Shorting generator-coils

[cody]

Hi Luc,
From my understanding of it he is not shorting the coils in the fashion that this thread is discussing (pulse shorting). He is just using a constant short to provide an infinite load, there in lies the difference. Sorry if my comments were unclear. Also he dosnt always direct short it, he has been using resistive loads on it as well(bulbs). Thanes magic happens from the extremely high impedance precharging the coil with only potential on the magnet approach, then at tdc the impediance drops to 0 thereby allowing the precharged potential to come out as current, pushing the magnet away, please correct me if im wrong or missing something. I was suggesting that we could use a shorter coil length and slower rotor/magnet frequency by using the pulse short technique to trick the coil into thinking the rotor speed was extremely fast by using a short pulse duration slightly before through slightly after tdc. The coil would be open for most of the rotation, so it would not "see" any frequency until the short occures, so we could possibly trick and manipulate what the coil "sees" by using a short pulse to achieve the same results. Just a theory, may be wrong What do ya think, plausable, or just a wacko idea, or am i still not making any sense? Ill have to setup a better model to run some more tests, to many projects

[baroutologos]

I was one of the persons to have Replicated Thane's perepeteia setup along with others.

The extraordinary thing to note is that above a certain frequency with the correct amounts of TURNS per coil, either in parallel or normal signle wire, you got the "accelerating" effect as most G-fields genys do.

The things is, that there is almost not any potential to it.
For the phenomenon to manifest, cogging torque due to magnetic make/break flux path must be TOO GREAT, and upon use of power out (or circulating current into the circuit) the alleviation from the lift of cogging torque compensates a lot more than the load powered (withing certain linits)

...
Perhaps its difficult to graps what i am saying unless you get hands on experience. The point is that is a dead-end there.

I have tried also extensively to simulate the short with adjustable capacitors or with a diode plug. No use either. Apart from great efficiencies no OU there. At least to my experiments.

Finally i tried to smooth out the Cogging torque by applying a Flywheel or a odd/even configuration of coils/magnets. Again my reslts were no where near OU.

....
Your ONLY BET for this kind of machine to work is, to build a make/break strong magnetic flux path generator (as Kromreys converter or Muller's) that you will manage SOMEHOW (even though tremendous forces are created due to the magnetic flux make break) the machine to run at very very low input (say 2000 rpm at 12watts as Bedini's FEG claims with 56 coils) when generator is unpowered.

or to put it another way, the magnetic field should be interrupted with 0 losses since no power out will be drawn.

Simple in theory, impossible in practice. I have somewhere read that Donald Smith have claimed, that magnetorestrictive materials as Terfenol-D interrupt the magnetic field quite easily and smoothly, allowing such possibility.
I have not any Terfenol-D experience myself, since i have not any...

Baroutologos

[gotoluc]

Okay cody, I now see you understand it well

I definitely would encourage you to try your idea since it sounds like it could work.

The quick test I did was using my dual MOT secondary air core coils connected in parallel (38 Ohms) with a PM rotor in the center opening and used a small 12vdc VCR motor to turn the magnet rotor. I connected a bulb and reed switch in parallel to the coils and tried the reed switch at all angles while monitoring the bulb intensity and current draw.

So as you see my test was a very simple one and I would encourage other configurations to be tested.

I hope you will find time to test your idea

Luc

[nilrehob]

The reason for the high draw is due to the fact that you used a magnet in the middle.

Not quite. Looking at your picture you get a sinewave, right? By putting magnets N-S-N-S real close, you still get sinewave, right? The magnets i used was too weak to trigger the coil i used when in normal N-N-N mode, so by using all the small and weak magnets i had in a N-S-N-S fashion the sinewave got magnified and the triggercoil woke up. But it takes a lot of magnets, you have to fill the wheel completely.

Catch the current going through the motor instead of grounding it.

This sounds like an ancient enigmatic Chinese quote
Can you make a schematic?

/Hob

[nilrehob]

here's the link to to the OU forum topic, you can read till you drop : Thane Heins Perepiteia.

Thanks!
(although i find the layout at overunity rather disturbing )

Edit: Holy crap! This is a long thread at overunity!
486 pages and then the replication thread at 65 pages.
Thats what i call a Perepiteia thread!
I guess i just dropped...

[nilrehob]

The quick test I did was using my dual MOT secondary air core coils connected in parallel (38 Ohms) with a PM rotor in the center opening and used a small 12vdc VCR motor to turn the magnet rotor. I connected a bulb and reed switch in parallel to the coils and tried the reed switch at all angles while monitoring the bulb intensity and current draw.

Since shorting the coil all the time seems to remove the drag, as if the coil wasn't there, i guess un-shorting it quickly might be a better approach?
What im trying to say is: instead of seeing the normal state for a generator coil to be un-shorted (and to shorten it once in a while), it should be the other way around: the normal state for the coil should be to always be shorted (and to un-shorten it once in a while).

Edit: Sorry, i was obviously wrong about "shorting the coil all the time seems to remove the drag", i must get some sleep...
The way to go is of course to very shortly short-circuit the coil many times per magnet, especially around each peak-voltage.

/Hob

[Tishatang]

Here are some related links along the lines of this thread. Maybe it will help the discussion?

Garry Stanley 2 flat flipped coils motor

Garry 2 flat coils motor tests by Ron Pugh

tishatang

[nilrehob]

Here are some related links along the lines of this thread. Maybe it will help the discussion?

Garry Stanley 2 flat flipped coils motor

Garry 2 flat coils motor tests by Ron Pugh

tishatang

My conclusion after reading the text is that you should use both ends of a coil, not only one as in a Bedini SSG with a bicycle-wheel.
I agree, it is a good point.
I have been looking for a simple setup to achieve that with what i have lying around for quite some time now.

There doesn't seem to be any other benefits or conclusions in the text that works on the bench, or am i missing something here?

/Hob

[nilrehob]

I moved this post here from http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...ad.php?t=4844:

Do you close the switch just for a short moment at a certain time?

The way i do it, i close it as short as possible, opening it when the coil would be at its peak voltage if not shorted.
Thus you could do it at least two times per magnet, on each peak, pos and neg.
I've heard from konehead you can do it several times around each peak.

Here is another guy i just found (again) also doing this:
YouTube - Radiant Energy From Generator Coil
I actually saw it when it was new, but i didn't understand what he was doing at the time.

/Hob

[cody]

nilrehob,

Yea thats my old video. I have learned some things since i made that. Most of what i did in the vid was based on kone's info, but i think you might like to look at this link and study it.
Basic AC Generator
Seph showed me this. You will see that when the voltage is peaking, the induced field strength is 0. Now this may be a little different since we are most likely using all N pole mags(or all south). But remember that there is a virtual south between the norths(as bedini shows). That vid just covered the very basics, im working on a setup to show the more interesting stuff.

[nilrehob]

nilrehob,

Yea thats my old video. I have learned some things since i made that. Most of what i did in the vid was based on kone's info, but i think you might like to look at this link and study it.
Basic AC Generator
Seph showed me this. You will see that when the voltage is peaking, the induced field strength is 0. Now this may be a little different since we are most likely using all N pole mags(or all south). But remember that there is a virtual south between the norths(as bedini shows). That vid just covered the very basics, im working on a setup to show the more interesting stuff.

Thanks for the link
Looking forward to your next video!!



/Hob

[minoly]

The Ultimate SSGshort

I did not know this thread was here, found it on a google search just now, very nice

Cody, we first learned of Coil shorting w/ your Vid years ago, thanks for posting that!

I just posted a vid showing how to do it Bedini style.
the Ultimate SSGshort

been playing w/ this in my head for a while now. finally got it out.
that SSG is something else.

YouTube - min2oly's Channel

here's the rub, it's going to take more energy to push the rotor w/ a coil on it, shorted or not. So we are not going to get overunity w/ just one idea, we have to mix a few together. If we put this on the SSG wheel our regular SSG charging will increase and the amp-draw will go down, all while getting more out of an SSGshorted pickup coil.

Patrick

[nilrehob]

Really cool idea!

/Hob