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A Conversation with AI - A resonant tank circuit

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  • A Conversation with AI - A resonant tank circuit

    Me:
    How much energy is needed to maintain resonance in a parallel LC circuit?



    AI:
    Example Calculation:
    Suppose we have a parallel LC circuit with:


    L = 10 μH
    C = 100 pF
    R = 10 Ω
    f₀ = 1 MHz

    I = 1 A (peak current)


    Energy stored:


    EL = (1/2) × 10 μH × (1 A)^2 = 5 μJ
    EC = (1/2) × 100 pF × (100 V)^2 = 5 μJ
    ET = EL + EC = 10 μJ


    Energy loss per cycle:


    ΔE = (1/2) × (1 A)^2 × 10 Ω × (1/1 MHz) = 5 nJ


    Power input required:


    Pavg = 5 nJ × 1 MHz = 5 μW


    Quality factor:


    Q ≈ ω₀ × (10 μJ / 5 nJ) ≈ 2000


    Keep in mind that these calculations assume ideal conditions. In practice, additional losses may occur.




    Me:
    Therefore all of the energy required to maintain resonance can come from the output?

    AI:

    Yes, theoretically, all the energy required to maintain resonance can come from the output, but with some limitations and considerations.

    Self-Sustaining Resonance:
    • Feedback loop provides energy to compensate for losses.
    • Output energy is sufficient to maintain resonance.
    Conditions:
    • High-quality factor (Q) circuit: Minimizes energy losses.
    • Efficient transformer and feedback mechanism.
    • Sufficient output energy.
    Limitations:
    • Initial energy input: Required to initiate resonance.
    • Startup transient: Energy required to reach steady-state.
    • Stability and control: Feedback loop must ensure stability.
    Practical Considerations:
    • Efficiency: Energy conversion losses in transformer, feedback circuit.
    • Parasitic losses: Unintended energy losses (e.g., radiation, heating).
    • Noise and interference: Affecting resonance stability.
    Theoretical Frameworks:
    • Nonlinear dynamics and control theory
    • Electromagnetic field theory
    • Circuit analysis and synthesis
    Examples:
    • Self-resonant wireless power transfer systems
    • Active resonance circuits
    • Energy harvesting devices
    Research and Development:
    • Optimizing feedback loop design
    • Improving transformer efficiency
    • Developing advanced control algorithms

    Me:
    If the inductor is in fact the primary coil of a transformer and the output from the secondary coil is fed to a capacitor bank before being utilized. Under these circumstances would the primary coil experience bemf?


    AI:
    In your scenario, where the primary coil is part of a transformer and the secondary coil feeds a capacitor bank, the primary coil will still experience a Back Electromotive Force (BEMF).

    BEMF occurs due to:
    • Self-inductance: Changing current in the primary coil induces a voltage.
    • Mutual inductance: Current in the primary coil induces a voltage in the secondary coil.
    However, the BEMF will be affected by:
    • Load on the secondary coil: The capacitor bank will influence the BEMF.
    • Transformer efficiency: Energy transfer between primary and secondary coils.
    To analyze the BEMF, consider:
    • Reflected load: The impedance of the secondary coil and capacitor bank reflects back to the primary coil.
    • Transformer leakage inductance: Non-ideal transformer behavior.
    Calculating BEMF:
    • Use the transformer's mutual inductance (M) and self-inductance (L).
    • Consider the reflected load impedance (Z_reflected).
    • Apply the BEMF equation: V_BEMF = -M * (dI/dt) - L * (dI/dt)
    where:
    • V_BEMF = Back Electromotive Force
    • M = Mutual inductance
    • L = Self-inductance
    • dI/dt = Rate of change of current
    Example Calculation:

    Suppose:
    • M = 1 μH
    • L = 10 μH
    • Z_reflected = 50 Ω
    • I = 1 A (peak current)
    • f₀ = 1 MHz
    Using the BEMF equation:

    V_BEMF ≈ -1 μH * (1 A / 1 μs) - 10 μH * (1 A / 1 μs) ≈ -11 V

    Keep in mind that this calculation assumes ideal conditions. In practice, additional losses and non-idealities will affect the BEMF.


    Me:
    Will the back emf effect resonance in the primary coil?

    AI:

    Yes, the Back Electromotive Force (BEMF) will affect resonance in the primary coil.


    BEMF Impact on Resonance:
    • Damps oscillations: BEMF opposes changes in current, reducing oscillation amplitude.
    • Shifts resonant frequency: BEMF changes the effective inductance, altering the resonant frequency.
    • Increases energy loss: BEMF contributes to energy dissipation, reducing quality factor (Q).

    Quantifying BEMF's Impact:
    • Resonant frequency shift: Δf₀ ≈ (1/2π) * (M^2 / (L^2 * C))
    • Quality factor reduction: ΔQ ≈ (M^2 / (L^2 * R))

    where:
    • M = Mutual inductance
    • L = Self-inductance
    • C = Capacitance
    • R = Resistance

    Minimizing BEMF's Impact:
    • Optimize transformer design: Minimize mutual inductance (M).
    • Use high-quality components: Reduce resistance (R) and increase capacitance (C).
    • Active resonance control: Implement feedback loops to maintain resonance.

    Resonance Condition:


    For resonance to occur, the primary coil's impedance must be:


    Z_primary = √(L / C)


    BEMF will modify this impedance:


    Z_primary_BEMF = √((L - M^2 / L) / C)


    Resulting in a shifted resonant frequency:


    f₀_BEMF ≈ (1/2π) * √((L - M^2 / L) / C)




    Me: List BEMF compensation strategies


    AI:

    BEMF (Back Electromotive Force) compensation strategies:

    Passive Compensation:
    • Resistor-Capacitor (RC) Snubber: Connect RC circuit across primary coil to damp BEMF oscillations.
    • Diode-Resistor (DR) Snubber: Use diode-resistor combination to clamp BEMF voltage.
    • Inductor-Capacitor (LC) Filter: Filter BEMF using LC circuit.
    Active Compensation:
    • Active Snubber: Use power electronics (e.g., IGBT, MOSFET) to actively cancel BEMF.
    • BEMF Feedback Control: Monitor BEMF and adjust primary coil current to compensate.
    • Pulse Width Modulation (PWM): Use PWM to modulate primary coil current and reduce BEMF.
    Transformer Design:
    • Optimize Mutual Inductance (M): Minimize M to reduce BEMF.
    • Use Air-Gap Transformers: Air-gap transformers reduce M and BEMF.
    • Toroidal Transformers: Toroidal designs minimize M and BEMF.
    Resonant Circuit Design:
    • Tuned Resonant Circuits: Design resonant circuit to match primary coil's resonant frequency.
    • Quality Factor (Q) Optimization: Optimize Q to minimize energy loss.
    Control Algorithms:
    • Proportional-Integral-Derivative (PID) Control: Use PID to regulate primary coil current.
    • Model Predictive Control (MPC): Employ MPC to predict and compensate BEMF.
    Hybrid Approaches:
    • Combine Passive and Active Compensation: Use RC snubber with active BEMF feedback control.
    Considerations:
    • Component Selection: Choose components with low loss and high reliability.
    • Efficiency and Power Loss: Optimize compensation strategy for minimum power loss.
    • Stability and Robustness: Ensure compensation strategy maintains system stability.

    Me:
    By employing a capacitor bank between the secondary coil and load would that isolate the transformer from the load?


    AI:

    Yes, employing a capacitor bank between the secondary coil and load can help isolate the transformer from the load to some extent.


    Benefits:
    • Decoupling: Capacitor bank acts as a buffer, decoupling the transformer from load fluctuations.
    • Voltage regulation: Capacitor bank helps regulate voltage supplied to the load.
    • Reduced transformer stress: Capacitor bank absorbs voltage transients, reducing stress on transformer.
    • Improved efficiency: Capacitor bank can reduce energy losses due to transformer impedance.

    Isolation Level:


    The level of isolation depends on:
    • Capacitor bank size and configuration.
    • Transformer design and mutual inductance (M).
    • Frequency of operation.

    Types of Isolation:
    • Electrical isolation: Capacitor bank provides electrical isolation between transformer and load.
    • Magnetic isolation: Transformer design (e.g., air-gap, shielding) provides magnetic isolation.

    Considerations:
    • Capacitor bank design: Ensure proper capacitor selection, sizing, and configuration.
    • Transformer design: Optimize transformer design for minimum mutual inductance (M).
    • Frequency response: Ensure capacitor bank and transformer are optimized for operating frequency.

    Capacitor Bank Configurations:
    • Single-capacitor topology: Simplest configuration, effective for low-frequency applications.
    • Multi-capacitor topology: Improves filtering, suitable for high-frequency applications.
    • CLC (Capacitor-Inductor-Capacitor) topology: Enhanced filtering, suitable for high-frequency, high-power applications.

    Simulation and Testing:


    Verify isolation performance through:
    • SPICE simulations
    • Experimental testing
    • Frequency response analysis

    Me:

    Would the capacitor bank reduce bemf on the transformer?


    AI:

    Yes, the capacitor bank can reduce BEMF (Back Electromotive Force) on the transformer.


    Mechanisms:
    • Voltage clamping: Capacitor bank clamps voltage across the secondary coil, reducing BEMF.
    • Current filtering: Capacitor bank filters high-frequency currents, reducing BEMF.
    • Impedance mismatch: Capacitor bank creates impedance mismatch, reducing BEMF coupling.

    Benefits:
    • Reduced transformer stress: Lower BEMF reduces transformer insulation stress.
    • Improved efficiency: Reduced BEMF minimizes energy losses.
    • Increased reliability: Reduced BEMF decreases risk of transformer failure.

    Capacitor Bank Configuration:


    Optimize capacitor bank configuration for BEMF reduction:
    • Capacitor value: Choose suitable capacitance value.
    • Capacitor type: Select suitable capacitor type (e.g., film, ceramic).
    • Configuration: Use series, parallel, or CLC topology.

    Quantifying BEMF Reduction:


    Estimate BEMF reduction using:
    • Simulation tools (e.g., SPICE)
    • Analytical models
    • Experimental measurements

    Typical BEMF Reduction:
    • 20-50% reduction with simple capacitor bank
    • 50-80% reduction with optimized capacitor bank and transformer design

    Considerations:
    • Resonance: Avoid resonance between capacitor bank and transformer.
    • Frequency response: Ensure capacitor bank is optimized for operating frequency.
    • Component selection: Choose components with low loss and high reliability.

    Advanced BEMF Reduction Techniques:
    • Active BEMF cancellation
    • BEMF compensation circuits
    • Optimized transformer design



  • #2
    Kind of reminds me of this old concept I was playing around with, needs refinement.
    v1.png

    Comment


    • #3
      I believe one of Don Smith's devices works on this principle. Although he uses a spark gap to "ring the bell" or resonate the circuit.

      Comment


      • #4
        Yup, Don went and looked through Tesla's stuff and found one of the keys in capacitor discharges, possibly this one:

        http://www.tfcbooks.com/tesla/nt_on_ac.htm#Section_4

        If you can charge and discharge a cap at a fast enough rate you can make up for the usual problem of only having a certain amount "energy" per unit of time available, though he used another element to tap them to get much more out of each discharge, cap discharges can be looked at as a catalyst rather than the main provider of Power, be it to stimulate something else or indirectly tapping them through reactive oscillations without dampening them.

        Though that idea in the image above was more with playing around with isolating the source coil from a change in resonant frequency when attaching a load, it's an old idea from my earlier research days so I wouldn't be relying on that design.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by p75213 View Post

          Regarding the elimination of back EMF...
          The Perfect Circuit for Nikola Tesla’s “Ideal Flying Machine” - Electrical Science - Quora

          https://is.gd/perfectcircuit

          Comment

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