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Making Coils With Foils?

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  • Making Coils With Foils?

    Hello Everyone,

    I was wondering, why don't we make coils with copper or aluminium foils.
    Making coils with foils can make the coil more compact and efficient without any gaps, and with much less resistive impedance. I don't know if I can find coated foils somewhere, or I need to insulate the layers by using tape.

    Consider making a coil by using a coil with a copper foil of thickness of about 0.1mm and width of about 50mm and about 300 turns, about 50 meters, which will result on approximately 0.15 ohms of resistive impedance, which will highly increase the efficiency of it, especially for charging Bedini Circuits.

    Normal Aluminium Foils have a thickness of about 0.01mm and are too thin, but even with them one can build a coil of about 1000 turns and 10cm height, and a core of about 10mm and whole diameter of 30mm which is very small and light, but with high inductance and the resistance would be only 2.6 ohms.

    This is one source I have found that makes these types of coils: Jantzen Audio Cross Coil copper foil

    Where the highest standard of performance is required it pays not to skimp on inductors. To do otherwise will result in distortion and power loss. High-end loudspeaker producers overcome this problem by using foil coils, where the copper is flat instead of round. If you take a 1.6 mm˛ copperwire and roll it flat, the copper surface area becomes 12 times larger. And why is this an advantage? We know that with rising frequency, the electrons will reach for the surface. This phenomenon is known as power distortion. And this is why we need as large a surface as we can get, so the electrons do not "get squeezed" along the way. Jantzen Cross Coil gives your loudspeaker ballast in pure copper weight an extremely unexpected low resistance i.e.16 AWG 2.70 mH (0.55 kg Cu) RDC 0.600 Ohm. Coppertape width of 19 mm gives 1.33 mm˛ (16 AWG). Until recently, the only disadvantage with foil inductors was the price. But with Jantzen Audio´s new production methods and specially constructed machinery, the price has been greatly reduced. Every single Jantzen Cross Coil goes through specially developed Jantzen Anti-Oxidant Treatment and Measurement, which guarantees lifelong top performance. A hardwood core makes it possible to wind the coils extra close. This results in a very low magneto-striction factor and virtually zero FM distortion, which makes it very close in all respects to an "ideal inductor". The tolerance is +/-3.0% where the normal industry standard is set at +/-5%. Copper purity is 99.99%. With Jantzen Cross Coil, you have an eminent opportunity to upgrade your existing loudspeaker system, and set them soaring to new performance heights!
    Any suggestions, or comments?

    Elias
    Humility, an important property for a COP>1 system.
    http://blog.hexaheart.org

  • #2
    elias,

    I've made many things with the adhesive backed aluminum foil tape. You definitely want a roll of that in your survival kit. My most recent experiment was a wrap of the magic tape around a cfl cliped to av plug to watever.....got some good voltage and a little amperage it lit a led a little bit. Also, the roll of tape on the spool is a coil.

    I guess RFID antennas qualify as foil coils too.

    Theres some linear actuator motors that use foils...theres info maybe at rexresearch? They were used in flight simulators.

    Peace
    PJ
    A Phenomenon is anything which can be apprehended by the senses.

    Comment


    • #3
      here's that motor at rex

      Phillip Denne -- Wireless Planar Motor
      A Phenomenon is anything which can be apprehended by the senses.

      Comment


      • #4
        Hi

        Thanks for the input, this is what I found that seems to be a good guide on this subject: A Guide to Designing Copper-Foil Inductors Page of

        Elias
        Humility, an important property for a COP>1 system.
        http://blog.hexaheart.org

        Comment


        • #5
          Copper Foil Coils | FoilQ | ERSE

          Insualted Copper Foils (Laminax)

          Mike Klimesh
          Live to experiment, Experiment to live (+_+)

          Comment


          • #6
            look up stained glass they use copper foil to wrap around the edges so they can be soldered tougher
            it comes in one side sliver plated or both or bare 1to3 .000" thick from 1/16" to 1/2"
            here is the down side of this stuff the adhesive may not work as a dielectric
            one side is bare the rolls are only 120' long

            aluminum has a higher magnetic moment than copper and may work better than copper in an inductor
            I have been thinking that a pancake coil IS worth a try the only way to build one
            and have every thing line up perfectly would be to use foil for the conductors

            aluminum duct tape is cheep $17.00 for a 2.5"x300' roll by my guess that would be enough for 5 bedini ssg coils

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by rob.rice View Post
              look up stained glass they use copper foil to wrap around the edges so they can be soldered tougher
              it comes in one side sliver plated or both or bare 1to3 .000" thick from 1/16" to 1/2"
              here is the down side of this stuff the adhesive may not work as a dielectric
              one side is bare the rolls are only 120' long

              aluminum has a higher magnetic moment than copper and may work better than copper in an inductor
              I have been thinking that a pancake coil IS worth a try the only way to build one
              and have every thing line up perfectly would be to use foil for the conductors

              aluminum duct tape is cheep $17.00 for a 2.5"x300' roll by my guess that would be enough for 5 bedini ssg coils
              Thanks,

              I found a source where insulated copper foils are sold, I am going to buy and try it. And yes it seemed to me that making a coil this way will result in a three dimensional pancake coil, and thus, can be even used without a core I suppose.

              Elias
              Last edited by elias; 02-16-2010, 09:11 AM.
              Humility, an important property for a COP>1 system.
              http://blog.hexaheart.org

              Comment


              • #8
                Some Tests

                Hi,

                Synchronisticly, someone handed me some suitable copper foils, with thicknesses ranging from 0.1 mm to 0.3 mm, and a width of about 40mm.
                They were not that long, I managed to insulate them with tape, and build a 15 turn 3D pan-cake coil. I am satisfied, with the results, as It would become a very compact and efficient coil, and my crude measurements show that this type of configuration is at least about 20% more efficient.

                I will be buying some foils to experiment with, I am especially interested in the recovery spike of these type of coils.

                Elias
                Humility, an important property for a COP>1 system.
                http://blog.hexaheart.org

                Comment

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