Home Made Deep Cycle Batteries

[Matthew Jones]

I don't know about the going back and forth element. I have never seen that. Deep cycle has more to do with the thickness of the plate.

But as far formatting the plates its easy. You have several option the best is doing a set at time at 2.7 volt charge. So you make your set maybe 10 plates 5 in parallel on each side. Then your going to charge it with 3 volt at 10 amp or so.
Charge it for 10 minutes, then put a load on it for 10 minutes and repeat with a longer discharge. After about 5 times you can hit the next set. Once they are started then you can put 6 sets together for 12 volt and start charging them together with regular charger or oscillator or cap pulses whatever your flavor is.
Do 2 cycles or so on full battery then your ready to go pretty much.

Just remember the thicker the lead the more current 20 amp and deeper discharge like 10.5 volt.

Its not hard. Your fluid needs to be at the halfway point on your hydrometer, I can't remember the number, before you add the lead. Let the lead sit in the fluid for period of time before charging.

If you really worried buy this book
Battery Builder's Guide by Phillip Hurley

He explains it all in real depth not only the construction but why and when and how.

The other thing you can do is just start small with canning jar and some sheet lead and small rubber spacer like 1/8 inch thick. Then put a 3 volt charge on it see how it acts.

The Bedini video didn't really go into depth.

Matt

[john_g]

I don't know about the going back and forth element. I have never seen that. Deep cycle has more to do with the thickness of the plate.

But as far formatting the plates its easy. You have several option the best is doing a set at time at 2.7 volt charge. So you make your set maybe 10 plates 5 in parallel on each side. Then your going to charge it with 3 volt at 10 amp or so.
Charge it for 10 minutes, then put a load on it for 10 minutes and repeat with a longer discharge. After about 5 times you can hit the next set. Once they are started then you can put 6 sets together for 12 volt and start charging them together with regular charger or oscillator or cap pulses whatever your flavor is.
Do 2 cycles or so on full battery then your ready to go pretty much.

Just remember the thicker the lead the more current 20 amp and deeper discharge like 10.5 volt.

Its not hard. Your fluid needs to be at the halfway point on your hydrometer, I can't remember the number, before you add the lead. Let the lead sit in the fluid for period of time before charging.

If you really worried buy this book
Battery Builder's Guide by Phillip Hurley

He explains it all in real depth not only the construction but why and when and how.

The other thing you can do is just start small with canning jar and some sheet lead and small rubber spacer like 1/8 inch thick. Then put a 3 volt charge on it see how it acts.

The Bedini video didn't really go into depth.

Matt

Hi Matt

The swapping back and forth does seem strange - but that's what it said. Another good book is Storage Battery Engineering by Lamer Lyndon - loads of ways of forming plates described in there.

Regards

John

[Sawt2]

I just used lead sheet about 2 x 3 inches and not quite 1/8 inch thick.
Charged it for 30 min and discharged
Reversed the charge for 30 min and discharged
Then about 25-30 cycles of charge and discharge to form the plates
Just for funThen I took the plates out of the acid and made an alum crystal batt with the plates. After about 20 more cycles of 15 min charge and then discharge to .5 volts that little battery would run a bank of 6 LEDs on a lidmotor penny oscillater for close to 4 hrs on a 15 min chg. all these charges were done on the energizer except the initial forming charges, they were done with AA batt in series. I have not taken the time to make a substantial size battery but I do believe it is entirely possible. I made a few of these little ones and they not only work well but I have been able to let the sit for months and they will still hold charge. Plus you can run them down to near zero with no apparent harm.
Like Matt said don't overthink it!
Make some small ones then go big after you are comfortable with the process.
Brian




QUOTE=pugwash;248562]when you say continue for a month. That could mean anything, how many charges back and forth, is there any specific procedures written about it. There must be somebody here that has made and using the home made battery's, if so are there any specifics on it all. I have plenty of lead and some battery acid and have seen where I can get more acid. Which is the hardest thing in Australia as for some stupid reason its a prohibited substance.( Like you cant get it out of any car battery). Thanks
pugwash[/QUOTE]

[pugwash]

Bought the book and had a good read. Is there any reason that you can't make the plates circular. using the kiss principle you would only need two lengths of lead rolled up with a barrier in-between. the area of lead would govern the current storage. It would save all the lead welding.
It sounds just two easy that there must be a reason that they are not made like that.

[Matthew Jones]

Put 2 plate together with a spacer and roll it up. Thats one cell.

[pugwash]

Put 2 plate together with a spacer and roll it up. Thats one cell.

That's what I am saying, The length and how wide the lead is would govern its current carrying capacity. Instead of having smaller multy plated cells to make up the area, just have the one plate . But roll it up to get it in a smaller space. It would be a lot simpler to make.

[Sawt2]

Absolutely you can make them circular
I actually have a couple very old calcium lead battery that the plates were wound in a circular fashion
Some heavy duty truck batts are like that still
Brian

That's what I am saying, The length and how wide the lead is would govern its current carrying capacity. Instead of having smaller multy plated cells to make up the area, just have the one plate . But roll it up to get it in a smaller space. It would be a lot simpler to make.

[pugwash]

Absolutely you can make them circular
I actually have a couple very old calcium lead battery that the plates were wound in a circular fashion
Some heavy duty truck batts are like that still
Brian

Ok. do you know if it has just the two plates rolled together or is it a multi plate cell. I cant see why it would be a multi plated cell, as that would be a lot harder to make. but if it is there might be a reason . I have seen circular cell battery's for sale but never took much notice of them. I don't think I will see anything from the outside of one anyway.

[Sawt2]

As near as I can tell it looks like 2 plates wound up
There aren't any little bridges to join plates
maybe I will try to unroll one of them sometime
Brian

Ok. do you know if it has just the two plates rolled together or is it a multi plate cell. I cant see why it would be a multi plated cell, as that would be a lot harder to make. but if it is there might be a reason . I have seen circular cell battery's for sale but never took much notice of them. I don't think I will see anything from the outside of one anyway.

[vzon17]

Pure lead battery

there are now AGM batteries that are thin pure lead sheets with fiber glass mats compressed between to hold the acid. Look up the Odessey deep cycle AGM batteries. they go for around 390 to 400 for one size 31 battery. But you can get the exact same ones at sears for around 250 bucks.

[Joit]

I know this is a old thread but does anybody have the Battery forming video .2008_04_25_16_16_47.wmv
As in this thread, the link does not work now.
Thank you

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sF5AB7NF51k

[Quigon10101]

I feel that owning, maintaining and studying a lead battery bank and of course attempts at constructing it among all the other projects is pretty much a necessity for anyone who dreams to become self sufficient, independent or achieve true "off-the-grid" status through all the efforts so many fine people in this area are putting in. Moreover, I haven't yet come across a on line, free and comprehensive resource of data and various parameters involved. Searches will lead to a few threads including this one.

With all that in mind, due to necessity and the intention of positive contribution to our greater cause, I ran some tests in May which lasted through July. I built a single cell of two sizable plates and charged them in various fashions including my recently completed 8 filar SS-SSG. I have observed good enough results and therefore a few days ago I purchased a 8'x4'x1mm sheet of lead, glass wool separators, and a salvaged large battery container. I intend to build a 12 volt, Group 31 or larger battery out of these materials. I will be posting in this thread (if thats okay) and will keep updating and sharing my findings. Already I have several photos to share but I need to find a new host since imageshack is not free anymore.

And that is why I necro this thread now. I encourage people to revive and take part in this discussion, as it is an important discussion and much can be achieved and saved with it.

[BroMikey]

My Idea? No Not Mine!!

I feel that owning, maintaining and studying a lead battery bank and of course attempts at constructing it among all the other projects is pretty much a necessity for anyone who dreams to become self sufficient, independent or achieve true "off-the-grid" status through all the efforts so many fine people in this area are putting in. Moreover, I haven't yet come across a on line, free and comprehensive resource of data and various parameters involved. Searches will lead to a few threads including this one.

With all that in mind, due to necessity and the intention of positive contribution to our greater cause, I ran some tests in May which lasted through July. I built a single cell of two sizable plates and charged them in various fashions including my recently completed 8 filar SS-SSG. I have observed good enough results and therefore a few days ago I purchased a 8'x4'x1mm sheet of lead, glass wool separators, and a salvaged large battery container. I intend to build a 12 volt, Group 31 or larger battery out of these materials. I will be posting in this thread (if thats okay) and will keep updating and sharing my findings. Already I have several photos to share but I need to find a new host since imageshack is not free anymore.

And that is why I necro this thread now. I encourage people to revive and take part in this discussion, as it is an important discussion and much can be achieved and saved with it.

Here is an old Idea for making great lead plates. First make a structure like this 1/4-1/2" thick or 8-12mm thick.





Next take some of your thin Lead and make what looks like small corrugated rolls of tape like shown in this picture.




Then with many rolls fill the large plates holes and you now have a 30 year battery if it is taken care of.

Just thought I would share my view for the best design in my opinion.


Mike

[Quigon10101]

Update:

First and Foremost. The most important piece of information I would like to bring to you all is that I can now feel I've made a mistake following the conventional industry cell design like this:

It is complex. My friend repairs (and builds) lead acid batteries so I had the molds and plate group holding vice that looks like a comb as well as a gas torch and other little items needed to form groups out of the solid lead plates we cut out of the 8'x4'x1mm lead sheet in the same way as shown above.

We're accustomed to working with lead with antimony and other stuff mixed into it, which we salvage from scrapped batteries. I have to tell you that pure lead does not mechanically behave the same as the lead+antimony alloy the industry uses especially when using a torch to melt and connect the pure lead plates cut from a sheet. The reason is, lead+antimony is harder. Antimony is added to lead on purpose and this is the purpose -- to give the plate groups the needed mechanical strength and make it more workable.

With that in mind I would like to recommend BroMikey's cell design to any builders, minus its round form. Instead, it can be turned rectangular to fit into the usual, empty battery containers which have rectangular cell compartments, simply by pressing them into there. Thats the most important piece of information. Thats the important part.

Phillip Hurley's "The Battery Builders Guide" or even its free abstract ad version with pictures in it can be viewed if you wanted to see pictures of my work. I have cut the sheet in exactly the same manner as shown in that booklet to make my plates. Due to extreme humidity my digital camera kept shutting down, otherwise I had planned to make a nice video too. Apologies.

Back to the spiraled design that BroMikey has also shown, I'm not sure what material would make the perfect separator. I believe I will know once I'm done forming this battery. I'm thinking that the usual glass wool separators we use can be lined up in between the two strips of lead to form a long strip. I will try that with the next battery. My goal is to build a nice big battery bank of may be 2000 amps (or more) @ 48 volts, in hopes to make my home go comprehensively off grid with solar, the SSG tech and a backup generator. And to this end a huge battery bank with a loong life is a must-have.

[Quigon10101]

battery complete

Pics:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...0&l=4e16d0788b
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...1&l=34538774c6

The battery lit a 10 watt LED right after the first 10 minute charge. How promising.

Now the last and arduous step of forming the plates has begun. I have been charging and discharging (@ C/20) the battery. After doing this like 7 times now I feel I should reverse charge. To be honest I'm in a bit of dark here.

I read Lyndon Lamar's book but most of those steps are feasible for very commercial purposes, not home made.

Any suggestions on how to form the plates are quite welcome at this point.