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The Bulb That Never Burned Out!!!

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  • The Bulb That Never Burned Out!!!

    Hello friends and fellow thinkers in the realm,

    Have you changed out all your old style light bulbs for the new energy saver compact fluorescents yet?

    Indoors and outdoor floods also?

    Do you have a place where a bulb is hard to get to and its a problem to change it out?

    Does it bother you like it has me for years that they can build a light bulb and predict with a high rate of accuracy how many hours that bulb will last. Some from 800 hours to over 2400 hour rating.

    If they can build em to last between that window and predict their lifespan then its only common sense that it was designed that way for a purpose, that purpose being more future sales. And if they could build one to 2400 hours could it be they could have designed one to also last a liftime but never released that model? I think you get the picture here.

    What if I were to tell you that I designed a very simple circuit to make the cheapest of these bulbs last forever? Well at least to the best of knowledge that is the case.

    And what if I told you that when I built this circuit it had only two
    components that cost 2 bucks at the shack (Radio Shack) would that interest you? Today those same components will cost you a little over 3 bucks retail for you wanting to get your feet wet and who may like to try your hand here at a simple electronics build. A build even a young child could do.

    Let me first tell you the story of how it was that I came up with this being a newbie to electronics myself, well that is not exactly true as I fixed my first electric appliance at age 4 which was a toaster for bread slices. I was one of these problem children that was facinated with how stuff worked, and my first experiment at around age 2 was to stick a
    screwdriver into a wall socket to see what would happen. I was unharmed but the wall instantly cracked floor to ceiling when the wires inside the wall got real hot real fast and shot sparks out some of the crack. So needless to say I figured at that point that was no longer a good idea. Anyway years later (now in adulthood) I decided I craved a deeper understanding of electricity and in electronic in particular. So I went down to the shack and purchased every book and mini engineers books they had, and began to attempt to teach myself about this subject. I am a little slow sometimes of catching the concepts of different components and how they worked and interacted together but was getting the basic parts like resistors and capacitors and a few others down with a good basic understanding of what I was dealing with. I already had a soldering Iron and some solder I used in my auto shop, so had the basic tools needed to do a few things. Then one day my grandfather stopped by for a visit and we got on the topic of light bulbs burning out, as the lamp next to the couch burned out when i went to turn it on for us. My grandfather then related his childhood years and how the light bulbs seemed to last for many many years as he was growing up. I then was curious why things were that way. I was then possessed to ask him some questions as to see if he could recall what system of power they were using then and asked if it was the Edison system as I also bought some Tesla books from another source and knew that for a time Edison's system predated Tesla's AC system. You see my grandfather was about 80 years old at that time and just recently died at the age of 96. He replied he believed it was Edison's electric system which to me ment DC power. So I pondered this for a week or so and started to think about automotive lamps and how long they lasted with a DC system, in spite of all the shocks to the filament as the vehicle went down even the roughest of roads.
    That is when the light came on in my head that a DC bulb could outlast an AC bulb both having similar type filaments. Then I came up with one of my theories to why AC bulbs could be designed to last a predicted amount of time based upon how heavy the filament was and the stresses upon it by a fluctuating AC current of 60 Hz, or in laymans terms 60 cycles of the electricity going from negative to positive in one second at an elevated voltage of 120 instead of 12 volt common to most vehicles. So to test my theory I first needed to find out if i could convert an AC bulb to run off DC electricity using an electronic circuit. Since I
    was by no means an electronics engineer nor electrical either and having limited knowledge I decided to throw together a simple two component circuit, no PC board nothing but the two components. One was a full wave bride rectifier I chose to be rated at 4 times the input
    amperage of a 100 watt bulb which was about 1 amp of power that would surge through it....so It was rated at up to 400 volts AC and 4 amps of current. I figured that would be plenty safe enough for my experiment. Then I picked a 1 MFD capacitor to solder across the plus and minus legs of the full wave bridge rectifier leaving 2 more legs for the AC cord to the wall. I then thought I should dip the 2 component package into dipping rubberized plastic few times one uses on
    common household pliers to insulate the handles and make em more comfortable to grip. I then placed it inline on the power cord of a cheap clamp light ficture with the bell shaped hood, you know the ones, then proceeded to plug it in which was a little un-nerving being it was AC I was playing with right off the wall socket. To my surprise it WORKED!!!!....but the 100 watt bulb was now dimmer like it was about 60 watts of light. I then tested everything with my trusty Digital
    multimeter with frequency meter also and determined it wasn't using but about 60 watts now at 0 hz. After that I made up another one and placed it in the base of the lamp next to the couch that set on an end table, the same one I mentioned above and then decided to never turn it off to see if eliminating the stress on the filament of 60 Hz would cause it to last longer, and well the rest is history as I gave you that part of the story already.
    So you may think this really does not save energy, but would that be true? I calculated that 800 hour bulb should have lasted 33 days running 24/7 and it lasted for about ten years before I lost tract of the lamp stand it was in. So doing the math that bulb lasted as long as 110 bulbs just like it and it was still working when the lamp went away. So how much energy does it take to melt glass into a form of a light and make 110 bulbs including all the other automated equipment to do so. What about all the landfill space no longer taken up by 110 broken light bulb bases? In fact that bulb outlasted even the best new bulbs that make today and I spent 25 cents on that bulb on sale. And saved countless minutes changing the bulbs out. Wasted time I could have used more productively....like reading posts here in this forum.....

    Good Day!1!!....24

    PS...on a side note I also noticed my eyes were far less fatigued when reading by the unmodified type or even the new style CFL. I could read for hours by that light...no 60 Hz flicker.

  • #2
    Hi 1NRG24Seven, thanks for that info. in your last sentence are you saying your using this method on cfl's, which as far as i know the cfl's need the ac for the frequency step up circuitry to work. Also the full wave bridge would give pulses and the 1 mfd cap was enough to smooth that. May have to test that out. Thanks.
    peace love light
    Tyson

    Comment


    • #3
      @1NRG24Seven

      About 99% of the time lightbulbs burn out at the moment they're turned on. If filament is cold then its resistance is quite low. So, when you turn it on using AC and if you do it at the exact moment voltage is at 90° or 270° (or a few degrees preceeding) you're exposing filament to a maximum stress because of maximum dI/dt so the likelihood of burning out is at its highest. Exactly same thing will happen with DC if you have capacitor value high enough to keep the voltage stable during turn on phase. Of course if the DC voltage source is not stable enough to provide stable voltage during initial low resistance phase then dI/dt curve will be less steep and you will get what is usually referenced as soft start circuit.

      Once fillament is heated to some degree any of this won't matter because resistance won't be at its lowest and dI/dt curve will be less steep. Also, using AC or DC on lightbulbs will produce exactly the same stable light because while using AC thermal inertia of the filament will keep the light stable (the same is not true for fluorescent gas filled lamps of any kind). So, yeah with gas filled lamps you will see the flickering (you can even measure it) at 50 or 60Hz but with filament lightbulbs it is not the case.

      Another thing is that every time you turn on lightbulb with cold filament you're putting some stress on the filament and will damage it to a certain extent. After a number of such cycles the filament will suffer and become more sensitive. Also, during the turn on of cold filament it will mechanically stiffen for a fraction of a second which will add additional mechanical stress on the system. So, I'm sorry to say that your leaving lightbulb permanently turned on using DC source proves nothing. Leave lightbulb permanently turned on using AC source and it will last exactly the same amount of time.

      As for the DC system used by Edison and the longevity of the lightbulbs you have to consider that lightbulbs at that point were not all using wolfram based filaments but rather a carbon ones which had a bit of a different electrical and mechanical characteristic.

      Anyway- I was just passing by when I saw your post and it caught my eye because for some business reasons in past I have had quite a bit of experience with lightbulbs and I learned quite a bit about their mode of operation.


      @SkyWatcher

      CFL lamp inverters actually rectify AC because their internal circuitry is using DC. In fact internal inverters are operating in HF range to optimise their efficiency and to minimise size of the magnetic cores used. All of those circuits I saw use normal diode bridge to provide DC so you can connect it to either AC or DC and it will work normally since diode bridge will conduct full votage (minus forward voltage drop of two diodes).
      http://www.nequaquamvacuum.com/en/en...n/alt-sci.html
      http://www.neqvac.com

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by SkyWatcher View Post
        Hi 1NRG24Seven, thanks for that info. in your last sentence are you saying your using this method on cfl's, which as far as i know the cfl's need the ac for the frequency step up circuitry to work. Also the full wave bridge would give pulses and the 1 mfd cap was enough to smooth that. May have to test that out. Thanks.
        peace love light
        Tyson
        Hi SkyWatcher!!!

        CORRECT...do not use this with CFL's only the old style incandescent light bulbs.

        24

        Comment


        • #5
          Lightly thank you for your input,

          But as stated that lamp pretty much stayed on all the time before the conversion and had to be replaced every month as its life expenctancy as stated on the bulb was 800 hours, do the math...all I can say is that your statement that it changed nothing is false in light of the fact that bulb lasted for ten+ years...now if that is proof of nothing changing I must be insane.

          Build the circuit yourself and prove me wrong, won't cost you much time or money to do so.

          Good day....24

          Comment


          • #6
            Re-read my post.
            http://www.nequaquamvacuum.com/en/en...n/alt-sci.html
            http://www.neqvac.com

            Comment


            • #7
              Hi 1NRG24Seven, what lighty is saying which i already thought about myself and from direct experience with bulbs blowing when turning them on, is the conditions he speaks about. Now if you or we do an apple to apple test turning the bulb off everyday at night as would the average folk at home, then it would be a worthy experiment.
              peace love light
              Tyson

              Comment


              • #8
                Errr, I understand all your points. But what he is saying is that he had 2 bulbs of same rating. Both left on 24/7. The AC bulb blew once a month and the DC was going strong 10 YEARS later.

                Originally posted by 1NRG24Seven View Post
                Lightly thank you for your input,

                But as stated that lamp pretty much stayed on all the time before the conversion and had to be replaced every month as its life expenctancy as stated on the bulb was 800 hours, do the math...all I can say is that your statement that it changed nothing is false in light of the fact that bulb lasted for ten+ years...now if that is proof of nothing changing I must be insane.

                Build the circuit yourself and prove me wrong, won't cost you much time or money to do so.

                Good day....24

                Comment


                • #9
                  U rms <> U arv

                  Hi,

                  let me make a little additional contri.

                  U peak be the peak voltage.

                  U rms be the root mean squre.
                  Root mean square - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

                  U arv be the average rectified value.
                  Gleichrichtwert – Wikipedia


                  Rectified or not rectiefied we have the same U peak in either case.

                  For sine wave form there is following relation:

                  U rms = 2^(-1/2) * U peak ~= 0.707 U peak;
                  U arv = 2/pi * U peak ~= 0.636 U peak:


                  U arv / U rms = 0.636 / 0.707 = 0.900

                  Power P = U * U / R => 0.9 * 0.9 = 0.81;

                  For equals lamps:

                  P (AC) = 100 Watt
                  P (DC) = 81 Watt

                  This Power reduction does generate a longer lifetime by itself.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Thank You Magnet

                    yes and since it was lower wattage that then translates into less heat being dissipated by the filament which translates into a longer life for that filament.

                    Now as far as the turning it on and off goes, I stated it was only on for seven years continually, and therefor did not expound upon the other 3 years left in total of ten years. The last three years after the lamp was moved into the new place was sort of unknown, let me explain. That lamp was one of three identical lamps we purchased new from a furniture store, so when we moved there was no way to tell one from the other two as this circuit was placed up into its base and since it was a clay type lamp base with a removable glued on surface on the bottom, like a felt pad for protection of the tabletops...I did not care to rip apart three lamps in order to find the one...and since this was something my wife got very upset with me on when I modified the lamp without running it by her, I was not going to now seek to any longer upset her, hoping instead she would forget about it. But I did sort of figure out which one it was cause two of the three lamps were modified to the newer CFL type bulbs and the odd ball lamp was now in the dinning area of our new place...so the one with the circuit was now not on all the time but being turned off and on as in a normal operation. So the last 3 years it was on and off. I was not about to bring it up or try and keep it on as it was a sore spot with her, see she had a great fear of electricity and fire. So she had a fear of the lamp being a fire hazard. She was the type that unplugged the toaster when not in use..she did not unplug lamps nor was she concerned with the modified lamp by the couch much or should i say maybe she did not think about it much being that it was normally on. I had witness over the years with her no less than three hair dryers that developed an electrical short she was using and once it burned her hand....so her and electricity were at odds one with another. So anyway when we moved I sort of let the issue ride so as not to reignite her fears of the lamp in hopes she would forget about it.
                    Anyway hope this makes it all more clear.

                    Now about the last three years going on and off....that bulb still outlasted its expected 800 hours printed on its top. Also...because of her fear of electricity she would allow me to take care of any bulb changes, so I doubt she ever changed that bulb without my knowledge. Further more I worked at home so was home most all the time. Sorry for the left out details, but the first post on this was already getting very wordy, did not think i needed to write a book on it, but that is ok.
                    I don't mind covering it here to help clear up some more details as you can only make a judgment on something based on the information you were given.


                    Thank you for your understanding here....24

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Nice.

                      Ok here is what I suggest.

                      To clear up any thing that could be possibly misunderstood about this, this is what I would do.

                      Approach this in a scientific way. Document everything. That even means making a log of usage. That way you have the numbers and this would also give you a test to see if this is a one of a kind happening. Meaning, is it repeatable?
                      Having a schematic even if it is a simple one with part numbers that are required to build the project help as well.
                      Give your report more legitimatacy by having these things. Make the story that much more credible to this forum by including these things and they will see what you are trying to convey. Otherwise tell stories and they will scoff at you like you have seen here.
                      Last edited by Jbignes5; 02-07-2010, 03:33 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Taking Jbignes thoughts into count. (Good habit for any profession).

                        Let's not take 7 years this time? I propose you do a type of MBTF test.

                        So run bulb in stressed environment to shorten the time needed.

                        Say you have 2 75W bulbs. Run one on DC and one on AC (obviously) but run them at a higher voltage so that they are putting out 100W.

                        Maybe that wouldn't work as it might negate the benefit of switching to DC, but it's a thought.

                        David

                        P.S. Magnet0 has a good point, perhaps with round 2 you could add a power correction factor to the DC bulb as to average out the power due to the voltage peak difference?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Jbignes5 View Post
                          Ok here is what I suggest.

                          To clear up any thing that could be possibly misunderstood about this, this is what I would do.

                          Approach this in a scientific way. Document everything. That even means making a log of usage. That way you have the numbers and this would also give you a test to see if this is a one of a kind happening. Meaning, is it repeatable?
                          Having a schematic even if it is a simple one with part numbers that are required to build the project help as well.
                          Give your report more legitimatacy by having these things. Make the story that much more credible to this forum by including these things and they will see what you are trying to convey. Otherwise tell stories and they will scoff at you like you have seen here.
                          Thank you Bignes5 good input...

                          Another thing I did not mention is I made several of these using different values for full wave bridge rectifiers and placed them in the electrical box of 3 bedrooms of the old house that had a center light fixtures in the room with capacity to screw in 4 light bulbs. So the amperage of 4 100 watt light bulbs was around 4 amps @120VAC, so I chose a full wave bridge rated at 8 amps @ up to 400VAC this way the bulbs would most likely stay way below the rated amperage of 8 amps it was rated at, making sure that circuit would not over heat. I also used the same 1 MFD capacitor across the DC +/- legs. When I moved I probably should have removed them out of the ceiling, but figured as long as bulbs were there most people would never change them out until they burned out, and if they tried to use CFL's in those light sockets the CFL's will not work. But I enjoyed the same success with bulbs no longer burning out. And those rooms had the light turned on and off as in any normal use.

                          I had another problem bulb outside the house located over a door and wall that was added converting a garage into more living area. The garage door was removed and a wall and regular door was installed. The roof and gutter system would drip water right on the flood lamp when it rained causing that bulb to go out. Those bulbs were expensive and soon got tired of replacing it, but had too because it was the main floodlight for the driveway. So I thought if this circuit made the bulb run cooler maybe it would cause the bulb to survive when cold water hit it. It was the most difficult one I modified as this circuit had to be placed AFTER the electric eye circuit and BEFORE the light bulb. I finally succeeded in doing the conversion and again IT WORKED. Those flood lights were of the 150-250 watt range. The bulb could get wet being hot and be no longer effected by it.

                          Good Day!!...24
                          Last edited by 1NRG24Seven; 02-07-2010, 11:58 PM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by eternalightwithin View Post
                            Taking Jbignes thoughts into count. (Good habit for any profession).

                            Let's not take 7 years this time? I propose you do a type of MBTF test.

                            So run bulb in stressed environment to shorten the time needed.

                            Say you have 2 75W bulbs. Run one on DC and one on AC (obviously) but run them at a higher voltage so that they are putting out 100W.

                            Maybe that wouldn't work as it might negate the benefit of switching to DC, but it's a thought.

                            David

                            P.S. Magnet0 has a good point, perhaps with round 2 you could add a power correction factor to the DC bulb as to average out the power due to the voltage peak difference?
                            Eternalightwithin thank you for your input,

                            When you test this circuit with a multimeter you will find the dc OUTPUT is now not the rms value of 120VAC but will be the peak of that wall voltage up to its highest voltage spike, the cap holds that higher voltage. In Portland, Oregon that was around 176VDC at the DC side of the full wave Bridge rectifier, up here in Eastern Oregon the peak is fluctuates between 140-148VDC depending on what time of year on the back side of the full wave bridge rectifier with the 1 MFD cap across it. Why this is, being that all the electricity of the grid comes from one of several dams on the Columbia River here in the NW. Maybe different dams produce different AC spikes and the one we are on here is lower. Also if I recall the RMS value here is around 115VAC so a little lower than Portland area.

                            Hope that helps...24

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Oh another thing Skywalker I did not have a scope to test the ripple...but believe if I did see it the ripple would be minimized by the 1 MFD cap. I have a friend with a scope will make another one and have him hook it up while pluged into a wall socket so I can see it...will take pics and post em here when I can do this. Or should I say minimized enough to increase the life of the filament. Im convensed that its heat plus the AC 60 HZ that stresses the filaments and causes them to fail.

                              Let me go out in my shop I have a huge bag of shack parts still in their packages and will see if I have an extra Full wave bridge like I used and a 1 MFD cap and will post the part numbers and pics of the parts. Then will bend the leads and make a step by step duplication with pics...very simple to do. I made my units so all I had to do was to cut the elctrical cord and wire nut the circuit in line of the power cord at the base of lamps, or the same circuit could be placed in the electrical box above the lamp fixture in the cieling. Only difference being the rated amperage of the full wave bridge from a single lamp stand to a multible bulb cieling fixture. My rule of thumb was to use a fullwave bridge at minimum twice the rated amperage of any bulb amperage or total of bulbs. So if you had a fixture that 2 100 watt bulbs were to be used in I would figure 2 amps @120 volts...its close enough, then would use a fullwave bridge rated at 4 amps, or double. When dealing with AC I wanted to make sure that the circuit was safe, as I did not wanna leave a light on and leave the home only to return to home that was now reduced to ashes. As long as your not using bulbs that are drawing to much amperage the circuit should work for years without failure. Always make sure that if it did over heat that its not in a spot it can start a fire, better safe then sorry.

                              Good Day!!!...24

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