Donald Smith Devices too good to be true

[nowatts]

NST Questions

I've been experimenting with the Don Smith device and am about to reverse the primary and secondary coils as suggested. Interesting approach. This thread is great.

I am now wondering if a major flaw in my replication is due to my not understanding the NST. I am using one of the older, non-GFI iron-cored NSTs. Is this putting out only 60 Hz and not the 35 kz Don talks about? And if it is only 60Hz ouput, will the spark gap be sufficient to raise the frequency?

I also am wondering if it would be viable to put a diode on the line voltage feeding the NST so it outputs pulsed dc. Anyone tried this?

I am really concerned there is a world of difference between the old and new style of NST. Perhaps the best solution is using a new solid-state NST and attempting to bypass the GFI.

[Muon]

Very interesting thread. Thanks Zilano for responding to my earlier question.

I'm looking forward to the replications by Mike and Drak and others... More power to you. We need a new source of energy!
Question: what size wire is recommended for the secondary, and the primary?

I built my own Tesla coil as a teenager, a number of years ago... I remember winding the secondary slowly, carefully. Wish I had that coil now!

[spark2]

Hi spark2!

frequency depends upon the wirelength of primary coil we r going to use

its calculated by formula

length of wire in feet=246/freq. in mhz
secondary is 4 times of primary and if bifilar wounded its 8 times

read my post on page 23 of this thread where i explained how to calculate the primary capacitor.

even a 60 hz old nst can be used and also latest solid state 30 or 40 khz nst can be used.

nst is just power supply and its freuency only helps to charge primary cap faster.

DIODE HELPS TO PREVENT DAMAGE FROM SEC COIL VOLTAGE SPIKES



regards



zzz

hi Zilano

I see what you mean now

As I understand
It's up to us during the construction of L1, what is the frequency the more natural and less cumbersome for us.

The frequency of NST do not have any connection with the construction of L1 than to decide the value of the charge rate of C1.

So what we see on the image of Don suitcase is not reality. Because the coil L1 has a length of 2.25 feet, making it a frequency of 109mhz but that is just one example.

Am I correct??

[vrand]

The new circuit is very interesting, Z. A primary, a resonant secondary which is completely unloaded, and then a pair of tertiary coils paralleled to drive the load. You don't mention the tuning of the tertiary coils only the wire size, so I am assuming they are not resonant and simply pushing displacement current into the load. Very curious.

I did some experiments with similar arrangements, but without the resonant secondary stage. I was able to convert spark discharges into into brightly lit halogen bulb on the output stage, but never saw anything I thought was above unity. I can see that the resonant secondary may change the game though, and I'm looking forward to trying it.

Yes it an interesting circuit that I am still not certain how its built.

Is the resonant secondary shorted to itself as shown below? Does it need to go to ground? The Kapanadze drawing does not show it going to ground.





Also Zilano is saying that the secondary and tertiary windings goes on first to the ferrite core, then with the thick primary on top. Both these features are shown in the Kapanadze drawings above from the authors speculation on the design. Need more experiments to prove these designs.

Cheers Mike

[boguslaw]

zilano, I'm not good in electronics ,could you explain some things ?

1. We should match capacitor C1 at primary to impedance of transformer ? What does it mean ? Is that for minimizing reflections from souce so capacitor is charged from this power source fastest possible way ? How fast is that and is that important for final effect ? Your computation is for 50Hz which is very slow frequency - does frequency of power source matter ?

Thinking about TV flyback with own driver ; how we can find output voltage (can be measured approximately by spark length), amperage of spark and frequency (can be measured by scope probably) to set proper concensator C1?

2. We are matching primary RLC to the 1/4 of natural frequency of primary coil length ,right ?

3. Secondary length is 4 times primary length - means full wave length , right ? Do we assume in that case Tesla bifilar (two windings in opposite directions from center) and does it mean 1/2 wavelength for each sub-coil ?

4. Then we have match secondary cap and coil to this natural full wave frequency making second RLC circuit on output side?

5. Using Tesla coils method (two TC; one for step up and one for step down) how the procedure should be corrected ?

And finally the most important question : what is that natural resonant frequency of wire ? why 246/Mhz ? Sorry,if that was explained before (just post link where)

[spark2]

Hi spark2!

frequency depends upon the wirelength of primary coil we r going to use

its calculated by formula

length of wire in feet=246/freq. in mhz
secondary is 4 times of primary and if bifilar wounded its 8 times

read my post on page 23 of this thread where i explained how to calculate the primary capacitor.

even a 60 hz old nst can be used and also latest solid state 30 or 40 khz nst can be used.

nst is just power supply and its freuency only helps to charge primary cap faster.

DIODE HELPS TO PREVENT DAMAGE FROM SEC COIL VOLTAGE SPIKES



regards



zzz

Hi ZZZ

thank you zzz

impressive documentation

many hours of delightful reading

thanks again

[h2ocommuter]

its time ....

hi ZZZZ, you have show all of us a mastery of the highest order and you should honor us with some way to give you some compensation for your troubles if you please..... If you desire nothing or for other reasons decline I want to say thankyou.

a paypal ID or somthing??

We all want the best for you and to show our appreciation.

Most of all your privacy we want to honor.

Please be as discrete as possible.

Zane

in another vane; I am just getting the understandings to get my plasma globe lab back up again. You stated we should know the freq of the globe. so from that I can choose say 1/4 wave of that as Driver and then build Step up/step down from there, and so on.... I am also truely figuring out what is necessary to getting my Old 5k neon transformer up and going too. I digress; with all the fine questions and unbelievable answers that have fallen off your toung effortlessly I normally can only laugh at the schooling you are giving us. I am at awe as to your repitwar and grace.
I agree, delightfull reading indeed.

Hi ZZZ

thank you zzz

impressive documentation

many hours of delightful reading

thanks again

[boguslaw]

Hi Boguslaw!

1. well we match impedance of nst with cap. so efficient power transfer of nst to cap. moreover its also to match timming of 50 hz or wotever frequency u have for nst. so cap charging cycles r timed correctly (only when we r using ac) if we r using dc as in case of dons circuit-diodes after the nst then we dont need to calculate cap and just follow length of primary and match cap for the inductance of primary and we can stick to 246mhz or 123 mhz)

2. well in case of flyback we dont know voltage and milli amps so we use hit n trial method. as flyback has diode built in(color tv/color monitor) we just calculate L of primary and calculate c using formula f=1/2*pi*rootLC. and just feed the two wires of flyback in series with spark gap or parallel spark gap to either parallel LC or series LC
primary circuit.

3. Well a single tesla when erthed from bottom and around bottom 1/4 wavelength primary triggers it so it resonates at 1/4 of its wavelength. here we have two tesla coils joined at base and we r with primary resonating at 1/4 so it will make 2 tesla coils to resonate independently at 1/4 of its wavelength. coz middle is base of 2 tesla coils joined back to back of bifilar is earthed.

4. again at secondary we r matching 1/4 wave but coils r joined so we add cap to one tesla bifilar. so primary n sec resonate at 1/4. here the trick is we harvesting 2 outputs with single primary resonating input. bifilars r used to divide voltage into independent unit one tesla producing amps and other tesla voltage. we can tap more amps and less voltage by tapping less turns on voltage producing tesla and more turns on current producing tesla by using a rheostat like tapping slider on tesla coils.

5. there r many ways. one we can step down using similar tesla coil. or when we make coil we decide voltage of secondary by having less turns on secondary so its diameter is bigger. we can make coils to get 110 volts by using a single turn of secondary or by using a little say quarter portion of secondary.
watch carefully the pic of kapanadze coil green box . the coil u see which is biggest has been tapped not at ends but a portion of the turn.
thats giving kapanadze 5kw else kapanadze said it was giving 200kw so they made it suitable for 5 kw.

well the last part of ur question is if we use frequency in kilo hertz say 30 khz=30/1000=.03mhz


formula for finding length of resonant wire is

length of resonant wire in feet=246/freq. in mhz
so its 246/.03mhz =8200 feet
which is too big coil

so we use 246/246mhz= 1 feet
or 246/123=2 feet
which are manageable in winding.

regards

zelina zeis zane!

Thank You! That cleared things a bit, but forgive me because I have much more questions

1. You said : two Tesla coils joined at base, or our bifilar Tesla.If one is clock-wise wound and other counter-clock-wise, that's the way we get more amps in one and more volts in other ? Or rather because we connected cap across one forming parallel resonant circuit to get more amps ? I saw your other circuit with cleverly joined secondaries outputs without capacitor - does it mean Don Smith has right and winding direction determine if we got amps or volts.Is that correct ? That topic surely need clearance.

2."DIODE HELPS TO PREVENT DAMAGE FROM SEC COIL VOLTAGE SPIKES TO THE NST" - does it mean we still have problem with lenz law or it's just inductive spikes from collapsing magnetic field of secondary ? Did you measured input power during loading output ? If there is no or almost no Lenz law response on primary then input should stay almost the same with or without large load connected to output of device.

3. Ground connection in our Tesla-Smith bifilar (I will address this bifilar that way because there is also pancake flat bifilar and normal bifilar with both coils wrapped on the same place as opposite to Tesla-Smith where both are separated in space) - can you elaborate it more ?

[boguslaw]

zilano and others

I think I'm starting to understand formula of natural resonance.

L=246/f[Mhz]

it's taken from speed of propagation of EM wave along the surface of wire. We match the length of wire (L) to 1/4 of wavelength :
L= 1/4 * alfa (alfa = wavelength)

because f = c / alfa (c - speed of light in vacuum or air (nearly)) f - frequency

then we have :

alfa = c / f , alfa = 4 * L => L = 1/4 * c / f

one foot = 0.3048 m (meters) and c = 299 792 458 m /s

so computing all using feet instead of meters and choosing to cut frequency to Mhz (instead of Hz) we have :

L = 1/4 * 983571056,43(...) / 10^6 = 245.89/f [in Mhz] , the result is in feet

I hope I understood it correctly zilano ? Maybe that helps somebody.

Now if this is the case then 1/4 wavelength is maybe also 1/4 of period of oscillation of that EM wave. Would that mean we are chasing strictly magnetic field of 1/4 of oscillation or so called NEAR field ?

[vrand]

Yes it an interesting circuit that I am still not certain how its built.

Is the resonant secondary shorted to itself as shown below? Does it need to go to ground? The Kapanadze drawing does not show it going to ground.





Also Zilano is saying that the secondary and tertiary windings goes on first to the ferrite core, then with the thick primary on top. Both these features are shown in the Kapanadze drawings above from the authors speculation on the design. Need more experiments to prove these designs.

Cheers Mike

The image above came from Russian author Vladimir Utkin book:

FREE ENERGY
NIKOLA TESLA SECRETS FOR EVERYBODY
by Vladimir Utkin u.v@bk.ru

There are a couple of sites that have some of the 58 pages of this document. Here is the 58 page Word Doc download site:

Deposit Files

Interesting document on free energy devices and theories.

Cheers Mike

[Zlatko]

Zilano,
what resistor values R1 and R2 do you use in your home device
to change 246 MHz to 50 Hz with 8000 microFarad capacitance?
Ihave trouble with reactance chart to find the resistor values for it.

[WeThePeople_USA]

...Now if this is the case then 1/4 wavelength
is maybe also 1/4 of period of oscillation of that EM wave.
Would that mean we are chasing strictly magnetic field
of 1/4 of oscillation or so called NEAR field ?

Standing waves in a straight-line conductor are marvels for some things,
but when wound into an electro-coil format of some kind
that is representitive of one quarter wavelength of said standing wave.

You now have to total potential differential from zero (centerline) to max.

Does the max swing from 0-90 or 180-270 degrees mean that
your chasing the maximum inductive potential, basically yes.

Relation to the near field is best understood by studying in the light spectrum,
and forget what is written about magnetics to get the correct connection.

I hate to use the word "Scaler" here, but it applies to your thought's path...
www.free-energy-devices.com/P63.pdf

magneto near-field communication will overwhelm searches,
just remove them to find pertinent data to study from.
near.field explained -communication - Google Search

Your not very far off from the correct answer.

When you get it,
you'll understand the amplication.

We are mearly borrowing energy.

Thank you VRand for the legwork,
and Zilano for her pointy stick...

[spark2]

Hi there!

"For those not well acquainted with Tesla coil design and operation, Hull begins by pointing out that, fundamentally, grounding the base end of a vertical coil forces a node at that end, and the coil resonates at its natural 1/4-wavelength frequency. A "good" ground connection is a must. If, however, the coil is ungrounded, and typically placed in an elevated, horizontal position, the coil then self-resonates at its natural 1/2-wavelength frequency with a node forced at the center. "


If we place a quantity of electrical energy into the coil and do it quickly enough, the coil will ring at its natural resonant frequency, much like a bell. Voltage nodes and peaks will appear along the coil. If the coil is floating in free space, it will tend to oscillate at its natural 1/2-wavelength resonant frequency, and each end of the coil will exhibit a voltage peak while a voltage nodal point will exist in the exact center of the coil. If, however, we ground the base of the coil, this is a forced nodal point and the coil will oscillate at its natural 1/4-wave resonant frequency. The results will be enhanced if the energy is pulsed into the coil at its exact resonant frequency. The effect is called resonant rise, and the coil a helical resonator. A standing wave appears on the classic 1/4-wave resonator which has a current peak at its base or ground point and a current node at the top of the coil. Likewise, there exists a voltage nodal point at the ground or base of the coil and a voltage peak at the top. Resonant rise is a function of the current value at the base of the resonator and the "Q" or quality factor of the resonator. This quality factor is determined by the inductance of the coil, its resonant frequency and the AC resistive losses within the coil. This is all that enters into the equation as long as the coil is free and floating in the "perfect vacuum" of interstellar space! To my knowledge, no coil in history has ever completely satisfied the equation for Q!

In the real world, Q is most affected by the coil form that the wire is wound upon, specifically its composition and thickness. There is another "evil" with which Tesla did battle constantly, and never so boldly as when at Colorado Springs, that is known as inter-turn capacitance. In addition to self inductance, a coil of wire also has internal or distributed capacitance created by the proximity of the adjacent turns to one another. Each turn is like a small capacitor plate which interacts capacitively with each turn adjacent to itself. Both the form factor and the internal self capacitance work to reduce the resonator Q. Finally, near effects by things such as the ground, metal objects, etc., all conspire to make the real world Q an almost impossible value to calculate.

Why all the fuss about Q? This is what Tesla terms the "magnification factor" and is directly related to the efficiency of all Tesla coil or similar resonant systems. And, this is what makes a magnifying transmitter into the ultimate Tesla coil.


rgds

zzzz

Hi zzz

I think that's why Don has said that we need to focus on the magnetic components, not the electric part of it!

[sinergicus]

There is a 3MB limit to what posters can Upload Attachments to this site. So Zilano would have to start deleting previous uploaded attached photos/diagrams etc... Myself I just uploaded 3 documents and am already at 2.65MB.

Here is Zilano's circuit design in a summary document I created (see post #595). You might also want to read Dynatron's design attachments on post 593 & 594 as Zilano used some of his design ideas.

http://www.energeticforum.com/attach...ranslation.pdf

Cheers Mike

For all you guys who don,t know how to avoid upload limit on this forum:

upload the images, schematics on some servers (ImageShack® - Online Photo and Video Hosting for example );every image, schematic you will upload on that server will have a back link ;copy and insert the link of that images ,schematics in your post on this forum with insert image button ;your schematic will appear in your post ;if no,you did something wrong and must see where mistake happened ....after that ,no need to delete images and schematics anymore...don,t forget to make an account at that server where images are uploaded...if you will upload them without account ,after a while your uploaded things will be deleted from that server ...

[spark2]

plz re read again things updated

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...tml#post154395

rgds

zelina zilano zeis zane

Hi zzz

In a link that you sent me this asserion Matt Behrend is incredible.

This proves that the establishment of several people do not agree with us.

I quote here what he says:

(''I want to Emphasize the Fact That Tesla coils do not produce "free energy". Some
May argues people That energy WAS Produced sincere convert the high voltage capacitor charged to the tank 10 kV at 100 mA and Their secondary coil runs at 100 kV and several amps. This is a difference in power, not energy. Power Is the rate at Which Energy is moving, and energy is power Multiplied by time. '')

I would reply with this: how can we speak of energy if we do not have power,

It should still start somewhere!

We always know that to have the energy it takes power

Regards s2