The American Ruling Class

[OrionLightShip]

I do not believe that I even alluded to the possibility of using guns. If I am attacked at my home for peacefully growing food and living my life in a protective bubble of love and forgiveness, then that becomes a forced reality.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OrionLightShip

I will fight the other fight when it appears on my doorstep whatever time it comes. They will have a lot to deal with before they get to me.


I really don't care anyway. I came here for this. Good or Bad. We are eternal beings and the next life is a blink away at all times. "Fear nothing. Live your life with passion and joy", was the direct message I received.


OrionLightShip

I would appreciate it if you wouldn't twist the meaning my words to make a statement about using violence when I have neither violence in my heart or my intention. Every man has a right to defend his home and family from people doing evil no matter who it is. If you read anything else into my previous post then read it again from the heart of a caring, peaceful, human.

We are all of us declared enemies at this point. I stand in solidarity with the peaceful occupy movement and have marched with them here in Asheville.

This situation will only be resolved by the complete failure of the current economic system. Voting for one criminal moron instead of another is pointless and I believe your thinking process is badly mistaken. There are not enough Americans awake nor enough honest people running for office to make that a reality. As long as the media squelches third party independent candidates, we will find no redress or remedy. Voting is completely pointless at this point of the process. I have hopes of people rising up in peace to solve this dilemma and the occupy movement is that beginning....big maybe.

Please do not quote me or involve me further in this pointless discussion. I am only here for the renewable energy forum and anyone with any sense would move this thread into a political forum elsewhere. I am sorry I stumbled upon it and even more sorry I stubbed my toe by posting here.

I never talk politics or religion due the immense volume of ignorance inherent to those discussions. If you enjoy that...have at it, but do not attempt to paint me as a someone seeking to do battle against the forces of evil. when all I wish to do is provide my family with food and water.

If you believe that voting with a controlled media and corrupt government works, then by all means go sign up with their program and vote. But do not use any of my words as a reason to forward your views while possibly putting my family at risk by talking guns and violence. In short...please leave me out of further discussions.

Good day and good luck to us all.


Orion

I would urge you to think about using your intelligence, rather than your guns and ammo, to fight the Ruling Class. Guns and ammo should be a last resort, and used only if you or your loved ones lives are being threatened. Armed rebellion by the People is exactly what the Ruling Class hopes for, because it would allow the non-government Corporation U.S. to declare that action an act of war. There are only two ways that Corporation U.S. can gain validity as our government:
1. By admitting they are not our lawful government, and asking the People to affirm by vote that Corporation U.S. shall become our government.
2. By going to battle with their already declared enemy, the American people (see the Trading with the Enemy Act) to put down a rebellion, thus winning the war and gaining the ability to do whatever they want with this nation and its People.

Note: The Trading With The Enemy Act, otherwise known as the War Powers Act of 1917 originally excluded citizens of the United States from being enemies of the U.S., but in 1933 section 2 of the Act was amended to include "any person within the United States, or any place under the jurisdiction thereof." This provision effectively made every United States citizen an enemy of the United States (Corporation U.S.) by declaration.

The Trading With The Enemy Act was due to expire this year, but Obama gave it a one year extension by executive order. And now that the National Defense Authorization Act of 2012 has been passed by the Corporation U.S. Congress with language that allows for military arrest and indefinite detainment of American citizens when determined appropriate by the President, this ensures that the People will continue to be looked upon as the enemy of the United States (Corp. U.S.).

So, you are already their declared enemy, and as such are determined to be a likely terrorist and a definite threat which should be dealt with in the most expedient manner possible. How you propose to defend yourself against their plans to destroy you and confiscate your property are up to you, but I hope you will consider the only approach where you can win with a non-violent confrontation, and that means doing by peaceful means what is necessary to end the Corporation U.S. reign of tyranny. You won't do that by winning a gunfight, but you can do it by electing and seating a lawful original jurisdiction government if you will simply get involved with the effort to ensure it succeeds.

[rickoff]

I do not believe that I even alluded to the possibility of using guns.

Oh really? In post #2365 you quoted DrStiffler as saying, "You will wake some morning at 3AM with a Federal SWAT team busting in and hauling you and your family off to flower land," and responded to him by saying, "They will have a lot to deal with before they get to me." A swat team is dressed to kill and uses guns, so just what are you alluding to using against them if not guns or other weapons of a violent nature? Do you plan to fend them off by spraying them with a garden hose? I don't think so. Don't get me wrong - I have said all along that people should be preparing themselves for a worst case scenario, and have offered suggestions for doing that, but I have also said that scenario will become inevitable unless we peacefully accomplish what is needed to bring the Corporation U.S. agenda to a halt. Preparing for the worst and hoping for the best is not enough. We need to be actively pursuing a plan to save and restore our Republic to the ideals expressed by the Founding Fathers in our Constitution.

Every man has a right to defend his home and family from people doing evil no matter who it is.

I agree wholeheartedly, and would do the same. I am not a violent person by nature, and I never assumed or implied that you were.

I stand in solidarity with the peaceful occupy movement and have marched with them here in Asheville.

That's nice, but what were you marching for, what did you feel would be accomplished by your march, and do you believe that you accomplished that goal?

Voting for one criminal moron instead of another is pointless and I believe your thinking process is badly mistaken. There are not enough Americans awake nor enough honest people running for office to make that a reality. As long as the media squelches third party independent candidates, we will find no redress or remedy. Voting is completely pointless at this point of the process.

In figuring that my thinking process is badly mistaken, you are yourself mistakenly assuming that I think voting in the Ruling Class/Corporation U.S. elections will solve anything, or make anything better. I have plainly stated that the only reason I will vote, and vote for Ron Paul in their election, is to send them a message saying that I will not vote for their chosen candidates which they foist upon us through the media. What I will do differently than you that will make a world of difference is to vote in the original jurisdiction government elections (completely different than the Corp. U.S. elections) to ensure that my vote does count and that lawful and constitutional state and federal government officials are elected. I have talked about that procedure in detail, but obviously you have not read those posts. If you had, you would understand the following points:

1. This plan can be accomplished peacefully and quietly, without the need for massive protest rallies, "occupy" movements, uprisings, and media attention.
2. Participation by just a handful of dedicated people in each state is all that is needed to ensure success.
3. This plan has been successfully employed since 1993, and its goals have already been largely accomplished, making completion by 2012 a very probable and realistic achievement.

Wouldn't you want to participate in such a plan if you knew it existed?

Please do not quote me or involve me further in this pointless discussion..... I am sorry I stumbled upon it and even more sorry I stubbed my toe by posting here.

Fine with me, but if you don't want to be quoted then either don't make any more posts, or at least don't make any posts with contentious or unsupported statements that I or other readers will feel compelled to respond to. And just remember that if anyone has learned anything useful from reading this thread then the posts and discussions found herein are not pointless. If you have read this post with an open mind then you too will have learned about something very useful - an effective and realistic way that you can protect yourself and your family by peaceful means now that will prevent the otherwise inevitable need to defend by other means at a later time.

[aljhoa]

NEW YORK — More than 30 years after the murderous Khmer Rouge were driven from power in Cambodia, the U.N.-backed effort to bring justice to the victims of the killing fields stands on the brink of ignominious failure due to political interference from the Cambodian government and the indifference of the international community.

Even with these conditions fulfilled, victims of the Khmer Rouge will be cheated of the more comprehensive accountability further trials would have produced. And every Cambodian will know that all the will the international community could muster was not sufficient to create a truly independent court. It’s time for the U.N. to end the charade.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/27/op...oldston27.html


“The war on terror served as a justification for the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan, two countries which ten years latter are still shattered and fractured, with a rather bleak future. It seems that it has, under the eyes of the International community, also been used as a cover up for a conflict that was nothing more than a racist war,” says Anissa Haddadi writing on Sri Lanka in International Business Times, Friday, asking the question, “Is the US war on terror responsible for Sri Lanka Killing Fields?”

The US embassy in Colombo not only legitimised the Sri Lanka Army, but also approved the paradigm set by it, by participating the genocidal military’s international conference on disseminating the paradigm, last month.
TamilNet: 17.06.11 US-UK responsible for ‘killing field’ war on Eezham Tamils: papers

Al

[OrionLightShip]

You are correct. I stumbled in here without reading back issues with a simple plan of community, bartering, and food growth and was met by Stiffler and his correct but overly dramatic view of the illegality of my plan which is also already in great and wide implementation as we speak. Cromwell, under King Henry the 8th said this, "I say no harm, I think no harm, but I wish everybody good. And if this be not enough to keep a man alive, in good faith; I long not to live."

As darkness descends on this planet, light rises up. Everyone doing something peaceful is wanted and desirable. Perhaps the 1993 plan you speak of is borne of light as well. I wish you luck.

I now stumble back out the way I stumbled in. I apologize for not having studied your past viewpoints before responding defensively.

Good luck with your plan.


Orion

[aljhoa]

"The other path is one of self-love , whereby the ego is swelled until it cracks and splits open, consuming him and forming a giant walking, talking, @#$hole. "-Orion's Post

John McCain the co-author of the NATIONAL DEFENSE AUTHORIZATION ACT.

During morning debate Saturday on an Omnibus Appropriations bill, Senator John McCain decried what he called outrageous spending by Congress.
McCain: 'This System Is Broken' - YouTube

Just some of the ways that politicians make the same excuses over and over again.
John McCain the system is broken.avi - YouTube

Al

[rickoff]

You are correct. I stumbled in here without reading back issues with a simple plan of community, bartering, and food growth ....

As darkness descends on this planet, light rises up. Everyone doing something peaceful is wanted and desirable. Perhaps the 1993 plan you speak of is borne of light as well. I wish you luck.

I now stumble back out the way I stumbled in. I apologize for not having studied your past viewpoints before responding defensively.

Good luck with your plan.


Orion

Thank you for your kind response, Orion. You, and your viewpoints, are welcome here and I hope you won't feel compelled to leave. The more that you read my posts here, the more you will realize that our thinking and our actions are much closer together than being farther apart. I think that what DrStiffler was attempting to point out is that people need to become actively involved in not only preparing for hard times, but in also taking actions to promote positive change while that opportunity still exists, and that those who simply talk about change only in Internet forums, or bury their heads in the sand and hope things will somehow get better are deluding themselves. He is correct in saying that we all need to get out there and talk with people face to face, in the hopes of enlightening them, and I have been saying this and practicing this all along, but I also feel that the Internet does provide us with many opportunities to express our ideas and reach out to people that we would otherwise never have the opportunity to interact with.

You are actively attempting to bring about positive changes, while at the same time actively preparing for the hard times which nearly seem inevitable, and I applaud you for making these efforts. Those who make these efforts will either be rewarded by them, or at least have peace of mind, while those who don't will certainly be weeping and wailing when the going gets tough.

If you would like to learn more about the plan I am speaking of, and how you can participate in it, you will find a summary of the plan in post #1990. To understand why this is the only peaceful, lawful, and constitutional plan of action that can, and is likely to, succeed in saving our Republic by 2012, you would also need to read posts # 1955, 1975, 1981, 1988 and 1989.

Best regards to you,

Rick

[DrStiffler]

Thank you for your kind response, Orion. You, and your viewpoints, are welcome here and I hope you won't feel compelled to leave. The more that you read my posts here, the more you will realize that our thinking and our actions are much closer together than being farther apart. I think that what DrStiffler was attempting to point out is that people need to become actively involved in not only preparing for hard times, but in also taking actions to promote positive change while that opportunity still exists, and that those who simply talk about change only in Internet forums, or bury their heads in the sand and hope things will somehow get better are deluding themselves. He is correct in saying that we all need to get out there and talk with people face to face, in the hopes of enlightening them, and I have been saying this and practicing this all along, but I also feel that the Internet does provide us with many opportunities to express our ideas and reach out to people that we would otherwise never have the opportunity to interact with.

You are actively attempting to bring about positive changes, while at the same time actively preparing for the hard times which nearly seem inevitable, and I applaud you for making these efforts. Those who make these efforts will either be rewarded by them, or at least have peace of mind, while those who don't will certainly be weeping and wailing when the going gets tough.

If you would like to learn more about the plan I am speaking of, and how you can participate in it, you will find a summary of the plan in post #1990. To understand why this is the only peaceful, lawful, and constitutional plan of action that can, and is likely to, succeed in saving our Republic by 2012, you would also need to read posts # 1955, 1975, 1981, 1988 and 1989.

Best regards to you,

Rick

@rickoff
Thank you for you eloquent explanation of my so-called 'Extreme' view of what is indeed today a fact. For the benefit of Orion in furthering my position, I do know a number of SWAT members and one thing they follow as closely as possible is 'Surprise' when possible. They do indeed prefer early morning when you are sleeping as opposed to dinner time when all are awake and alert. Anyway enough of that...

Your text of;

Internet does provide us with many opportunities to express our ideas and reach out to people that we would otherwise never have the opportunity to interact with.

Because of the internet and our participation we are already marked, 'WE' are on a list for possible future action and each day the chances of that increase by many fold. The Food Modernization Act and the NDAA or Mr. O or Mr. Holder or just about anyone of them is a button pushed when someone makes a worldwide statement about them that is in contradiction of their direction and goals.

I stupidly thought (still think) that the People are indeed obligated to take actions outside of the ballot box it such existing measures do not foretell of resolution? How can anyone be selective in upholding the Constitution and Bill of Rights, isn't this just what is going on now? Anyway we are out of here also, it has reached a point where antagonizing the villain is causing problems of which is a direct result of this so called free speech.

[aljhoa]

Since 1775, over 1.3 million American troops have made the ultimate sacrifice. Thank you and please visit SemperFiFund.org to help give back to those who protect our freedom.
2011 Christmas Lights- Thank You Troops and Veterans! Thanks for Your Votes! - YouTube

The Amazing Grace Christmas House. Designed and programmed by Richard Holdman in Pleasant Grove, Utah
The Amazing Grace Christmas House - Holdman Christmas - YouTube

Holdman Christmas Lights - Pleasant Grove, Utah

Al

[rickoff]

Because of the internet and our participation we are already marked, 'WE' are on a list for possible future action and each day the chances of that increase by many fold. The Food Modernization Act and the NDAA or Mr. O or Mr. Holder or just about anyone of them is a button pushed when someone makes a worldwide statement about them that is in contradiction of their direction and goals.

Quite right, Doc, but since we are already known, and marked as being against their marxist/fascist plans for America, I can't see any good reason to stop practicing our right to free speech as long as we still have the ability to do so, no matter what consequences may arise.

How can anyone be selective in upholding the Constitution and Bill of Rights, isn't this just what is going on now? Anyway we are out of here also, it has reached a point where antagonizing the villain is causing problems of which is a direct result of this so called free speech.

No one can claim to be a constitutional conservative or American patriot unless he or she will take a stand to uphold and defend the entire Constitution and Bill of Rights as written. Those who selectively pick and choose what they will or will not uphold and defend are traitors, and there are plenty of them in Washington. Yes, antagonizing these traitorous villains will likely result in some kind of reprisal against us, but if we don't speak up when we see tyranny in action, and call the traitors out, then we forfeit one of the few liberties that we have left.

As Thomas Jefferson said:
"And what country can preserve its liberties, if its rulers are not warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of resistance?"

"When wrongs are pressed because it is believed they will be borne, resistance becomes morality."

"The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the Constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first."

[aljhoa]

follow your nose
Elion

Al

[kcarring]

The Trillion Dollar Lawsuit

I can't believe I never heard about this, until, now..

im trying to put this all into perspective?

CONFIRMED: The Trillion-Dollar Lawsuit That Could End Financial Tyranny

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...GviD4N5k_mK2rA

[rickoff]

Obama's reelection plan - could he succeed?

While the media focuses their attention upon one Republican debate after another, and the portrayal of any candidate doing well in the polls as being either of immoral character, inept, nutty, or simply unelectable, many wonder what possible strategy Obama can be hoping to rely upon to win reelection in 2012. After all, Obama's job approval rating has trended lower and lower ever since he was innaugurated, and currently rates a minus 18 in the daily Rasmussen Presidential tracking poll. This rating, which is calculated by subtracting the percentage of voters strongly disapproving of Obama's performance (39%) from the percentage who strongly approve (21%) indicates that those voters who have strong dislike for Obama's policies outnumber strong Obama supporters nearly 2 to 1.



This wouldn't seem to bode well for Obama's reelection prospects, and we also see considerable discontent among Democrats, as well as widespread discontent among Americans of all political persuasions as to the direction our nation is headed. So what then is Obama's plan for reelection, and does he actually stand a chance of winning?

In 2008 Obama won because he ran on a campaign of hope and change, with the motto, "Change We Can Believe In." It worked, because nearly everyone wanted and hoped for changes - positive changes, that is. Most voters now understand that the changes we have seen are not ones that we hoped for. A great many working class Americans are now furious over Obama's agenda, and his failed policies, which have resulted in continued high unemployment rates, a massive increase in the national debt with an accompanying massive burden on the shoulders of taxpayers, and the ever increasing size and power of our so-called federal "government" at the expense of states rights and loss of individual liberties. How then, with all this discontent, which has only grown stronger since the mid term elections, can Obama possibly hope to capture enough votes to remain in the Oval Office?

The answer to this question is that Obama has been effectively working on a multipronged approach to remaining in power since day one of his term in office. While many of us would consider his record in office as an utter failure, that is not actually so. As Rush Limbaugh (whom I seldom quote) has aptly stated, "He [Obama] has not failed. From his perspective, he has had resounding success: Bankrupting the country, joblessness, increased debt, a transfer of money from the private sector to the public sector to government that's never been done before on this level. The cutting down to size of the private sector, the class warfare, he's succeeded – and when you see one in two Americans are now poor or low income, and you understand Obama's gonna spend a billion dollars in his reelection targeting those people? The more poor the better."

Yes, Obama's campaign approach will be (and already is) to focus on the poor and downtrodden masses, portraying himself as their champion (as in supporting the "Occupy" movement) while at the same time harvesting huge donations from labor union bosses, corporations, and Wall Street cronies just as he did in 2008. This campaign approach alone could be enough to see Obama reelected, but he also has backup plans in his multipronged approach:

• If Obama fails to actually capture enough votes to win the election fairly, those results can certainly be altered after the elections through tampering with the electronic vote counting process, as those who have watched the Hacking Democracy video are well aware.
  
• If public opinion is so tilted against Obama that the public does not believe the election results, and there is a large scale public uprising to protest and demand for a verifiable recount, Obama can declare a state of emergency and impose harsh protest restrictions and curfews, and would likely use his new Internet and cell phone "Kill Switch" powers to severely impede protest organizers. Those who find other ways to continue organizing efforts would be blacklisted as being "racists, hate group members, or potential terrorists," and could be arrested and indefinitely detained under the provisions of the new National Defense Act.

So you see, Obama has all the bases covered. Those who would count him out as not standing a chance of remaining in power are deluding themselves. Obama is definitely the Ruling Class #1 choice in 2012, but even if it becomes apparent to them that it would be in their best interest to have Obama concede defeat, they have no problem with allowing Newt Gingrich or Mitt Romney to ascend the throne as C.E.O. of Corporation U.S., and will do everything necessary to ensure those are the only other options available to voters. It is highly unlikely that Ron Paul can succeed against this stacked deck in winning the Republican nomination, and much more likely that he will end up running as an independent candidate, which will be demanded by his supporters after losing the Republican nomination to Newt or Mitt. Once he does that, though, the media campaign against him will be relentless, and it has already begun shaping up that way as the January 3 Iowa caucuses approach. Even radio talk show hosts who claim they are constitutional conservatives are dissing Ron and his supporters. When supporters call in to these talk shows to defend Ron, the hosts attack them and proclaim them to be inarticulate and incapable of supporting or defending their viewpoints with facts. Often times this actually appears to be the case with these callers, and I would suspect that these call-ins are either handpicked by the radio program director due to their obvious lack of intelligence, or are engineered "call-ins." If you don't think that engineered "call-ins" are used in radio talk shows, you should take a few minutes to review the "Classic Characters" list at Phil Hendrie's website. There are close to a hundred different characters, and all of them are actually voiced by Phil Hendrie. More often than not, Phil will pretend to be interviewing one of these characters, and when unknowing radio listeners scanning their radio dial for something to listen to accidentally happen upon Phil's frequency and hear the disgusting and/or outlandish remarks made by his "guest," they will call in to vigorously protest. And often times Phil uses another voice pretending to be a protesting caller, and carries on a three way conversation between himself, the "guest," and the protester. For people who realize what is actually going on it makes for some very funny and amusing listening, but those who don't realize what is going on believe that it is all quite real. Here's an example of how the Phil Hendrie show works, starring Phil as both the show host and the "guest," who is called "Pastor William Rennick." When this same tactic is used in radio talk shows which concentrate on politics, listeners are led to believe that certain "callers" to the show are idiots, sex perverts, racists, or whatever else the host would have them believe, and if the "caller" is said to be a Ron Paul supporter then many would-be supporters begin to question why they would throw their support Ron's way.

Ron has scored in the double digits in every Rasmussen Iowa poll, and in the latest one is in a close second place to Mitt. With less than two weeks to go, we can expect the media smear tactics against Ron Paul to escalate on a daily basis. While this will definitely have an influence on voters in general, it will not deter Ron Paul Supporters in the least, and they will only become more determined to assure a Ron Paul victory in Iowa. If that becomes a reality, the Ruling Class media will of course downplay the Iowa results as insignificant, and point out that Huckabee won Iowa in 2008 but never made it to the ballot.

To the Ruling Class, all of this is little different than coordinating circus sideshows, and preparing for the final 3-ring event. They aren't worried, because they know that no matter what transpires they will stay in control of Corporation U.S., and that all those who are elected will only be officers of the corporation. This is why a vote for anyone other than Ron Paul in the Corp. U.S. election is a vote to continue the status quo, and why a vote for Ron Paul is merely a protest vote which will not change the status quo. In the highly improbable event that Ron wins the election, he would appear to have a popular vote mandate to change all that is wrong, but would actually be a lame duck president simply because the establishment politicians in Congress will remain in power and continue to push the Ruling Class agenda while defeating every proposal that Ron brings forth.

As I have said before, I will vote for Ron in the 2012 Corporation U.S. elections, but for the reasons stated above also see it as imperative to vote in the original jurisdiction government elections - the only election wherein I can be assured that my vote actually counts and is likely to bring about the changes that are so sorely needed. I sincerely hope that others will see the need to do the same.

Rick

[kcarring]

Good read Rick. I agree, Obama's run has been like a bad remake of Rocky I, where this time we are supposed to imagine Apollo Creed came from the Bronx, and Rocky was vietnam vet white collar navy boy. Apollo wins, again, of course, and then we find out what he's really about.

[aljhoa]

In the highly improbable event that Ron wins the election, he would appear to have a popular vote mandate to change all that is wrong, but would actually be a lame duck president simply because the establishment politicians in Congress will remain in power and continue to push the Ruling Class agenda while defeating every proposal that Ron brings forth.

The ’60 CEO needed no C-level executives only protection.

40:00 to 43:21 Mark

"What is Constitutional Money?" with Edwin Vieira -- Ron Paul Money Lecture Series, Pt 2/3 - YouTube

Al

[rickoff]

The 1960 CEO was Eisenhower. Kennedy took the helm in 1961, and didn't get the protection he needed. No one bucking the establishment would.