Hendershot Replications

[morpher44]

coils ...

Hi Morpher44,

This is a very interesting thread.
Youtube is down at the moment so I will watch those vids later.

I would like to suggest that you put induction coils IN SERIES on each of those L's.
I found that they are even more effective than capacitors. I am beginning to use caps too to tank and otherwise, but if there were one to choose it would be the inductor.

It is an entirely different animal from the same coil being used as a transformer.
The reason is that in series every pulse going down the line makes another spike and that 'creates' more energy.

Give it a try. If I can find my way back here I will check back tomorrow.
(I keep getting lost on this forum .)

thank you, this is wonderful stuff,

jeanna

@ jeanna
I think your intuition is right-on-the-money.

One odd thing about Hendershot's circuit (actually in the
Barry Hilton book there are several alternative circuits),
Hendershot may have wound his current path unconventionally
through his 5:1 transformers. These are standard off-the-shelf
guys extracted from TV or something.
On the 120V side there would be lots of turns around an iron
core ... making for an inductance that could well be up
in the Henries.
His circuit is so weird it might be difficult to do conventional
circuit analysis on it ... unless your good at that (unlike me I'm afraid).
There is mutual inductance all over the place here...

I too have the feeling that he is exploiting LARGE inductances
by simply hooking all these coils up in series essentially. His 40 MFD
and 80 MFD do something clever as well.
In the circuit I'm experimenting, which is essentially half of
Hendershot dual-coil arrangement, I can see pulses from a relay -- which
amount to just high-voltage spikes really, turned into a SQUARE wave ...
as if they were run through a flip-flop. This done with passive
components ... coils ... capacitors ... no diodes ... no transistors.
Its mind bending.

I had this thought before ... but last night got this thought again
after studying the Hendershot material.

The thought was ...

"Why did Hendershot select 5 15/16 inches for the diameter of his coil?"

This bothered me because Hubbard too, who used PHI in his coil designed,
came up with a radius for his first prototype that was a similar diameter.

I have to assume that Hendershot used some sort of math to come up
with this radius ... because it is so specific ... and so unusual.
Its not a standard coffee-can size ... I don't think.

In fiddling with the numbers, I came up with this ... using a very
Hubbard-ish approach:

Start from 60Hz.
Take it up a power of two until your in the 2Ghz range.

60 * 2^25 = 2.013266 GHz

That is your standing wave that will appear on the top of your
cylinder.

Ok ... now compute how much distance that is using speed-of-light
equal to 299792458 meters/sec.

I get the value in inches to be 5.862540. The dowels were .125 inches,
so add one half that ... twice ... yielding: 5.98754.
Take the fractional part .98754 and multiply by 16 to get it in 16ths ..
and truncate: 5 15/16 ... viola!!

Better still, I wanted to check this line of reasoning ... so I thought
to myself:

"How did he come up with 14 turns for L1 ... which is clearly the
coil that when combined with 7.8nF ... TUNES a special frequency?"

"So is that special frequency also a power-of-two harmonic of
2.013266 GHz derived above?"

60 Hz * 2^12 = 245760 Hz (well below AM dial).

What value of inductance would be needed to resonate at
245760 Hz if the capacitor is 7.8nF?
Answer: 53.768017 uH (assuming AIR-COIL)

Now the question is...
"How many turns on a coil form that has diameter 5 15/16 would
be needed of 28 AWG wire to achieve 53.768017 uH?"

Hendershot would have had the Wheeler forumla if he looked
that up in some Radio Engineer book.
Solving for N (number of turns), given:
L = 53.768uH, D = 5.9375 in, H approx .33 inch (a guess)
results in
***** 14 turns *****
which is the correct answer!!!

This is either an amazing coincidence ... or the very math
Hendershot used.

Caveat: The Wheeler formula is only accurate for when
H > .4 * D which is NOT the case above. This cylinder coil
has a height far too small for that formula to predict accurately
the inductance. However, I'm not bothered by that too much
because Hendershot was interviewed and stated that
sometimes he needed to REMOVE wire since he wrapped
the coil (presumably this last coil L1) ... with too much wire.
So that little TWEAK to get it working might be a clue
that this last coil requires a bit of guess work due
to the inaccuracy of the Wheeler formula.

If all of the above math is correct and was used ... then
Hendershot derived his coil dimensions in a similar way to how
Hubbard did it.
Certainly they would have the Wheeler formula in common...
but the bit about a standing wave across the top of the cylinder
is a very ANTENNA-like calculation ... not normally done for coils ...
except for perhaps TESLA COILS!!!.

[jeanna]

Yes,
I have recently seen a book by collins?? from 19early and it is all about how to make inductors and what to think about.
[The link is posted by MW383 on earthbatteryNathanStubblefield thread opened by localjoe at ou.]
I think we have a lot to learn from those guys in the early 1900's.
Everybody who investigated electricity back then used induction coils. They knew a lot about them, so ... I will never be bored, that is for sure!

Hendershot dual-coil arrangement, I can see pulses from a relay -- which
amount to just high-voltage spikes really, turned into a SQUARE wave ...
as if they were run through a flip-flop. This done with passive
components ... coils ... capacitors ... no diodes ... no transistors.
Its mind bending.

It is so incredibly simple and I am sure we can cut out enough dross to see it soon.

Personally, I think the tall narrow spikes are the way to go.

It is hard to describe what I was noticing mostly because I was having a hard time understanding if what I was seeing was important or a mental confusion.

I had a set up that had pretty much fixed volts and frequency
So 89v spikes and 208Khz frequency.
I would look at the volts on individual lights or whole secondaries and it seemed that if I added more lights which should take the overall reading down, the reading went up.
There were other things like this too, but since I am not too sure, I do not want to cause confusion.
The thing about it is that it seemed that there is something that is taking the place of amps, and I think it is the frequency.
Its like this if you look at only one spike it is immeasurably skinny, but if you cram 208 thousand of them into one second, you start to have something.

It may be just right to have tall skinny spikes and the "ooo no, they do no work" may be just a part of the disinfo game, and since at 60 hz we MUST use amps, everyone believed it to be true for all voltages. I think at higher frequencies you can get the same work out of closely packed thin voltage spikes.

But that is just my idea, I need to do much more to show it.

thank you,

jeanna

[morpher44]

tall skinny spikes

It may be just right to have tall skinny spikes and the "ooo no, they do no work" may be just a part of the disinfo game, and since at 60 hz we MUST use amps, everyone believed it to be true for all voltages. I think at higher frequencies you can get the same work out of closely packed thin voltage spikes.
jeanna

"tall skinny spikes"
This high-voltage, narrow bandwidth events, when arriving from
space can convey a lot of energy ... but in a very extremely short
duration. Most are attenuated by our atmosphere and ozone.
As we loose our ozone, who knows, it might become simpler to harvest
energy from space.

Also, when they arrive, they may arrive in multiple harmonics.
I don't have access to a spectrum analyzer ... but it would
be interesting to see if it can be shown that one event
amounts of a signal across several power-of-two harmonics.
If the answer is YES ... a scalar wave, or toroidal shaped wave
packet may cause particle spins at various diameters as
it travels past. Each diameter amounts to a signal at a different
frequency. So as the smoke ring passes -- analogy here --
little particle spins are left in its wake at different diameters.

As for the "cylinder" coil form having a standing wave.
Cylinders are known to LEAK at these end points.

Ping a coil at 60hz, and every power-of-two harmonic is also
ringing in the sucker ... right up the spectrum.
The one that matches the DIAMETER of the coil (if
there is a match) ... may STAND there ... and not leak away.
Standing waves and resonance are two wild-and-crazy
phenomenon.

[jeanna]

I just bought a conical drinking cup today for use as a conical coil template. I think the shape helps match whatever is there...I read that from tesla quote maybe??

I will give it a try.

I guess I need to move my big camera file over to this computer so I can show a pic or 2 of my scopeshots taken at a place between 2 wires with probes stuck into the earth with stubblefield generators at each end. I have a comparison set of probes without the stubblefield gens too.

The shape is the same but the inductance etc whatever he did increases the voltage from typically 5mV from just 2 probes to often 65-85mV with the coils at either end. It is ac on top of a 0.5v-0.7vdc. very interesting and amazing looking.

BTW The stubblefield generator is a perfect wire replication of the ancient caduceus.
The ancient drawings even look like wires in some versions.
I understand that JNL has made a modern version that can produce scalar waves. HMM.

Whatever is coming our way may be just what we need and maybe it won't hurt either. I like the idea of toroidal packets. Sounds great to me.

thank you,

jeanna

[mlurye]

morpher,
I would say that outside coil is wound on 6" diameter. Wooden dowel + 1st coil + electrical tape ... (in regards of 5 15/16 diameter)

[morpher44]

L1?

morpher,
I would say that outside coil is wound on 6" diameter. Wooden dowel + 1st coil + electrical tape ... (in regards of 5 15/16 diameter)

@mlurye,

The calculation for L1 is bugging me.

If the cylinder is ferromagnetic (which I am assuming),
then I think you use the Wheeler formula and also multiply
by the permeability constant ... 5000 or so for Iron ...
something less if your material is say some sort of stainless steel
that is magnetic.
I'm leaning towards this being the case because for
Hendershot to achieve resonance with L1 and the 7.8nF cap he
made, L1 has to have a large inductance ... assuming buzzer
frequencies.

I messed around with that little "made in china" dual-coil buzzer
I have. I hooked it up to my pulse generator. As I dial around
in the frequency range, providing it a narrow DC pulse, the
buzzer hums in the audio range, but won't pull the clapper
to the solenoid until I'm in the range of say 90Hz to 110Hz.
Its a narrow range. Anything outside that range won't do it.
That buzzer solenoid essentially have a self resonance in that range
... which makes sense.

Placing this pulsing solenoid in proximity of the Hendershot coil
does induce a current in the Hendershot circuit.
It has a magnetic field that is easily picked up by the Hendershot coils,
even at a distance of a few feet. I'm impressed by the distance of
mutual inductance ...

If I connect a ground wire between the buzzer's metallic case
and the Hendershot circuit (between the two big caps),
that signal is BOOSTED substantially ... this being the one-wire
connection between them.

But what I'm realizing is that since Q is so high with these values --
high inductance ... low capacitance ... the bandwidth
will be an extremely narrow range. It could be on the order
of one third of a Hertz ... or less.
The chances of tuning to that one PEAK resonant place --
for my crudely made thing -- might be very difficult.
Also, I don't have a precise way of measuring the inductance
and capacitance ... so knowing this sweet spot frequency
is ball park only.

I might have to rethink my coil ... to provide a slightly larger
bandwidth ... so as to make tuning less difficult -- at the cost
of smaller Q (and possibly attenuated results).

L1 is a challenge.

[mlurye]

I noticed 1 more thing,
Everybody saying that cap should be wrapped around stainless steel tube. Check comment on fig1 The Inventions of Lester Hendershot. It says: stainless or Aluminum tube.
And the coil I was talking about is L4, see schema on the link above.

[morpher44]

L1 is L4?

I noticed 1 more thing,
Everybody saying that cap should be wrapped around stainless steel tube. Check comment on fig1 The Inventions of Lester Hendershot. It says: stainless or Aluminum tube.
And the coil I was talking about is L4, see schema on the link above.

Yeah ... in the schematic you are referring to L4 is what I'm calling L1.
Other schematics have that outside coil as L1. Yes its confusing.

Yes the tube the cap is wrapped around is puzzling.
If its aluminum, its paramagnetic .. which would actually
REDUCE the inductance ... so placing it in the coils like
that would influence their inductance the other way ... bring
the resonant frequency higher.
Stainless steel is problematic because there are several
varieties of it... each with different permeability characteristics.
These would be below iron ... but approaching iron in
permeability
Some stainless steels are non-magnetic, however ...
but that is a bit more exotic to find.

But again, IF the tube is paramagnetic or non-magnetic,
making the coils essentially air coils ...
the oscillations would be well up in the VLF frequency
range ... approaching the AM band.

I can actually see on my scope the following effect.
If I ping with pulses of say 1Khz .... I can see on this outer
coil (my L1, your L4), a dampened oscillation which corresponds
to that AIR-Coil assumed frequency. Its dampened, however,
and fades away FAR before the next pulse.

If I then slowly lower the cylinder into the coil,
as I do, that oscillation doesn't change in frequency, but
does get more and more dampened.

When the capacitor is completely inside the coil,
that oscillation is almost completely gone ... negligible.

If that oscillation is WANTED, then yes I agree with
you that these should be air coils ... tuning
at that higher frequency ... and an attempt should
be made to get that ringing to go longer ... and go
regenerative if possible. The Q in that situation is
not so great ... but the bandwidth is more reasonable
with respect to tuning. It becomes more wide-band.

If, on the other hand, we are trying to tune for buzzer
frequencies, I think the coil inductance must be brought
much higher using ferromagnetic material.
Here the Q goes VERY VERY high ... bandwidth becomes
extremely narrow and tuning becomes a pain-in-the-a**.

There are a few clues that lead me to assume the latter.
A. Hendershot's device was notoriously difficult to tune.
B. One photo has a sticker inside the coil with the letters "Fe" -- Iron.
C. Hendershot's early designs used coffee cans -- most are magnetic
D. When Hendershot switched from coffee cans -- which would damage
his caps due to ridges and left over dielectric in his hand-made caps
(presumably some sort of ARCing damage) -- he switched to
stainless steel (but kept his original coil geometry and turns) - I think.

It is possibly that Hendershot realized he needed to switch
away from a ferromagnetic material ... but this should have caused
him to alter his coil significantly ... much greater number of turns.

This is my line of reasoning. It may be incorrect...

What can be done ...what I suggest ... is that you
build various capacitors types to fit in your coil ...
one wrapped around ferro material ... and one wrapped aluminum ..
or a non-magnetic stainless steel ... and perhaps one
wrapped around cardboard or plastic.

I have more experimenting to do with respect to this issue.

[mlurye]

To begin with, I will assume that we are dealing with air coil.
Did you figure out direction of coils and how they are connected? I'm certain that direction of coils and trasformers is very important.

[morpher44]

more notes... can someone help with circuit analysis?

To begin with, I will assume that we are dealing with air coil.
Did you figure out direction of coils and how they are connected? I'm certain that direction of coils and trasformers is very important.

I decided to wrap counter-clock-wise when facing into the coil
from the top.
The notes state that BOTH coils are wrapped the same.
I think it is only important that you stick with the same
direction for both.

Hendershot's circuit looks like it switches the wires on one side ...
which might imply both coils are in fact the same ... and he
alters direction by that phase change.
I do suspect that the left coil and the right coil are
to do the opposite behavior ... one going negative while the other
goes positive. If they oscillated completely in phase with each
other, the potential different between them would be ZERO.
If they oscillate with a phase difference, a potential difference
can be established between them. A 180 phase difference
would yield LARGEST potential difference .. with currents
flowing to the left, to the right, and so on.
One challenge here would be to make both the left and right
sides exactly match to achieve that. They won't exactly match,
I realize, because that would be too perfect. The will
therefore BEAT just a bit. You can establish a potential different
between beating frequencies as well ... but for efficiency you
probably want to bring these two coils into synchronization or
as close as possible to it. -- speculation on my part --

The phase relationships in the circuit are complex. You have
currents going through these 40MFD and 80MFD caps which
will alter phase ... and you have it going though the 5:1 transformer
coils and the Hendershot coils.

In figure 5.3 of the Barry Hilton book we see Hendershot's drawing
of his layout ... with 1 & 2 being his coil and so called
"Resonance Tuner" ... aka C-Clamp on his capacitor.
Similar to Radio, this is the place were the feedback path
is re-entering the circuit to cause regeneration -- I believe.
As such this coil-capacitor tank circuit is the STARTING
point of the entire circuit.
In terms of circuit analysis, if you can simplify EVERYTHING
in his circuit down to just this tank circuit, we have
the 7.8nF cap (variable in that by squeezing it physically
the capacitance increases from that 7.8nF baseline value)
and the coil proper.
The combination of the outer coil (14-turn one) and
the one under (64-turn one) create a transfomer --
with inductive coupling.
NOTE: With an iron core we can assume a PERFECT inductive
coupling and use normal transformer analysis here.
If, on the other hand, we have a air coil, the coupling will
not be ideal .. and hence K (the mutual inductance constant)
will be less than 1 (at some value more appropriate for air transformers
closely wound -- whatever that is).
Certainly air transformers work as they are used in radio designs ...
but there are losses to account for since mutual inductance
is not ideal.
Anyway, whatever the load is on the other side of that transformer
is being impedance matched via the transformer.
Since its a step up with a turn ratio of 64/14 (or 4.57:1),
we can assume current is reduced on the other side,
but voltage increased.
Normally what someone might do is just hook up
the 1:5 transformer again on the other side of this 64 turn coil
to bring the voltage 5x even higher, and the current 5x even lower.
But instead we see things wired all around using the other
coils and transformers in a non-conventional way.
The other coils look similar to the "tickler" coils found
in regenerative radio designs.
So yes circuit analysis might shed some light here IF
you can properly account for all the mutual inductance
-- and possibly some non-conservative field effects.

Those really good at electronic circuit analysis might
be able to model this using spice or something better.
A simulation might need to model these mutual inductive
effects in a special way.

If we could get the help of someone really good
with this sort of circuit analysis, they might be
able to shed some important insights into what
the circuit should actually be -- out of the
many choices presented in the Barry Hilton book.

[synchro]

Neutral line.

@Morph44.
I saw your latest video running your relay and magnet around the iron bar.The Neutral line is close to the surface of the permanent horseshoe magnet. When it runs through the iron bar, the bar is depolarized, however still strongly attracted to the magnet. Inside the neutral line the poles form in opposition to the horseshoe magnet, while outside they reverse into attraction mode. Picture an iron bar with a soft iron rod attached to the center and running first from the bottem of the armature, through a heavy spring, a frame followed by two solenoids in tandem, and a wing nut attached to threads on the very end. Now, placeing the magnet on the frame sideways like Wesley Gary, the soft iron bar can be positioned so the neutral zone runs through it and is depolerized. Now, two South pole activated Reed relays must be positioned at the ends of the iron bar, wired reverse polarity to one of two batteries that drive each solenoid independently. The bar first must be jiggled out of the neutral zone, then one side polarizes south and triggers the solenoid to carry the armature down through the neutral zone to the side of reverse polarization, and a fluctuation follows. This is a tensioned self positioner of my own design I offer you to try and recreate to generate a great amount of intense power from the magnet armature. The fluctuation only needs to be a half millimeter in width. What do you think?
synchro.

[morpher44]

mechanically challanged...

@Morph44.
I saw your latest video running your relay and magnet around the iron bar.The Neutral line is close to the surface of the permanent horseshoe magnet. When it runs through the iron bar, the bar is depolarized, however still strongly attracted to the magnet. Inside the neutral line the poles form in opposition to the horseshoe magnet, while outside they reverse into attraction mode. Picture an iron bar with a soft iron rod attached to the center and running first from the bottem of the armature, through a heavy spring, a frame followed by two solenoids in tandem, and a wing nut attached to threads on the very end. Now, placeing the magnet on the frame sideways like Wesley Gary, the soft iron bar can be positioned so the neutral zone runs through it and is depolerized. Now, two South pole activated Reed relays must be positioned at the ends of the iron bar, wired reverse polarity to one of two batteries that drive each solenoid independently. The bar first must be jiggled out of the neutral zone, then one side polarizes south and triggers the solenoid to carry the armature down through the neutral zone to the side of reverse polarization, and a fluctuation follows. This is a tensioned self positioner of my own design I offer you to try and recreate to generate a great amount of intense power from the magnet armature. The fluctuation only needs to be a half millimeter in width. What do you think?
synchro.

@synchro

I think I'm mechanically challenged.
I admire German engineering where parts are so nicely machined
and precision is an art form.
I'm good with scotch tape, and cardboard and glue ... and that
is about it.

There is a temptation to play with these strong neodymium magnets,
but they are so strong that they border on dangerous.

I buy this notion of neutral zone and I observe that when
the metal clapper SLAPs against the core of the coil, that a BURST
of energy is released and easily received by nearby coils.
I imagine zillions of little atoms suddenly spinning around
as the metal makes contact.
When the metal is pulled off, again, huge burst!!

So yes there is the nice feature in these buzzers and relays
and coils of back EMF to recover the other-side of your pulse energy ..
but if you slap metal together, there is yet another untapped
energy phenomenon in the metal itself.

Do you have a URL you can share showing us your design ... or
can you paste a schematic or diagram or picture?

[morpher44]

positive feedback...

To begin with, I will assume that we are dealing with air coil.

@mlurye,

Running a quote from "Hendershot in Farbe.doc" thru Babel fish yields:

"Opinion of the Trafos/transducer in „“PCU links. It acts here around American 110V on 6,3V Netztrafo. The metal rings of the PCU´s used with this version are from coldly rolled soft iron and are thus magnetic. They are several times spot welded at the seam/overlap place. The inside diameter of the metal rings is 5.25 tariff, with a height of 2,75 tariff. "

I believe this is an actual Hendershot device they are discussing .. depicted
in the photographs.

This lends additional support that the cylinder is to be magnetic ...
and that permeability is to be assumed in this coils.

In order for the tank circuit to ring when a pulse arrives to it,
it will need

R*R well below 4 * L / C

R can be kept small by using thicker gauge wire.
Hendershot used 28 AWG for this outer coil.
Other coils too have a pretty large gauge wire.

C can be made tiny ... L can be made large.
There are limits though since you don't want the
bandwidth too narrow, making tuning impossible.

The smaller you make C within certain limits
and the larger you make L, the better situation
you will be in in terms of a long duration damped oscillation.

Also, since the oscillation angular frequency is

Wd = sqrt( 1/LC - (R/2L)^2)

again, by making L large and R small, you approach
the "ring forever" ideal. If R could be made zero,
it would ring forever.

If there is positive feedback happening in the Hendershot
system, R can be made extremely small due to regeneration ..
but again Large inductance helps the situation.

Also, the more ideal transformer with iron as core implies
also that the formula for the inductance the tank circuit sees
becomes a bit simpler ... approaching:

L = K * sqrt(Lp * Ls)

where Lp is the inductance on the primary and Ls is the
inductance on the secondary side (and all other series inductance
you wire on that side as well), and K is near 1.
This implies that the secondary side should also have a very
LARGE inductance if possible to make the answer work
out to a large inductance.

So of the various Hendershot circuits to consider,
are the ones that have the current path on the secondary
side (of that larger coil) wind around through as many
inductances as possibly to make for the situation
whereby the tank circuits rings longer ... going into feedback
after each pulse from the buzzer ... OR
perhaps rings exactly at that buzzer frequency.

[morpher44]

latest video...

In this video I show some results while testing
Figure 5.13 (or half of the circuit really)
from Barry Hilton's book.

YouTube - "Hendershot Fuelless Generator" -Mark Hendershot 1995 Update

After I made the video, I removed the iron bar
and put the relay right in the horseshoe magnet.
This dropped the supply current down to 2.5mA @ 6V
(< 15mWatts), and the Neon lights just fine
with nice 300 volt spikes.

I am not yet able to light a 4Watt incandescent bulb yet, however.

I wonder if these 300 volt spikes could do electrolysis
to make hydrogen?

[mlurye]

@mlurye,

Running a quote from "Hendershot in Farbe.doc" thru Babel fish ...

morpher,
Here is the same document translated by Joit MEGAUPLOAD - The leading online storage and file delivery service (thank you again Joit, very nice job) check title of this document. It was built by Aho.
And yes Hendershot did use ferromagnetic materials for the ring. My assumption, it was used as base for capacitor and nothing more.
I just finished building 1st coil, it took me 3 days. 2nd one should be a little bit easier