Steorn's Orbo

[nilrehob]

Hi all,

Here is JLN's take on orbo:
The Steorn magnetic motor replication by JL Naudin

/Hob

[nilrehob]

Hi all,

I just verified the experiment at:
Understanding the Steorn's effect by JL Naudin

It works!

/Hob

[sebosfato]

Yes their technology works but the maximum they can generate is 2,5 times the input power and the amount of energy depends on size of the unite and the cost will depend on the durability of the magnets.

It works with the principle naudin described however they use a photo sensitive relay switch to be able to switch on and of the electro magnets, accordingly with the position of the rotor.

Is very very simple but this is the principle behind bedini and almost all the free energy devices, this is the less efficient...

I'm able to do this too and anyone could, you just need some patience.

[Jules Tresor]

JL Naudin is baaack !

Jean Louis Naudin arrived at the right time to confirm and explain Steorn technology )
Now I understand better how it works !

It's an attraction motor (Like Peter Lindemann's concept), with a regauging pulse like in the Minato patents !!!

Minato says his motors use only 20% of input power, for the same output power, compared to standard motors ...

So if you put a generator coupled to it, let say a 85% efficient generator, then you have:
20 Watts IN, give 85 Watts OUT = 65 Watts extra
take out the 20 Watts IN and you have 45 Watts for free

Peter Lindemann Attraction Motor here : http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...r-secrets.html and Free Energy, Products, Books and DVDs
Minato here : Minato Kohei - Magnet Motor - ENERGY archives - MDG 2008-09

A winner IMHO
David

[sebosfato]

yes but energy is coming from the magnets when they discharge it should stop work

I don't think with 2,5 times more than input in this case would be economically viable solution. However is very nice!

[broli]

yes but energy is coming from the magnets when they discharge it should stop work

Perhaps in 100 years? There's nothing that is constantly trying to repel the magnets so its dipoles should remain unstressed.

And I disagree with the Bedini statements. The only similarities this has with a bedini motor is recovering the energy in the coils. But I agree with the other statement that it's very similar to P. Lindemann's attraction motor. It made me believe that his attraction motor is absolutely over unity and finally understand why all the mechanical energy is free. You change inductance in time, but the core doesn't care how this happens. As far as the coil all it sees is a material as its core that has a permeability that is increasing in time.

[sebosfato]

You are right about the re-energization of the coils and to understand how this free energy come from the magnet. Yes, the magnets are receiving a repelling pulse after they pass the center of the coil. The electromagnetism discharges the magnetism. Perhaps it remained charged for some time...

Stanley meyer created an electrical pulse generator with this principle but he went beyond this and didn't used permanent magnets, only electromagnetism. in a kind of resonance between the coils and capacitors. When it was driven at a certain speed it would generate electricity directly with more than 100% efficiency witch was a good efficiency for a generator that was a nice approach because there were less losses in mechanical movement or 3rd part other generators and was small and light...

But as i said other technologies are better than both !

[Jules Tresor]

adding recovery circuit

Could we make the toroid windings bifilar, to recover the pulse from the collapsing field ? Like Bedini does.

Or could we use a trifilar instead of the reed sensor, like Bedini does ?
1 coil to sense (and trigger) the magnet coming, 1 coil to send the opposing pulse, and 1 coil to recover the collapsing field pulse ?

Anyway I'm sure it will be a very interesting experimentation adventure ...
Good luck to all
David

[Sephiroth]

Guys, I think we are missing the significance of the toroids.

All Naudin has shown is that this set up will act as a pulse motor in exactly the same way Bedini's does (though we don't know if he is recovering the flyback).

If the toroids are ferrite cored then that may be important because something very interesting happens with the magnetic flux that doesn't happen with solenoid coils.

I'm not saying I understand how it works, or even that I think it works... just if there is something unique here, it is the coils.

I've drawn some very (over) simplified diagrams just to show you what I mean.

Here is the face view of the ferrite toroid



Then when the magnets are in front of the toroids the flux of the magnets will flow equally down both side a and side b I'm assuming the magnets are opposite polarities.



Then when the toroid energizes the flux in side a is forced to change direction and all the flux from the magnets is forced through side b whose flux then doubles.



I don't see how this would be advantageous over solenoid windings, but it is worth noting that this is very different.

Perhaps someone with a magnetic field simulator (I'm looking at you, Jetijs ) can put a model together so we can better visualize how the flux is behaving.

[Jules Tresor]

Non inductive motor

YouTube - The Steorn motor replication : No induction and No Back EMF in the stator coils

If it's a non inductive design, then we can not use a multifilar coil to trigger the pulse nor to collect the collapsing field pulse, because there is NO induction in the stator coils !!

That's what is new for me, the non inductive parameter ...

It's an attraction motor, using electric pulse for degauging, but it's also non inductive (because of the toroid core?)

So I'll just shut up from now until some real guys tell me what it's all about

Amazing the tons of things we have no idea about
David

[Jules Tresor]

Extract from Naudin's page

From The Steorn magnetic motor replication by JL Naudin

"The new Steorn magnetic motor shown on december 15, 2009 by Sean McCarthy in Dublin is composed by a rotor equiped with neodymium magnets and a stator which contains toroidal coils with a ferrite core.

The rotor magnets are attracted by the ferromagnetic material of the torus, so the magnetic potential energy is converted into kinetic energy of rotation. The ferrite will be magnetically polarized and will be temporarily transformed into a magnet of opposite polarity to that of the rotor magnet. So there is attraction but when the magnet is closest to the ferrite it is locked by the magnetic force and enable to exit. When the magnetic potential energy is minimal and when the kinetic energy is maximum (the nearest point of the magnet closest to the torus), a depolarization pulse is sent through the toroidal coils changing the orientation of magnetic domains (Weiss domains) of the ferrite, which frees the magnets."

"I recall that there is no magnetic field outside a toroidal coil, it is commonly compared to a coil of infinite length. There is no direct interaction of the magnetic field of the torus with the magnetic field of the rotor magnets. The magnetic field of the toroidal coil is used only to depolarize temporarily the magnetization of the ferrite core. Thus, the magnetic force of attraction of the rotor becomes unbalanced (symmetry is broken), the magnetic potential energy during approach of the rotor magnet is less than the potential magnetic energy during the exit phase. This is therefore the purpose of "magnetic regauging" fully explained by Tom Bearden.

To summarize, we have a "non-reciprocal" and fully asymmetrical system. There is no counter electromotive force (back-emf) in the toroidal coils of the stator produced by the rotation of the rotor. The current required to get the temporary depolarization of the magnetic domains of the ferrite is fully independent of the mechanical torque produced on the motor shaft."


Mr Naudin was absent from internet for many months, but is now free from professional obligations and started again publishing his experiments on his famous very large and serious website.

Weeeeeeelcome back Jean Louis Naudin !!!!
Already 4,000 hits on that page in 2 days ! (page linked above)

I hope Mr Naudin will join our energetic forum to share the explanations with all of us.

[Sephiroth]

Interesting... I wouldn't have thought that configuration could work...

But I don't get why he is calling it a successful steorn replication... perhaps I'm being a bit obsessive about this, but there are two magnets for each stator on the orbo... He doesn't mention this anywhere which makes me wonder if he has noticed

[Sephiroth]

I recall that there is no magnetic field outside a toroidal coil, it is commonly compared to a coil of infinite length

I noticed that bit as well, but it doesn't matter if the magnetic field of the toroid doesn't extend outside of the toroid (at least significantly) since the magnetic field of the rotor magnets will extend into the toroid instead.

[broli]

@Sephiroth:

Your last illustration is flawed. You didn't mention that indeed one side increases in flux but the other side will also decrease in flux. For instance if the coil is making a 1 Tesla field, then by adding a magnet one side of the coil will have a 1.5T field while the other side will have a 0.5T field for example. If we consider the rate of change of flux it will be the same in both sides but opposing signs...meaning emf cancels. A bedini motor doesn't cancel flux. If you short the coil at TDC the coil will induce an EMF which is countering your applied emf from the battery.

[Sephiroth]

@Sephiroth:
Your last illustration is flawed. You didn't mention that indeed one side increases in flux but the other side will also decrease in flux. For instance if the coil is making a 1 Tesla field,

I did say it was very simplified The point was the flux on side b will be greater than side a, and the flux on side a will be in the opposite polarity to how it was originally. Completely different principle to Bedini's motors.