film is fiction and this thread is all about reality. Where there has been a documented experiment which on the 83rd run produced a COP of 21 .

[Savvypro]

If anyone has been over to rex research lately they may have come across the Starlite Plastic page: http://www.rexresearch.com/ward/ward.htm

There are many claims on that page two of the interesting ones are:

Starlite-coated eggs were subjected to light-energy sources that simulated a nuclear flash, equivalent to a temperature of 10,000 C. 'They did it twice and it was still there. Charred, but intact.' The Foulness equipment couldn't keep up. 'I said to one scientist, "Are we doing all right?", and he burst out laughing. He said, "Normally, we do a test every couple of hours because we have to wait for it to cool down. We're doing it every 10 minutes, and it's sat there laughing at us."' Most materials vaporise beyond 2,000 C. Pure carbon, which has the highest melting point of all elements, melts at 3,500 C. Starlite was withstanding temperatures and forces that physics and thermodynamics dictated it shouldn't. Even with tests from unquestionable authorities like AWE, people were sceptical. 'Some people called me a shyster. But they are blinkered. We've got video: We can show you.'

'Starlite has a Q-value [an energy absorption rating] of 2,470. The space shuttle tiles have a Q-value of 1.' Not only that, but because Starlite is so lightweight – 1mm thick, compared to 75mm for the space tiles – it's actually '2,470 x 75 times better'.

If the stuff is real and not some well executed hoax.

One could make a furnace out of almost anything - well within reason, if you wanted to create a vacuum you couldn't use paper - could you. Even if it was coated in Starlite you'd need a material strong enough to withstand the vacuum.

[aljhoa]

If anyone has been over to rex research lately they may have come across the Starlite Plastic page: Maurice Ward -- Starlite plastic

There are many claims on that page two of the interesting ones are:




If the stuff is real and not some well executed hoax.

One could make a furnace out of almost anything - well within reason, if you wanted to create a vacuum you couldn't use paper - could you. Even if it was coated in Starlite you'd need a material strong enough to withstand the vacuum.

Starlite is made form readily available materials and is an insulator.
Maurice Ward: Hello One and All
In March 1990 The Live demonstrations on Video BBC's Tomorrow's World showed that Starlite could keep an egg cold even with a 1200 degrees celcius flame impingeing on the EGG for 5 minutes, and when cracked open 'The Egg had not even began to cook''.
How Brown’ Gas Plasma could be used to heat water (1)with and (2)w/o Starlite?
Al

[Savvypro]

Starlite is made form readily available materials and is an insulator.
Maurice Ward: Hello One and All
In March 1990 The Live demonstrations on Video BBC's Tomorrow's World showed that Starlite could keep an egg cold even with a 1200 degrees celcius flame impingeing on the EGG for 5 minutes, and when cracked open 'The Egg had not even began to cook''.
How Brown’ Gas Plasma could be used to heat water (1)with and (2)w/o Starlite?
Al

Thanks for the link.

I may not have been clear, but my post about Starlite was about using it to coat the inside of the atomic hydrogen furnace chamber to prevent it from melting.

If Starlite is real and does what it says on the tin then one could make an atomic hydrogen or helium version furnace using a chamber made out of almost anything - within reason.

Which would mean cheaper construction.

For the heating of water one could use a simular pipe coil setup as shown the the Lyne atomic hydrogen furnace i posted. Or heat pipes to remove the heat from the chamber for use externaly.

[Radiant_Science]

Unified theory

If you check out the patent I have attached, you will see that mainstream science has completely defined what is going on, and they can make hydrogen bind to many things. They are making VERY cheap Salt Hydrides instead of expensive metal hydrides. In this patent you will also see references to a new unified theory and a lot of info that will clear MANY things up. In fact...I have figured out that Stanley Meyer was in fact using this process!

[Savvypro]

Radiant_Science,



Great find, I'll have a good read of the file when I free up some time as I'm now suddenly quite busy with a couple of business projects.
Strange how things quickly change for the better.

[Electrotek]

If anyone has been over to rex research lately they may have come across the Starlite Plastic page: Maurice Ward -- Starlite plastic

This Starlite seems like an amazing substance. This stuff should keep a Fusor's inner grid from melting. I wrote to the guy to see if he would be interested in selling these small grids, insulated with his plastic, but he hasn't written back.

I heard similar tales a few years back about concrete mixed with ABS granules. One side of a slab was heated with a cutting torch for 8 hours and the temperature on the other side didn't change. Nothing was said about the size of the granules, and I can't find anything on the Internet. I guess I'll have to do some testing on my own.

This concrete insulation would probably be good enough for both the furnace and the laser. I'd like to have a furnace providing steam to drive a Tesla turbine powering a generator, or a laser powering photo cells.

[Savvypro]

This Starlite seems like an amazing substance. This stuff should keep a Fusor's inner grid from melting. I wrote to the guy to see if he would be interested in selling these small grids, insulated with his plastic, but he hasn't written back.

I heard similar tales a few years back about concrete mixed with ABS granules. One side of a slab was heated with a cutting torch for 8 hours and the temperature on the other side didn't change. Nothing was said about the size of the granules, and I can't find anything on the Internet. I guess I'll have to do some testing on my own.

This concrete insulation would probably be good enough for both the furnace and the laser. I'd like to have a furnace providing steam to drive a Tesla turbine powering a generator, or a laser powering photo cells.

Electrotek,

If I were to go down the steam route I would also use a Tesla turbine, you just can't beet the simplicity of that design.

[Electrotek]

Electrotek,

If I were to go down the steam route I would also use a Tesla turbine, you just can't beet the simplicity of that design.

Do you know of anyone who's selling them? Or are they strictly DIY?

Harbor Freight has a 10kW generator head for $289. It needs a 20Hp motor to drive it. Something like this would be ideal for a closed loop system, if at least half of the power were available as output.