Donald Smith Devices too good to be true

[SunofFather]

@singergicus.Thanks man!
@peculian,I will follow your advice.

Yes, online team work is indeed good for us.I am very open to suggestions from anyone might suggest alterations or mods to what I am doing.For example,Zilano suggested bringing L1 and L2 to resonance.Maybe if I tried that with the 60Hz 110 to 12VAC transformer.

Any idea as to how one can achieve or what is meant by "automatic resonance" as stated by Kapandanze?

Ged

Arkadiy Stepanov made energy multiplaying transformer Резонансный трансформатор. Primary coil is have self oscilating frenquency with capasitor 50 herc and from socket going 50 herc. Then transformer core is like in picture, have long sticks or how say in English?... And secondary windings is in same distance from primary windings and thats makes, that you can load secondary windings, but this not change input power on primary windings, its little similary like say Zilano in simplest divice. Let say you making LC resonane like in Stepanov divice like in link, that I give. Let say outlet is 220 volts and 50 herc. To get resonance you for example can chose 10 milihenries inductor (with resistance 0.5-0.1 om, less om is better) and 100 mikrofarad capasitor and then in LC circuit gose curent of 7 amps, then input gose 1-0.1 Amps, depending that resistance active is on LC circuit. Or ca chose 1000 mikrofarad capasitor and 1 milihenri inductor, with resistance of 0.1-0.01 omhs, then in LC circuit curent be 70 amps and input curent be 7-0.07 amps, depending on resisnace LC circuit.
Or can chose 1 microfarad capasitor and 10 henries inducor or 10 mikrofarad capasitor and 1000 milhenries inductor Resonant Frequency Calculator - here can find than need capasitor on specific inductance for 50 herc. But with 10 mikroF capasitor and 1000 mH inductor you only get curent in LC circuit 0.7 amps, that is not much. Or with 1 mkF capasitor and 10 henries inductor only 70 miliamps, then gose from socket 7-0.7 miliamps depending on LC circuit resistange. So i recomendate use betwen 10 and 500 mikrofarad capasitos and betwen 1 and 0.02 henries inductor. Here information is for 220 volts and 50 herc, if you have 60 herc, then need find other numbers and curent be smaller if you have 120 volts, not 7 amps for 100 mikroF...
But need exatly find resonance, then add load, then can inducatance makes smaller and need add capasitor if you not exatly replicate Stepanov divice, there i give link. More exatly you go to resonance and more less omh have you choke wire (with capasitors and conect wires) in LC circuit, then less be input power.

[Guruji]

Hi Sinergicus with one transistor I've put a neon for protection on it on my driver.
Did yours survive the back emf?

[gyula]

Hi sinergicus,

I would do the followings:
-With the oscillating circuit, no load at the secondary and single 2N3773 and using the 270 Ohm 220 Ohm resistors, I would short the 4 turn feedback coil with a piece of wire to stop oscillation and see the total DC current draw from the 12V supply.
-Knowing that roughly 40-45 mA is taken by the resistors and the B-E diode of the transistor, the collector current will be known if you substract the 40-45 mA from the total current.
-I believe a 300-500 mA collector current would be more than enough as a DC operating current without oscillation so if the actual draw is higher, then you have to reduce the 220 Ohm resistor a little (connect 0.82 - 1.5 kOhm in parallel with it or use a 2.2 kOhm trimpot) and watch the current draw. If the actual DC current draw is less than 300-500 mA, then you have to reduce the 270 Ohm a little (do as above).
-Do this same procedure for the BU508 transistor.
-IT is possible the 300-500 mA DC idling current could be reduced towards 100-200 mA, especially if you increase the number of turns a little for the feedback coil from 4 to 5 or 7 turns, this can help to restart oscillation. The 100-200 mA current may be a small value, I only speculate here, just do the tests and see how stabil the oscillation remains for the spark loads. The hfe of the 2N3773 is minimum 40 at 1 A DC collector current and at 1 kHz (from data sheet http://www.onsemi.com/pub_link/Collateral/2N3773-D.PDF ) so it sounds acceptable (it is less for lower collector currents of course).

Regarding the smaller value of R2 resistor as say 22 Ohm shown in your link, it is possible of course, the 22 Ohm may set the DC collector current in the 100 mA range or below, depends on the transistor too and you do not know that the coil on the line output transformer used for the feedback coil consisted of how many turns? The AC feedback depends 100% on it.

When you had the 3 transistors in parallel your normal oscillating current must have been in the 6-8 Amper range so no wonder they became warm and when you shorted the secondary, the power supply protection was triggered of course. 12V times 6-8 Amper is considerable dissipation!

The 2N3055 could be used of course but it has the risk of burning by the voltage spikes coming back from the secondary when sparking, the collector emitter breakdown voltage is only 60-70V. Perhaps with 5 or 6V DC supply voltage you could safely use it? provided the HV output remains still high enough for the job...

Regarding the tuning circuit I miss a series coupling capacitor, if the primary coil is tested: diode D4 would short out the DC supply when the 'output terminal' of the tuning circuit (top of the Tesla coil) is connected to the collector of the transistor. Putting it on the secondary coil as you drew it seems okay. So it can serve as an indicator whether the oscillator is working or not. The principle would be: when a coil or an LC tank circuit is resonating i.e. the AC frequency of the current exciting the coil or the tank equals to their self resonant frequency, then a voltage maximum (i.e an AC voltage) appears across the coil terminals and this may be able to drive a LED indicator. IT cannot say the frequency of course. For me it is not clear whether the Tesla coil drawn into the indicator circuit is a coil to be probed by the indicator or it is a needed component part of the indicator? Is that clarified? I would use a normal Avramenko plug (2 diodes and a LED with a series resistor) for such indicating purposes, it is a 'single wire' indicator, no ground connection is needed other than your holding hand brings about.

rgds, Gyula

PS Here is a good explanation on transistor biasing:
Biasing techniques : Bipolar Junction Transistors and study this schematic at the bottom of link http://sub.allaboutcircuits.com/images/03135.png and its explanations. (Resistor R1 in series with the base is not really needed in your oscillator though.)

[sinergicus]

Hi Sinergicus with one transistor I've put a neon for protection on it on my driver.
Did yours survive the back emf?

I didn,t used the circuit extensively with 2n3055 ;anyway I prefered to experiment with 2n3773 ;voltage rating is around 140 volts if I remember at 16 amps...

Gyula thanks man for your help...

[Gedfire]

Resonance

Arkadiy Stepanov made energy multiplaying transformer �*езонансный трансформатор. Primary coil is have self oscilating frenquency with capasitor 50 herc and from socket going 50 herc. Then transformer core is like in picture, have long sticks or how say in English?... And secondary windings is in same distance from primary windings and thats makes, that you can load secondary windings, but this not change input power on primary windings, its little similary like say Zilano in simplest divice. Let say you making LC resonane like in Stepanov divice like in link, that I give. Let say outlet is 220 volts and 50 herc. To get resonance you for example can chose 10 milihenries inductor (with resistance 0.5-0.1 om, less om is better) and 100 mikrofarad capasitor and then in LC circuit gose curent of 7 amps, then input gose 1-0.1 Amps, depending that resistance active is on LC circuit. Or ca chose 1000 mikrofarad capasitor and 1 milihenri inductor, with resistance of 0.1-0.01 omhs, then in LC circuit curent be 70 amps and input curent be 7-0.07 amps, depending on resisnace LC circuit.
Or can chose 1 microfarad capasitor and 10 henries inducor or 10 mikrofarad capasitor and 1000 milhenries inductor Resonant Frequency Calculator - here can find than need capasitor on specific inductance for 50 herc. But with 10 mikroF capasitor and 1000 mH inductor you only get curent in LC circuit 0.7 amps, that is not much. Or with 1 mkF capasitor and 10 henries inductor only 70 miliamps, then gose from socket 7-0.7 miliamps depending on LC circuit resistange. So i recomendate use betwen 10 and 500 mikrofarad capasitos and betwen 1 and 0.02 henries inductor. Here information is for 220 volts and 50 herc, if you have 60 herc, then need find other numbers and curent be smaller if you have 120 volts, not 7 amps for 100 mikroF...
But need exatly find resonance, then add load, then can inducatance makes smaller and need add capasitor if you not exatly replicate Stepanov divice, there i give link. More exatly you go to resonance and more less omh have you choke wire (with capasitors and conect wires) in LC circuit, then less be input power.

Thanks for this SunOfFather,

I will use your suggestions.

Regards,
Ged

[SunofFather]

I made error 10 milihenries inductor (with resistance 0.5-0.1 om, less om is better) and 100 mikrofarad capasitor
Not 10 milihenries, but 100 milihenries inductor and 100 mkF capasitor resonate on 50 herc. If more exatly say is 50.329212104487034 herc. Maybe and more errors made I.
"And secondary windings is in same distance from primary windings and thats mak..." Here also not wery good write, better say ...is in same distance away from primary windings.

[Gedfire]

Donald Smith Tesla Toroid Secrets Revealed???

I made error 10 milihenries inductor (with resistance 0.5-0.1 om, less om is better) and 100 mikrofarad capasitor
Not 10 milihenries, but 100 milihenries inductor and 100 mkF capasitor resonate on 50 herc. If more exatly say is 50.329212104487034 herc. Maybe and more errors made I.
"And secondary windings is in same distance from primary windings and thats mak..." Here also not wery good write, better say ...is in same distance away from primary windings.

@SunofFather Thanks for that and corrections acknowledged my friend .

@All I think I may have found the patent for Donald Smith Toroidal Unit.

Patent US7940534 - Resonant transformer systems and methods of use - Google Patents

Keep an open mind.As I have stated before,Tesla's Don's and other devices may have been bought,solved ,stolen,modified and ultimately patented by the groups or individuals.They carry different names but those ardents of the Master Tesla Don et al may spot the relationship between these patented devices and those of their possible originators.

The said document clearly states how to achieve self resonance.WOW!

Hi Guys, this Patent is a must read.For me it answers and sheds a lot a light on almost everything we have discussed and theorised about.From Zilano to the latest self resonant systems.The mysteries of Don may also come out here.No claims for overunity with this one but you are all skilled in the art and may want to factor in sparkgaps, earth ground,ferrite core ,bifilar windings as L2 ,NST,flybacks and a feedback to run the system.Note the linear version.Also factor in the Kunel Patent and Jeannas' Light .Patrick Kelly and Zilano would be very pleased with this.


Happy musings

Ged

[SunofFather]

Who want build like Stepanov resonant transformer, who must multiple energy. Then recomendate use 40-50 meters 1,8-2 mm diameter wire (лаковую - maybe you translate) and core transformer about 5x5 centimeters, that thin on that you wind (bigger is better). Primary about 200-300 turns for 220 volts probarly be. Then you can try use curent transformer like in it other patent instead seconadary windings that shuold be away from primary windings.

[SunofFather]

Who want build like Stepanov resonant transformer, who must multiple energy. Then recomendate use 40-50 meters 1,8-2 mm diameter wire (лаковую - maybe you translate) and core transformer about 5x5 centimeters, that thin on that you wind (bigger is better). Primary about 200-300 turns for 220 volts probarly be. Then you can try use curent transformer like in it other patent instead seconadary windings that shuold be away from primary windings.

If fallow link that I give about Stepanov transformer, then it must look something like this: resonant transformer.png - Speedy Share - upload your files here

[Gedfire]

Stepanov Resonant Transformer

Who want build like Stepanov resonant transformer, who must multiple energy. Then recomendate use 40-50 meters 1,8-2 mm diameter wire (лаковую - maybe you translate) and core transformer about 5x5 centimeters, that thin on that you wind (bigger is better). Primary about 200-300 turns for 220 volts probarly be. Then you can try use curent transformer like in it other patent instead seconadary windings that shuold be away from primary windings.

If fallow link that I give about Stepanov transformer, then it must look something like this: resonant transformer.png - Speedy Share - upload your files here

Thanks again.What you are suggesting makes very good sense.I appreciate your efforts.

Ged

[Peculian]

R component = Frequency changer

Greetings everybody!

Lastly I`ve been contacted though PM`s by some members here asking me on how I did managed to change the frequency
in one of my litle oscillators proving this way exactly what Don Smith himself suggested to use a resistor
to change operating output frequency into our replication attempts, the R at the input side of the isolation transformer.
I thought it is better to write it here for everyone to see than just communicate by PMs.
Soo... here is my experience in this:
Well, let me explain what I did.Not a big thing however.
Do you remember what D.S said on how to modify frequency, based on his pdf document shared by P.J.Kelly ?
i.e put a resistor in there or cap etc..
In fact what I have done actually initially had no connection with D.S circuits.
It is in fact this circuit presented here:
12V 60A car battery , maybe dead?

it is a HF (high frequency) air-core battery charger.
Mine is really a crude circuit but nevertheless charges batteries from the aaa ones to 12v 17a bats. really great.
One day while I was playing with it`s output was connecting different pieces of components like litle to big caps and resistors.
I could hear it`s operating frequency changing.unfortunately I have no way to exactly measure it`s frequency...anyway.
It happens I have around my home some chinese led lights which charge directly to mains house voltage 220V AC/50Hz.
So I thinked:Why not try to charge this thing though my battery-charger of HF ?
And so I connected it to these complete circuit of light.No sign of charging however.
Well, I thought why this thing does not charge at all since it has a very low power requirement to recharge it ?
Just playing more with resistor I accidentally discovered that when I connected the led torch to the charger with a resistor in parallel it charged.WoW! I was really impressed.
Later, reading on Don`s writings I understand then, that conecting a resistor does really changes the frequency.
The led torch operates-charges when connected to mains 50Hz electricity.
My charger gives out HF "electricity".That`s why with a resistor in parallel at the output
the led torch thing "could see" the electricity going through it!
The only part I substituted was the BUX80 transistor with an BD243C one which I had in my home, and it worked great to it.
This was my litle experience.

Hope this helps others in the same research lines.

[Gedfire]

Resistor to Change Frequency

Greetings everybody!

I did managed to change the frequency
in one of my litle oscillators proving this way exactly what Don Smith himself suggested to use a resistor
to change operating output frequency into our replication attempts, the R at the input side of the isolation transformer.
I thought it is better to write it here for everyone to see than just communicate by PMs.

it is a HF (high frequency) air-core battery charger.
Mine is really a crude circuit but nevertheless charges batteries from the aaa ones to 12v 17a bats. really great.
One day while I was playing with it`s output was connecting different pieces of components like litle to big caps and resistors.
I could hear it`s operating frequency changing.unfortunately I have no way to exactly measure it`s frequency...anyway.
It happens I have around my home some chinese led lights which charge directly to mains house voltage 220V AC/50Hz.
So I thinked:Why not try to charge this thing though my battery-charger of HF ?
And so I connected it to these complete circuit of light.No sign of charging however.
Well, I thought why this thing does not charge at all since it has a very low power requirement to recharge it ?
Just playing more with resistor I accidentally discovered that when I connected the led torch to the charger with a resistor in parallel it charged.WoW! I was really impressed.
Later, reading on Don`s writings I understand then, that conecting a resistor does really changes the frequency.
The led torch operates-charges when connected to mains 50Hz electricity.
My charger gives out HF "electricity".That`s why with a resistor in parallel at the output
the led torch thing "could see" the electricity going through it!
The only part I substituted was the BUX80 transistor with an BD243C one which I had in my home, and it worked great to it.
This was my litle experience.

Hope this helps others in the same research lines.

Hi Peculian,

Its uncanny how this came as I was thinking about asking you the exact same question!

Thanks a million for the confirmation.This is research worth looking into.I did hear what Don said about it,the guys who disputed it many many posts ago did not do actual experiments.Just simulations and calculations

Thank you for posting this info.

Another question, what was the actual frequency of your circuit @ the HF end.What exactly was it at the input to the LED with resistor in place.Did it match up with ARRL tables as mentioned by Don and Kelly?

I have in my possession a very old radio with tubes and stuff.There is a transformer inside that is just covered with resistors.

Remainded me of the stuff Don said.I guess what is needed is for the rest of us or some of us to try what you did.

I have on standby some iron core transformers I plan to use after setting up my Tesla HV HF Circuit as presented by Don as well as Don's DIY device.

I will measure the inductance, choose my required frequency and read off the appropriate resistor or capacitor that is needed.Is this the LR time constant mentioned in electrical texts and one of Don's PDF.

One more thing, your charger appears to be self resonant, no tuning needed!

Well done Peculian!

Ged

[Gedfire]

Stepanov + Peculian Charger

Привет SunOfFather,

Я думал, зарядное устройство Peculian могла быть адаптирована к геометрии Степанов .....

На основе принципов, изложенных вами, не конденсатор не потребуется для L1 как LCR из установки сама вызовет автоколебани на resonance.Also, более низкие напряжения может быть использован вместо.

Интересно, что произойдет, если я использовал ферритовые в качестве основного и бифилярными на вторичном?

Я думаю, что, возможно, понадобилось построить специальную бобину для этого arrangement.Just некоторые мысли.

Ged

[Guruji]

Hi Peculian thanks for the info. This can be done on a bedini charger to adjust freq?
Thanks

[SunofFather]

Привет SunOfFather,

Я думал, зарядное устройство Peculian могла быть адаптирована к геометрии Степанов .....

На основе принципов, изложенных вами, не конденсатор не потребуется для L1 как LCR из установки сама вызовет автоколебани на resonance.Also, более низкие напряжения может быть использован вместо.

Интересно, что произойдет, если я использовал ферритовые в качестве основного и бифилярными на вторичном?

Я думаю, что, возможно, понадобилось построить специальную бобину для этого arrangement.Just некоторые мысли.

Ged

Я ничего не знаю про Peculian, что это такое? В принципе и у Степанова резонансного трансформатора можно использовать низкое напряжение и выше частоту. Используя выше частоту можно сэкономить значительно на проводе и на конденсаторе, но вся проблемма от куда взять чистый синус и чтоб устройство создающее его имела высокий КПД? Поэтому думаю луще от розетки прямо брать и сильно упрощаеться вся установка. Ферититовый магнитопровод можно испоьзовать, но у ферита немножко вроде бы ниже магнитная проницаемость чем у трансформаторного железа. Можно попробовать на вторичной обмотке использовать бифиляр, что будет я не знаю, но думаю суть тут не в бифилярной обмотке. А главное создать мощьное магнитное поле, оно создаёться из-за резонанса и из-за больших токов в колебательном контуре. А потом удалить вторичную обмотку от первичной, чтоб был зазор воздушный, что есть и в установке Мелниченко и установке Габриеля ( Two Toroid Over-Unity Gabriel Device -- Part 1 ) там другим способом как-то магнитное поле обхитрено без резонанса, тут резонанс какбы и не при чём можно видемо и другими спосабами обхитрить магнитное поле, чтоб выше КПД единицы был, но там тоже есть свои сложности, хоть может и не обязательно использовать наноперм, а может можно и ферит обычный использовать. Такой бублик железный тоже от куда взять? Хотя там луще, что не надо толстых и догогих проводов и конденсаторах, но какбы он удалил своё видео, может с замерами ошибся?